Worst blackjack ever?
H17
6-5 blackjack
22 for dealer all hands are stand-off except bj.
The only benefit for player is that it is a low limit table.
This is not in Las Vegas.
Interested to hear thoughts on this abomination of a game.
Thanks
Quote: MadbseI encountered this version of blackjack in my travels and it just seems horrible.
H17
6-5 blackjack
22 for dealer all hands are stand-off except bj.
The only benefit for player is that it is a low limit table.
This is not in Las Vegas.
Interested to hear thoughts on this abomination of a game.
Thanks
Sounds like a charity room or csrnival and not a casino
And I think it's disgusting how Some casinos take advantage of that. I agree you pay for the entertainement, but these rules just take your money too fast without giving you much entertainement.
If you think that's an abomination, that same Lucky ladies with 18% house edge I have is with a good pay table, it's not enough to some places who have pay tables with a 30% house edge according to the Wizard's analysis on it. At some point casinos have to know that the people who play with those rules.. well they'll take their money sooner or later.. they could at least give them more entertainement.. or more "foreplay" if I may.. before doing it.
Double on first 2 cards, hard 9,10,11
Split to 3 hands, except A's
Double after split
Quote: Madbse6 decks continuous shuffler
Double on first 2 cards, hard 9,10,11
Split to 3 hands, except A's
Double after split
Before the push 22, I get a house edge of 2.09%. The push 22 adds 6.91% to that for a total HE of about 9%! Someone can recheck for me.
Quote: IbeatyouracesBefore the push 22, I get a house edge of 2.09%. The push 22 adds 6.91% to that for a total HE of about 9%! Someone can recheck for me.
Two bets actually. Traditional 21+3, and the "super" version, were it pays "cubed" for a suited straight flush, 3OAK, and something else, I have forgotten what. but the payout for a suited 3oak is a nice 270:1
I hate the +3 part of the game so I am not sure on the edges on the bet. Im sure the normal +3 is unchanged but the trilux I have no idea on. You MUSTS make the regular +3 bet to make the trilux bet. They have added a couple new tables to implement these new bonus games, and are currently a 6 deck shoe game. Oh, to be sure you can still find the dreaded CSM, but they now seem to be less than 50% of the games at this point.
I am sure that will change at some point, but for now, if you can put up with the +3 crap, you can find an ok shoe game there.
Quote: MadbseI encountered this version of blackjack in my travels and it just seems horrible.
H17
6-5 blackjack
22 for dealer all hands are stand-off except bj.
The only benefit for player is that it is a low limit table.
This is not in Las Vegas.
Interested to hear thoughts on this abomination of a game.
Thanks
In this case you should be fine putting the location of this out there. I doubt there will be a rush of AP's flying in to kill the action.
Quote: TigerWuIs that worse than all those Indian casino BJ games where you have to pay 50 cents a hand to even play?
If you only bet $5 it is. And I see people do it.
The Indian casinos in OK charge $0.50 per $50. So you can reduce the edge from the ante to 1% with proper betting. (I still won't play it)
It's single deck, man! ...lolQuote: GreasyjohnI remember a decade ago where the Rio in Vegas had a SD game where blackjack paid even money. People played that too.
Quote: RomesIt's single deck, man! ...lol
What's worse is that on weekends it was $100
Minimum and people were playing.
I was watching the table one night and one of the players was criticizing another player for the way he was playing.
How ironic .
Quote: richeilersI play at Hollywood. The two bets, I call Little Trilux and Big Trilux, small one pays 9 to 1 for Straight, Flush, 3OAK, Straight Flush, 3OAK suited. You MUST play the Little to bet on the Big. Big max is $10, Little max is $100. Minimum on each is $1 and the Big must equal or be higher than the Little. You do not have to play the Big. The Big pays 3OAK (90-1), Straight Flush (180-1) and 3OAK Suited (270-1). I didn't play BJ before Trilux and only play it for the Trilux. I've financed all of my playing since December on Trilux wins and I only bet $5 on the Big and usually $10 on the Little. It's on every BJ table with both continuous shuffle and shoes. I never play the shoe tables.
How many decks at these continuous shuffle and shoe tables?
Quote: PokerGrinderMy local casino just made all their $5 tables the exact rules of free bet blackjack but without the free bet. I laughed really hard when I saw this and the players don't even care.
Any chance that someone can PM the names of these casinos using 'Push 22' on a regular game? I'd like to check into it if possible.
- Single deck
- Dealer stands on soft 17
- All wins, including blackjack pay even money (or 2 for 1)
- Player may never double or split
- Player and dealer must automatically stop on six cards.
My blackjack programs don't even support such awful rules so I asked expert Norm Wattenberger for the bottom line. He said the house edge was 4.30%. Benny Binion must be rolling over in his grave. I wish I could put copper wire and magnets in it to generate electricity.
Still, in all fairness, it isn't as bad as Blackjack Plus, with a house edge of 6.36%.
I'd like to thank Norm for his help on this. Please check out his blackjack software Casino Verite.
Quote: WizardI had a nice dinner with Charles Mousseau (hope he doesn't mind the name drop) yesterday. He drew my attention to a bar-top game at Binion's with some awful rules. Afterward, we went over and I can confirm the rules were:
- Single deck
- Dealer stands on soft 17
- All wins, including blackjack pay even money (or 2 for 1)
- Player may never double or split
- Player and dealer must automatically stop on six cards.
My blackjack programs don't even support such awful rules so I asked expert Norm Wattenberger for the bottom line. He said the house edge was 4.30%. Benny Binion must be rolling over in his grave. I wish I could put copper wire and magnets in it to generate electricity.
Still, in all fairness, it isn't as bad as Blackjack Plus, with a house edge of 6.36%.
I'd like to thank Norm for his help on this. Please check out his blackjack software Casino Verite.
That's pretty standard these days. Maybe a third of bar video blackjack machines offer splits or limited doubling. Most only allow you to split queens, not a queen and a Jack.
On the plus side, you can play for a dollar a hand and drink more than your expected loss and vbj is eligible for slot points ,especially on multiplier days. It often is a better option than the 7-5 JOB many places offer.
Quote: billryanThat's pretty standard these days.
Shows you what I know. Pretty sad. Still a much better bet than reeled slots.
Quote: WizardShows you what I know. Pretty sad. Still a much better bet than reeled slots.
Does that mean that the new fancy slots are better than the old reel slots?
Quote: VCUSkyhawkDoes that mean that the new fancy slots are better than the old reel slots?
No, they are worse.
And yeah, really the big benefit of that game was that it was a 25 cent minimum. Compare that to, say, the MGM's Bar Top which has doubles and splits allowed but has a $2 minimum.
But agreed with the Benny Binion spinning in his grave, massive electromagnet theory. They don't even have the token $25 min full pay single deck game anymore. 6-5 on every blackjack game in the joint. Oh Benny, what have they done to you?
Quote: CharlesMousseauOh Benny, what have they done to you?
Yep, ironic that Binions has become exactly the opposite of what Benny stood for. If I had twenty million to burn I'd buy a small downtown property, have the best odds in Vegas on every game, and I'm sure run it into the ground within a few years.
Quote: WizardYep, ironic that Binions has become exactly the opposite of what Benny stood for. If I had twenty million to burn I'd buy a small downtown property, have the best odds in Vegas on every game, and I'm sure run it into the ground within a few years.
Let's do it. I'm in for 5%.
Quote: WizardYep, ironic that Binions has become exactly the opposite of what Benny stood for. If I had twenty million to burn I'd buy a small downtown property, have the best odds in Vegas on every game, and I'm sure run it into the ground within a few years.
I would almost do that.
I would have Video Poker that was all in the 99+% range on half of my machines, except Video Poker would not earn points and there wouldn't even be a place to put your player's club card in for it. I would have several 100%+ games on VP, but they would all be single line for either nickels or dimes.
I would have 3:2 Blackjack, but most other rules would positively suck. Some players know that 3:2 is good and 6:5 is bad, but I imagine a good percentage of those players don't know what else to look for.
-Eight Decks
-Six-Card Charlie (Fun and doesn't affect much, I also think people would go after it too aggressively)
-Double on Any Number of Cards, but total must be 9-11. (Doesn't add much)
-Split only to two hands.
-No RSA or HSA
-No Surrender
-Hit Soft 17
-No Double After Split
You're looking at about .9355% HE with Basic, before you knock a wee little off of that for my Six Card Charlie and Double on Any Number of cards (except after split) rule. I think I'm giving back roughly .39-.4% with my Six-Card Charlie and Double on Any Number of Cards (before Splitting only), so that's an overall HE of about .53-.54% with Basic on a semi-complicated rule set with lots of opportunity to make errors. Still not a bad HE, really.
All the tables would be electronic with physically dealt cards. Comps would be 5% of theoretical loss.
Anyway, I would advertise the hell out of, "We have 3:2 Blackjack and ALWAYS will!"
Quote: CharlesMousseauSome of the best veal I ever had, to be honest.
I'll be in Vegas next week. Where's more of that veal to be found, if I may ask.
Quote: racquetI'll be in Vegas next week. Where's more of that veal to be found, if I may ask.
That was at the Golden Nugget. I recommend a table with a view of the pool.
Doubled down on a 10 and drew a six. Dealer drew a six card 16 and instead of pushing I won. Seems like dealer loses any hand under 17.
I could advertise I have some of the best odds in town and cater to people looking for that. However, I would rape anyone who's dumb enough to play the worst games in town because I would have lots of those games and machines as well.
Anyone playing games like the big 6 doesn't care about the odds and nothing will change the way they gamble or how much they lose.
I would add a fortune teller booth to each entrance.
I would name my casino Fortune Tellers and design it according to the name.
The Gift Shop and rooms would be stocked with every betting system and voodoo book imaginable.
Quote: AxelWolf
I could advertise I have some of the best odds in town and cater to people looking for that. However, I would rape anyone who's dumb enough to play the worst games in town because I would have lots of those games and machines as well.
If I owned a bar in Las Vegas I would advertise "Over 100% payback video poker available here". Most of my games would be the normal 95%-96% video poker available in bars but I would put a 10/7 Double Bonus on a few machines for quarters. Almost nobody would play it but I reap the benefits of advertising it.
Quote: DRichIf I owned a bar in Las Vegas I would advertise "Over 100% payback video poker available here". Most of my games would be the normal 95%-96% video poker available in bars but I would put a 10/7 Double Bonus on a few machines for quarters. Almost nobody would play it but I reap the benefits of advertising it.
That's an interesting idea, and one I think we've all seen before. A casino puts a "100%" on a bank, but only one or two of the machines has the good game on it.
If *I* had a bar, I would put maybe six games on my machines, all in the 97% range, and put a 2% meter on them. The word would get around, I'd make sure of it. Teams, APs, would all be welcome. I could advertise "best progressives in town", and essentially I would be telling the truth.
Or, maybe lower the line-up but make a $1500 reset. Keep the 2% meter.
If you all remember the Dancer-Kneeland experiment at The M Resort, I feel they were doomed from the start, because they were giving too much away. Plus, the games at reset really stunk. Oh well, no one asked me.
I would also put a good meter on a keno 6-spot, or something like that. I know I've said that before and am repeating myself.
I make deal with AP team, I get half their profits. #Quote: bobbartopThat's an interesting idea, and one I think we've all seen before. A casino puts a "100%" on a bank, but only one or two of the machines has the good game on it.
If *I* had a bar, I would put maybe six games on my machines, all in the 97% range, and put a 2% meter on them. The word would get around, I'd make sure of it. Teams, APs, would all be welcome. I could advertise "best progressives in town", and essentially I would be telling the truth.
Or, maybe lower the line-up but make a $1500 reset. Keep the 2% meter.
If you all remember the Dancer-Kneeland experiment at The M Resort, I feel they were doomed from the start, because they were giving too much away. Plus, the games at reset really stunk. Oh well, no one asked me.
I would also put a good meter on a keno 6-spot, or something like that. I know I've said that before and am repeating myself.
5%meters.
Quote: AxelWolfI make deal with AP team, I get half their profits. #
5%meters.
Ok, 5% meter, but only game is Joker-Two Pair. If they can beat it, bring it. lol
Quote: CharlesMousseauBy all means, name drop away. It was a very good dinner. Some of the best veal I ever had, to be honest.
I know it tastes good, but I live next to veal farms. It's awful. I try to avoid driving where I will see them in those little boxes. Very sad. I boycott it.
