calculating house advantage on 2:1 online game
March 6th, 2013 at 5:00:08 AM
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I found an online blackjack game with the following rule variations;
Hands dealt from an 8 deck shoe
After each hand is played, a new 8 deck shoe is used to deal the next hand
Blackjack pays 2 to 1
Dealer hits on soft 17
No double down
Split pairs once
No surrender
Assuming the rest of the rules are standard, what is the house advantage for this game....if WoO BS is followed? Thanks :)
Hands dealt from an 8 deck shoe
After each hand is played, a new 8 deck shoe is used to deal the next hand
Blackjack pays 2 to 1
Dealer hits on soft 17
No double down
Split pairs once
No surrender
Assuming the rest of the rules are standard, what is the house advantage for this game....if WoO BS is followed? Thanks :)
March 6th, 2013 at 5:38:35 AM
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Sounds as if this is the same as shuffling and re-introducing the discards at the end of each hand.
March 6th, 2013 at 7:17:38 AM
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Looks like a player advantage of about 1.27%, minus whatever the cost of not being allowed to double is.
"So as the clock ticked and the day passed, opportunity met preparation, and luck happened." - Maurice Clarett
March 6th, 2013 at 12:08:55 PM
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Are you sure about these rules or you forgot any other rule variations. It could be that there is a small positive EV for the player under such rules but I do not have an accurate figure. I get an estimate figure of around +0.3% for the player but I could be wrong.
March 6th, 2013 at 12:20:07 PM
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Why would you ever beet at a place with this in their rules / Just asking.
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March 7th, 2013 at 12:36:50 AM
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March 7th, 2013 at 2:47:42 AM
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Using the wizard's calculator I get a house edge of 0.82%, before factoring the 2-1 on blackjacks and no doubling.
If my math calculation are correct, and I am 99.99% certain they are, then:
2-1 on blackjacks is worth 2.26% advantage to the player.
No doubling is worth 1.37% advantage to the dealer.
So the house edge is 0.82% -2.26% + 1.37% = -0.07%. (In favor of the player)
Min bet is $1 , Max bet is $25
So, correct me if I'm wrong here, but:
Assuming you play just 150 hands an hour, the promotion is available for 6 hours on Fridays, and you bet $25 a hand:
150 hands/hr x 6 hrs = 900 hands.
Winning percentage with BS is .507% , Losing percentage with BS is .493%
900 hands x .507% = 456.3 winning hands
900 hands x .493% = 443.7 losing hands
At $25 a hand:
456.3 winning hands = $11,407.5 won in 6 hours
443.7 losing hands = $11,092.5 lost in 6 hours
11,407.5 - 11,092.5 = $315 won in 6 hours (based on player advantage perfectly following BS)
Am I missing something here?
If my math calculation are correct, and I am 99.99% certain they are, then:
2-1 on blackjacks is worth 2.26% advantage to the player.
No doubling is worth 1.37% advantage to the dealer.
So the house edge is 0.82% -2.26% + 1.37% = -0.07%. (In favor of the player)
Min bet is $1 , Max bet is $25
So, correct me if I'm wrong here, but:
Assuming you play just 150 hands an hour, the promotion is available for 6 hours on Fridays, and you bet $25 a hand:
150 hands/hr x 6 hrs = 900 hands.
Winning percentage with BS is .507% , Losing percentage with BS is .493%
900 hands x .507% = 456.3 winning hands
900 hands x .493% = 443.7 losing hands
At $25 a hand:
456.3 winning hands = $11,407.5 won in 6 hours
443.7 losing hands = $11,092.5 lost in 6 hours
11,407.5 - 11,092.5 = $315 won in 6 hours (based on player advantage perfectly following BS)
Am I missing something here?
March 10th, 2013 at 4:27:48 PM
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I think by playing as I have stated above, coupled with good money management, will equal a winning game here.
March 10th, 2013 at 4:34:49 PM
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Player's edge = 0.0681%.
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March 10th, 2013 at 5:56:29 PM
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Quote: gravity89Using the wizard's calculator I get a house edge of 0.82%, before factoring the 2-1 on blackjacks and no doubling.
If my math calculation are correct, and I am 99.99% certain they are, then:
2-1 on blackjacks is worth 2.26% advantage to the player.
No doubling is worth 1.37% advantage to the dealer.
So the house edge is 0.82% -2.26% + 1.37% = -0.07%. (In favor of the player)
Min bet is $1 , Max bet is $25
So, correct me if I'm wrong here, but:
Assuming you play just 150 hands an hour, the promotion is available for 6 hours on Fridays, and you bet $25 a hand:
150 hands/hr x 6 hrs = 900 hands.
Winning percentage with BS is .507% , Losing percentage with BS is .493%
900 hands x .507% = 456.3 winning hands
900 hands x .493% = 443.7 losing hands
At $25 a hand:
456.3 winning hands = $11,407.5 won in 6 hours
443.7 losing hands = $11,092.5 lost in 6 hours
11,407.5 - 11,092.5 = $315 won in 6 hours (based on player advantage perfectly following BS)
Am I missing something here?
You must be missing something. I think you've also made the math more complicated than it needs to be. 900 hands * $25/hand * .07% player edge per hand= $15.75 session win.
"So as the clock ticked and the day passed, opportunity met preparation, and luck happened." - Maurice Clarett
March 10th, 2013 at 11:50:22 PM
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Gotcha
March 11th, 2013 at 1:14:08 PM
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Quote: teliotPlayer's edge = 0.0681%.
Interesting that they offer a Positive expectation game even though it is such a small edge.
Teliot, I assume your figures are for for Total Dependent strategy, so for composition Dependent strategy it would be slighly bigger.
If they offer also bonuses etc for playing this game then this is an interesting game for someone to pursue.
March 11th, 2013 at 5:44:12 PM
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Quote: AceTwoInteresting that they offer a Positive expectation game even though it is such a small edge.
I'm not entirely surprised, if I'm not mistaken, many casinos charge a fee of some sort whenever you want to cash out. You'd have to play an insane amount (at EV) to eventually overcome the fee.
https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/gripes/11182-pet-peeves/120/#post815219
March 20th, 2013 at 1:12:03 AM
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$16 a week plus the bonuses from the casino still make this a pretty intriguing deal for some...
March 20th, 2013 at 1:39:40 AM
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Good luck getting a royal
I am a robot.
April 5th, 2013 at 11:51:53 AM
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After each hand played, a new 4 deck shoe is shuffled and dealt.
Blackjack pays 2/1.
Dealer hits on soft 17.
Double down on 10 and 11, even after splits.
Split any pair once.
Late surrender available.
Insurance pays 9/4.
Player loses ties on 17.
How about this one?
Blackjack pays 2/1.
Dealer hits on soft 17.
Double down on 10 and 11, even after splits.
Split any pair once.
Late surrender available.
Insurance pays 9/4.
Player loses ties on 17.
How about this one?
April 5th, 2013 at 12:23:39 PM
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Quote: gravity89After each hand played, a new 4 deck shoe is shuffled and dealt.
Blackjack pays 2/1.
Dealer hits on soft 17.
Double down on 10 and 11, even after splits.
Split any pair once.
Late surrender available.
Insurance pays 9/4.
Player loses ties on 17.
How about this one?
House edge changes from 8 deck, S17, DOA, DAS game:
Four decks +0.06%
Blackjacks pay 2 to 1 +2.27%
Dealer hits on soft 17 -0.22%
Player may double on 10,11 only -0.18%
Player may not resplit -0.10%
Late surrender against ten +0.07%
Player loses 17 ties -1.87%
Net changes: +0.03%
The player disavantage from an 8 deck S17 DOA DAS game shuffling after every hand is: -0.43096%
So the game you described is about -0.4096% to the player, or 0.4096% house edge.
April 6th, 2013 at 9:35:27 PM
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I played yesterday and won just shy of $250 in 5 hours....which goes right along with my math I used before, listed below. Can someone walk me through where I am messing up the math here? Is the player advantage in this game not 7/10ths of a percent as I have put into my calculations below?
Assuming you play just 150 hands an hour, the promotion is available for 6 hours on Fridays, and you bet $25 a hand:
150 hands/hr x 6 hrs = 900 hands.
Winning percentage with BS is .507% , Losing percentage with BS is .493%
900 hands x .507% = 456.3 winning hands
900 hands x .493% = 443.7 losing hands
At $25 a hand:
456.3 winning hands = $11,407.5 won in 6 hours
443.7 losing hands = $11,092.5 lost in 6 hours
11,407.5 - 11,092.5 = $315 won in 6 hours (based on player advantage perfectly following BS)
Assuming you play just 150 hands an hour, the promotion is available for 6 hours on Fridays, and you bet $25 a hand:
150 hands/hr x 6 hrs = 900 hands.
Winning percentage with BS is .507% , Losing percentage with BS is .493%
900 hands x .507% = 456.3 winning hands
900 hands x .493% = 443.7 losing hands
At $25 a hand:
456.3 winning hands = $11,407.5 won in 6 hours
443.7 losing hands = $11,092.5 lost in 6 hours
11,407.5 - 11,092.5 = $315 won in 6 hours (based on player advantage perfectly following BS)
May 19th, 2013 at 1:42:44 PM
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0.007 x 25 = $0.175 a hand
900 hands = $157.50
900 hands = $157.50
May 19th, 2013 at 4:16:44 PM
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Quote: redsfan0.007 x 25 = $0.175 a hand
900 hands = $157.50
0.07 per cent = 0.0007
Yo field, yo come, both gunna get you some!
May 19th, 2013 at 6:00:52 PM
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Quote: AceTwoInteresting that they offer a Positive expectation game even though it is such a small edge.
Locals casinos in Vegas would sometimes offer a positive expectation on a low maximum game. A true card counter would never play at such small betting spread, and they could always ask someone to leave. Reality is most people can't play accurately anyway, and they make money on idiots and on selling other stuff. They do better by attracting people into the casino.
