AlanMendelson
AlanMendelson
Joined: Oct 5, 2011
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July 31st, 2022 at 5:20:50 PM permalink
Quote: Ace2

Quote: AlanMendelson


But making an informed decision involves more than just the house edge on a bet.
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Assuming you enjoy playing a certain game, what does an informed decision involve besides knowing the edge (and variance) of a bet?

Let me guess: skill level of the shooter, elapsed time since a 7 has been rolled, hot/cold table status and moon phase
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Is this a serious response or are you just trying to be a troll?
AxelWolf
AxelWolf
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July 31st, 2022 at 9:42:30 PM permalink
Alan, Just play poker, math is probably 3rd or 4th least important aspect of the game. Oftentimes, the super mathy guys suck at poker.

With that being said, EVRYTHING is based on math.
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
AlanMendelson
AlanMendelson
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July 31st, 2022 at 9:49:18 PM permalink
Quote: AxelWolf

Alan, Just play poker, math is probably 3rd or 4th least important aspect of the game. Oftentimes, the super mathy guys suck at poker.

With that being said, EVRYTHING is based on math.
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Math is 3rd or 4th least important? I thought it was the most important aspect of the game.

You dont play much poker, do you?

You probably never heard the phrase "you can't bluff the guy holding a royal flush."

And by the way, economic utility is math.
DeMango
DeMango
Joined: Feb 2, 2010
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August 1st, 2022 at 2:34:43 PM permalink
Quote: AlanMendelson

Quote: MrV

To what degree do ploppies factor math into their gambling decisions?

If little or none, what then drives their decision making?
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No one said there aren't morons in this world.

But making an informed decision involves more than just the house edge on a bet.
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Hi Lo Yo The original bet for the mentally challenged
When a rock is thrown into a pack of dogs, the one that yells the loudest is the one who got hit.
AxelWolf
AxelWolf
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August 1st, 2022 at 6:28:35 PM permalink
Quote: AlanMendelson

Quote: AxelWolf

Alan, Just play poker, math is probably 3rd or 4th least important aspect of the game. Oftentimes, the super mathy guys suck at poker.

With that being said, EVRYTHING is based on math.
link to original post



Math is 3rd or 4th least important? I thought it was the most important aspect of the game.

You dont play much poker, do you?

You probably never heard the phrase "you can't bluff the guy holding a royal flush."

And by the way, economic utility is math.
link to original post



I'm more than willing to play you some HU NLHE: Make it 3 sessions of at least 1k buy-in per session. I promise not to use any exact math.

If you're dumb enough to bluff into someone holding a Royal flush, that's not a math issue, that's a bad read of the entire situation.

Logic, theory, reading players, putting people on hands, knowing what somome is capable of, their range, their tendencies, and beating patterns are all more important than math when it comes to poker.

I didn't say math isn't important, obviously knowing the odds of hitting a drawing hand when you believe you are beaten is important among all the other math-related things. I bet many of the pros don't know the exact odds of hitting their outs needed, especially when it comes to that and calculating pot odds during play.
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
Seedvalue
Seedvalue
Joined: Apr 5, 2022
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August 1st, 2022 at 6:46:33 PM permalink
Quote: AxelWolf

Quote: AlanMendelson

Quote: AxelWolf

Alan, Just play poker, math is probably 3rd or 4th least important aspect of the game. Oftentimes, the super mathy guys suck at poker.

With that being said, EVRYTHING is based on math.
link to original post



Math is 3rd or 4th least important? I thought it was the most important aspect of the game.

You dont play much poker, do you?

You probably never heard the phrase "you can't bluff the guy holding a royal flush."

And by the way, economic utility is math.
link to original post



I'm more than willing to play you some HU NLHE: Make it 3 sessions of at least 1k buy-in per session. I promise not to use any exact math.

If you're dumb enough to bluff into someone holding a Royal flush, that's not a math issue, that's a bad read of the entire situation.

Logic, theory, reading players, putting people on hands, knowing what somome is capable of, their range, their tendencies, and beating patterns are all more important than math when it comes to poker.

I didn't say math isn't important, obviously knowing the odds of hitting a drawing hand when you believe you are beaten is important among all the other math-related things. I bet many of the pros don't know the exact odds of hitting their outs needed, especially when it comes to that and calculating pot odds during play.
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In this hypothetical match if there was a time bank and blinds involved I would advise Alan to use his entire time bank every decision. He should randomize two bets sizes for his entire range.
2x and ALL INN and make it a pre flop, flop, and turn game only.

3 1k HU sessions of NL is such a small sample this should give the amateur Alan a good shot at beating the Pro axel if heís unable to assign a proper range to Alanís strategy
AlanMendelson
AlanMendelson
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August 1st, 2022 at 7:09:29 PM permalink
I'm not exactly an amateur. Several years ago my son and I finished second in Card Player Magazine's national father-son tournament.

It was my fault we didnt win the whole thing.

At the final table it was me and two sons.

I had AJ off.

The other two players went all in. My strategy was to let them eliminate one other player, leaving us a free ride to second place.

One son had A3, the other KQ.

Both missed the board and A3 won.

Of course my AJ would have won knocking out one player and dominating the A3 with chips.

My error, says my son.
AxelWolf
AxelWolf
Joined: Oct 10, 2012
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August 1st, 2022 at 9:47:03 PM permalink
Quote: AlanMendelson

I'm not exactly an amateur. Several years ago my son and I finished second in Card Player Magazine's national father-son tournament.

It was my fault we didnt win the whole thing.

At the final table it was me and two sons.

I had AJ off.

The other two players went all in. My strategy was to let them eliminate one other player, leaving us a free ride to second place.

One son had A3, the other KQ.

Both missed the board and A3 won.

Of course my AJ would have won knocking out one player and dominating the A3 with chips.

My error, says my son.
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Then this should be an easy bet for you.. I will even make it better for you, I will slam 4 shots before I even start playing... I have a feeling Mike would be willing to host a poker night for this.

Heck, if you don't want to play me HE, perhaps just a smaller blind game 1/2 - 2/5 NL Holdem or dealers choice, and we both agree to buy in for at least $500, I don't care what amount really, the more the better.
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
AxelWolf
AxelWolf
Joined: Oct 10, 2012
  • Threads: 154
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August 1st, 2022 at 9:47:08 PM permalink
Quote: AlanMendelson

I'm not exactly an amateur. Several years ago my son and I finished second in Card Player Magazine's national father-son tournament.

It was my fault we didnt win the whole thing.

At the final table it was me and two sons.

I had AJ off.

The other two players went all in. My strategy was to let them eliminate one other player, leaving us a free ride to second place.

One son had A3, the other KQ.

Both missed the board and A3 won.

Of course my AJ would have won knocking out one player and dominating the A3 with chips.

My error, says my son.
link to original post

Then this should be an easy bet for you.. I will even make it better for you, I will slam 4 shots before I even start playing... I have a feeling Mike would be willing to host a poker night for this.

Heck, if you don't want to play me HE, perhaps just a smaller blind game 1/2 - 2/5 NL Holdem or dealers choice, and we both agree to buy in for at least $500, I don't care what amount really, the more the better.
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
AlanMendelson
AlanMendelson
Joined: Oct 5, 2011
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August 1st, 2022 at 11:28:37 PM permalink
Axelwolf in my cash game playing days when I lived in LA there were always wise guys who would stumble into the casinos after 3am who would take a seat at our $200 table and then go all-in blind every hand.

No one would call unless they were holding AA.

The game would quickly bust up.

You sound like that's what you'd do.

You're no poker player. You're a bully player. You'd show up with ten thousand and force players out by buying every pot.

That type of player uses no skill.

But you'll never find that kind of player in a tournament when each hand could mean your tournament life.

So, in short, your reputation precedes you.

I decline.

By the way, I was also a player at one of the WPT Invitationals and I outlasted Daniel Negreanu and Carlos at my table.

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