curtmack
curtmack
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January 25th, 2010 at 10:56:28 PM permalink
Once a year, the student activity council at my college hosts a "casino night." Since gambling isn't actually allowed in this state, you just get your chips at the door and play for fun.

This particular year, there was an... interesting ruleset for the blackjack table.

- 2 decks with ~95% deck penetration (the dealer eyeballed when it was time to reshuffle)
- Dealer stands on soft 17
- Double on any two cards
- Double after splitting allowed
- Resplit to four hands
- Can resplit aces
- Can hit after splitting aces
- BJ pays 3:2

So, pretty much as good as it gets. But then here's the kicker. The dealer, I think, wasn't quite clear on the rules of Blackjack, and happened to play with these two additional rules:

- Player's natural wins against dealer's natural (and still pays 3:2)
- Naturals after split aces allowed

In other words, if you split aces, and get a ten, that counts as a natural and pays 3:2.

Obviously this is a very profitable (for players) table, but I was curious: what is the actual player advantage for this game?
pocketaces
pocketaces
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January 26th, 2010 at 6:01:40 AM permalink
Without accounting for the extra two rules, the house edge is -0.03527% optimal (requiring composition dependent strategy adjustments) and 0.04173 realistic according to the Wizard's house edge calculator.

Now, adding in those two extra rules, both of which are listed under 'rule variations' on the blackjack page, we can get something close to the final house edge:

Ace and 10 after splitting aces is a blackjack: -0.19%
Blackjack tie pays 3 to 2: -0.32%
Total: -0.51%

Keep in mind these two figures were calculated using 8 decks. I think blackjack ties would occur slightly less in a two deck game, lowering the benefit a bit, however it would not be far off.

Total: about 0.54/0.47 optimal/realistic players edge, with the actual number perhaps being a bit lower due to the effect listed above.

Of course, with the 95 percent penetration, this game would be extremely profitable with card counting. The last few hands would routinely have very large positive or negative counts.
cclub79
cclub79
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January 26th, 2010 at 6:34:30 AM permalink
We've discussed Monte Carlo/Casino Nights before, and since there is no real money at stake, the rules you see would never be seen at a real casino. A "house edge" is not really meaningful (or necessary) if there is no house. It actually does a disservice to those college students. A smart casino would run a Monte Carlo circuit in the area, and have a lot of player advantages to convince new gamblers that it's fun and easy to win (as a teacher, I can say it doesn't take much to convince a teenager/high school/college student that they are really wise and know stuff that no one else ever on the planet has ever figured out)...then they come to the "real" house and it isn't quite as profitable.
DJTeddyBear
DJTeddyBear
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January 26th, 2010 at 7:03:22 AM permalink
Wow. Those are some really liberal rules.

Yeah, I can see how someone playing that could very easily be convinced that they should head to a casino to continue to try thier luck.


By the way, next year you gotta add a Five Card Charlie rule! :)
I invented a few casino games. Info: http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ ————————————————————————————————————— Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
pacomartin
pacomartin
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January 26th, 2010 at 8:36:22 AM permalink
So it is a feel good experience. I have heard of cash games for charity that go the complete opposite direction (like the house wins ties).

I think it would be more fun to go back to 1960 rules for blackjack (before E. Thorpe). Double after split permitted, no re-splitting aces, one card for split aces, no naturals after splitting, doubling on any two cards, 3:2 payout, 95% penetration, single deck, and dealer stands on soft 17, no restrictions on betting except for bankroll. Then you can make it a contest and see who is the best card counter (or best basic strategy player). You can have a prize for the winner.

It would be more fun than giving totally artificial advantages.

It would be interesting to see if a non-card counter wins. I would think with 95% penetration that there would be an overwhelming advantage to the counter.
joenunz
joenunz
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January 26th, 2010 at 11:01:37 AM permalink
My parish has an annual festival (30 years and running) which is a huge fundraiser for the school. There are rides, food, entertainment and a gambling tent. Parents with kids in the school are required to work. I have been dealing “Blackjack” for the last 10 years.

The rules:
• $1 min / $3 max (a few years ago, we had a $5 table, but the house got killed one night and that put an end to that!)
• 4 decks, most dealers let the decks run down to almost the end
• Dealer stands on all 17s
• Double allowed on all hands 11 and under, but…
• Doubling on soft hands makes the hand hard (meaning, doubling on A-4 is doubling on a 5 NOT a 5 or 15
• Blackjack pays 2-1 (so we don’t have to deal with change), but...
• Ties lose

I have a GREAT time dealing, as most people either realize the rules are in hugely favor of the house since this is a fundraiser for the school or this is the one time all year they play blackjack and have no clue.

But my favorite players are the ones who THINK they know what they’re doing….

They complain EVERY time they tie. When I tell them that the ties lose rule is slightly offset by the fact that they get paid 2-1 on Blackjack, I get mostly blank stares. I usually pick someone out every year to try and dissuade them of the fact that “3rd base screws up the table” and of course it never works. In fact, I like to encourage people to split their $1 pair of tens or hit their 17 vs. A (I think the latter is the right play) just because I know it will drive the others crazy!

Always a fun time…

“That’s not how it is in Atlantic City!” they say.
“You’re not in Caesar’s Palace! You’re in St. Greg’s schoolyard!” is my reply.

If you’re in Bellerose, NY at the end of June, stop by the tent and ask for me!
http://www.sgtgfestival.com/
Insurance is closed.
Ibeatyouraces
Ibeatyouraces
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January 26th, 2010 at 11:31:02 AM permalink
deleted
DUHHIIIIIIIII HEARD THAT!
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