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Wizard
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September 7th, 2021 at 8:44:56 PM permalink
I must admit I was asked this puzzle back in July. I have tinkered with it off and on since then. Usually, my efforts led to a contradiction towards the end and I had to start all over. However, I finally got it today.

Here it is:

  1. There are five houses.
  2. The Englishman lives in the red house.
  3. The Spaniard owns the dog.
  4. Coffee is drunk in the green house.
  5. The Ukrainian drinks tea.
  6. The green house is immediately to the right of the ivory house.
  7. The Old Gold smoker owns snails.
  8. Kools are smoked in the yellow house.
  9. Milk is drunk in the middle house.
  10. The Norwegian lives in the first house (from the left).
  11. The man who smokes Chesterfields lives in the house next to the man with the fox.
  12. Kools are smoked in the house next to the house where the horse is kept.
  13. The Lucky Strike smoker drinks orange juice.
  14. The Japanese smokes Parliaments.
  15. The Norwegian lives next to the blue house.


Questions:
Now, who drinks water?
Who owns the zebra?

For extra credit, provide the nationality, color, drink, smoke, and pet in all five house by order.

The parenthetical remark about the Norwegian and the first house is mine.

If you are going to participate in this thread, please don't cheat by searching.

No particular question, other than the puzzle itself. It is time for me to pass on the agony and the ecstasy (hard word to spell).

The question for the puzzle is what do you think of it?
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
rxwine
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September 8th, 2021 at 5:15:28 AM permalink
Moved spoiler down page________________-----------------------
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Part of the answer must be they all drink water. Even the animals. I hope this isn't an aggravating answer where someone argues they only drink some other beverage, because some people do claim to not drink water. Because then the answer might be only the animals.
Last edited by: rxwine on Sep 8, 2021
There's no secret. Just know what you're talking about before you open your mouth.
unJon
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September 8th, 2021 at 7:22:16 AM permalink
I think I’ve done this one before. Isn’t this the Einstein logic game puzzle?
The race is not always to the swift, nor the battle to the strong; but that is the way to bet.
Wizard
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September 8th, 2021 at 7:43:49 AM permalink
Quote: unJon

I think I’ve done this one before. Isn’t this the Einstein logic game puzzle?

  • link to original post



    Some people call it that. There is no evidence, that I'm aware of, that Einstein had anything to do with it.
    "For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
    ThatDonGuy
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    September 8th, 2021 at 8:24:56 AM permalink
    Quote: Wizard


    Questions:
    Now, who drinks water?
    Who owns the zebra?

    For extra credit, provide the nationality, color, drink, smoke, and pet in all five house by order.


    I am assuming that only one person drinks water, and only one owns a zebra.

    So far, I have gotten that the Norwegian drinks water (and lives in the yellow house, and smokes Kools - still working on the pet).

    MrV
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    September 8th, 2021 at 8:32:10 AM permalink
    *scraches head*

    A zebra is never mentioned in the clues, so how can one deduce who owns it?

    Maybe the answer (duh) would have to be "No body owns a zebra."
    "What, me worry?"
    MDawg
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    September 8th, 2021 at 8:41:29 AM permalink
    These sorts of "games" remind me of LSAT questions. You may get better and better at them with practice, but as far as how fast you may solve them, everyone's mind is different and some people will never be able to solve them as quickly as others.

    Basically you have to chart them rapidly, using Venn Diagrams or connecting lines, a sort of overlap or lack of overlap logic, or arranging them in order (hierarchy), and then solve. Anyone who has "studied" for the LSAT remembers doing hundreds of these things, timed.

    This one is more complex than any single LSAT question that I recall, though.

    P.S. I assume the zebra ends up belonging to the one that doesn't own any other named pet? Just a guess I didn't work the puzzle.
    I tell you it’s wonderful to be here, man. I don’t give a damn who wins or loses. It’s just wonderful to be here with you people. https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/gambling/betting-systems/33908-the-adventures-of-mdawg/
    Wizard
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    September 8th, 2021 at 8:44:59 AM permalink
    Quote: ThatDonGuy

    I am assuming that only one person drinks water, and only one owns a zebra.



    That's correct. Every house has a unique owner, pet, drink, smoke, and color.

    Quote: MrV

    A zebra is never mentioned in the clues, so how can one deduce who owns it?

  • link to original post



    It's implied the fifth pet is the zebra. The other four are mentioned.
    "For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
    MrV
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    September 8th, 2021 at 8:48:23 AM permalink
    Ah, I see now, thanks.

    Process of elimination ...
    "What, me worry?"
    Wizard
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    September 8th, 2021 at 8:48:31 AM permalink
    Quote: MDawg

    These sorts of "games" remind me of LSAT questions. You may get better and better at them with practice, but as far as how fast you may solve them, everyone's mind is different and some people will never be able to solve them as quickly as others.

    Basically you have to chart them rapidly, using Venn Diagrams or connecting lines, a sort of overlap or lack of overlap logic, or arranging them in order (hierarchy), and then solve. Anyone who has "studied" for the LSAT remembers doing hundreds of these things, timed.

    This one is more complex than any single LSAT question that I recall, though.

  • link to original post



    This is a tough, tedious, and time-consuming puzzle. I don't think I could solve it in the time it takes to take the LSAT. Especially under time pressure.

    Personally, I spent several hours on it back in July and never solved it. Then I forgot about it for two months. Then I came back to it and after several more hours, finally figured it out. Not just the two questions, but all the connections.

    The person who told me this puzzle said JFK solved it in two hours, but who knows if that's true.
    "For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
    rxwine
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    September 8th, 2021 at 9:21:32 AM permalink
    Quote: Wizard

    That's correct. Every house has a unique owner, pet, drink, smoke, and color.



    Bah. I consider that a flaw then, because that wasn't designated as a condition. Every individual mentioned drinks water in some form.
    There's no secret. Just know what you're talking about before you open your mouth.
    Mission146
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    September 8th, 2021 at 9:38:45 AM permalink
    Quote: Wizard

    I must admit I was asked this puzzle back in July. I have tinkered with it off and on since then. Usually, my efforts led to a contradiction towards the end and I had to start all over. However, I finally got it today.

    Here it is:

    Questions:
    Now, who drinks water?
    Who owns the zebra?

    For extra credit, provide the nationality, color, drink, smoke, and pet in all five house by order.

    The parenthetical remark about the Norwegian and the first house is mine.

    If you are going to participate in this thread, please don't cheat by searching.

    No particular question, other than the puzzle itself. It is time for me to pass on the agony and the ecstasy (hard word to spell).

    The question for the puzzle is what do you think of it?

  • link to original post



    SPOILER: THE SPOILER CONTAINS THE FULL SOLUTION, SO ONLY OPEN IF YOU WANT TO SEE THE FULL SOLUTION

    (Quote clipped to limit duplication)

    Two hours.

    Two hours, Wizard.

    I have been doing this for TWO HOURS?

    Would you like to know why? Because I saw this post and I knew that I could. As usual with these things, the REAL clues are the ones that look like they're not actually helping you that much. Being able to figure it out with just straight positive or straight negative statements would be too easy, but you have to assemble the information you can assemble and look for that tiny little hint that allows process of elimination to remove something.

    Two godforsaken hours. I don't think I can forgive you for this.

    Anyway, these are just like the logic puzzle books you find in the magazine section of the store. Essentially, you have to list each possible condition (House Number, Color, Animal, Drink, Smokes, Nationality) as if you are trying to solve for that and only that, but then put them all together and figure it out when you run out of known facts.

    Essentially, you end up with a statement like, "Because a cannot be b or c, but has to be x or y and y MUST be either b or c, a must be x." That sort of thing.

    Anyway, I did these books all the time when I was growing up because I liked them, they were cheap, I spent a lot of time at my Great-Grandma's, she had no cable and Internet wasn't really a thing in my area yet.

    And, I have now done it again. I had to. Because I knew I could.



    House 1: Norwegian, Yellow, Water, Kools, Fox

    House 2: Ukrainian, Blue, Tea, Chesterfield, Horse

    House 3: Englishman, Red, Milk, Old Gold, Snails

    House 4: Spaniard, Ivory, Orange Juice, Lucky Strike, Dog

    House 5: Japanese, Green, Coffee, Parliament, Zebra


    Proof that I didn't cheat is available, upon request, for the next 24 hours. I have some eight total sides of notebook paper and one piece of computer paper with notes, tables and propositions all over them. I'm throwing them away this time tomorrow because anyone who sees them will think that I am clearly insane. I also can't promise anyone will be able to read these materials.

    Seriously, imagine looking at my paperwork and seeing, "Chesterfield Fox Neighbor," probably think it was some sort of code for who knows what.

    I voted, "I am a bigot." I am not happy. I am not proud. I pity myself because I saw this and almost had no other choice but to figure it out.
    Last edited by: Mission146 on Sep 8, 2021
    https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/gripes/11182-pet-peeves/120/#post815219
    Mission146
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    September 8th, 2021 at 9:39:28 AM permalink
    Quote: ThatDonGuy

    I am assuming that only one person drinks water, and only one owns a zebra.


    So far, I have gotten that the Norwegian drinks water (and lives in the yellow house, and smokes Kools - still working on the pet).

  • link to original post



    Yeah, this would be even tougher if that part hadn't been frontloaded.
    https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/gripes/11182-pet-peeves/120/#post815219
    Mission146
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    September 8th, 2021 at 11:07:56 AM permalink
    Quote: MrV

    *scraches head*

    A zebra is never mentioned in the clues, so how can one deduce who owns it?

    Maybe the answer (duh) would have to be "No body owns a zebra."

  • link to original post



    By knowing what animals go to what other people, houses, beverages, cigarette preference or house color...

    The whole thing is interconnected. The first thing that you have to do is treat separately what you can, then you have to look at things as two-fold propositions...if that changes anything, then go back to seeing if that gives you any separate facts, then back to two-fold propositions, then three-fold...etc.

    The quickest way to do it (I used to be good at these, apparently not anymore) is by having a list of positive statements and a list of NOT statements for each category. Eventually, with the vast majority of these, you end up reduced to process of elimination, so it ends up being important to figure out what TWO OR THREE things cannot simultaneously be true, or even simultaneously be false based on what you know to be false.

    It's really tricky to explain because it kind of combines mathematical logic with verbal logic.
    https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/gripes/11182-pet-peeves/120/#post815219
    Wizard
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    Mission146
    September 8th, 2021 at 11:11:03 AM permalink
    Quote: Mission

    Two hours....



    Congratulations! I checked your answer and agree.

    I may test you with a similar puzzle the next time you're in Vegas.

    As for me, I initially used air sickness bags on the Alaska Ferry for notes. After I returned home, I did everything in Excel.
    "For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
    Mission146
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    September 8th, 2021 at 11:13:00 AM permalink
    Quote: Wizard

    Congratulations! I checked your answer and agree.

    I may test you with a similar puzzle the next time you're in Vegas.

    As for me, I initially used air sickness bags on the Alaska Ferry for notes. After I returned home, I did everything in Excel.

  • link to original post



    Excel would be tough for me to use. I prefer just a notebook and a pen.

    Thank you for the congratulations, but I decline your challenge in advance, unless that's the only proof you'll accept that I didn't cheat. I strongly dislike these sorts of puzzles (even though I liked them when I was a kid) and avoid them at all costs.

    I found no enjoyment, satisfaction or relief in solving it. I was mainly irritated that I'm apparently much slower than I was when I was legally a child. I also have a headache.

    Actually, not just legally. I was definitely faster at this as an actual child.
    https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/gripes/11182-pet-peeves/120/#post815219
    billryan
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    September 8th, 2021 at 11:32:51 AM permalink
    It took me twelve minutes to come up with what I guess is the wrong answer.
    The difference between fiction and reality is that fiction is supposed to make sense.
    Mission146
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    September 8th, 2021 at 11:37:05 AM permalink
    Quote: billryan

    It took me twelve minutes to come up with what I guess is the wrong answer.

  • link to original post



    I'll be irate if it isn't. lol
    https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/gripes/11182-pet-peeves/120/#post815219
    billryan
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    September 8th, 2021 at 11:45:27 AM permalink
    This time, I'm going to use pencil and paper.
    The difference between fiction and reality is that fiction is supposed to make sense.
    Mission146
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    September 8th, 2021 at 12:49:21 PM permalink
    For anyone who wants a full solution, please see below:

    1. There are five houses.
    2. The Englishman lives in the red house.
    3. The Spaniard owns the dog.
    4. Coffee is drunk in the green house.
    5. The Ukrainian drinks tea.
    6. The green house is immediately to the right of the ivory house.
    7. The Old Gold smoker owns snails.
    8. Kools are smoked in the yellow house.
    9. Milk is drunk in the middle house.
    10. The Norwegian lives in the first house (from the left).
    11. The man who smokes Chesterfields lives in the house next to the man with the fox.
    12. Kools are smoked in the house next to the house where the horse is kept.
    13. The Lucky Strike smoker drinks orange juice.
    14. The Japanese smokes Parliaments.
    15. The Norwegian lives next to the blue house.



    House 1: +NORWEGIAN +YELLOW +KOOLS +WATER +FOX
    House 2: +BLUE +HORSE + UKRANIAN + TEA + CHESTERFIELD
    House 3: +MILK
    House 4:
    House 5:

    Englishman: +REDHOUSE (NOT WATER) (NOT KOOLS)
    Spaniard: +DOG (NOT WATER) (NOT KOOLS) (NOT YELLOW)
    Ukranian: +TEA (NOT KOOLS) (NOT YELLOW)
    Norwegian: +HOUSE 1 ///BLUENEXTDOOR +YELLOWHOUSE (NOT Coffee) (NOT Milk) (NOT Tea)
    Japanese: +PARLIAMENTS (NOT YELLOW) (NOT WATER)

    Red House: +ENGLISHMAN
    Green House: +COFFEE +RIGHTOFIVORYHOUSE (NOT "House 1") (NOT Ukranian) (NOT "House 3") (NOT Norweigian) (NOT Englishman) ("NOT House 2")
    Blue House: ///NORWEGIANNEXTDOOR
    Ivory House: +LEFTOFGREENHOUSE (Not "House 5")
    Yellow House: +HOUSE1

    Old Gold: +SNAILS
    Kools: +YELLOWHOUSE ///NEXTTOHORSEHOUSE
    Chesterfields: ///NEXTTOFOXHOUSE
    Parliaments: +JAPANESE
    Lucky Strike: +ORANGEJUICE

    Fox: ///CHESTERFIELDNEXTDOOR
    Horse: ///KOOLSNEXTDOOR
    Zebra: Don't Bother***
    Dog: +SPANIARD
    Snails: +OLDGOLD

    Milk: +HOUSE3
    Orange Juice: +LUCKYSTRIKE
    Tea: +UKRANIAN
    Coffee: +GREENHOUSE
    Water: Don't Bother***

    NOTE KEYS:

    +---The plus sign means this definitely goes with this.

    (NOT)---This means this does not go with this.

    ///---Slashes tell you about something closely related. These are usually secretly the most helpful.

    ***You don't bother with these because you are told nothing about them other than they exist.

    EARLY SOLUTIONS

    1.) We are told that the Norwegian lives in the first house (10) and next to the blue house (15), so the second house must be the blue house.

    2.) We know that the Green House drinks coffee and is NOT the first house, because the Norwegian lives there. We also know that it is not the first house, because the first house is not to the right of anything. From 1.), we know that the second house IS blue, so the green house cannot be the blue house. We KNOW that the green house MUST be to the right of the ivory house, so it cannot be HOUSE 3, or it would be to the right of the blue house.

    Therefore, the Green House MUST either be House 4 or House 5

    3.) We KNOW that House 1 cannot be the Ivory House because the house to its right is Blue and the Green House must be to the right of the Ivory House. We KNOW that House 1 cannot be Red because the Norwegian lives there and Red MUST belong to the Englishman. Therefore, House 1 is NOT Red, Ivory, Green, or Blue and MUST be Yellow.

    4.) We KNOW that the Norwegian does NOT drink coffee, because coffee is drunk in the Green House. We KNOW that the Norwegian does not drink Milk, because milk is drunk in the third house. We KNOW that the Norwegian does not drink Tea because the Ukranian drinks Tea. The Norwegian must drink either water or orange juice.

    5.) We KNOW that House 1 is the Norwegian and is Yellow, thus, House 1 MUST smoke Kools.

    6.) The smoker of Lucky Strikes drinks orange juice, House 1 smokes Kools...House 1 is the Norwegian, the Norwegian does NOT drink coffee, milk or tea...now we know he also doesn't drink orange juice, so House 1 CAN ONLY drink water.

    7.) Because Kools ARE smoked in the house next to the horse, and House 1 smokes the Kools, the Horse MUST be in House 2.

    8.) The Green House drinks Coffee and MUST be House 4 or House 5. House 3 drinks milk.

    9.) House 3 does NOT smoke Kools because House 1 does. House 3 does NOT smoke Lucky Strikes because that person drinks orange juice. Here are the possibilities for House 3:

    Smokes Old Gold + Owns Snails
    Smokes Parliaments and is Japanese
    Smokes Chesterfields and lives next to a man with a fox---House #4 would have a fox, in this case.

    10.) The Ukranian drinks tea, so CANNOT live in House 3 and Does Not live in House 1, because that is the Norwegian. The Ukranian does NOT smoke Kools because House 1 smokes those. The Ukranian does NOT smoke Parliaments because he is not Japanese. The Ukranian does NOT smoke Lucky Strikes because he does not drink orange juice. Therefore, the possibilities:

    The Ukranian smokes Old Gold and owns snails.
    Smokes Chesterfields and lives next to a house with a fox.

    11.) IF the Ukranian smokes Chesterfields, then he MUST live in House #2 and a Fox MUST live in House #1 or House #3.

    12.) The Ukranian can NOT live in a Green House because he drinks tea and the Green House drinks coffee.

    13.) (LEAP OF FAITH) Clue #15 references the Norwegian living next to the blue house, which is House #2. Clue #11 is the only other clue that cares about what a neighbor is doing that doesn't involve house color and answers the only thing we don't know about House #1, if true. SEE #14 and #15...

    14.) House 1 does NOT have a Horse, because a Horse lives in House 2. House 1 is NOT the Spaniard, so does not have a dog. House 1 does NOT smoke Old Gold, so does not keep Snails.

    House 1 either has a fox or a zebra.

    15.) (LEAP OF FAITH) A clue for House 1 refers to House 2. If House 1 has a fox, then that would mean a clue for House 2 would be referring back to House 1. More than that, ZEBRA and WATER are the only two items for which we are not provided any facts, but we already know WATER goes to House 1 because nothing else can go there, so would WATER and ZEBRA really both go to House 1? Doubtful.

    This would also complete Houses 1 and 2.

    Also, can go back and change this if it doesn't work out...so put *** as a point of uncertainty.

    16.) The remaining three houses are red, ivory and green. The green house MUST NOT be the third house, because it must go to the right of the ivory house. Here are the possibilities:

    Red-Ivory-Green

    Ivory-Green-Red

    TAKE AN INVENTORY OF REMAINING ITEMS AND RESTART

    House 1: +NORWEGIAN +YELLOW +KOOLS +WATER +FOX
    House 2: +BLUE +HORSE + UKRANIAN + TEA + CHESTERFIELD
    House 3: +MILK +RED +ENGLISHMAN + OLD GOLD +SNAILS
    House 4: +SPANIARD +DOG +IVORY +ORANGE JUICE +LUCKY STRIKES
    House 5: +JAPANESE +PARLIAMENTS +COFFEE +GREEN +ZEBRA

    Smokes:
    Parliament +JAPANESE
    Lucky Strike (NOTJAPANESE)
    Old Gold (NOTJAPANESE) + SNAILS

    Houses:
    House 3 (NOT GREEN) (NOT SPANIARD)
    House 4
    House 5 (NOT IVORY)

    Colors:
    Red +ENGLISHMAN
    Green (NOT HOUSE 3) +COFFEE
    Ivory (NOT HOUSE 5)

    People:
    Japanese +PARLIAMENT
    Englishman +RED HOUSE
    Spaniard +DOG (NOT HOUSE 3) +LUCKY STRIKES + ORANGE JUICE (NOT RED) (NOT GREEN) +IVORY +HOUSE4

    Pets:
    Dog +SPANIARD
    Snails +OLDGOLD
    Zebra Don't Bother

    Drinks:
    Milk: +HOUSE 3
    Orange Juice: +LUCKY STRIKES +SPANIARD
    Coffee: +GREENHOUSE

    17.) House 3 drinks milk. The Green House drinks coffee. House 3 cannot be green, but we already knew that. House 3 does NOT smoke Lucky Strikes because that is what Orange Juice smokes. Possibilities for House 3:

    +MILK
    ---Is Ivory or Red
    -Smokes Parliaments and is Japanese or smokes Old Gold and has snails.

    FACT: The Spaniard is NOT Japanese. The Spaniard does NOT have snails because he has a dog. The Spaniard CANNOT live in House 3 because he does not satisfy either of the possible conditions.

    18.) The Spaniard CANNOT smoke Old Gold because he has a dog. The Spaniard CANNOT smoke Parliaments because he is not Japanese.

    19.) The Spaniard MUST smoke Lucky Strikes.

    20.) The Spaniard lives either in House 4 or House 5.

    21.) The Spaniard cannot live in a green house, because he drinks Orange Juice and smokes Lucky Strikes. The Green House drinks Coffee. The Green House CAN NOT be House 3. The Spaniard CAN NOT be House 3. The Spaniard MUST live in House 4 which MUST be Ivory.

    22.) House 3 MUST be the Red House and the Englishman lives in the red house.

    23.) The Japanese smokes Parliaments and the only other cigarette brand is Old Gold, so the Englishman who lives in Red House 3 must smoke Old Gold and have Snails.

    24.) The Japanese smokes Parliaments and lives in House 5 Green and must have a zebra because there are no other animals.


    Okay, some of you might question the legitimacy of Step #15, but that's a perfectly legitimate tactic for these. The most important thing is not to do that really early in one of these puzzles and always make a note of where your, "Point of Departure," was at.

    The big thing if you are going to do something like Step #15 is to not have assumed anything before that and DON'T assume anything after that. Otherwise, it will be hard to tell where you went wrong. If you make exactly ONE assumption or educated guess, but you are 100% sure everything before that was right, then you know where you need to go back and restart if you end up with a contradiction later on.

    Had the assumption in Step #15 been wrong, then we would have known:

    The Ukranian smokes Old Gold and has Snails


    And, could operate starting from the other binary possibility...except the possibility would have become FACT because we would know that the first possibility that we used as an assumption was wrong.
    Last edited by: Mission146 on Sep 8, 2021
    https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/gripes/11182-pet-peeves/120/#post815219
    Mission146
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    September 8th, 2021 at 12:50:22 PM permalink
    Quote: billryan

    This time, I'm going to use pencil and paper.

  • link to original post



    Computers have made me irrelevant...looks like I was born just in time. I might have been useful had I been born 40+ years before I actually was.
    https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/gripes/11182-pet-peeves/120/#post815219
    billryan
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    September 8th, 2021 at 1:34:05 PM permalink
    I suck at math problems but logic ones are way easier for me.
    The difference between fiction and reality is that fiction is supposed to make sense.
    Wizard
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    September 8th, 2021 at 1:38:48 PM permalink
    Interesting method there, Mission. Much different than mine.

    I respect the method of proving by contradiction. I've done other puzzles that way. However, with this one, I tried to add to the full solution one bit of information at a time. See next spoiler tag for how I started.




    I created ten matrices for each combination of the way to match any two items. Here is how it looked blank.


    There were side notes that pertained to the order of the houses.

    Then I simply filled it in, slowly. Most of it was simply this logic, over and over:

    The Wizard lives in a red house
    Mission lives in a blue house
    Wizard has a horse.
    Mission drinks milk.

    We could then say the horse does not live with the milk drinker.
    "For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
    Mission146
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    September 8th, 2021 at 1:46:19 PM permalink
    I also like your method!

    I think our methods play to our strengths. Your method is more analytical in the computer science/programming sense of the term, whereas my method follows more of a verbal logical progression. My mathematical and formal logic is obviously, at least, passable, but approaching the situation verbally is playing most to my strengths.

    I also drew similar charts, but those were mostly just to organize known, "TRUE," propositions and known "FALSE," propositions.
    https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/gripes/11182-pet-peeves/120/#post815219
    Mission146
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    September 8th, 2021 at 1:48:11 PM permalink
    I tried to print out charts, but the computer doesn't seem to know how to tell the printer what to do today and I have no idea how to fix that.
    https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/gripes/11182-pet-peeves/120/#post815219
    rxwine
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    September 8th, 2021 at 1:56:53 PM permalink
    Quote: Mission146

    I tried to print out charts, but the computer doesn't seem to know how to tell the printer what to do today and I have no idea how to fix that.

  • link to original post



    Now add a new complexity turning all of them into aunts, second cousins, married to brothers or who is the half brother of the grandfather.and so forth.

    Then figure out who had the baby with the Irishman, who is now the older cousin, of the stepbrother. .
    There's no secret. Just know what you're talking about before you open your mouth.
    Mission146
    Mission146
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    September 8th, 2021 at 2:08:42 PM permalink
    Quote: rxwine

    Quote: Mission146

    I tried to print out charts, but the computer doesn't seem to know how to tell the printer what to do today and I have no idea how to fix that.

  • link to original post



    Now add a new complexity turning all of them into aunts, second cousins, married to brothers or who is the half brother of the grandfather.and so forth.

    Then figure out who had the baby with the Irishman, who is now the older cousin, of the stepbrother. .
  • link to original post



    I'm originally from West Virginia---sometimes aunts and second cousins are the same person, so that makes it a little easier.
    https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/gripes/11182-pet-peeves/120/#post815219
    billryan
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    September 8th, 2021 at 2:11:15 PM permalink
    https://youtu.be/8A4ADzu-v3s?t=7
    The difference between fiction and reality is that fiction is supposed to make sense.
    Dieter
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    September 8th, 2021 at 4:14:35 PM permalink
    Quote: Mission146



    Two godforsaken hours. I don't think I can forgive you for this.

    Anyway, these are just like the logic puzzle books you find in the magazine section of the store.



  • Binary sudoku are nice and relaxing.
    May the cards fall in your favor.
    Mission146
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    September 8th, 2021 at 4:19:05 PM permalink
    Quote: Dieter

    Quote: Mission146



    Two godforsaken hours. I don't think I can forgive you for this.

    Anyway, these are just like the logic puzzle books you find in the magazine section of the store.



  • Binary sudoku are nice and relaxing.
  • link to original post



    Haha!!!

    Sudoku is actually okay. I got into the Sudoku books a little bit when I worked at the hotel and nothing was going on at the forum.

    It’s fun until you’re breezing through the hardest ones, then you have to stop doing it for several months so that you suck and it’s a challenge again.
    https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/gripes/11182-pet-peeves/120/#post815219
    Dieter
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    September 8th, 2021 at 4:22:08 PM permalink
    Quote: Mission146

    Quote: Dieter

    Quote: Mission146



    Two godforsaken hours. I don't think I can forgive you for this.

    Anyway, these are just like the logic puzzle books you find in the magazine section of the store.



  • Binary sudoku are nice and relaxing.
  • link to original post



    Haha!!!

    Sudoku is actually okay. I got into the Sudoku books a little bit when I worked at the hotel and nothing was going on at the forum.

    It’s fun until you’re breezing through the hardest ones, then you have to stop doing it for several months so that you suck and it’s a challenge again.
  • link to original post



    You start with a 10x10 grid, with 1 cell filled in.
    You should be able to get all 100 cells solved with that.

    You also get to play with the crayons.
    May the cards fall in your favor.
    gordonm888
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    Mission146
    September 8th, 2021 at 5:06:29 PM permalink
    I tried this soon after Wizard first posted it. I developed a solution, and as I was checking I found that only condition #15 was violated ("The Norwegian lives next to the Blue House" - but not in my solution.)

    I have been so busy, I haven't had a chance to tackle it since. But I'm amazed that JFK found two hours to work on this. I think he might have solved it even faster if they had replaced the Pets category with "Movie Starlets being boinked."
    So many better men, a few of them friends, are dead. And a thousand thousand slimy things live on, and so do I.
    ThatDonGuy
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    September 9th, 2021 at 7:51:59 AM permalink
    Quote: Mission146

    Okay, some of you might question the legitimacy of Step #15, but that's a perfectly legitimate tactic for these. The most important thing is not to do that really early in one of these puzzles and always make a note of where your, "Point of Departure," was at.


    I solved it (finally, after about 10 attempts that resulted in errors) without making that assumption:

    1, Norwegian, Yellow, Water, Fox, Kool
    2, Ukrainian, Blue, Tea, Horse, Chesterfield
    3, English, Red, Milk, Snail, Old Gold
    4, Spaniard, Ivory, Orange Juice, Dog, Lucky Strike
    5, Japan, Green, Coffee, Zebra, Parliament


    I have been doing these, on and off, for something like 50 years - they're called "Logic Problems" by Dell Publications. I use the "chart" method the Wizard uses.
    The solution is pretty much, "Begin with the initial conditions, then, for each known pair (e.g. Kool and Yellow), mark off the pairs that are not possible; eventually, all of the pairs are known.
    There are some additional things that needed to be noted in this one:

    Clue 6: The green house is immediately to the right of the ivory house.
    This means that the green house is not 1, and the ivory house is not 5; since the blue house is 2 (by clues 10 and 15), the ivory house cannot be 1, and the green house cannot be 3. This means the ivory and green houses are either 3 and 4 or 4 and 5, so house 4 cannot be red or yellow (we already know it is not blue).

    Clue 12: Kools are smoked in the house next to the house where the horse is kept.
    You can determine early on that Kools are smoked in 1, so Horse must be in 2.

    Clue 11: The man who smokes Chesterfields lives in the house next to the man with the fox.
    When you determine where Chesterfields are smoked, you can eliminate Fox from the three locations not next to that one.

    Mission146
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    September 9th, 2021 at 8:49:24 AM permalink
    Congratulations!

    I still maintain that assumptions are a defensible tactic if you get to the point where you're making a binary assumption that solves for multiple things simultaneously. I was able to complete this in two attempts, (my first attempt showed my rust) but it would have most likely been three even if my assumption had been wrong.

    This would definitely be in the, "Challenging," section of those books, though, or whatever vernacular your particular books used.
    https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/gripes/11182-pet-peeves/120/#post815219
    Wizard
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    September 23rd, 2021 at 6:34:16 AM permalink
    Here is my newest and longest video on how to solve the Zebra Puzzle. I'm not happy that it doesn't fill the whole screen and don't know why YouTube did that. The original was 1280x720 and it only get expanded in my editing software. Oh well, it's not like I expect a lot of people to watch it.


    Direct: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HaNSHQOrSX8
    "For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
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