elisonw1
elisonw1
Joined: Mar 4, 2021
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March 4th, 2021 at 6:53:17 AM permalink
Hello everyone,
as my title suggests i am trying to convert the spreadsheet from the wizard of odds youtube video (can be found on youtube by searching Blackjack Basic Strategy for Infinite Decks) to apply the following rules:

1)Dealer stands on soft 17
2)Dealer does not peek for bj (european rule), but the rules of the online table say that if the dealer has a card value of 10 , and the dealer results in BJ my doublebet is returned.
3)Double allowed on any hand value.
4)Double allowed after splitting.
5)Split allowed, i can draw after split on all cards except Aces.
6)Resplit not allowed
7) Decks in total: 8
8)Deck used before the shoe is changed : about 4

You might think that i can find ready charts with all these rules , but i also want to use the spreadsheet as a cardcounter but not on the traditional way with TC.
Instead of counting highs and lows like in every casino, i want to take advantage of the fact that i am playing from the comfort of my home, where i can count every card, subtracting it from the deck, and each time the spreadsheet adjusts for the better choice based on the cards left.
I know the deck penetration is terrible but i thought since i am counting every card, it could still be viable.
Plus i am able to watch a table and count without bettting.

The only thing i have implented till now is the card counting on the dealer spreadsheet ("feel free to correct me since i am not sure i have done this correctly)
Adjusted spreadsheet : I am a new member so i cannot post links yet, if you are interested feel free to message me for the link.

To sum up, if anyone is willing , i would like some help implementing these rules, correcting my counting if it is flawed, and give me your thoughts on the general idea of counting each card instead of highs lows on the current scenario.
fantom
fantom
Joined: Dec 19, 2020
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elisonw1
March 4th, 2021 at 7:18:59 AM permalink
This is an opinion not at all based on the math involved (there are a few mathaholics here who will weigh n in for sure), but my impression is that the game cannot be beat, absent the ability for mid-shoe entry, where you can conduct your back-counting without any tap on the shoulder. My guess is that the biggest detriment is a 50% penetration (4 decks out of 8).

Dealer standing on 17 (S17) is better than the usual hit on 17 (H17), but not being able to resplit pairs other than aces improves the house edge over the usual rule.

All that being said, a spreadsheet or program where you can enter the actual cards being played - the specific value of each card - in order to determine the best play or even just to provide a really precise True Count that is as finely tuned as possible would be an interesting enterprise, regardless of its practical application.

This would not be usable in the real world at an actual table, but if the conditions in an online game allowed this from the comfort of home, and the software gave you the chance to both enter the data as well as see and react to the result in enough time to make a decision before they decide for you due to time expiring... who knows.

Even as a purely abstract exercise (and folks here love to debate how many blackjacks can fit on the head of a pin), learning what is Really Precise Hi Lo (RPHL) when you can know the EXACT condition of the deck would be fun to know.

I doubt there are enough rows and columns in a spreadsheet to accomplish this, so my second wild-ass guess is that there would need to be some pretty substantial programming involved.

Fascinating.
-Mr. Spock
heatmap
heatmap
Joined: Feb 12, 2018
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elisonw1
March 4th, 2021 at 7:29:14 AM permalink
the online casinos algorithms will know you are counting and keep your money for breaking the EULA or whatever its called

i am almost assuming this is evolution gaming blackjack of some sort
OnceDear
Administrator
OnceDear
Joined: Jun 1, 2014
  • Threads: 45
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Thanks for this post from:
elisonw1
March 4th, 2021 at 7:33:15 AM permalink
Quote: elisonw1

Hello everyone,
as my title suggests i am trying to convert the spreadsheet from the wizard of odds youtube video (can be found on youtube by searching Blackjack Basic Strategy for Infinite Decks) to apply the following rules:

1)Dealer stands on soft 17
2)Dealer does not peek for bj (european rule), but the rules of the online table say that if the dealer has a card value of 10 , and the dealer results in BJ my doublebet is returned.
3)Double allowed on any hand value.
4)Double allowed after splitting.
5)Split allowed, i can draw after split on all cards except Aces.
6)Resplit not allowed
7) Decks in total: 8
8)Deck used before the shoe is changed : about 4

You might think that i can find ready charts with all these rules , but i also want to use the spreadsheet as a cardcounter but not on the traditional way with TC.
Instead of counting highs and lows like in every casino, i want to take advantage of the fact that i am playing from the comfort of my home, where i can count every card, subtracting it from the deck, and each time the spreadsheet adjusts for the better choice based on the cards left.
I know the deck penetration is terrible but i thought since i am counting every card, it could still be viable.
Plus i am able to watch a table and count without bettting.

The only thing i have implented till now is the card counting on the dealer spreadsheet ("feel free to correct me since i am not sure i have done this correctly)
Adjusted spreadsheet : I am a new member so i cannot post links yet, if you are interested feel free to message me for the link.

To sum up, if anyone is willing , i would like some help implementing these rules, correcting my counting if it is flawed, and give me your thoughts on the general idea of counting each card instead of highs lows on the current scenario.

Hi,
I've done this and more, taking full composition based deck analysis and dynamically calculated best strategy for the online game you describe. It was fun, but not worth it. Favourable game conditions were rare and when I did do kelly betting adjustments, I made just a few hundred before they closed my account. There are far far more lucrative opportunities online than auto card counting of live dealer BJ
Take care out there. Spare a thought for the newly poor who were happy in their world just a few days ago, but whose whole way of life just collapsed..
elisonw1
elisonw1
Joined: Mar 4, 2021
  • Threads: 1
  • Posts: 4
March 4th, 2021 at 7:33:28 AM permalink
Can you be sure that all online casinos can do this ? i am not aware of people counting cards this way so seems a bit weird that the online casinos already have countermeasures in place
elisonw1
elisonw1
Joined: Mar 4, 2021
  • Threads: 1
  • Posts: 4
March 4th, 2021 at 7:34:32 AM permalink
Quote: OnceDear

Hi,
I've done this and more, taking full composition based deck analysis and dynamically calculated best strategy for the online game you describe. It was fun, but not worth it. Favourable game conditions were rare and when I did do kelly betting adjustments, I made just a few hundred before they closed my account. There are far far more lucrative opportunities online than auto card counting of live dealer BJ



Oh i see, thank you for your input.
OnceDear
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OnceDear
Joined: Jun 1, 2014
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March 4th, 2021 at 7:37:40 AM permalink
Quote: elisonw1

Can you be sure that all online casinos can do this ? i am not aware of people counting cards this way so seems a bit weird that the online casinos already have countermeasures in place

No, I survived a few months, but though they did not ban me for robotic play, they specifically said I was card counting and not welcome. take this to private message for more detail.
Take care out there. Spare a thought for the newly poor who were happy in their world just a few days ago, but whose whole way of life just collapsed..
OnceDear
Administrator
OnceDear
Joined: Jun 1, 2014
  • Threads: 45
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March 4th, 2021 at 7:41:00 AM permalink
Quote: OnceDear

No, I survived a few months, but though they did not ban me for robotic play, they specifically said I was card counting and not welcome. take this to private message for more detail.

I also did some live play with counting manually, While doing so, I spotted two other players conspicuously counting. They soon got booted too.
Remember, all cards are digitally read for display. It's obviously easy for the casino to count and look out for other counters, without human intervention.
Take care out there. Spare a thought for the newly poor who were happy in their world just a few days ago, but whose whole way of life just collapsed..
elisonw1
elisonw1
Joined: Mar 4, 2021
  • Threads: 1
  • Posts: 4
March 4th, 2021 at 7:56:34 AM permalink
Quote: OnceDear

No, I survived a few months, but though they did not ban me for robotic play, they specifically said I was card counting and not welcome. take this to private message for more detail.


Okay i messaged you
Last edited by: elisonw1 on Mar 4, 2021
kewlj
kewlj
Joined: Apr 17, 2012
  • Threads: 211
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March 4th, 2021 at 10:01:57 AM permalink
Quote: OnceDear

I made just a few hundred before they closed my account. There are far far more lucrative opportunities online than auto card counting of live dealer BJ



This is why I have never really gotten involved in online play. It just SEEMS to me there is no real regulation (similar to Indian Casinos here in the U.S.) and casinos can offer this and that and then close your account and not pay you.

Now I realize there are people like yourself and Axel that are being successful overall with online AP play. But to me just seems a hassle.

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