Best friends

So I meet her in French class about 2 years ago and since then I've become just about as close as a guy can get and still be just friends. She's one of those amazingly smart, cultured good girls but is willing to do stuff. We have connected on many levels and confided in each other on numerous occasions. And I do mean we've discussed everything from weather to the graphic details of our sexlife and desires. I recently told her I felt love for her and she responded by wanting to be friends and stay as close as we had been before. A contributing factor might be that Ive got almost none of the physical traits that she wants in a guy. But I feel as if something was left unsaid. We still hang out like normal and nothing is different. I thought my mind would have been at ease after telling her but of course I'm going to be a little heartbroken. Really the questions comes down to whether or not I pursue this further and what might she be feeling?

My advice is you have to let her go. As I've said many times, it is almost impossible for men and women to be truly successful friends. Maybe if you started seeing somebody else she would get jealous and changer her mind. Once you revealed your true feelings there is no going back to where you were before. My advice is tell her goodbye and to not contact you unless she is willing to take the relationship to a romantic level. Then don't look back.

First off, that sucks man. I feel for you. Many guys have been in your shoes and there's no easy way to make the pain go away. Friend is a four letter word.

Now, moving on to the tough realities.

I'd lay odds at 20 to 1 against you having a meaningful romantic relationship with this girl, but only at 8 to 1 against you possibly having sexual contact. The latter depends on how loose she is and how much you are in either's proximity while drinking heavily. In my opinion, I see 4 courses of action. There could be more but I feel like most things you do will fall into one of these 4 paths.

1) If you honestly do value her friendship and get meaningful value out of it, and the pain of rejection isn't too bad, then I would say remain friends with her, but throw away any hope of getting together with her. In fact, you need to start spending less time with her so you can get over your crush on her, and especially you need to double down your efforts with other girls. Start going on a lot of dates, get yourself out there, just try to force yourself to realize there are other great girls out there, and you can find one. She can be a friend but you need to have priorities.

2) If the ratio of value you get out of the friendship to pain is too low, then you just need to cut off all contact with her. I know this sucks, but she's not going to change her mind and you are just going to torture yourself by seeing her all the time. Cut bait and move on. If I had to pick one course of action, sadly this would be it. The pain is probably not going to be worth maintaining the friendship and holding out for that one chance...which brings us to the next 2 options.
EDIT: by favoring this option I pretty much agree with the Wizard. But I wanted to at least present some options.

3) If you think you have a chance of hooking up with her, know that this will almost certainly ruin and end the friendship. If it's worth it to you to pursue this from a sexual standpoint, I say go for it. Be casual and nonchalant around her, but if there is any talk of "fuck buddies" or "friends with benefits" show mild interest. Indicate that it could be fun, but you know, whatever. Go to lots of parties; I'm assuming you're in college so this shouldn't be hard. You're already talking about your sex lives, so you could try to work that angle. Some may call me misogynistic, but whatever. The pain of coming so close to your dream but then essentially having it torn away will be adequate punishment for any misogyny. Once you've hooked up, it will start to get weird after N number of times. N will vary.

4) Lastly if you want to go for the storybook Hollywood ending, just keep being really good friends with her and go for that 1 in 21 chance that you'll end up together. Not likely. Sorry bud.

I guess 3 and 4 aren't mutually exclusive, but I doubt a casual sexual relationship would lead to something more meaningful.

If you want to date a woman and she says that she just wants to be friends the only (and I mean only) proper response should be, "Thanks, but I have plenty of friends." Then move on.

Well see that's the problem I can't just say goodbye even if I wanted to. we have the same classes and all the same friends. I like the advice but she's just too valuable a friend to lose and despite what many believe guy girl friendships can work. Maybe not everyone can do it but so far I've seen it done and still have other friendships. Again thanks for the advice but I just don't think that's the best choice given my situation. Shes willing to talk and not let it affect her. So I'll just have to talk with her.

Aside to the board: (Is this the part where I try to earn another toaster?)

Quote: Johnt

Well see that's the problem I can't just say goodbye even if I wanted to. we have the same classes and all the same friends. I like the advice but she's just too valuable a friend to lose and despite what many believe guy girl friendships can work. Maybe not everyone can do it but so far I've seen it done and still have other friendships. Again thanks for the advice but I just don't think that's the best choice given my situation. Shes willing to talk and not let it affect her. So I'll just have to talk with her.

Just so you don't hold out hope for anything else. You may soon be hearing about her new boyfriend, and that may be painful.

They made a movie about this, When Harry Met Sally.
They couldn't really be friends.
Of course, it being Hollywood they end up together in the end.
I wouldn't expect that in this case.
She has drawn the line.
Find someone else to date or obsess over.
It's the only way

I see no problem here.

The two of you are friends; you would like it to perhaps become "more than that," and she demurs.

So, the ball is in your court: either slink away "broken-hearted," or maintain your friendship.

As for the Wiz commenting that it is almost impossible for men and women to remain good friends: bah, humbug.

I have been good friends with a couple women in my office for more than ten years.

We usually have lunch together at the office, and shoot the breeze for an hour or so.

None of us want more.

Why would we?

Haha that's already happened and I've tried to find others but none have put her out of my mind maybe I just haven't met her yet

You have some awesome points there.

Quote: AZDuffman

If you want to date a woman and she says that she just wants to be friends the only (and I mean only) proper response should be, "Thanks, but I have plenty of friends." Then move on.

+1000

I think George Michael had good advice on this - "Time can never mend, the careless whispers of a good friend. To the heart and mind, ignorance is kind. There's no comfort in the truth, pain is that all you'll find."

I was good friends for many years with a woman for whom I yearned madly, insanely. She knew about it, I made no secret. My internal torture was no fault of hers, she didn't do anything wrong. But it was very destructive for me. And in a way, I did it on purpose. Long story, but still. We had sex once, it was awkward. We didn't have sex again. But I still wanted the chance to get past the awkwardness of that one time, I was sure I could.

Then one day I wised up. I don't remember why, or how, I simply decided to stop "going out" with her.

Several years later, we got together again. It was OK. I still thought she was beautiful, but I had more self respect by then, and wasn't interested in wasting my heart's time. Love is a cooperative thing, and it wasn't going to grow from my side only. She made some sort of crack about how "friends forever" didn't seem to be forever anymore, something about how true friends don't stop calling each other.

I never called her again.


You're great friends right now, and that is a rare and valuable thing. But friends aren't always forever. When the time comes, break it, and break it clean and break it permanently. Cherish the friendship you once had and move on. Because your wife isn't going to take too well to your female best friend.

I hate to sound condescending, but if you have to ask for love advice from strangers on the internet, especially on a board devoted to gambling, you have bigger problems to take care of.

Quote: AlanRRT

I hate to sound condescending, but if you have to ask for love advice from strangers on the internet, especially on a board devoted to gambling, you have bigger problems to take care of.

On that note, I'll post something that I've posted before but I think it applies here as well:

Oooo, an opportunity for me to earn another toaster!! You've tried heterosexuality and it didn't work out? There's a hot new lifestyle available that (according to some people) you can now choose. Ditch the bitch and make the switch! Gay is the way! You too can know mano a mano love action. Go out to football or hockey games with your buddy and afterwards you can get a different kind of stick in your eye. Depending on the state you live in, you'll never have to worry about a divorce lawyer! What more can you ask for?

just remember to give credit to s2dbaker for recruiting you so that I get the toaster.

Tasteless, crass, homophobic, and not even funny in any way.
I guess that about sums up you in a nutshell.

Quote: WongBo

Tasteless, crass, homophobic, and not even funny in any way.
I guess that about sums up you in a nutshell.

Ellen thought of it first! I'll take the tasteless, crass and unfunny but homophobic?!?!? I shall not abide and neither shall my husband!!

Please no irrelevance

Quote: AlanRRT

I hate to sound condescending, but if you have to ask for love advice from strangers on the internet, especially on a board devoted to gambling, you have bigger problems to take care of.

The Wiz is well-known for taking relationship questions and doling out (IMO) level-headed and quality advice. Just google "is my boyfriend cheating on me?" and you'll see the WoO relationship page.

Since this forum started, the Wiz has asked that people direct their relationship questions here, so he can reply but they can also get the collective "wisdom" (cough) of the board (sorry my inner mrjjjjjjj came through there). So I'm guessing he really just was looking for the Wiz's famed relationship advice. Advice from the rest of us comes with no added charge :)

You say that you're going to be a little heartbroken. She's feeling like you are a friend and now she has you in your back pocket. Since you're asking this question, I gotta assume that you are pretty young, as this happens to men all of the time.

I've had female friends like that (as most men do) - women who I would want but that they only wanted friendship. It's kind of like banging your head up against a wall (in more ways than one) if you're hung up with the person. There is absolutely no harm in keeping them as a friend while you go after other prospects. It's completely unhealthy, however, to put all of your hopes and dreams into a person who will not participate. And when the other party feels that pressure, they tend to shun away, which makes it all of the worst.

So, you've gotta let go, respect what she said, and move on and look for other prospects. When you let go of those hopes and dreams (or at least not let her see them), she will inevitably no longer feel that pressure and will be probably be close to you again.

Life is short.

Try this: "I'd like to have sex with you once to see if we have any romantic chemistry. If we do have chemistry, great! If not, then we can maintain our wonderful friendship."

It's a new age, that kinda thing might work.

On another point, I'm glad I'm married and I don't have to deal with this anymore.

It sounds more like a crush developed amidst general lack of sex than anything else.
Try hooking up with and banging someone else, not necessarily a relationship, some one-nighters will do. It's quite likely that your head will clear up and a month from now you'll remember this as ridiculous, "What was I thinking".

Quote: AcesAndEights

they can also get the collective "wisdom" (cough) of the board (sorry my inner mrjjjjjjj came through there).

Hey, just substitute "(ahem)" for "(cough)" and there will be no intellectual property issues.

P90 excellent advice. i have been friends with two girls since I was 16. i am now 44 and still great friends and we talk about everything. i had a crush on both but never pursued it. As I grew older and got my own girlfriends and started having sex with other women, it cleared my head and I have been great friends with them ever since. I am now married and so are they and the six of us do stuff all the time. So Wiz on this one, I have to respectfully disagree with your opinion.

An update of the situation.
Well to cut the long story short... I told her, at first she was fine but then she began to misinterpret things, a cold war was fought with no clear winner, we bearly talk now, I seem to have been literally blinded by love and shouldve guessed the end result from the beginning, after it was ended I suddenly had a clear mind. It was actually so clear I was inspired and my school work and sudden boom in art prices I've produced show it. Things were a roller coaster but it seems benefits out weigh the losses. Haha as tragic as I might have seemed if you saw it played out before your eyes thing have only gotten better.

Jesus said "...you shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free." John 8:32


James Garfield said "The truth will set you free, but first it will make you miserable."

Gloria Steinem said "The truth will set you free, but first it will piss you off"

Well said to all 3

But then again....