help I need advice... is he cheating?

Ok I have been with this guy for almost 5 years(May 5th) we are engaged. He just started a new job, and has made friends really quick. A girl he works with is now his friend on FB, she comments on most of his stuff, and her profile is private. I've mostly noticed a difference in him this week. But there have been subtle changes in him since he got the job. Not to mention I had a weird dream that he was cheating on me with the above mentioned girl. He's been really distant lately, he doesn't grab me like he used to, he doesn't compliment me anymore, he went out two times in a row during the week, stayed out til 3 the first night, and 230 the second night. He told me that the girl I'm worried about bought him at least one drink. He spent over 70 dollars on just beer, the second night he took out 60 to do the same. He randomly mentioned that he hopes his job will post days for over time, because he's running out of money... when like a week ago he was sitting really well. When he comes home from work, he goes right for his home office closes the door, and either works on computers, plays on the computer or plays an xbox game for hours. We haven't spent much time together at all in the past 2 weeks. He told me he wanted me to offer sex but when I do he says he's tired or we'll have it later. We finally had sex after over a week, and it was different, more intense, and the foreplay was different. After we had sex he was acting pretty close to how he usually was. Please help me, everyone of my friends and family have given me the same answer please tell me what you think

Quote: tiptoe

Ok I have been with this guy for almost 5 years(May 5th) we are engaged. He just started a new job, and has made friends really quick. A girl he works with is now his friend on FB, she comments on most of his stuff, and her profile is private. I've mostly noticed a difference in him this week. But there have been subtle changes in him since he got the job. Not to mention I had a weird dream that he was cheating on me with the above mentioned girl. He's been really distant lately, he doesn't grab me like he used to, he doesn't compliment me anymore, he went out two times in a row during the week, stayed out til 3 the first night, and 230 the second night. He told me that the girl I'm worried about bought him at least one drink. He spent over 70 dollars on just beer, the second night he took out 60 to do the same. He randomly mentioned that he hopes his job will post days for over time, because he's running out of money... when like a week ago he was sitting really well. When he comes home from work, he goes right for his home office closes the door, and either works on computers, plays on the computer or plays an xbox game for hours. We haven't spent much time together at all in the past 2 weeks. He told me he wanted me to offer sex but when I do he says he's tired or we'll have it later. We finally had sex after over a week, and it was different, more intense, and the foreplay was different. After we had sex he was acting pretty close to how he usually was. Please help me, everyone of my friends and family have given me the same answer please tell me what you think

Well, first the dream is meaningless to the situation. I don't see a preponderance of evience to indicate cheating. What I see is he has a new job and new friends that seem the most change and excitement in his life in some time so that explains his spending time with them. You don't say, but my real question is "what is the wedding date?" If no date is set you are not "engaged" in the real sense. If it was set over 2 years out that is also a problem. If you have no plans for a "big" wedding but rather a quickie in Vegas there is no reason for more than the shortest engagement. If any of these fit he only proposed to keep you quiet and his chances of cheating are much higher.

Been with him for FIVE years?
The fire appears to have gone out. You've settled into "life together" ... and he has some new job, new workmates and probably a bit of a new flame. There has been no reason for this "engagement" to end in a marriage, so it probably won't end in marriage. You've got decisions to make and he has got some decisions to make.

Is this "cheating"? What was your arrangement on this issue during the FIVE YEARS? Has he been getting enough to keep him from straying? Doesn't sound like it.

First, I'd like to compliment you on posting the question successfully on your own. Every other time "cheating boyfriend" questions come to my Email first, and I have to provide personal tech support to assist with the registration process.

You're in a bad place where there is a lot of circumstantial evidence to point to cheating, but none of it can justify making an accusation. I'm not suggesting he is cheating either, he may just be drinking beers with the new girl. If he were cheating I think he would be happier at home, and trying harder to cover it up. If forced make a prediction, I say he is not cheating -- yet.

What is my advice? Tell him you're bored at home and want to hang out with his new friends after work. If he says 'no' then you'll be in a position to question him why not. If he hems and haws, don't have any compunction to move out to rethink your life with him.

My $.02:
You are coming across a little like a drama queen, which probably won't help matters. Yes, there are some indications that things are different, but you also don't have proof of anything, and have some possible explanations for things.

It's normal for your BF to want to fit in at his new job. He probably liked going out drinking with his coworkers, but maybe overdid it and that's why he's looking for the OT (to offset his spending). As far as the girl at his work is concerned, if he hasn't cheated in the past I think you need to give him the benefit of the doubt here. Forget your dream, that's probably just your insecurity talking to you.

So he's somewhat distant lately. Have you asked him about it? If not, why not? A couple who's been together as long as you have should be communicating better than you are. Talk to your guy about this. Don't make it all dramatic. Show him you are still into him and ask him if there is anything you can do for him. Tell him that his nights out sound like fun, and ask if you can join him for one.

And BTW, what is wrong with sex being more intense? What's wrong with trying different foreplay? Guys get tired of cuddly, lovey gentle sex all the time. Sometimes we want something more primal. Sometimes we want a little more variety in the routine. You won't know until you talk to him about this. (About him turning down sex, if it was around the days he was out until the wee hours, he probably was tired.)

If there's a night you're nearly positive he went out and cheated on you - plan to come onto him HARD when he gets home. If he turns you down for a few nights... then something might be up.

My advice: Sneak onto his Facebook account.

My wife will post advice in a little while.

First of all, I would like to say how offended I am, as a female, that many of the above responses accuse this poster of being "dramatic" and basically irrational because she has "no evidence." This person is obviously just suspicious, concerned and looking for help, so the accusations are entirely unnecessary.

Second, I think your best bet is to talk to him. If your relationship is ever going to last, communication is key. Coming from a person who has made many male friends at work, this could be entirely innocent. It is likely that he is just trying to fit in and be happy in his new job, but I completely understand your concern. If you plan on marrying him, now is the time to see if he will open up about his feelings and his situation. After 5 years, if you can't work this out, it isn't going to work long term and you are better off moving on.

Last, trust your instincts and your intuition. You would be surprised how accurate it can be. And if all of your friends and family have given you the same answer - as you mentioned in your post - they are probably right because they know both of you and your relationship better than any of us do.

If he is a cheater, good riddance. It is better to find out now than to let him waste anymore of your time.
If not, good luck in hopefully a long and happy marriage.

I went to his place of work, and called him on his break, he rushed to get off the phone and when he came back to work, he was with her they had just had lunch together.

I may be a drama queen, I've never been called that before, but in this case I may be. But that doesn't explain why he took her to lunch didn't tell me he was with her when I called. When she saw me she had her head down so her hair was covering her face. He knew it bothered me in the first place talking to her so why would he take her to lunch. She was trying her hardest and fastest to get in that building. I gave him the ring.

He called me asking what my decision was, I said it's his to make either her or me. He can talk to her at work but other than that I don't want him talking to her. He down right refused to stop talking to her. I went to his work when he got off, he called me again asking me what my decision was I gave him the same answer. he then proceeded to hang up the phone and follow her to a bar. I called him at the bar asking to come in and talk about our problems, she walked out giving me the death look all the way to her car. I argued with him some more, and now he is off trying to find her and apologize for god knows what. He's been out with since 9... it is now almost midnight.

me again sorry.. the date was set for Sept 10, 2011 we've been engaged for maybe 6 months. I tried looking at his facebook, he changed his password... all of his passwords are changed.

Thanks for the updates. Please keep them coming. I applaud how you confronted him to his face and forced him to a decision.

Tiptoe:

He is cheating on you. Your gut was right.
Your not being a "Drama Queen", he is just another guy trying to get some side action with a "new Girl".
How many of the married guys, or those in long-lived living together relationships would allow thier SO to stay out late, and act like this guy has?

Not many.

Get the book, "Not Just Friends" by Shirley Glass. Then, to get rid of the five year "Blahs", look into "His Needs, Her Needs" from Dr Willard Harley.

You can save your relationship. But your betting on a wayward guy. I would rather play the props bets. But even they hit occasionally.

Thanks for the applaud but it didn't make any difference. He still went out looking for her and left me home, he didn't return home until close to 4am. He apologized to me for being out so late, and said after he dropped of his friends xbox he passed out. I asked him what happened after apologized to her. He said "nothing we had a couple drinks and she left." He even took her to a new bar to do this apology so I couldn't find him again. I have no idea what went on. I sent her 2 messages on FB. One saying something a long the lines of "sorry for what we're both going through but I love him and I know if you were in the same boat;if your fiance was distant and hasn't really spent much time with you. you'd wonder. I'd like it if you'd stop talking to him outside of work. If he has a problem with me he should talk to me about it not someone who I don't know and have never spoken to."

I never got any reply from that, but I guess she told him cause he mentioned it to me. Later like close to 3 I messaged her again as well has 2 of his friends, asking if they know where he is because it's getting late. I told her it has nothing to do with how I feel about them I just want to know if he is with her or if she knows where he is. No reply from anyone.

This morning we talked. I want to believe him and think he was being honest, but he hasn't earned that trust from me yet. I've taken back the ring and this time if he cheats the ring stays with me and I'll pawn it. It was given to me I should keep it. We worked some stuff out but again I don't know how much he'll follow. I've asked him to stop talking to her outside of work. He said he would stop talking to her socially, but if shes at a bar that he goes to, he's not going to leave. I told him if he wants to stay friends with her, she needs to try and get to know me, if he or she can't do that then that just proves they did something wrong. But also he said he wants to see how I act and that will determine if he talks to her or not... which I believe is wrong... but what is right about this situation. We have 9 months til the wedding, who knows if it will happen, but I don't want to cancel anything yet... we'll see how it goes. If I feel he is doing wrong I won't hesitate to leave, I'll just do it. IF he loves me like he says he does he should do this for me. Shouldn't he?

I love him and it kills me to leave him... I haven't stopped crying since I saw the together at 3 yesterday afternoon. Like I said they weren't walking close together she was walking a head of him. but he was laughing and smiling to whatever she was saying or they were talking about.

He lets me stay out late with my friends... he calls and I answer which is different then what he's doing, but he does let me stay out. And he'll answer in the beginning but after a few I'm forgotten. Or his phone dies.

He says she helps him through his doubts about me. Because I did talk and hang out with another guy for awhile, and it ruined our relationship, but I changed. He should too. I've removed him as a friend on FB, I met him through work, and we both no longer work there. I never would have done anything with this guy, but it was nice to have someone other than my 2 best friends and him to talk to. But I stopped.

I want to believe him but he needs to earn the trust back... and I don't know how he's going to do that.

Tiptoe:

Sorry. It wasn't an applaud. It was a warning.

Get the books. Get smarter about what is about to happen.

If your interested in fighting for this guy, then you need the books..

This line right here:

Quote:

but if shes at a bar that he goes to, he's not going to leave

Tells you everything you need to know. HE would rather piss you off than NOT see her.

Pawn the ring when the time comes. Its YOURS. He gifted it to you.

Being out til 4am in the morning with a new girl? "I passed out playing xbox!" Unless new missy has something surgically altered, it wasn't an xbox he was playing in.

And this line:

Quote:

I told him if he wants to stay friends with her, she needs to try and get to know me, if he or she can't do that

Do NOT offer to be friends with the enemy. He already is CHOOSING her over you. Do not make it easier for him to choose HER. "Gee, Tiptoe, I can't understand WHY you don't want to hang out with us!" "You would really LIKE her, if you got to know her!"

This is an attempt to normalize the realtionship with the other woman. See, if you like her, than its OK for him to hang out with her, because you are OK with it.

One last thing, He wants the end of the relationship to be your fault. When he asks, "is that your decision?" when you gave him the ring back, and said it was over, tell him that "ITS HIS DECISION to bring OTHERS into the relationship..."

SFB

He came home to me last night, as well as tonight. Thats something right?

I'm not sure if this was the wrong or right thing to do but I sent a message to her fiancé explaining what was going on. I never said they were cheat I just said that I noticed a change in my fiancé and it started when he met yours. I told him what they were doing, that the go to lunch and bars together, that both refuse to stop talking to each other and she texts my fiancé at 1230 in the morning. I said I hope everything works out for them. And just that I thought he'd like to know. Now her relationship with her fiancée is in trouble because he thinks shes cheating. I regretted sending him the message the moment I did it. But I'm glad that he knows and maybe we all can work everything out.

When I told him about the text, he was furious.... it might have had something to do with me throwing his phone at the wall and breaking the screen. He stayed with me last night he didn't leave. Someone told me I need to focus on the little things. So i'm trying, but right now the man I love isn't talking to me. But he's home. It means the world to me that he came home, but I'm still scared.

Quote: tiptoe

I'm not sure if this was the wrong or right thing to do

It was wrong. You knew it was wrong. What is the use of his being there if there is disharmony and distrust? Why are you throwing temper tantrums and telephones? Time to grow up.

Quote: FleaStiff

It was wrong. You knew it was wrong. What is the use of his being there if there is disharmony and distrust? Why are you throwing temper tantrums and telephones? Time to grow up.

Because the message...what I could read of it any way was "Hey! He's go..."

Quote: SFB

Pawn the ring when the time comes. Its YOURS. He gifted it to you.

I'm not a lawyer, but from my memory of the People's Court, that is not the case. This was years ago, but I'm pretty sure Judge Wapner said that in California if an engagement is broken then the ring goes back to the giver, unless it was the giver alone who broke it off, in which case the recipient gets to keep it. Of course, the law may be different in the other 49 states, but the California law seems fair to me.

Quote: Wizard

I'm not a lawyer, but from my memory of the People's Court, that is not the case. This was years ago, but I'm pretty sure Judge Wapner said that in California if an engagement is broken then the ring goes back to the giver, unless it was the giver alone who broke it off, in which case the recipient gets to keep it. Of course, the law may be different in the other 49 states, but the California law seems fair to me.

Depending on where you live courts come down on either side.
Is it a gift or part of a contract.

However Zsa Zsa once said you have to give the ring back. You can keep the stone but give the ring back.

Quote: Wizard

I'm not a lawyer, but from my memory of the People's Court, that is not the case. This was years ago, but I'm pretty sure Judge Wapner said that in California if an engagement is broken then the ring goes back to the giver, unless it was the giver alone who broke it off, in which case the recipient gets to keep it. Of course, the law may be different in the other 49 states, but the California law seems fair to me.

Rain Man would know for certain.

New perspective.

The dream, while powerful, means nothing, except that your subconscious is supporting your cheating hypothesis.

Clearly, he is far too much into this woman and his changes of behaviour and defense of this woman clearly illustrate that he's got something going on with her, probably well over the bounds of what a traditional partnership would allow.

I personally don't have a problem with you doing everything possible to break them up and to bring the relationship out into the open for all parties. This is your life, and it certainly is not fair for the two of them to sneak around on you. So, while it might be "immature" to do wrong things, it's understandable.

That said, he clearly is on the fence between the two of you. You've got to tell him what his possible outcomes are and stick by them. He can go with her and end your relationship, or he can stay with you, under your *reasonable* conditions. If his job is easily transferrable, then he should transfer. If his job is not, then you can't expect him to break off all communications with her, but you can ask that, given his behaviour, that you have access to all of his electronic communication, cell phone bills, bank statements, etc, for the foreseeable future, and that he isn't allowed to go out with his buddies without you being there. It sounds like a jail sentence, but if you are going to trust him again, then you have to know that he isn't sneaking around on you (which he clearly has been). And if loves you and wants to save your engagement, he will abide by your terms, not because your terms are right, but because the terms will give you a level of comfort that you need and he should be willing to comply with a degree of unreasonableness to make things right.

As well, if he's out developing a relationship and having an affair, something's missing at home that needs to be worked on. Yep, relationships get stale over time and evolve to a level of comfort where the sex is less, the romance isn't there... that's normal. Men (and some women) want the thrill of the "honeymoon" but don't realize that over time, it turns into the same. The only way to make it different is to do so in your current relationship.

At the workplace, crushes come and go. I move from place to place as part of my worklife and I run into many attractive women who I like (and if I were single, I would be all over them). I haven't developed relationships with any of them that are beyond normal work relationships. Why? Because I love my wife and that having an affair with them or developing a relationship with them doesn't solve any problems that you have at home. It's an excuse.

I wouldn't call the relationship over. It could be a very good lesson learned that might make the relationship more honest and intimate over time if the lessons are taken to heart and cause a change in behaviour.

Quote: FleaStiff

It was wrong. You knew it was wrong. What is the use of his being there if there is disharmony and distrust? Why are you throwing temper tantrums and telephones? Time to grow up.

Flea:

This is wrong advice. Throwing the phone was worng, but telling the the womans fiance was the right thing to do. Keeps a second set of eyes on these two.
And, wouldn't you WANT to know if the one you are with has been stepping out? EVERYONE else knows but YOU?

And it IS time for Mr Tiptoe to grow up.

SFB

Tiptoe:

Boymimbo has some good advice. I particularly like this line:

Quote: boymimbo

I wouldn't call the relationship over. It could be a very good lesson learned that might make the relationship more honest and intimate over time if the lessons are taken to heart and cause a change in behaviour.

That is why i recommended the books. To give you something solid to read, and to examine your relationship, and make the changes that you have to make to be a better partner. You may decide that these changes are not worth it for THIS guy, or realize that your not that far off the mark.

Then BM mentions what are called extraordinary precations:

Quote: boymimbo

At the workplace, crushes come and go. I move from place to place as part of my worklife and I run into many attractive women who I like (and if I were single, I would be all over them). I haven't developed relationships with any of them that are beyond normal work relationships. Why? Because I love my wife and that having an affair with them or developing a relationship with them doesn't solve any problems that you have at home. It's an excuse

He KNOWs he can get into an affair, so he practices behaviors that protects himself from getting into one. He doesn't party after work with these women, nor allow himself to talk about anything except work with the, Can we have opposite sex friends? Sure. But we have to be careful. It can happen quickly, that they become morethan "just friends".

And dating, even living together, is rehersal for the "real thing" which is marriage. And right now, Mr Tiptoe is failing.

SFB

he left me again last night, after he got his phone number transfered to a new one he left again. He lied he didn't come home. Was he with her I don't know. She didn't come home either, but a friend of his and hers(the girl and her man) said she crashed on the couch. I didn't learn this until after I told him I was leaving. I talked to her finance all day today,the things they were telling us were identical. We talked for hours and I now know that she is a life ruiner. She loves the attention and the feeling of destroying men. He told me she is a manipulator, she is teaching him how to mind-fu** me, weather he knows it or not. What she was telling him when they had their talks were lies. From what her man told me the stuff he was saying to her were lies. Only one thing in that whole conversation with him sounded like what my guy would say. So I'am home waiting for him, I'm gonna act like nothing is bothering me if he wants to talk if he wants to come home he can if he wants to leave I'll let him. Because her finance will be in touch with me about what she is doing. They will probably go out to a bar weather it's alone or with a group, he and she told us to different things. But I don't know what happened last night he could have gone to a hotel, and she could have stayed with her friend. So I'll see how everything goes and if I don't feel anything has changed, I will leave. After talking to her man I'm more confident in my relationship with him, because she's the messed up one, and he'll find that out and leave. Will he come back to me? I don't know.

He wants me to stop freaking out I will. He wants me to stop calling him when hes gone I will. If their playing a game just to see how far they can push us, I won't give her the satisfaction of destroying me anymore. I believe he loves me, what he's doing isn't right and don't condone it. But after 2 weeks(cause thats when he has to be out of her house) if he's changed it hes with me then I won't freak out. It'll be hard. But right now I feel I can handle it.

From what I was told about her, she milks everything for what it's worth. She'll toss him aside sooner or later, and I pray it'll be sooner. Will I be there to take him back I don't know. But if he comes back to me willingly then I will consider it, but he'll have to work pretty hard to gain back the trust. I love him and still want to marry him despite this all, but if he's continuously gonna hurt me I won't stand by it. It'll be hard but now I know I'm strong and capable and I have one hell of a support system. I'll keep you guys updated on everything... you can stay to read or not. You can think I'm being childish but as long as I'm trying I think he'll come back.

Wow, lots of updates since I posted! I gotta say that when I originally read the post, certain things caused me to think that Tiptoe was just being overly dramatic and somewhat of a clingy/needy girlfriend. (Keeping track of how much he spent drinking, bemoaning the fact that he went out two nights in the same week, etc.) For the record, Mrs. Toes14 disagreed with my post & thought I was being insensitive. Maybe i took the guy's side because I had a ex girlfriend accuse me of cheating when I was absolutely innocent of it.

Now, based on the updates, I've gotta say that it looks like there was something going on alright. My gut says he's cheating on her, and that he's made his choice. Even if he hasn't actually physically cheated, he's certainly having an emotional affair. In either case, it's a long hard road back to trust in the relationship, and it may not be worth it.

Tiptoe - Good Luck with this.

Quote: Toes14

it's a long hard road back to trust in the relationship, and it may not be worth it.

The safest trust there is in a relationship is to trust that the parties will continue to do in the future that which they've done in the past.

Quote: FleaStiff

The safest trust there is in a relationship is to trust that the parties will continue to do in the future that which they've done in the past.

Tiptoe:

This is true...

Buy the books. He is into the "thrill" right now. And you have to get out of this...

HE thinks HE gets to make the decision. NO. YOU DO.

Big surprize for him....

SFB

Quote: tiptoe

... her finance ...

I had a girlfriend once who wanted me to be one of those! Unintentionally perhaps you have given me a new word to use, thanks!

On a hunch, I am increasing the possibility [always there] that someone is faking this whole scenario and being this person. Some of these aggrieved women have convinced me to 99% that it is not fake, I am taking you down from 95% to about 85% now. Nothing I can put a finger on exactly, just hunches here.

edit: word [not world] in first remark

Correct usage is:
Her fiance.
His fiancee.