Who should pay the tip?
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33 members have voted
Suppose two logicians, Jim and Bob, meet for a buffet lunch in a casino. Bob pays for both lunches using a coupon in the mail, which was based on Bob's play in the casino. The idea of the lunch was Bob's, because he had the coupon for two and didn't want to waste it.
Assume that Bob is an AP who was playing 9/6 Jacks or Better on double point days. Points on a regular day are worth 0.25%. Jim is also an AP but doesn't play at that property.
Bob also eats more of the expensive items in the buffet, like peeled shrimp, like Jim is more of rice and beans kind of guy. However, Jim orders three drinks from the waitress and Bob only two.
It finally comes time to leave a tip. How should they split the cost of it?
Quote: WizardThis is a tangent off of this post.
Suppose two logicians, Jim and Bob, meet for a buffet lunch in a casino. Bob pays for both lunches using a coupon in the mail, which was based on Bob's play in the casino. The idea of the lunch was Bob's, because he had the coupon for two and didn't want to waste it.
Assume that Bob is an AP who was playing 9/6 Jacks or Better on double point days. Points on a regular day are worth 0.25%. Jim is also an AP but doesn't play at that property.
Bob also eats more of the expensive items in the buffet, like peeled shrimp, like Jim is more of rice and beans kind of guy. However, Jim orders three drinks from the waitress and Bob only two.
It finally comes time to leave a tip. How should they split the cost of it?
This has happened to me lots of times
The real world (at least amongst my circle of people) is Jim picks up the entire tip because Bob earned the comped meal and was gracious to share it with Jim
Quote: darkozThis has happened to me lots of times
Me too. And I've played the roll of both Jim and Bob. I'll let some more responses come in before I state mine, but anyone who has been in this situation with me probably knows my position as I frequently opine about it when it comes time to open wallets.
My ultimate answer would be to play server trivia and whomever loses pays the extra couple bucks.
Quote: RomesThe number of drinks/etc is erroneous.
Do you mean extraneous?
-the way in which Bob earned the coupon is immaterial, as it is already a sunk cost. Although the casino essentially paid him for the coupon, even if he was playing the worst keno game possible, it should be treated the same as if he has never gambled in a casino and they still mailed him a comp (which does happen)
-Bob got full value from his meal, as he would have eaten there even if Jim declined. We don't know what value Jim got, as we don't know what his lunch costs and benefits would have been had he not been invited. Obviously the cost he would have spent on lunch could not have exceeded the listed price of the buffet, otherwise he would have already planned on eating there (this assumes the coupon could only be used for two people for one lunch, not one person for two different lunches)
-The total amount of the tip should be based on the full buffet price, how long they stay (if not, less turnover would negatively impact the servers income), and the service provided
my answer:
Jim should pay the full amount of the tip up to what he would have spent on lunch if not invited. If that does not cover an acceptable tip, Bob should pay the rest
possible changes:
-Jim should also pay 20% of the menu price of his meal before Bob's obligation begins
-after Jim has paid his tip obligation, the remainder is split 50/50
In practice I would expect to pay 100% of tip when playing the role of Bob and would offer to pay 100% of tip when playing role of Jim. In either scenario, if the other party offered to chip in any amount I would immediately accept their generous offer.
Quote: GWAEwhere is the option of, who the hell tips at a buffet ;-)
The closest option to that was 4th from the bottom. In reality, I think most people tip something at buffets, especially if you get drink service, except my father.
Unless there is a pattern otherwise. This has happened to me many times. Of course, I always offer up a tip nonetheless when someone else is paying my free way no matter what the circumstances are (unless it is a restaurant my friend knows I don't like or can't afford).
But Bob invited, Bob's responsible for disclosing terms before hand and he is on the hook for the entire meal.
Quote: GWAEwhere is the option of, who the hell tips at a buffet ;-)
There's still usually waitstaff that walk around clearing plates and taking care of drink orders.
Quote: boymimboBob invited. He pays the tip. Period. When you invite someone for lunch and don't disclose the terms, you are always paying.
Unless there is a pattern otherwise. This has happened to me many times. Of course, I always offer up a tip nonetheless when someone else is paying my free way no matter what the circumstances are (unless it is a restaurant my friend knows I don't like or can't afford).
But Bob invited, Bob's responsible for disclosing terms before hand and he is on the hook for the entire meal.
it would take a cheap (frugal) person to not offer to pick up the tip. If Bob says no, I got it after pulling it out, maybe different story.
Everybody. ;-)Quote: GWAEwhere is the option of, who the hell tips at a buffet ;-)
Pardon my grammar; you are correct.Quote: WizardDo you mean extraneous?
Jim was invited, so is under no obligation to pay anything.
However, failure to at least offer to pay will probably result in no future invitations.
I suppose it comes down to this- was either the food or the company worth a repeat performance. If yes, Jim should pay.
Or pulls out his micro fingered violin
Quote: onenickelmiracleLets say what if Bob offers to bring Jim, Bob offers to pay with his $50 comp, Jim orders a $40 steak, which runs the total to $65, will Bob still pay for the dinner that disrupts his zero cash plan?
If actual cash has to be involved, and I was Bob, I would use the $50 comp to get whatever I wanted, and any money left over I would give to Jim.
So, if my meal was $30 total, Jim would get $20, and he's responsible for anything over that.
Quote: TigerWuIf actual cash has to be involved, and I was Bob, I would use the $50 comp to get whatever I wanted, and any money left over I would give to Jim.
So, if my meal was $30 total, Jim would get $20, and he's responsible for anything over that.
What? Now Bobs free meal costs $20 amd Jim probably gets a freebie
Quote: WizardMe too. And I've played the roll of both Jim and Bob. I'll let some more responses come in before I state mine ...
Maybe Jim and Bob should just roll some drunk gambler in the men's room and take his money. Then, it probably wouldn't matter which one played the role of the generous tipper, right?
Now, suppose a logical wizard and a penniless grammarian went together for lunch... but, of course, numerous erroneous assumptions would probably make the whole thing an extraneous event neither would enjoy.
Wiz, my answer to your original question is this: If Bob offers to treat me to lunch using his coupon, as we are about to finish eating, I will ask, "Bob, can I get the tip?" or say, "Bob, let me get the tip." And, whatever Bob decides is fine with me. If I have the buffet coupon and invite Jim to lunch, I'm planning to pay for the meal (free with my coupon, right?) and the tip. If Jim indicates his interest in leaving the tip, I will thank him and allow it rather than start a discussion about who should tip.
Good point that in Reservoir Dogs nobody disputed that the old man shouldn't have to pitch in for the tip since he paid for the rest of the meal. That I totally agree with. Not just because that old man scares me to death. BTW, was he the same actor who played Elaine's father in Seinfeld? Anyway, by that argument, I think Jim should pay the tip, since Bob ultimately paid for the meal via his play. That it is a comp shouldn't matter.
Regarding Bob inviting, okay, that is a fair point. However, it is pretty common that the invitee pays the tip. This isn't a hard as fast rule, but I've seen it happen lots of times. I think it is a nice gesture. Now, if the person doing the inviting has some ulterior motive, like he is using the meal to ask for a loan, and it is primarily for his benefit, then let him pay for everything. So, if the meal was truly neutral in terms of topic and benefit, then I think the invited person should at least offer to pay the tip.
Another point made was what if it was at a fancy restaurant. Suppose a typical meal and drinks a this restaurant costs $150 per person. Also suppose the invited person is low on funds and/or to him the meal wouldn't be worth it to pay the $45-$60 tip. I know lots of people who get no more satisfaction from a $150 meal than a $15 one. Communication before the meal I think is the best remedy, although it can be awkward if the parties don't know each other well. Ultimately, I think the person inviting should pay the tip without hard feelings if the invitee doesn't seem to feel it is fair or affordable for him to pay it.
Yet another side issue is what happens if there is a big group and a comp doesn't cover the check the whole way. I think that if the comp covers at least two people's share, then the one who got the comp should not have to put in more cash and everybody else split up the difference equally. This is just a general rule of thumb and the means of those present and purpose of the meal can also factor into it.
I had a 25% off coupon which ended up saving quite a bit of money. It never occurred to me to say this was my share of the bill. I'd have looked down on anyone who made such a suggestion if they were the ones with the coupon.
In a similar vein, Another time a smaller group went to the seafood buffet at Rio and my friends handicap pass got us all in without the hour long wait. When the bill came, his wife actually suggested that that should be their contribution to the cost of the dinner. While I was still trying to figure out how to politely tell her to frig herself, he manned up and made a joke out of her sincere demand.
Quote: WizardLet me try to catch up. A lot of points to comment on.
Good point that in Reservoir Dogs nobody disputed that the old man shouldn't have to pitch in for the tip since he paid for the rest of the meal. That I totally agree with. Not just because that old man scares me to death. BTW, was he the same actor who played Elaine's father in Seinfeld? Anyway, by that argument, I think Jim should pay the tip, since Bob ultimately paid for the meal via his play. That it is a comp shouldn't matter.
Regarding Bob inviting, okay, that is a fair point. However, it is pretty common that the invitee pays the tip. This isn't a hard as fast rule, but I've seen it happen lots of times. I think it is a nice gesture. Now, if the person doing the inviting has some ulterior motive, like he is using the meal to ask for a loan, and it is primarily for his benefit, then let him pay for everything. So, if the meal was truly neutral in terms of topic and benefit, then I think the invited person should at least offer to pay the tip.
Another point made was what if it was at a fancy restaurant. Suppose a typical meal and drinks a this restaurant costs $150 per person. Also suppose the invited person is low on funds and/or to him the meal wouldn't be worth it to pay the $45-$60 tip. I know lots of people who get no more satisfaction from a $150 meal than a $15 one. Communication before the meal I think is the best remedy, although it can be awkward if the parties don't know each other well. Ultimately, I think the person inviting should pay the tip without hard feelings if the invitee doesn't seem to feel it is fair or affordable for him to pay it.
Yet another side issue is what happens if there is a big group and a comp doesn't cover the check the whole way. I think that if the comp covers at least two people's share, then the one who got the comp should not have to put in more cash and everybody else split up the difference equally. This is just a general rule of thumb and the means of those present and purpose of the meal can also factor into it.
I was actually in the situation about your expensive dinner. A friend of mine took me out and prior to going he told me that he would cover dinner with his comps if I picked up the tip. I said sure. I ordered a $20 steak and a beer. He ordered surf and turf and a bottle of wine. Our total was $160 and I had to tip $30 which was more than it would have cost me for my steak by myself. Lesson learned on that one.
Quote: billryanA couple of weeks ago, I had a large group of friends out to dinner at Binions Steakhouse. They were in town for a concert and looking for a nice place for everyone to get together the night before.
I had a 25% off coupon which ended up saving quite a bit of money. It never occurred to me to say this was my share of the bill. I'd have looked down on anyone who made such a suggestion if they were the ones with the coupon.
Whether or not a coupon should count should depend on whether it was earned or not. If it was only 25%, then it was probably a free one so he should get thanked for applying it but it doesn't lower his share of the bill.
On the other hand, if it were an earned comp, and it covered 75% of the bill, then I think that should suffice for his contribution.
Quote:In a similar vein, Another time a smaller group went to the seafood buffet at Rio and my friends handicap pass got us all in without the hour long wait. When the bill came, his wife actually suggested that that should be their contribution to the cost of the dinner. While I was still trying to figure out how to politely tell her to frig herself, he manned up and made a joke out of her sincere demand.
I agree with you 100% there.
Quote: MaxPenI don't invite people to dinner unless I'm prepared to pay for all of it, including the tip. Fortunately I generally dine with decent people and if I'm picking up the tab they will tip. When dining with others on comp or them treating I always insist on tipping. Usually everything works out if the people you hang with are decent. If not, then don't hang out again. Pretty simple. I generally like to over contribute beyond my share on split bills if I know there are people in attendance that might have trouble contributing a full share. All in all I'm fine with just about anything as long as the bill doesn't cause a scene.
While I may not agree with MaxPen about politics much, I can confirm he is a very generous guy. After the Super Bowl a bunch of WoV people, some with a +1, had a nice dinner and Max kindly picked up the check, just out of generosity. It must have been a pretty big one too. Thanks again for that.
I hope you don't mind me sharing the story.
Quote: darkozQuote: WizardThis is a tangent off of this post.
Suppose two logicians, Jim and Bob, meet for a buffet lunch in a casino. Bob pays for both lunches using a coupon in the mail, which was based on Bob's play in the casino. The idea of the lunch was Bob's, because he had the coupon for two and didn't want to waste it.
Assume that Bob is an AP who was playing 9/6 Jacks or Better on double point days. Points on a regular day are worth 0.25%. Jim is also an AP but doesn't play at that property.
Bob also eats more of the expensive items in the buffet, like peeled shrimp, like Jim is more of rice and beans kind of guy. However, Jim orders three drinks from the waitress and Bob only two.
It finally comes time to leave a tip. How should they split the cost of it?
This has happened to me lots of times
The real world (at least amongst my circle of people) is Jim picks up the entire tip because Bob earned the comped meal and was gracious to share it with Jim
this.
normal buffet tip = 10% per person
Quote: WizardWhile I may not agree with MaxPen about politics much, I can confirm he is a very generous guy. After the Super Bowl a bunch of WoV people, some with a +1, had a nice dinner and Max kindly picked up the check, just out of generosity. It must have been a pretty big one too. Thanks again for that.
I hope you don't mind me sharing the story.
Maxpen is da MVP for that one.
Quote: WizardThis is a tangent off of this post.
Suppose two logicians, Jim and Bob, meet for a buffet lunch in a casino. Bob pays for both lunches using a coupon in the mail, which was based on Bob's play in the casino. The idea of the lunch was Bob's, because he had the coupon for two and didn't want to waste it.
Assume that Bob is an AP who was playing 9/6 Jacks or Better on double point days. Points on a regular day are worth 0.25%. Jim is also an AP but doesn't play at that property.
Bob also eats more of the expensive items in the buffet, like peeled shrimp, like Jim is more of rice and beans kind of guy. However, Jim orders three drinks from the waitress and Bob only two.
It finally comes time to leave a tip. How should they split the cost of it?
The one who ordered the most food, ate the least, tried to take all the food he ordered to go, should also tip the least and pay an equal amount of which he ate (but did not eat). All the waitress did was bring out drinks and only took plates away from the table and did not serve food to the diners. Therefore, the tip should only be $2.
Quote: RS...Therefore, the tip should only be $2.
Finally, someone got the correct answer!
Stuck in the fifties, are we?
Quote: IbeatyouracesFinally, someone got the correct answer!
Anyone in town knows that most people don't tip very much at the buffet because of this theory or reasoning that the waitress only brings the drinks and clears the dishes. Tipping isn't mandatory anyway but it is the American way and it certainly is the Vegas Culture. I have places where I refuse to tip one nickle and in all honesty I'm about to boycott all tipping in general. I have mentioned it before that players should take a year and track every dollar they would tip. It adds up to a decent bankroll for players that average 40 hrs or more a week and eat out all of the time. Some problems that you will have to deal with is eventually being known as a stiff and I've seen it cost people in the long run getting targeted for being 86'd. It seems cocktail girls talk to slot people who talk to managers and hosts and this extortion crew works together. So it might be better to think of it as insurance against people fouling in your gaming, food and drinks. I've seen people spit and put hairs in food many times working behind the curtain.
Quote: monet0412Anyone in town knows that most people don't tip very much at the buffet because of this theory or reasoning that the waitress only brings the drinks and clears the dishes. Tipping isn't mandatory anyway but it is the American way and it certainly is the Vegas Culture. I have places where I refuse to tip one nickle and in all honesty I'm about to boycott all tipping in general. I have mentioned it before that players should take a year and track every dollar they would tip. It adds up to a decent bankroll for players that average 40 hrs or more a week and eat out all of the time. Some problems that you will have to deal with is eventually being known as a stiff and I've seen it cost people in the long run getting targeted for being 86'd. It seems cocktail girls talk to slot people who talk to managers and hosts and this extortion crew works together. So it might be better to think of it as insurance against people fouling in your gaming, food and drinks. I've seen people spit and put hairs in food many times working behind the curtain.
I have to. They went to jail and the place closed!
(Usually whispered closely in ones ear when casino staff arent within range)
$2 a person or $2 total?Quote: RSTherefore, the tip should only be $2.
what if he meant $2 per person and not $2 total?Quote: billryanIf I invited someone to a buffet and the person attempted to leave a dollar per person tip, it would be the last time they joined me.
still the last time?
Half hour later have a third beer. I tip a dollar per drink. Did I waste $4 or did I save $16?
When free valet is available, it's my decision to spend $3 for the convenience of not spending time looking for a spot in the garage, the increased chance of getting mugged and not having to remember where I parked.
Yes, tipping is -even, but so is renting an apartment when I have a perfectly good car to sleep in.
Quote: billryanIWhen free valet is available, it's my decision to spend $3 for the convenience of not spending time looking for a spot in the garage, the increased chance of getting mugged and not having to remember where I parked.
$3?!?!
I usually just tip $1 but im in md
Quote: IbeatyouracesI have to. They went to jail and the place closed!
I have no doubt that if you eat out you have eaten or drank something that someone has tainted. Not to mention some of the food I've seen on the floor to plate or served past expiration... or the numerous health code violations. I'm guessing your comment was some sort of a needle which is fine.
Quote: billryanI sit down at a VP machine at a bar. Order a shot of moonshine and an imported beer. Twenty minutes later have a second beer.
Half hour later have a third beer. I tip a dollar per drink. Did I waste $4 or did I save $16?
When free valet is available, it's my decision to spend $3 for the convenience of not spending time looking for a spot in the garage, the increased chance of getting mugged and not having to remember where I parked.
Yes, tipping is -even, but so is renting an apartment when I have a perfectly good car to sleep in.
Depends... valet is pretty hard on cars so it might cost you more down the road. The difference with the bar scenario is if you pay 16 dollars it goes to the company. The 4 dollars goes to your fellow man working in the trenches and if you tip better and get to know these bartenders in certain places it can get you free food or higher quality drinks. Making a new friend could be an AP play down the road. I like the idea of sleeping in the car. I've always said if you have a car and gym membership you don't need a residence but age beat me down and I'm too soft now. I don't think I could make it sleeping in my car ever again... if things get too bad it seems it's either gonna be a 45 to the temple or jumping off that new bridge for me lol. Hard truths to face but I don't like the other options like wasting away on dialysis or something similar.
Quote: 100xOddswhat if he meant $2 per person and not $2 total?
still the last time?
Less than a $5 tip and the person better have a magnetic personality .
Quote: billryanLess than a $5 tip and the person better have a magnetic personality .
Ok we all knew the thread wold take this turn, tippin g b threads always do.
$5 a table is what I do for all buffets. I don't care if it is the 4 of us or just myself.
People say, but they clear your plates and bring you drinks. Why should they be entitled to a 20% top on a $60 buffet when that's all they did. Does the waitress at bachaniel do any more work than the one at southpoint?
What about the Mirage buffet, you have to get your own drinks there? Does the waitress deserve any tip? They are basically just a busboy there.
Quote: IbeatyouracesQuote: RS...Therefore, the tip should only be $2.
Finally, someone got the correct answer!
I dunno how they tip up North, out West, or in big cities. But, on quite a number of occasions I have asked buffet servers questions about the number of tables in their "section" and the average frequency & amount of tips they receive. Here's what I found:
Buffet servers usually cover between 11 and 13 tables. Unless the buffet is especially busy, about half of their tables have guests at any one time, and diners usually stay for about 30 minutes. About two-thirds of diners tip, and the most frequent tip is $1.00 per adult diner.
So, at (roughly) 8 of 12 tables tipping x 2 diners/table/hour x $1 average tip/diner, the average hourly take is about $16 (plus whatever the hourly pittance the buffet pays it's servers). Maybe not great, but OK by Biloxi standards.
While I usually tip $1 or $2 when I dine at buffets, I tip more when I stop my server to discuss "stuff" mentioned in this post. Because I keep them from other duties for a couple of minutes, I tip a bit more after these conversations. One time, after eating a lunch buffet and having said discussion with my server, I was at a table game. A couple was sitting next to me, and the gal said to her guy, "This is the man I was telling you about," clearly indicating me. When I looked at her, she reminded me she had been my lunch buffet server. Apparently, my interest in her job and/or my tip -- while not extravagant -- had apparently made a sufficient impression that she mentioned it to her partner when her shift finished.
Lucky
(Usually seated in the "trouble-maker' section of the buffet, don'cher know?)
Quote: darkozWhat? Now Bobs free meal costs $20 amd Jim probably gets a freebie
How do you figure?
Bob has a $50 comp.
He gets $30 worth of food for himself. He has $20 left on the comp, so he lets Jim have it.
Jim gets a $40 steak. $20 of that is covered by the comp, so Jim pays $20 cash for the remainder.
Bob has paid $0 for his $30 meal, and Jim has paid $20 for his $40 meal.
Quote: TigerWuHow do you figure?
Bob has a $50 comp.
He gets $30 worth of food for himself. He has $20 left on the comp, so he lets Jim have it.
Jim gets a $40 steak. $20 of that is covered by the comp, so Jim pays $20 cash for the remainder.
Bob has paid $0 for his $30 meal, and Jim has paid $20 for his $40 meal.
But it's Bob's comp.
