Wizardmobile poll
Poll
 | 20 votes (47.61%) | ||
| | 8 votes (19.04%) | ||
| | 10 votes (23.8%) | ||
| | 4 votes (9.52%) |
42 members have voted
About leasing, I've never done it. We drive a lot less than the average couple, so it would seem like we are not getting out money's worth. I could see it making sense to somebody who drives a lot, assuming unlimited milage.
Quote: WizardThe question comes to down to whether it is worth wasting spending $20,000 to make Mrs. Wizard happy and buy some sorely-needed husbanding points.
How do you make sure Mrs. Wiz doesn't
get an account and read some of your
posts ? ? ?
Quote: Wizard
About leasing, I've never done it. We drive a lot less than the average couple, so it would seem like we are not getting out money's worth. I could see it making sense to somebody who drives a lot, assuming unlimited milage.
Mileage allowances in lease contracts are very flexible. The less miles you contract for the lower the depreciation which results in a lower monthly payment. Leases tend to make sense for people that would get a new car every three years or so. This article from Kiplinger's dispells some of the myths about leasing.
http://www.kiplinger.com/article/cars/T009-C004-S001-five-myths-about-leasing-a-car.html
Quote: WizardI've tried to convince my wife that the Infinity is the better car than the Mercedes and costs $20,000 less. She seems to agree. However, just the Mercedes name is worth $20,000 to her. I isn't worth jack squat to me. The question comes to down to whether it is worth wasting spending $20,000 to make Mrs. Wizard happy and buy some sorely-needed husbanding points.
About leasing, I've never done it. We drive a lot less than the average couple, so it would seem like we are not getting out money's worth. I could see it making sense to somebody who drives a lot, assuming unlimited milage.
I would not get the Mercedes. If you want to spend more to get a well-known luxury name, I'd go with a Lexus. You will have far fewer problems (it's a Toyota, after all) and you still get the well-known name.
My parents have both had Lexuses for a while. Definitely not my kind of car (except maybe the LFA :D) but they are good luxury sedans.
Quote: Wizard from DTI hope you car enthusiasts will contribute your two cents to my Wizardmobile poll.
These aren't my bag so I'll apologize in advance for any poo-pooing of your choices, but hopefully something can be gleaned from my response.
Infinity - I look at Infinity vs Nissan like I do GMC vs Chevy or Lincoln vs Ford, just a fancier version of an "every man's" car. To be honest, when I first saw a pic of the car in question, I thought Google messed up and showed me a Hyundai. I don't know much about Infinity, but I know I've never seen one and thought "Wow, that guy's doing something right!" Usually the only thing I think is "Why?".
Audi - See above. Audi's just a fancy VW. Yours looks like a fancy Passat. I like it. I like VW. I'd think it was a nice car if I seen it, and since it's a VW, I assume it's of high quality.
Merc - Something rubs me the wrong way. Most Mercs do. Unless it's an ultra high performance model, I don't like them. And while diesel has many pros, if you're not used to it, you might hate it. The power comes on way different than gas. Also, diesel smells terrible and is very greasy. It's not something a lady would want to get on her hands, so pumping gloves are a must. Which must be kept in the car. Which fills the car with diesel smell.
BMW - I like the 3 series. Almost bought a 328i, once upon a stupid day. But while the car was way out of my price range, the maintenance was out of my universe. And I have a weird thing with Beamers, whatever model I see, I can't help but wonder why the buyer didn't get a better one, as if he couldn't afford it so just got the little one. Unless you're driving an M Series, I can't help but think you're just posing. But if you do buy an M Series, I think you're showing off. I think I love all the cars, but hate all the drivers lol. Maybe I'm just jealous =p
Bottom line, take a little from what EvenBob said. Prestige is kind of stupid. Prestige is based off of what other people think. This ain't "other people's" car, this is your wife's. You could buy the most awe inspiring car to the masses, but if she hates it, you're still in the dog house. My '93 Subaru Legacy was a turd, but I'd cry if someone bought one for me again because I love it. Might I suggest making a day of it with her? A whole day of her finding her perfect car. She gets to try on a bunch, pick the car she wants, you get to spend a day together, and it's all about her.
Give her what you think she wants, and there's always the chance you muck it up. And since you're a man and a husband, you will muck it up. Let her get what she wants, and you might find that's all she wanted in the first place = )
Quote: AxiomOfChoiceI guess it depends how much you need the money vs how much you care about the finer points of the car.
And that's just it. The Hyundais, if you compare them point by point and feature by feature, are equal to or better than maybe everything about the German cars. Particularly impressive is the technology in the Equus. The Koreans have clearly surpassed the Germans with these new breed of cars.
Quote: FaceInfinity - I look at Infinity vs Nissan like I do GMC vs Chevy or Lincoln vs Ford, just a fancier version of an "every man's" car. To be honest, when I first saw a pic of the car in question, I thought Google messed up and showed me a Hyundai. I don't know much about Infinity, but I know I've never seen one and thought "Wow, that guy's doing something right!" Usually the only thing I think is "Why?".
Don't be fooled; the Infiniti is a good car. Drive one and you will know. It may look like a Hyundai, but drive both and you will feel the difference. Those things can move.
Japanese is DEFINITELY the way to go. Less problems, easier to maintain and repair.
And like you said "you'd stick to Japanese without a second thought"
Personally, I'd find a nice Lexus(IS or ES) or maybe an Acura(IL or TL). Both makers have some very nice 2012/2013 models.
To me, Infiniti, just doesn't have the prestige of the other higher end Japanese models...probably because of that Nissan connotation.
Check out CarMax too. They have some really nice, gently used, high-end cars.
Quote: iluvdisco33And that's just it. The Hyundais, if you compare them point by point and feature by feature, are equal to or better than maybe everything about the German cars. Particularly impressive is the technology in the Equus. The Koreans have clearly surpassed the Germans with these new breed of cars.
Yeah but they are boring cars to drive. FWD with slushboxes. If I had to drive one of these every day I would lose it.
I would not recommend the German cars just because of the maintenance issues. But there are great Japanese cars that are a lot more fun than these boring Korean cars.
Quote: EvenBobBMW or Mercedes, but why. I would get a fully
loaded Hyundai Sonata for about $20K. Its a
fantastic car and you can get a pair of them for
what you'll pay for the others and its just as
good a car.
My sister, when she was a teenager some 18 years ago had a Hyundai - needed to have the entire engine replaced once and transmission once as well. My cousin, a few years later, bought a Hyundai and went through the same problems of needing the entire engine replaced (and this was after the NY lemon law got her a new one for the original one she bought). Maybe Hyundai has improved but I, for one, will likely never find out from personal buying experience.
Quote: AxiomOfChoiceDon't be fooled; the Infiniti is a good car.
Didn't mean to imply it wasn't. I'm probably not the best to ask because I could care less for "prestige" or "accessories". I don't care about chrome, leather, power anything, heated massage seats, whatever. If it doesn't make it go faster, turn faster, or stop faster, it's unnecessary in my eyes =)
Quote: WizardI've tried to convince my wife that the Infinity is the better car than the Mercedes and costs $20,000 less. She seems to agree. However, just the Mercedes name is worth $20,000 to her. I isn't worth jack squat to me. The question comes to down to whether it is worth wasting spending $20,000 to make Mrs. Wizard happy and buy some sorely-needed husbanding points.
About leasing, I've never done it. We drive a lot less than the average couple, so it would seem like we are not getting out money's worth. I could see it making sense to somebody who drives a lot, assuming unlimited milage.
She understands that the blue tec is a diesel engine? That means harder to find gas, more expensive gas, different and more expensive maintenance...
Quote: toastcmuI think if the Wizard is going to lease, that would tilt my vote to the Audi or BMW, but since he states he's going to buy, then the long term cost comes into play. I think it boils down to also what Mrs. Wizard appreciates for the interior of the car. The Audi's tend to have the nicest 'looking' interiors in my opinion. Mercedes has gone so button happy these days, and they really haven't updated the E-class that much other than appearance changes. As other's have stated the newest Bmw 3-series is nothing like the BMWs of old. Shoot, they're even considering fwd BMWs!
Best of luck with the purchase! From what I hear, owning a car in Vegas is a crap shoot unless you have a good mechanic anyhow...
-B
I'm pretty sure you get the free maintenance no matter how you pay for it.
Quote: Wizardto make Mrs. Wizard happy and buy some sorely-needed husbanding points.
Those points are a waste of time. They last about a
day and a half. Best thing I ever did was stop trying
to please my wife. It never ends and never works
for long. Its a game they play, stop playing the game
and they have to stop too. Whats she going to do,
leave? She'll become reasonable overnight, but most
men don't have the guts to find that out.
Great line from a movie I was watching. How do you
get a man? "Find out what he likes and pretend
you like it too. Then convince him his happiness
depends on you being happy." Screw that.
Quote: EvenBobThose points are a waste of time. They last about a
day and a half. Best thing I ever did was stop trying
to please my wife. It never ends and never works
for long. Its a game they play, stop playing the game
and they have to stop too. Whats she going to do,
leave? She'll become reasonable overnight, but most
men don't have the guts to find that out.
Great line from a movie I was watching. How do you
get a man? "Find out what he likes and pretend
you like it too. Then convince him his happiness
depends on you being happy." Screw that.
very good points here. make the relationship about mutual respect instead of "owing" the girl things to make her happy.
interior appointments. The interior probably matters most
of all. Find a reasonable car that has a great interior, leather,
a big dashboard display, lots of whistles and bells, and women
love it. Killer air and killer heat, a good stereo, comfortable seats,
and they're good to go.
Quote: WizardI've tried to convince my wife that the Infinity is the better car than the Mercedes and costs $20,000 less. She seems to agree. However, just the Mercedes name is worth $20,000 to her. I isn't worth jack squat to me. The question comes to down to whether it is worth wasting spending $20,000 to make Mrs. Wizard happy and buy some sorely-needed husbanding points.
About leasing, I've never done it. We drive a lot less than the average couple, so it would seem like we are not getting out money's worth. I could see it making sense to somebody who drives a lot, assuming unlimited milage.
Wizard, I would make a counteroffer to the wifey. Offer the Infinity + a $20k trip or shopping spree versus getting the Mercedes.
Quote: AsswhoopermcdaddyWizard, I would make a counteroffer to the wifey. Offer the Infinity + a $20k trip or shopping spree versus getting the Mercedes.
Or how about this-
Offer a Honda Accord + a $10k trip, or shopping spree;
Keep the remaining $40k or so as your personal AP bankroll and go CRUSH THE VENETIAN!
2013 Tesla Model S
Unlike the four finalists, the Tesla has the added benefit of being made in the USA.
Quote: FaceAudi - See above. Audi's just a fancy VW. Yours looks like a fancy Passat. I like it. I like VW. I'd think it was a nice car if I seen it, and since it's a VW, I assume it's of high quality.
I'd buy a fancy VW over a Audi, but I have a thing for Golf and VW's Diesel engines.
Quote:
Merc - Something rubs me the wrong way. Most Mercs do. Unless it's an ultra high performance model, I don't like them. And while diesel has many pros, if you're not used to it, you might hate it. The power comes on way different than gas. Also, diesel smells terrible and is very greasy. It's not something a lady would want to get on her hands, so pumping gloves are a must. Which must be kept in the car. Which fills the car with diesel smell.
The only Merc I've ever enjoyed driving was the A-Class, which was super comfortable and the right size for driving around London. Otherwise, the larger boats are ugly, and feel 'wrong'.
Quote:
BMW - I like the 3 series. Almost bought a 328i, once upon a stupid day. But while the car was way out of my price range, the maintenance was out of my universe. And I have a weird thing with Beamers, whatever model I see, I can't help but wonder why the buyer didn't get a better one, as if he couldn't afford it so just got the little one. Unless you're driving an M Series, I can't help but think you're just posing. But if you do buy an M Series, I think you're showing off. I think I love all the cars, but hate all the drivers lol. Maybe I'm just jealous =
I have a 15 year old BMW. The early maintenance has been expensive to get rid of the troubles from the previous owner hadn't bothered with. The biggest culprit was the BMW garage mechanics, who were appallingly bad at fixing the root problems, rather than doing the bare minimum. Now I have it on a good maintenance schedule with a independent guy, it's not been much more expensive than the VW, while being much more fun to drive and toodle around in.
I'd be hard pushed to buy a brand new one, they seem to lose their value fast. But if I found an 10 year old 320i (kinda rare here) I'd snap it up. And if I had the money, I'd be looking at M3's very hard.
Quote: s2dbakerI can respect the Wizard's choices as the four finalists are all very nice cars but if you want to impress the wifey, then you have to go with the Motor Trend Car of the Year.
2013 Tesla Model S
Unlike the four finalists, the Tesla has the added benefit of being made in the USA.
Look at the dash in the Tesla. The huge display lets you
control everything. My wife would go crazy for a car like
this. MotorTrend says its quick and handles like a sports
car.
Shut up you!! Bob and I just agreed on something!Quote: IbeatyouracesJust more crap to cause "distrated driver syndrome."
Quote: WizardHowever, just the Mercedes name is worth $20,000 to her.
The Mercedes name bears weight, but so do others on the list; "Mercedes" only has a special ring with people who don't know or care about cars. It's hardly the crowd to base one's choice of vehicle on. And E-series diesel is as boring as cars even get. Buying it to get noticed is likely to be quite disappointing.
Quote: AZDuffmanLeasing is a very expensive way to maintain having a "new" car all of the time.
The maker advertises a 2-year lease on Infiniti G37 Journey, that very one, with options, at a total of $10,700. And you aren't easily selling a 2-year $40,700 MSRP car for $30,000 on your own, even with low mileage. If you drive less than average, only the better, you're sure to make the 10,000 mile/year limit.
Buying a car is for people who know what exactly they want, want it for their own enjoyment, and are enthusiastic enough about cars for the gains of ownership to outweigh the burdens. Leasing is for people who want to maintain appearance. And it saves time, you basically return it and go back in a new lease.
Quote: s2dbakerI can respect the Wizard's choices as the four finalists are all very nice cars but if you want to impress the wifey, then you have to go with the Motor Trend Car of the Year.
2013 Tesla Model S
True, Model S is a great car. Just by itself, forget being electric, it's fully competitive with gasoline models and beats them on a few counts. If I had to have a 4-door, it would be on my short list, especially in this price range. But you have to be prepared to deal with new technology and possible challenges of being a mid-early adopter.
The base model has only 160 miles of range, however. In practice you'll want to do 120 to reduce wear and keep good headroom. If you still have another car for those trips to Mexico, it shouldn't be a problem. But they aren't delivering them yet, only premium models are being shipped, and these are sold out anyway. So it would take some wait, probably till the mid year.
Yes!Quote: MakingBookKeep the remaining $40k or so as your personal AP bankroll and go CRUSH THE VENETIAN!
I have a feeling he wouldn't last very long...
I really like the suggestion about buying a $25K car and giving my wife $20K to do with what she pleases. As has been pointed out, the Infinity is a glofied Nissan, and Lexas a glorified Toyota. Personally, I don't need all the extra bells and whistles. I just want to get to point B in relative comfort, not break down on the way, and not put my mechanic's kids through Stanford. My other car, a Highlander has features I have never touched, like Bluetooth, which I'm too lazy to figure out how to use, or the rear view camera. I can look over my shoulder myself, thank you very much.
Maybe our next visit we'll check out the Camry, and to humor her, the BMW 328. Then I'll suggest the Camery + 20K idea. I'll keep you posted.
you won't be sorry..
The only reason I didn't extol the virtues of other cars was you asked us not to.
I agree about the tire punctures. I had 5 in Vegas between 2005 and 2008 but since then I only have had one.Quote: WizardHow is it different from anywhere else? Having lived here 12 years, I have had way more than my share of tire punctures, but otherwise I don't notice a difference as far as my cars. I think the tire punctures were from debri resulting from all the construction during the good times. Come to think of it, since 2008 the frequency of them has gone way down.
Quote: WizardAs has been pointed out, the Infinity is a glofied Nissan, and Lexas a glorified Toyota.
But then Porsche is a glorified Volkswagen.
Infiniti and Lexus are designed for the American/European markets, with emphasis on things these markets value. Legroom, headroom, different ergonomics, styling. Don't judge them by what you remember about Nissans and Toyotas, they may be the same under the hood and on the bottom, but not in the greenhouse.
But for A to B with legroom and great reliability, Camry's one of the cars to get.
I can't get behind Korean marques. Japanese vehicles, especially Honda and Toyota (applies to Nissan and Mitsubishi to a lesser extent), are designed and built such as to run through their warranty life without breaking down, and often do just that. If they do break down, parts are everywhere and fixes are easy.
If you were on a tight budget, a Hyundai could be a good idea, but you're not, and their cars just aren't on the same level.
I for one hope you do get Infiniti G37. It's certainly not too late to get into real cars, and in this case it won't cost you much more in terms of ownership or reliability. Maybe you'll enjoy that, maybe not, but you won't regret it. There may come a time for minivans, but not yet. Now, G37 is not a sports car, but it's a nice performance sedan that you can actually like, not just live with.
Quote: MoscaNo road feel...
It gets you where you're going and without feeling like you just got a colonoscopy. Is it supposed to give you one?
A car doesn't stay in the top 5 best-selling models in US throughout a decade for nothing.
Quote: P90
If you were on a tight budget, a Hyundai could be a good idea, but you're not, and their cars just aren't on the same level.
.
Spoken by someone who's never driven one recently.
They have improved them so much in the last 5
years its not even the same car.
Quote: AxiomOfChoiceYeah but they are boring cars to drive. FWD with slushboxes. If I had to drive one of these every day I would lose it.
I would not recommend the German cars just because of the maintenance issues. But there are great Japanese cars that are a lot more fun than these boring Korean cars.
That's what I was thinking until I did the test drives, and remember, this comes from a former Hyundai skeptic. The Equus is astoundingly more responsive than the big BMW. The Genesis R-Spec with 429hp and for the price & warranty that comes with? I can't even find a car on paper that has equal bang for the buck.
Quote: EvenBobSpoken by someone who's never driven one recently.
They have improved them so much in the last 5
years its not even the same car.
P90 had to of missed my input on the two cars we were lucky enough to discover.
On leasing, I thought that was for people who couldn't afford the downpayment?
Diesels aren't made for US drivers, who have little tolerance for unnecessary noise, spewing soot, or spending extra time at the filling stations looking for a pump that sells diesel. Someone mentioned they'd only drive a stick shift. A stick shift? Really? What third world country still has those? Electric cars & hybrids are for the birds. What a silly idea.
Quote: EvenBobSpoken by someone who's never driven one recently.
They have improved them so much in the last 5
years its not even the same car.
I think you might be the naive one. My daughter has a 2013 Elantra and I had a 2013 Sonata as a rental last week in Reno. If you really think the performance and handling is better than the German cars listed, I think you are nuts. I would agree 100% that the Hyundai's are more practical and affordable, but the driving experiences are completely different. I recommended my daughter get the Hyundai, but for someone that can afford and appreciate a more refined car, that wouldn't be the choice.
Quote: DRichI think you might be the naive one. My daughter has a 2013 Elantra and I had a 2013 Sonata as a rental last week in Reno. If you really think the performance and handling is better than the German cars listed, I think you are nuts. I would agree 100% that the Hyundai's are more practical and affordable, but the driving experiences are completely different. I recommended my daughter get the Hyundai, but for someone that can afford and appreciate a more refined car, that wouldn't be the choice.
Yeah, I think there's two things going on here. The Hyundais are much better than they were. I'd probably take a Sonata over a Camry at the Hertz counter now. But to say that a Sonata is on par with the cars on this list is just nuts. It's not close.
Quote: rdw4potusYeah, I think there's two things going on here. The Hyundais are much better than they were. I'd probably take a Sonata over a Camry at the Hertz counter now. But to say that a Sonata is on par with the cars on this list is just nuts. It's not close.
I'd believe that.
I would still stay away from the German cars due to reliability / maintenance issues.
I like the Infiniti best from the list, even ignoring cost. If the Wizard wants something more upscale, I'd suggest a Lexus over any of these. I wonder why no Lexus made the final 4? They are reliable, but still luxury cars with a well-known prestigious name.
Quote: iluvdisco33Someone mentioned they'd only drive a stick shift. A stick shift?
Quote: iluvdisco33P90 had to of missed my input on the two cars we were lucky enough to discover.
I am to a small extent - but still some - interested in girls' perspectives on cars. However you appear to be a male, so you can't provide that.
And to be able to give input on a car from a man's perspective, you have to use manual transmission.
Quote: iluvdisco33On leasing, I thought that was for people who couldn't afford the downpayment?
Then you were mistaken. Cheap used cars and zero downpayment loans are for people who can't afford the down payment. Leasing is for people who can afford to change cars every couple years.
Quote: iluvdisco33Someone mentioned they'd only drive a stick shift. A stick shift? Really?
Slushboxes are for women who can't drive. Just thought I'd point that out.
You should used the preferred term, "Broads".Quote: AxiomOfChoiceSlushboxes are for women who can't drive. Just thought I'd point that out.
Slushboxes are for broads who can't drive. (I have a two speed Automatic in my '57 Studebaker so call me a broad)
Quote: s2dbakerYou should used the preferred term, "Broads".
Slushboxes are for broads who can't drive. (I have a two speed Automatic in my '57 Studebaker so call me a broad)
No, that's acceptable. There are exceptions to every rule.
Quote: NicksGamingStuffI don't understand the part about giving your wife 20k. If you are married isn't everything you own hers too? Like a joint property thing?
I can only assume you are not married. What's her's is her's, and what's his is her's too !
Quote: P90
It gets you where you're going and without feeling like you just got a colonoscopy. Is it supposed to give you one?
A car doesn't stay in the top 5 best-selling models in US throughout a decade for nothing.
I get to drive them all. Camrys are horrible cars. Well built, yes. But awful. The new Kias and Hyundais are far better designs, not just in appearance but also in handling, NVH, tightness... Everything. I would buy either a Sonata or an Optima over a Camry, and know that I got the better car.
In the Wizard's poll, they're all excellent cars, and the reason to choose one or another is hazier, and more personal. Personally I'd take the Audi; I've always liked those cars. But I would also be done with it in 3-4 years; reliability of Audis goes way down past 60k, and parts and labor on them is astronomical. The Infiniti fits his situation of wanting both a status symbol and wanting to have the car a long time. There is the additional bonus that Nissan engineers enjoy performance, and Infinitis are fun to drive.
Quote: WizardI've tried to convince my wife that the Infinity is the better car than the Mercedes and costs $20,000 less. She seems to agree. However, just the Mercedes name is worth $20,000 to her. I isn't worth jack squat to me. The question comes to down to whether it is worth wasting spending $20,000 to make Mrs. Wizard happy and buy some sorely-needed husbanding points.
About leasing, I've never done it. We drive a lot less than the average couple, so it would seem like we are not getting out money's worth. I could see it making sense to somebody who drives a lot, assuming unlimited milage.
How about a compromise by way of buying a gently used Mercedes? My parents know the owner of a car dealership and always check in with him for a car that is used by dealers or as a company car. They routinely get 1 year old cars with under 5,000 miles on them for 20-25% off of retail. Essentially you are getting a new car, you just aren't paying that huge premium you pay to drive it off the lot with 0 Miles on the gauge, which to me is worth nothing.
