Obese privilege
Quote: TomGAll workers should be allowed to set their schedules to work as much or as little as they want. If a boss doesn't allow someone to take an hour or a day off whenever they want (with notice), that means the boss is essentially saying they are irreplaceable. That is a poor way to run a workplace
Or make work so great people want to work there.
Does your car move "slower" because you're so heavy?
I don't understand their logic....
Quote: TigerWuI don't get it... what does being obese have to do with traveling during rush hour?
How is being allowed to work seven hours instead of eight such a noteworthy privilege that it requires such a discussion? Aren't different schedules among workers something that already exists at most workplaces?
Quote: TomGHow is being allowed to work seven hours instead of eight such a noteworthy privilege that it requires such a discussion? Aren't different schedules among workers something that already exists at most workplaces?
If it is a salaried position and one person is allowed to work less yet remain paid the same—you have no issue with that?
I remember a summer job I had during college allowed smokers one smoke break per hour - smokers would get to walk outside, smoke, walk back inside - amounting to approximately 10 minutes per hour — essentially working only 5/6 what others did
Quote: aceofspadesIf it is a salaried position and one person is allowed to work less yet remain paid the same—you have no issue with that?
I have no issues with what was proposed by the government advisor in the article you cited. There are many things in this world outside of that proposal that we can all take issue with.
Quote: TomGAren't different schedules among workers something that already exists at most workplaces?
Yes, but that doesn't answer my question...
What does obesity have to do with rush hour? Regardless of different working schedules, why is an obese person unable to travel during rush hour? I think it's odd they are making that one specific claim...
Quote: TigerWuWhat does obesity have to do with rush hour? Regardless of different working schedules, why is an obese person unable to travel during rush hour? I think it's odd they are making that one specific claim...
Having the fattest people ride the bus when it is less crowded, instead of when it is most crowded would be good for everyone
Quote: TigerWuI don't get it... what does being obese have to do with traveling during rush hour?
Does your car move "slower" because you're so heavy?
I don't understand their logic....
In large cities like london most people are not driving to work. They are taking subways m busses
Quote: TigerWuI don't get it... what does being obese have to do with traveling during rush hour?
Does your car move "slower" because you're so heavy?
I don't understand their logic....
I believe they are referring to public transit. If they come an hour late to avoid rush hour, they get to avoid the evening rush by leaving an hour late, as well.
Quote: billryanI believe they are referring to public transit. If they come an hour late to avoid rush hour, they get to avoid the evening rush by leaving an hour late, as well.
But why should they receive a special dispensation to avoid rush hour merely because they ate themselves into obesity?
Here's a nigtmare scenario: a 420 pounder buys a single seat in the coach section of a Southwest Airlines flight; no way they can fit without encroaching on the neighbor's space.
Quote: aceofspadesBut why should they receive a special dispensation to avoid rush hour merely because they ate themselves into obesity?
It doesn't have to be special. It could be standard
Quote: MrVPerhaps so more riders can be accomodated?
Here's a nigtmare scenario: a 420 pounder buys a single seat in the coach section of a Southwest Airlines flight; no way they can fit without encroaching on the neighbor's space.
Buy 2 seats
Quote: TomGIt doesn't have to be special. It could be standard
Ok - then why make it a standard privilege for them - everyone else has to be to work at a certain hour (which usually means dealing with rush hour traffic or the lack of space on buses and trains at that time )but, if you make yourself obese, you get a free pass?
Quote: aceofspadesBuy 2 seats
*ahem*
That seems discriminatory.
Quote: aceofspadesBuy 2 seats
Most airlines have a rule that if the
arm rests won't go down, or you
need a seat belt extender, you have
to buy two seats. I remember a guy
in the 90's in an aisle seat that was so
fat, half his bulk was in the aisle and
you had to squeeze around him to
get to the restroom.
Quote: MrV*ahem*
That seems discriminatory.
Not at all - the obese are not a 'protected class'
Is it discriminatory that insurance companies charge more to teenage drivers?
Is it discriminatory for life insurance companies to refuse to insure Tom Cruise on a movie set when he does his own stunts?
Is it discriminatory for automobile manufacturers to charge more for SUV's, which more readily accommodate obese drivers than they do for a Prius?
Quote: aceofspadesOk - then why make it a standard privilege for them - everyone else has to be to work at a certain hour (which usually means dealing with rush hour traffic or the lack of space on buses and trains at that time )but, if you make yourself obese, you get a free pass?
It should be standard that employees aren’t so special that the only way their workplace can run is if they are their for specific times. Let everyone decide when they want to work and then compensate them based on how much value they add, regardless of obesity status
Quote: TomGIt should be standard that employees aren’t so special that the only way their workplace can run is if they are their for specific times. Let everyone decide when they want to work and then compensate them based on how much value they add, regardless of obesity status
I don’t run a business, at least not one where there are people showing up like at a typical office job. But I’m pretty sure that puts a strain on the business because now they would have to be open for longer periods of time. They have to pay more in lighting, electricity, security, janitor (kind of), and other stuff that likely exists.
If you can pick your own hours, some people are going to be showing up at 4am and leaving by noon and others will be showing up at 2pm or later and leaving by midnight or later. So now I need a manager to show up at 4am, another to be there at noon, and a third to be there for closing?
Why can’t obese people show up to work on time? If you have to walk to work, leave earlier. If you take the bus, take an earlier bus if you need to. If you walk to lunch during your break, either walk faster or eat faster.
If you are jealous of them for their special privileges, a couple months of Mickey Ds and you can join them. Win Win.
Quote: RSBut I’m pretty sure that puts a strain on the business because now they would have to be open for longer periods of time. They have to pay more in lighting, electricity, security, janitor (kind of), and other stuff that likely exists.
If it would put a strain on the business, it wouldn’t be adding any value so the employee wouldn’t be compensated for those hours and all those problems would solve themselves
Quote: TomGIf it would put a strain on the business, it wouldn’t be adding any value so the employee wouldn’t be compensated for those hours and all those problems would solve themselves
Usually, businesses require their staff to be at their office/facility so that they can interact with customers and with each other. Having some people work shifts where they can't readily interact with other staff or customers is not useful.
Also, basing salary/compensation on an assessment of value is tricky -for many kinds of employees it is illegal not to pay them for hours that they have worked. There are minimum wage laws, etc. Also, any system for frequently adjusting/changing the determination of employee value would be a burden - there would need to be all sorts of controls to make sure that there is no discrimination (against minorities), no favoritism and no basis for an employee law suit.
see: airline obesity policies
Air Canada has this to say:
"“For travel within Canada, customers who require extra seating because they are disabled by obesity or because they must accommodate another disability may request the service free of charge” on most aircraft. (A physician’s approval is required.)"
Quote: MrVHere's a nigtmare scenario: a 420 pounder buys a single seat in the coach section of a Southwest Airlines flight; no way they can fit without encroaching on the neighbor's space.
Bad example, as Southwest provides an extra seat to "customers of size" for free. (Seriously.)
Yesterday I was flying Delta from LAS to DTW. Flight was completely full. Two 300+ pound guys were sitting near me in the gate area bitching about the "awful customer service" the gate agent gave them. From what I was able to deduce from their whining, they asked to be next to an empty seat and there weren't any available. They seemed completely miserable. I was just hoping to not be seated next to either of them.
-variant of ancient Chinese saying.
We don't need to shame and punish grossly obese people - God will take care of that for us.
Quote: gordonm888"If you sit by the river long enough, the bodies of all the grossly obese people will go floating by."
-variant of ancient Chinese saying.
We don't need to shame and punish grossly obese people - God will take care of that for us.
Apparently God has many, many agents on earth then, perhaps self-appointed.
Quote: happaheroStuff like this is why the western world is on the decline and China is on the upswing.
People need not be fit and svelte in order to work, breed and survive in America today: few of us have to do the type of hard, physical work which requires a lean, mean body.
"You want fries with that?"
Quote: mcallister3200Tom, what you are describing is available to those unable or unwilling to work the way their employer asks, it’s called self employment.
What’s weird is that self-employment is the only time an employee is irreplaceable. Anyone who works for someone else can always be replaced, so there is no reason that spending an hour, day, or week away from a job shouldn’t be an available option if they ask for it professionally
Quote: ParadigmForget all the examples...the question is do you believe obese people should be a protected class of citizens?
It so obviously shouldn’t happen and so obviously won’t happen. But if it did it would be hilarious to hear all the snowflakes so easily offended by everything bitch and whine about it
Quote: ParadigmForget all the examples...the question is do you believe obese people should be a protected class of citizens?
No, because the vast majority of the time, obesity is the result of years of mostly poor dietary and exercise choices a person has made on their own behalf.
"Protected classes" should only be for things where people have no control over how they are.
Quote: TomGIt so obviously shouldn’t happen and so obviously won’t happen. But if it did it would be hilarious to hear all the snowflakes so easily offended by everything bitch and whine about it
So get to work on time obese ones...Tom says no preferential treatment will be legislated for you and your employer can tell you when to get to work or you will be fired.
Quote: TomGIt should be standard that employees aren’t so special that the only way their workplace can run is if they are their for specific times. Let everyone decide when they want to work and then compensate them based on how much value they add, regardless of obesity status
Yeah.... this would work well in the real world.... NOT!!!!
Um, we would have opened our store at 9, the hour listed for store opening, but our obese cashier decided she didn't want to come in until 10.....
Um, I know your surgery was scheduled for 8 but the obese anesthesiologist didn't want to come in until 10......
Um, I know the 8 of us in this unit are supposed to be meeting at 9, but the obese 8th member doesn't want to come until 10 so we will wait....
Quote: ParadigmSo get to work on time obese ones...Tom says no preferential treatment will be legislated for you and your employer can tell you when to get to work or you will be fired.
The employer would be a lot stronger if they were willing to negotiate terms that would be more favorable to both sides. Why are they choosing to be so weak?
Quote: SOOPOOYeah.... this would work well in the real world.... NOT!!!!
Market forces would easily take care of all those problems, whether different schedules were caused by fatness or anything else
Quote: TomGIf it would put a strain on the business, it wouldn’t be adding any value so the employee wouldn’t be compensated for those hours and all those problems would solve themselves
So you’re good with getting rid of minimum wage? Because if some dumba** wants to work 2pm-10pm, he’s only getting paid for the hours between 2pm-5pm. Am I going to get sued for only paying 3 of 8 hours worked? Am I going to get sued for being prejudiced or whatever against obese people because I’m paying them less because they aren’t adding as much value as other employees?
Yeah, that’s never going to work in the real world.
Quote: ParadigmSooPoo...so many on this Forum have never signed the front of a paycheck and have no idea how actual business works. But they have great suggestions for those that do...you should hit them up for great ways to grow your practice and employ more Americans ;-).
Look, I cannot believe many of the proposals on this thread are serious... No one can actually believe a business should just allow its employees to just show up whenever they want. I am not sure what TomG's motives are here.
In my business, I would guess I've been late to work less than ten times in 35 years, Each time called, a few times it was less than 5 minutes. This thread is bothering me. Few do like this one.
Quote: billryanIsn't soopoo an employee? Why would you think he has any practical experience as an employer?
I was an employer for 25 years. Still am in our surgicenter, which is just a small part of my practice, I am the advisor to all our graduating residents about employment, contracts, etc....
Quote: SOOPOOIn my business, I would guess I've been late to work less than ten times in 35 years, Each time called, a few times it was less than 5 minutes. This thread is bothering me. Few do like this one.
Timelines, flexibility, negotiation, and professionalism do not have to be in conflict with each other. Show up to work as expected, but the expectations shouldn’t be that you’re the only person who can do the job and no one else can fill in as needed.
Quote: RSSo you’re good with getting rid of minimum wage? Because if some dumba** wants to work 2pm-10pm, he’s only getting paid for the hours between 2pm-5pm.
Then he can work at McDonalds from 2-5 everyday, then go across the street to 7-11 and work until 10. Both employers should have no problem following minimum wage laws
I see little difference, really, between obesity and substance abuse.
Few if any people choose to be obese; few if any people choose to be meth or heroin addicts.
I've not looked into the root causes of obesity but I'd be willing to bet the dynamics are similar to that of substance abuse addiction, which I think boils down to trying to "feel better," whether it be by eating a bag of Oreos or taking a shot of meth.
The fundamental most important question is simply this: what is it about life in the world today that induces people to engage in such self-destructive behaviors?
Oh, stop it! As we become older, our brains trick us into thinking that we really know something. After all, we are old, so we must really know something? When, in fact, it's the same old world it always was. How could it not be? Especially after only a couple of generations have walked it. Perhaps, this "thinking" leads to the branching off of older persons. We naturally become more physically isolated when older. If the EvenBob's of the world actually knew as much as they claim to let on on internet message boards, they wouldn't be on message boards with the other seeming loners. Sure, we learn bits of specific information that may be quite true, but who really knows anything. And the world chugs along.Quote: MrVThinking about whether obesity should be a protected class harkens back to discussions as to whether drug and alcohol addiction is a disease, and thus covered by insurance, or a choice which should not be covered.
I see little difference, really, between obesity and substance abuse.
Few if any people choose to be obese; few if any people choose to be meth or heroin addicts.
I've not looked into the root causes of obesity but I'd be willing to bet the dynamics are similar to that of substance abuse addiction, which I think boils down to trying to "feel better," whether it be by eating a bag of Oreos or taking a shot of meth.
The fundamental most important question is simply this: what is it about life in the world today that induces people to engage in such self-destructive behaviors?
