kewlj
kewlj
Joined: Apr 17, 2012
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October 29th, 2015 at 3:53:01 PM permalink
Quote: petroglyph



Yes she did, among other things she has stolen the time that the other students deserve to spend getting an education. We pay for the school, the teachers, transportation, meals, nurses and everything else. Why does a 16 year old need a cell phone, and especially in class disturbing the entire flow?.



OMG! Again, some of you people must be 60 year removed from your high school years and have completely forgotten what happened. Hey I've seem American Graffiti. :/ Stolen time and preventing other students from getting an education......LOL.
petroglyph
petroglyph
Joined: Jan 3, 2013
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October 29th, 2015 at 3:57:57 PM permalink
Quote: kewlj

The officer did not belong in the classroom or being involved in this type of situation. It is not his job. His job is to break up fights and protect the students against outside forces.

I disagree. The reason an officer [240lb. weightlifter] is there at all, is as a deterrent, so that fights don't happen, same thing with radar traps along the hwy.
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Disciplinary matters are supposed to be handles the same way they have been for decades, by the school.

And how do you see that working out?
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If the teacher can't handle the student they call the principal, who may then call the parent.

Swell, got an estimate of how much that cost everyone else including what the good students opportunity lost, cost this country? It cost us our position in the world.
tongni
tongni
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October 29th, 2015 at 3:57:59 PM permalink
Quote: kewlj

Your corporal punishment comment speaks for itself. You might want to consider joining the 21st century.

But I'll end with this. Three 10 year olds are playing monopoly at the kitchen table. One is the banker and he cheats. His friend gets mad, goes out to the street and flags down a cop. The officer tells the boy who cheated to give back the monopoly money and play fair. The boy says no. He has now ignored a command from the officer and failed to comply, so the officer throws him to the ground, handcuffs him and arrests him.

You might think this a silly comparison, but it is 100% the same thing. The officer literally had no authority in either case. In the school case, the officer had absolutely no authority in that classroom unless a crime had been committed, which it had not. And that is why he is out of a job.



While I side with the child and not the officer, nearly everything you are saying is incorrect. Citizens are required to obey lawful orders from police officers. If in your story the 10 year old child resisted, then the police officer would be in his rights to use reasonable force to arrest him, if in fact a crime was committed. In your example, monopoly money has no value, therefore no crime has been committed, so the order would be unlawful, so the officer could be charged with false arrest and battery.

In this case, the officer had authority. CNN reports that there is a law called "disturbing schools" in LA which gives school officers authority to arrest when requested by administrators. Arresting the girl has nothing to do why he's out of a job. It's the disproportional use of force.
darkoz
darkoz
Joined: Dec 22, 2009
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October 29th, 2015 at 4:01:11 PM permalink
Quote: petroglyph



You can talk that way here, but either in the ghetto or in prison you wouldn't even make eye contact with persons that may rip you to shreds. That is acknowledgement of the reality that when a superior force demands you do something, then you do it. If she would have complied, he wouldn't have tossed her, you think?



Having grown up in the ghetto and knowing people who have spent time in prison, you definitely make eye contact with persons that may rip you to shreds. You have to let them think you may be ready for a scrap even if you know you are bluffing.

It's the ones who avoid eye contact who are usually victimized first.
For Whom the bus tolls; The bus tolls for thee
Joeman
Joeman
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October 29th, 2015 at 4:04:54 PM permalink
Quote: kewlj

His supervisor, the sheriff that fired him, stated that this was specifically NOT the duties of the school resource officer. I believe the City council say that as well. You might want to check something a little more official than Wikipedia.

Yeah, probably. It's an easy go-to, and usually pretty close to accurate. :)

I wouldn't be surprised if the Sheriff is doing a little damage control here. Or maybe the officer did exceed his authority. I've read conflicting stories about this (not including Wikipedia!). I don't know all the facts, and I certainly am not knowledgeable about SC laws.
"Dealer has 'rock'... Pay 'paper!'"
kewlj
kewlj
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October 29th, 2015 at 4:09:37 PM permalink
Here is what some of you are failing to recognize and/or consider. A police type presence in schools is a response to two things, school shootings and drug activity, both serious criminal activity.

A police presence is not there to arrest someone that stole and extra milk at lunch, or has an overdue library book, or talking on a cell phone. These are school related disciplinary issues that are still handled by the school, not the judicial system.

The school resource officer getting involved in this type of thing is akin to an officer acting outside his jurisdiction. In this particular case it was wrong for this officer to get involved in this issue, even if he was asked. This is were he needed to respond by saying this is not my job, this is a school disciplinary issue. And again, THAT is why he is out of a job.
BedWetterBetter
BedWetterBetter
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October 29th, 2015 at 4:11:24 PM permalink
Not that I agree with the OP, but had a weapon been found on the child or even a threat been made towards another student or teacher, this would be a different story. And probably been played off as, "Security Office Stops School Attack!" or something greatly exaggerated like that.

Point is, no matter what the circumstances, the media will blow the whole thing out of proportion. So why get caught in that whirlwind?
Greasyjohn
Greasyjohn
Joined: Dec 8, 2013
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October 29th, 2015 at 4:18:40 PM permalink
Quote: kewlj

Here is what some of you are failing to recognize and/or consider. A police type presence in schools is a response to two things, school shootings and drug activity, both serious criminal activity.

A police presence is not there to arrest someone that stole and extra milk at lunch, or has an overdue library book, or talking on a cell phone. These are school related disciplinary issues that are still handled by the school, not the judicial system.

The school resource officer getting involved in this type of thing is akin to an officer acting outside his jurisdiction. In this particular case it was wrong for this officer to get involved in this issue, even if he was asked. This is were he needed to respond by saying this is not my job, this is a school disciplinary issue. And again, THAT is why he is out of a job.



Twice now you have referred to this girl as getting arrested for "talking on her cell phone." If she would have complied with the teacher's request to hang up there would be no problem. The student ignored the teacher. The officer ask her to leave the class and she ignored him too. Then she failed to comply with an order to remove herself from the classroom as her actions were disruptive. It was for her failure to comply with the officer's commands that she was arrested. Are you being obtuse?

So you think I might want to "consider joining the 21st century" because I think corporal punishment in schools should be reinstituted. I don't agree that current mores and morality are the most enlightened.
petroglyph
petroglyph
Joined: Jan 3, 2013
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October 29th, 2015 at 4:19:16 PM permalink
Quote: kewlj

OMG! Again, some of you people must be 60 year removed from your high school years and have completely forgotten what happened. Hey I've seem American Graffiti. :/ Stolen time and preventing other students from getting an education......LOL.



My daughter has her kids in the same elementary school she went to, and a few of the teachers are still there. I was aghast when she told me that in that grade school, kids who don't misbehave are given a piece of candy every fifteen minutes.

Yeah, I'm getting older K. I graduated high school in '73, right at the end of the jungle conflict. I did some disrespectful things, smoked weed, mouthed off, didn't take advantage as well as I should have. I also always had a job or two.

A job provides a lot more than just a paycheck. Our folks worked us, we grew up and moved out. Loved them dearly. When my dad spanked me what few times he did, I now thank him for that love. I was a kid that needed some authority, and I don't begrudge him one bit for it.

My kids now thank me for loving them enough to intervene in some of their behavior physically.

I mouthed off a few times after a few beers to a cop, got away with it. But generally with a large cop in front of me telling me to hang up the phone, I would have. Back then though, cops could lean on you a bit and nothing ever came of it. Matter of fact, I got roughed up a little for walking down the street with a glass of beer, by the cops. No problem, I quit doing it. Mom was my best friend and pretty easy on me, but if dad said do this or don't, that is what happened. Same way raising my kids.

The universe needs order, chaos isn't working.

You got to cut me some slack here K, I never been this old before. I'm new at it.
RS
RS
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October 29th, 2015 at 4:23:59 PM permalink
I disagree KJ. I'm not sure how old you are, but I think you're fairly young, but not young enough to have been in high school when cell phones were popular and almost every student had one.

Thankfully, I went to a school where most of the kids were well-behaved-enough. Still plenty of drugs and all sorts of other stuff. But the kids at least semi respected the teachers. If the teacher told the kid to leave, almost every time the kid left. Of all the times a teacher has attempted to kick a student out of the classroom, I think only once the student decided not to leave but to continue to be a nuisance to the class.

For the most part, I just kinda chilled in class, paid attention, and although it was probably the last place I wanted to be (in a class-room), I still enjoyed learning. Well, scratch History and English (two worthless subjects, IMO, but I still paid attention somewhat and wasn't disruptive to the class).


When others are being disruptive to the class....it's really annoying. I'm just thinking, "B****, just go outside. You clearly don't want to be here. And I'm sure you don't give a sh** about math, but I actually care about this....if we don't cover the material in class, we're still gonna get the same test everyone else gets."

Actually, the only time someone was asked to leave a classroom and the kid refused -- it took probably 10-15 minutes of arguing, but the kid finally left. No principal was called, parents were called, and no police were called. In fact, 2 of the other kids were talking sh** to the idiot who wouldn't leave.




KJ, if I'm at a restaurant and I'm being disruptive and am asked to leave but I refuse, do you think the restaurant-people (owner/manager/boss) should be in his right to call the police to have me leave? Do you think it would be within the policeman's job to show up to the restaurant and get me to leave? What if that all happens, but I tell him to F*** off, and I continue to be disruptive? Ultimately, it shouldn't come down to the policeman to have to show up to get me out of the restaurant -- it should have been UP TO ME to leave the restaurant. If I'm an idiot and refuse to leave....well, whatever happens next is on me.

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