Here We Go Again
Quote: MintyI think the claim that African Americans are becoming more defiant is unfair. Anything that isn't complete and total compliance with police is viewed as defiant by some people, and I feel it's an extreme position. Better to stand up for oneself than be trampled on, though it does carry greater risks.
IMO
Are stating facts still considered UNFAIR in your world? Just image if this young girl had gone along with the teacher and others who asked her to stop using her cell phone --- this was a clear cut case of DEFIANCE on her part. Now what the PO did wasn't right and he paid for it with his job. There are segments of our society who feel they can do whatever they want i.e., African Americans determined to fight with the MAN -- the truth doesn't matter whenever your black -- just cry racism and your free at last from any responsibility for said actions.
Quote: JohnnyQI do acknowledge that I would be outraged if my daughter was treated that way.
I would be outraged if my daughter acted that way.
Quote: MintyI think the claim that African Americans are becoming more defiant is unfair. Anything that isn't complete and total compliance with police is viewed as defiant by some people, and I feel it's an extreme position. Better to stand up for oneself than be trampled on, though it does carry greater risks.
When you are being arrested total compliance is the only way to go. If you have issues regarding your arrest then bring it up later. Getting yourself trampled on or worse? You think this is the way to go? As soon as you do that you lose.
Quote: IbeatyouracesI invite all of you to live one week in a Detroit "hood", ride the buses in Detroit, etc., then do the same in the suburbs. You're attitude toward them will change to the worse.
You could apply that scenario to any "hood" type community thru out America and get the same results. Those attitudes towards some Africans Americans aren't getting worse - IMO the moral turpitude of some AA's is totally void of any responsibility, ever.
Quote: MintyI think the claim that African Americans are becoming more defiant is unfair. Anything that isn't complete and total compliance with police is viewed as defiant by some people, and I feel it's an extreme position. Better to stand up for oneself than be trampled on, though it does carry greater risks.
I get what you're saying, but that doesn't work on the streets. I've said it before, the police's job is to enforce the law. Sure, they should have some understanding of said law first, but everyone has parts of their job they're worse at than others. I don't see why the police would be any different.
Compliance absolutely is the answer after a certain point. You get nabbed in one of those "unconstitutional road side checks", sure, resist. Keep your window up. Show license / reg by holding it up to the window. That's your right. But if the cop is either ignorant or a legit bad apple and attempts to remove you from the car, what's a fight gonna do other than leave you with a face full of pepper, if not a chest full of 10,000v or .40cal? As I've said, not one person has ever been killed by "Your Honor". A cop violates your rights, make him pay in court. On the streets, you lose every time.
This video made me smile. I don't care, it did. That doesn't mean I think his actions were correct, but I grew up with many of these types. I remember once (I grew up post-corporal punishment era) when an old timer subbed in shop and one of these types mouthed off. The old timer slapped him right across the face. Best day of school ever. Hell, that was '96 and I still remember it.
Now, the video gives not near enough info to make an informed opinion, but her slapping and punching at him when she is grabbed makes me believe this wasn't a simple issue that he severely overreacted about. It appears that she was already quite amped and defiant. And flashing back to my own history and remembering how these types act... I can't help it. I almost laugh. About the only other thing I'd have liked to see was a finishing move. The teacher's desk was right there, and everyone knows how to do a Macho Man off the top rope. That'd have been keen, indeed.
But yeah. Real talk, you can't do that.
Yes, the wonderful 21st century. People now are so tolerant, open minded and respectful of other people's opinions--as long as they agree with them.
Quote: GreasyjohnI just saw the video, again--about 10 times. Even some media outlets referred to the girl as getting "slammed to the ground." I think a lot of people are brainwashed. The take-down was appropriate. She wasn't slammed to the ground. I'm glad the officer got her out of that chair. It seems as though some of you that have responded to this story think we should have engaged her in dialogue and counseling for hours while she sat there.
Yes, the wonderful 21st century. People now are so tolerant, open minded and respectful of other people's opinions--as long as they agree with them.
GJ - you are not a legal authority. The officer was fired. He did not handle the situation properly. Your opinions here don't matter and thankfully, most people see how wrong you are.
You are entitled to your opinion just like people who believe in DI are. But opinions don't change facts.
BTW - Backwards flip with arm around throat with the result girl lands on floor - qualifies to most people as being slammed to the ground. It doesn't have to be a well executed pro wrestling body slam.
Quote: HeySlickIMO
If this had happened in another setting and, the parties involved were reversed this incident wouldn't have even made the news. What really irks me is the hypocrisy of so many people.....especially Black people. To many African Americans avoid the real bottom line/problems within their ranks. IMO fatherless children is another big issue AA's refuse to address --- the gang culture within SOO many AA communities. Being disrespectful and defiant seems like a normal think in so many troubled black communities. It seems like each new generation/some AA's are getting more and more defiant with authority in general.
Understanding that the above is your opinion, do you or anybody else really think that if a black 240lb cop had dumped a white 16yo girl onto her head then dragged/thrown her across the room, and there was video, that it would not create the sensation it has?
Puh-leeze. The cop would not only have been fired, he might not have lived the day out.
I have had a chair go out backwards from under me. My first, useless reaction as I'm tipping was to windmill my arms wildly, trying to grab for anything in reach to keep from continuing to fall. I defy any of you put in that chair and having someone throw you onto your back unexpectedly to keep from doing the same thing. It's simply not possible, if your arms are free, to NOT try and balance/catch yourself as you're going down. So I discount the narrative that she was hitting at him; she was flailing, trying not to land on her head.
As someone with a mixed race family I see a lot of racism by the police. racism in my favor as well.
I beat paying a subway fare when I was a teenager and was picked up by the cops. Taken into a room with other farebeaters. I was the only white person arrested. Within a few moments, the all-white officers pointed to me and said, "Oh, he was just going through the gate to use the telephone. Let him go."
Really? I had been apprehended ON THE ACTUAL TRAIN as it was about to leave the station.
The cops released me and to this day I am so ashamed of the obvious racism that occurred.
Now back to this incident. Everyone involved actually claims race was not an issue. The cop's actions were over-policing/police brutality. It's a shame so many members on here are decrying black people are at fault. White teenagers can be just as disruptive but you know what, the cops simply treat them better.
Quote: darkozGJ - you are not a legal authority. The officer was fired. He did not handle the situation properly. Your opinions here don't matter and thankfully, most people see how wrong you are.
You can ignore what I have to say if you like. It’s a free country. I have discussed the issues in this thread with several friends who agree with me. And if a person expresses an opinion that is truthfully and thoughtfully given then that opinion matters. At the very least I would hope that you’d agree that I should have the right to express my opinion.
Quote: GreasyjohnYou can ignore what I have to say if you like. It’s a free country. I have discussed the issues in this thread with several friends who agree with me. And if a person expresses an opinion that is truthfully and thoughtfully given then that opinion matters. At the very least I would hope that you’d agree that I should have the right to express my opinion.
Yes, you have the right to express your opinion.
To make my statement more lucid, I was saying that the legal aspects have been defined (cop did not do his job, was fired as result) so your opinions don't count in that respect.
Your opinion could be that stealing food is okay as long as a person is hungry but your opinion doesn't count there either. The law says stealing is a crime.
So feel free to express your opinion but recognize the law has declared it incorrect.
Quote: darkozYes, you have the right to express your opinion.
To make my statement more lucid, I was saying that the legal aspects have been defined (cop did not do his job, was fired as result) so your opinions don't count in that respect.
Your opinion could be that stealing food is okay as long as a person is hungry but your opinion doesn't count there either. The law says stealing is a crime.
So feel free to express your opinion but recognize the law has declared it incorrect.
My understanding is that the policeman has retained legal council to get his job back. The fat lady has not sung yet.
Dicenor33 stated that the cop should get a medal. I agree.
Quote: beachbumbabsRe: the girl "slapping and punching" the cop.
I have had a chair go out backwards from under me. My first, useless reaction as I'm tipping was to windmill my arms wildly, trying to grab for anything in reach to keep from continuing to fall. I defy any of you put in that chair and having someone throw you onto your back unexpectedly to keep from doing the same thing. It's simply not possible, if your arms are free, to NOT try and balance/catch yourself as you're going down. So I discount the narrative that she was hitting at him; she was flailing, trying not to land on her head.
Poor observation, IMO. Sure, I've missed a chair or, more likely, had one pulled out from under me. And I've certainly windmill chopped persons nearby in an attempt to gain balance. But this just wasn't that.
When you fall, where do your arms go? Either down to catch yourself or out to hold yourself. And once you contact something with which to hold, what do you do? You hold on.
Her hands went over her head, right to the guy's face. Not once, but what looked like three times. Certainly twice. You don't prevent a backwards fall by throwing your hands in the air. You don't stop a fall by not hanging on.
That still doesn't make his actions right. But it's that very evidence which makes me all but certain that she was already riled and causing a scene. Stopping a fall it was not. More like resisting and assaulting an officer.
Again, it doesn't mean the officer was right. He could've done a lot more to neutralize the situation. But it's the above that makes me smile when I see her get slammed. What can I say? I like deserved smack downs.
Quote: FacePoor observation, IMO. Sure, I've missed a chair or, more likely, had one pulled out from under me. And I've certainly windmill chopped persons nearby in an attempt to gain balance. But this just wasn't that.
When you fall, where do your arms go? Either down to catch yourself or out to hold yourself. And once you contact something with which to hold, what do you do? You hold on.
Her hands went over her head, right to the guy's face. Not once, but what looked like three times. Certainly twice. You don't prevent a backwards fall by throwing your hands in the air. You don't stop a fall by not hanging on.
That still doesn't make his actions right. But it's that very evidence which makes me all but certain that she was already riled and causing a scene. Stopping a fall it was not. More like resisting and assaulting an officer.
Again, it doesn't mean the officer was right. He could've done a lot more to neutralize the situation. But it's the above that makes me smile when I see her get slammed. What can I say? I like deserved smack downs.
I think you and I are seeing different things. There's a big difference between missing a chair and going down, and being seated and going backwards unexpectedly.
See how his arms fly up? That's what I'm talking about.
Quote: GreasyjohnYou can ignore what I have to say if you like. It’s a free country. I have discussed the issues in this thread with several friends who agree with me. And if a person expresses an opinion that is truthfully and thoughtfully given then that opinion matters. At the very least I would hope that you’d agree that I should have the right to express my opinion.
Welcome to my world. You most certainly should have the right to express your opinion unfettered, unmolested and free of harassment. That is understood in most civilized countries.
What do you think the outcome would have been if the girl's parent or parents did that to her? They'd probably be arrested and have their daughter taken away.
Quote: beachbumbabsI think you and I are seeing different things.
We must be, so let me help. Sorry that I can't find a clean YouTube video, all I have is an ad filled news report. But in it, it shows what I'm describing and it does so in slow motion. FF to ~24seconds in.
http://www.msn.com/en-za/video/peopleandplaces/south-carolina-cop-fired-for-violent-arrest-of-student/vp-BBmxs7z
The cop grabs her around the neck, her right hand closes over the cop's hand. Immediately after that, she releases and strikes him in the face. As she goes over, it appears she attempts at least once more if not twice before being wadded up.
I'd hear an argument that it wasn't a strike and instead a flail. But it's going to have to be one hell of an argument. That's a strike if I ever saw one.
Again, not saying that the cop was right.
He does deserve to be looking to a new career IMO. Looks like he'd be a good fit for what casinos unfortunately seem to look for in security officers.
Re: A bad student vs a dead grandpa
Tons of people care a lot when a cop did a wrestling move on a bad student (who will sue the police department, and she will get rich later.)
On the other hand, not much people care when a Kung Fu guy beat a defenseless grandpa to dead (The beating/killing started @ 0:30.)
I don't get upset/outraged anymore because that's just another fact of life. May the Almighty rest the grandpa's soul.
Quote: ArtemisHere is just another fact of life...
Re: A bad student vs a dead grandpa
Tons of people care a lot when a cop did a wrestling move on a bad student (who will sue the police department, and she will get rich later.)
On the other hand, not much people care when a Kung Fu guy beat a defenseless grandpa to dead (The beating/killing started @ 0:30.)
I don't get upset/outraged anymore because that's just another fact of life. May the Almighty rest the grandpa's soul.
How are the two remotely related so that they'd be mentioned in comparison?
Quote: mcallister3200
How are the two remotely related so that they'd be mentioned in comparison?
They're not.
The only comparison I could glean from the two incidents, is an over usage of force. In the incident that everyone seems so interested in, the officer used an excessive amount of force regarding the compliance of an individual who was noncompliant.
The second incident is a demonstration of physical force with the intent to cause harm. Beyond the actual use of physical force, I see no similarities.
The post seems mostly intent to cause shock value to the thread.
Quote: 1BBAs long as megalomaniacs are given a badge and a gun we will have this problem of abuse. It runs rampant not only in law enforcement but in all walks of life. These crimes against defenseless children and innocent adults sicken me.
I invite everyone to take a look at this video. See link below
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=emmoJvpSGyw
Quote: beachbumbabsUnderstanding that the above is your opinion, do you or anybody else really think that if a black 240lb cop had dumped a white 16yo girl onto her head then dragged/thrown her across the room, and there was video, that it would not create the sensation it has?
Puh-leeze. The cop would not only have been fired, he might not have lived the day out.
In the current climate of endless accusations and biased reporting by the MSM entities e.g., CNN & MSNBC et al --- NO, I don't believe it would've created the same coverage/sensationalism. -- I don't agree with your final and last remark. IMO the black officer probably would've been reassigned or possibly given another chance --- Oh please! with the assination malarkey LOL!
Quote: ArtemisHere is just another fact of life...
Re: A bad student vs a dead grandpa
Tons of people care a lot when a cop did a wrestling move on a bad student (who will sue the police department, and she will get rich later.)
On the other hand, not much people care when a Kung Fu guy beat a defenseless grandpa to dead (The beating/killing started @ 0:30.)
I don't get upset/outraged anymore because that's just another fact of life. May the Almighty rest the grandpa's soul.
Both acts are horrific, and any ordinary human being should be outraged in both instances. However, there is a big difference between the two acts: One act was committed by a street criminal, and the other was committed by a law enforcement officer, whose job is "to protect and to serve." The officer action has implication of public trust, and thus was given national news coverage.
IMO, the recently fired police officer should take this opportunity to contact Vince McMahon to start a new career as a wrestler for the WWE, and he can make million$$$ based on the many comments I see in this thread.
Quote: HeySlickIn the current climate of endless accusations and biased reporting by the MSM entities e.g., CNN & MSNBC et al --- NO, I don't believe it would've created the same coverage/sensationalism. -- I don't agree with your final and last remark. IMO the black officer probably would've been reassigned or possibly given another chance --- Oh please! with the assination malarkey LOL!
Again, we're talking opinions, which is cool. I think the majority of the issue right now is police brutality or excessive force and resentment and pushback, regardless of race, but that race adds to it when it is or appears to be a factor. Part of that same issue is anonymous attacks on police officers, such as the two slain in NYC this past year. The whole thing is also highly subject to available evidence; anecdotes are one thing, video evidence is another, so what gets attention is highly subjective.
To me, the race of the girl (and the officer) is irrelevant, but it matters a lot that it was a girl of some size smaller than the officer. I lived in SC for 4 years, too, and would have to say it would not be surprising IF her race DID factor in how she was treated. That part is unproven/unknown, but seems likely to be looked at for trends or bias.
I'm going to add that, in the last year, SC has had a white police officer gun down a black man running away during a traffic stop, and a white man slaughter 9 blacks during bible study as retaliation, and a big backlash for removing the stars and bars from the statehouse, among other smaller incidents so no, unfortunately, it's not malarkey there right now.
Quote: beachbumbabs
...To me, the race of the girl (and the officer) is irrelevant....
to you maybe, but not to the media and apparently the rest of the population. Us whites apparently are oppressing blacks all over again.. or at least says media and advocate groups
Quote: ajemeisterto you maybe, but not to the media and apparently the rest of the population. Us whites apparently are oppressing blacks all over again.. or at least says media and advocate groups
Yeah, where is the media attention on all of the black heroin dealers selling this crap to and killing the white addicts?
Quote: IbeatyouracesYeah, where is the media attention on all of the black heroin dealers selling this crap to and killing the white addicts?
The media in general has its agenda and your accusations DON'T fit their narrative --- it wouldn't be politically correct to chastise OR expose black heroin dealers --- white casualties aren't relevant in the current scheme of things. Unlike black people, Whites who get addicted are expected to take responsibility for their addiction. AA's can and will blame society (supposed racism) for all of their transgressions etc.
Quote: IbeatyouracesI invite all of you to live one week in a Detroit "hood", ride the buses in Detroit, etc., then do the same in the suburbs. You're attitude toward them will change to the worse.
Does riding the PEOPLE MOVER count ? LOL on a Sunday afternoon to boot
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TIObFMbaGH8
Same goes for any colored thug. White or black.
Quote: tongni
Would you use a taser on a 15 year old? A 10 year old? A five year old?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AkMkGOpAF4s
I'm not saying that it's never warranted, but it has more negative side effects than other methods. Sure, advocate for spanking your kid, but if that's your only method for teaching, it's quite possible they'll adapt to it and/or resent you. Diplomacy first.
Quote: MintyThis thread has turned largely into a celebration of violence. Behavior can be modified so many other ways. It's the individual who lacks creativity, patience and discipline that uses force in place of other actions.
I'm not saying that it's never warranted, but it has more negative side effects than other methods. Sure, advocate for spanking your kid, but if that's your only method for teaching, it's quite possible they'll adapt to it and/or resent you. Diplomacy first.
Your comments are thought provoking. Sometimes when I see rude and obviously disrespectful behavior I want to see the wrong righted forthwith. Everyone knows the behavior is disrespectful and rude and they're waiting to see the outcome.
You are right, there are better ways of handling this situation than immediate force. But in the absence of creativity, force will and should suffice.
It would have been a wonderful learning experience if the kids in that classroom saw a calm and clever way of handling the disruption. But it's easy to say that when we're calm and reflective, and removed from the hostility of the situation.
I spent five years working in a group home for male Young Offenders. These were kids, all high school aged, who had been convicted of multiple crimes from burglary / robbery to assault. The group home was a place for the kids to be rehabilitated and their terms there ranged from about 2 to 10 months.
We were all trained (multiple times) how to handle physical escalations and physical altercations with the kids, and yes, we did get into a few. There are ways to take out a person without tackling them and dragging them out of the classroom. There are pressure points and non-violent ways to suppress an offender, especially someone who is clearly weaker than you.
This officer would have known this and should have exercised this. If I'm an 21 year idiot at a group home with no authority who knows how to do this stuff, this stuff would be basic training to the officer with many years of traiing and should have been the 2nd line of attack with the kid.
And Face, this kid was resisting by striking back, but to be fair the guy had lunged on her, that much is clear. As LEO, you don't put yourself in that situation as a professional. There are other ways to subdue her.
I *did* have the opportunity once to drag one of these rugrats across the floor, and it was because the kid was pretending to be asleep in an empty bed in another room. So I pulled him out of bed, picked him up, and threw him into his own bed. One of the few nights I remember being there, 25 years later.
And corporal punishment is still in force in 19 states, including South Carolina.
Quote: WizardI'd be interested to know what the school was supposed to do in that situation.
Just a few thoughts...
The teacher could have gotten the rest of the students up and taken them out of the classroom, leaving the principal and the disruptive girl there; a hand to her shoulder would have kept her seated. The class was already disrupted; why not take a walk outside while continuing the lesson, or to the gym, or the library? (not that I know what class it was).
The LEO could have grabbed her shoulder closest to him and stood her up; there's a large pressure point that can be pinched. Or grab the back collar of whatever shirt she's wearing and lift, again standing her up. After either, any number of come-along holds will get her moving.
I also liked what someone said above about the whole class taking an "F" for the day unless she put the phone down/handed it over. A little peer pressure is a good thing.
I thought most schools had policies about cell phones having to be left in lockers during classes. They certainly don't belong there. We were under the same restrictions at work, and it wasn't that much of a big deal to leave them in our lockers or mail slots. Make the rule and enforce it. Since I don't have kids, I don't know what current practices are.
Quote: GreasyjohnYour comments are thought provoking. Sometimes when I see rude and obviously disrespectful behavior I want to see the wrong righted forthwith. Everyone knows the behavior is disrespectful and rude and they're waiting to see the outcome.
You are right, there are better ways of handling this situation than immediate force. But in the absence of creativity, force will and should suffice.
It would have been a wonderful learning experience if the kids in that classroom saw a calm and clever way of handling the disruption. But it's easy to say that when we're calm and reflective, and removed from the hostility of the situation.
Thank you. I'm not trying to change anyone's way of thinking or say that one thing is wrong and another right, I'm merely suggesting ideas. I work in the human services field with individuals that have learned some really aggressive behaviors. Punching, biting, hitting and hair pulling are just a few. We almost always try to de-escalate situations verbally before using physical interventions. Even when we are swung upon we attempt blocking and verbal redirection before implementing restraints.
You are right that the girl could have been better behaved. I've seen classrooms that have cell phone holders that students put their phones in before class and get them after. If teachers start things like that in the beginning of the year, I believe students would almost always understand and respect it.
Quote: beachbumbabsJust a few thoughts...
The teacher could have gotten the rest of the students up and taken them out of the classroom, leaving the principal and the disruptive girl there; a hand to her shoulder would have kept her seated. The class was already disrupted; why not take a walk outside while continuing the lesson, or to the gym, or the library? (not that I know what class it was).
The LEO could have grabbed her shoulder closest to him and stood her up; there's a large pressure point that can be pinched. Or grab the back collar of whatever shirt she's wearing and lift, again standing her up. After either, any number of come-along holds will get her moving.
I also liked what someone said above about the whole class taking an "F" for the day unless she put the phone down/handed it over. A little peer pressure is a good thing.
I thought most schools had policies about cell phones having to be left in lockers during classes. They certainly don't belong there. We were under the same restrictions at work, and it wasn't that much of a big deal to leave them in our lockers or mail slots. Make the rule and enforce it. Since I don't have kids, I don't know what current practices are.
It's mostly the parents who are arguing their children need cell phones on them in the classroom. The same cause of having police in the schools (the columbine like rash of shootings) is the argument parents make for having cell phones kept on the person of their children..
If your child was in a school and you got word of a mass shooting, all the kids inside were on lock-down and when you went to see where was your child, was he in danger and the school principal lets you know you can't reach them because all the cell phones are stashed away in the lockers, well, you would suddenly not be so happy about that practice.
Quote: beachbumbabs
The LEO could have grabbed her shoulder closest to him and stood her up; there's a large pressure point that can be pinched. Or grab the back collar of whatever shirt she's wearing and lift, again standing her up. After either, any number of come-along holds will get her moving.
In regards to pressure points, there are a dozen or so around various parts of the body. Around the shoulder would typically cause the subject to pull away, and in this instance, down or away from the officer.
To get someone out of a seat, there are several pressure points around the face and jaw line that are easily accessible, such as a J grip along the infraorbital and occipital nerves, or access the mandibular nerve from below the jaw. These techniques are excellent in aiding someone to a standing position.
So would I, but I wouldn't slam her to the ground and drag her across the room. If you would, we don't see eye-to-eye on parenting. Perhaps you prefer a more traditional approach; after all, the Bible says you get to kill your children when they don't behave:Quote: GreasyjohnI would be outraged if my daughter acted that way.
Quote: Deuteronomy 21:18-21
18 If a man have a stubborn and rebellious son, which will not obey the voice of his father, or the voice of his mother, and that, when they have chastened him, will not hearken unto them:
19 Then shall his father and his mother lay hold on him, and bring him out unto the elders of his city, and unto the gate of his place;
20 And they shall say unto the elders of his city, This our son is stubborn and rebellious, he will not obey our voice; he is a glutton, and a drunkard.
21 And all the men of his city shall stone him with stones, that he die: so shalt thou put evil away from among you; and all Israel shall hear, and fear.
Regardless of how you feel about the girl's actions -- and I am not legitimizing them at all -- the cop was clearly not suited to the task of properly subduing her. That's an entirely proper reason for termination.
Even if you think she deserved harsh treatment, cops usually are suppose to deliver the person to the proper authority, not deliver justice on the way.
The cops do have to do what is necessary. I don't think his superiors thought that amount of force was necessary.
Quote: boymimboOf course this was excessive force where a member of law enforcement did the wrong thing. Was it racial? Who knows? Who cares? It still is the wrong action.
I spent five years working in a group home for male Young Offenders. These were kids, all high school aged, who had been convicted of multiple crimes from burglary / robbery to assault. The group home was a place for the kids to be rehabilitated and their terms there ranged from about 2 to 10 months.
We were all trained (multiple times) how to handle physical escalations and physical altercations with the kids, and yes, we did get into a few. There are ways to take out a person without tackling them and dragging them out of the classroom. There are pressure points and non-violent ways to suppress an offender, especially someone who is clearly weaker than you.
This officer would have known this and should have exercised this. If I'm an 21 year idiot at a group home with no authority who knows how to do this stuff, this stuff would be basic training to the officer with many years of traiing and should have been the 2nd line of attack with the kid.
And Face, this kid was resisting by striking back, but to be fair the guy had lunged on her, that much is clear. As LEO, you don't put yourself in that situation as a professional. There are other ways to subdue her.
I *did* have the opportunity once to drag one of these rugrats across the floor, and it was because the kid was pretending to be asleep in an empty bed in another room. So I pulled him out of bed, picked him up, and threw him into his own bed. One of the few nights I remember being there, 25 years later.
And corporal punishment is still in force in 19 states, including South Carolina.
Why the casinos are required to list the problem gamblers help line’s phone number on the player cards and in their advertisings? Why do the society need fireman, police, regulations, etcetera …?
The simple answer is everyone of us is imperfect and we live in an imperfect society.
There are misbehaving students/human, good behaving students/human. And there are bad cops, good cops.
Here is the fact, there was no violence or any other physical confrontation at the beginning, and the student sat peacefully and her only “crime” was disobeying the officer’s command. The student’s slapping or hitting as described by many here or other social media may not be the appropriate description. There are several ways to interpret the student’s “slapping/hitting” action:
1. The student’s arm movement was a natural reaction to balance her body in response to a surprise excessive force that threw her body off balance.
2. The student’s arm movement was a natural self defense reaction in response to a surprise excessive force.
3. The student’s arm movement was deliberated in response to a surprise excessive force.
IMO, her instantaneous reaction upon being attacked by the officer was a VERY NATURAL human response of either item 1 and/or 2. How would you react if Mike Tyson or any police officer suddenly plunge at you, throw a left hook, or bite your right ear? I don’t know anyone of you here, but I’m 100% confident that in such situation, your brain would instantaneously stimulate your arms, legs or any other muscles in your body to engage you in a SELF DEFENSE mode. I don’t think her arm movement was a deliberate act to harm the officer. Her instantaneous REACTION (whether a natural human response, or intentional depending on one’s perspective) upon being attacked would have been easily avoided if the officer maintain patient and apply the training he received during his days at the police training academy. Yes, excessive force can be applied if necessary, but it is totally unnecessary in this circumstance.
The student misbehavior is unfortunate and is not acceptable. There is no dispute that the student did not listen to her teacher, and did not obey the officer’s command. Since there was no violence action by the student, the officer made a very poor judgment in applying excessive force. Remember, the law enforcement’s motto is “to protect and to serve”. The police officer should have used his skill and applied his years of TRAININGS to bring the “standoff” to a peaceful end.
Has there been one mention in this thread of the fact that the girl was in foster care?
