New shutdowns of casinos
Quote: DRichI don't think a 3 or 4 week closure will satisfy many people. I would expect closer to two months. I think the idea is to slow it to closer to the time the first vaccines will be available.
If a second casino shutdown occurs, I think it will be sold as initially 3-4 weeks but will end up growing into several months until a vaccine starts to become available.
So looking at the period just after New Years, here in Las Vegas that is traditionally one of the busier times of year. But that is all conventions and trade shows, the biggest of which is CES and all that kind of business has already been cancelled.
Super bowl weekend is also in that period which Vegas draws as many people as the Superbowl city. Who knows how that will work, if we even get to a Superbowl. I think I have a bet that we won't. :/
Quote: kewljI think I have a bet that we won't. :/
You do!!!
Quote: SOOPOOYou do!!!
I thought that would get your attention. I haven't forgotten. lol
It is a bet I am fine with losing. Especially if the first place (3-5-1) Eagles make it to the Superbowl. Ok THAT seems unlikely. But still I would like to see the season completed at this point.
And the NFL has sort of changed how they are handling things. Early on when a team had a few players test positive, they cancelled or moved games. That clearly was going to be unsustainable in a rather rigged NFL schedule. Not cancelling many games now, they just sort of play on, treating positive covid tests sort of like a minor injury. Player is out for a week or two.
Quote: kewljYou have to understand that at this point any kind of lockdown or restrictions is not about getting the virus under control. THAT boat has sailed a long time ago. The concern right now is just flattening the curve enough that hospitals, and medical personnel aren't overrun. And I am not so sure THAT boat hasn't already sailed as well.
That is what we were told it was about back in March. "Flattening the curve" they said.
We can't keep shutting down, it is insane. We have to just tough thru it.
Quote: ChumpChangeWe won't make it to February as a society.
What do you mean by that?
"A week before serious interstate travel resumed?" Not at all. I drove from New England to New Jersey that Saturday - September 15, 2001. Onto Manhattan Island, across the GWB. On Interstate 95.
There's no way you could block off all the interstate highways. Can you restrict access to an island that has limited access? Sure. But there are over 100 on-ramps to just I-95 - in Connecticut alone - for example.
Let's not lose even more of a grip on reality with ideas like this that make no sense.
Quote: ChumpChangeMexico's foreign ministry confirmed in a pair of tweets that nonessential land traffic would be shut down at the U.S.-Mexico border through Dec. 21. U.S. officials confirmed to Reuters that the same policy was being followed at the U.S.-Canada border.
Shutting down travel across the US-Mexico border? So how was that working BEFORE Covid-19?
Here's an idea.
Let's build a wall...
Yea... That will work!
Quote: racquetNot NYC - the island of Manhattan. A relatively small number of points of entry - only bridges and tunnels.
"A week before serious interstate travel resumed?" Not at all. I drove from New England to New Jersey that Saturday - September 15, 2001. Onto Manhattan Island, across the GWB. On Interstate 95.
There's no way you could block off all the interstate highways. Can you restrict access to an island that has limited access? Sure. But there are over 100 on-ramps to just I-95 - in Connecticut alone - for example.
Let's not lose even more of a grip on reality with ideas like this that make no sense.
You are right but I was referring to NYC in the local vernacular since I live here.
People in the outer Burroughs (Queens, Brooklyn, Bronx and Staten Island) refer to Manhattan as "the city" and often as NYC.
I do recognize people who aren't familiar with local custom may get confused.
Mail, for example, is almost always addressed as Queens, NY or Brooklyn NY, etc not NYC, NY.
Quote: racquetNot NYC - the island of Manhattan. A relatively small number of points of entry - only bridges and tunnels.
"A week before serious interstate travel resumed?" Not at all. I drove from New England to New Jersey that Saturday - September 15, 2001. Onto Manhattan Island, across the GWB. On Interstate 95.
There's no way you could block off all the interstate highways. Can you restrict access to an island that has limited access? Sure. But there are over 100 on-ramps to just I-95 - in Connecticut alone - for example.
Let's not lose even more of a grip on reality with ideas like this that make no sense.
I-95 in Connecticut is six lanes wide and passes under hundreds of overpasses. Parking buses sideways under a dozen such overpasses would effectively shut it down. In NJ, parking buses sideways in front of the tolls by exit 16W would do the exact same thing. Surely you remember Bridgegate, where shutting down a single exit off the George Washington bridge backed up traffic for hours.
I could be mistaken but aren't there a couple of draw bridges on I-95 around the NY-Conn. border? You could open them or simply park a dozen garbage trucks on them.
Going north from NYC, how many bridges are there across the Hudson River? Shut down I-95 and the Palisades Parkway and the next major crossing is the Tappan Zee Bridge.
I-40 is two lanes most of the way from Virginia to California, going up a lane or two as you near major cities. Park two buses under every few overpasses and it's shut down. I-10 in Arizona is two lanes most of the way from Tucson to the New Mexico border.
Give me 50 school buses and I could easily shut down both of those roads, effectively cutting off the two major east-west roads in the SouthWest.
California already has checkpoints on all major routes into the state for agricultural checks. They could shut off all incoming traffic with a phone call.
What was the subject?
Oh yeah, the movie "Pandemic!"
Quote: ChumpChange"Killer bees, murder hornets, fruit flies..."
What was the subject?
Oh yeah, the movie "Pandemic!"
You're almost like the Nathan of the coronavirus 😉😉😉
I also (don't) like how he originally phrased it. That it was up to us to slow the spread while voluntarily staying home. Makes it easy to come back and blame the citizens.
For me personally, I have shutdown my blackjack play which is the bulk of how I support myself, for the year. Probably to next spring. But I do have some free play that I am still collecting on each week. I am only picking up the places that I have $50 week or more, which comes to about $800 a week at 6 locations, including my top location of $400 weekly. I am in and out within a couple minutes and usually go early in the day to reduce risk. And I am only picking up free play, not doing any play to generate future offers right now.
I have had such a lousy year playing blackjack that I sort of don't want to give up that free play. That is sort of my own personal stimulus or unemployment at the moment. lol. And if this past spring was any indication, there is no guarantee casinos will pick up at the same spot in the cycle, so I am hoping to avoid a casino shutdown and be able to continue to pick up my free play for the rest of the year.
Quote: billryanParking buses sideways under a dozen such overpasses would effectively shut it down. Park two buses under every few overpasses and it's shut down. Give me 50 school buses and I could easily shut down both of those roads. California already has checkpoints on all major routes into the state for agricultural checks. They could shut off all incoming traffic with a phone call.
I live less than ten miles from a border with two other states. There are at least a dozen state border crossing roads within ten miles of my house that are not even close to being "interstate highways". If you prevent people from driving on the interstates then they just use the back roads. The purpose of this hairbrained idea is to prevent the virus from crossing state lines. This is not a situation with a history of established "hard" international boundaries. People in New England cross state lines to buy groceries and play golf on one course that is in two states.
Solutions have to be practical, reasonable, and enforceable.
Mayors in cities near me have promulgated "EXECUTIVE ORDERS" that are enforceable only within the boundaries of their tiny little municipalities. Rhode Island has thirty nine (39!) different cities and towns, several just slightly larger than one square mile. These local poo-bahs think that they are emperors when in fact they are nothing more than the Head Raccoon at the lodge with a self-generated false sense of power. They look and sound like the fools that they are.
Right after we close all the interstates, lets order everyone to the seashore with a teaspoon. It's only because the rate of compliance is too low that we have not yet stopped the tide from coming in!
Quote: racquetI live less than ten miles from a border with two other states. There are at least a dozen state border crossing roads within ten miles of my house that are not even close to being "interstate highways". If you prevent people from driving on the interstates then they just use the back roads. The purpose of this hairbrained idea is to prevent the virus from crossing state lines. This is not a situation with a history of established "hard" international boundaries. People in New England cross state lines to buy groceries and play golf on one course that is in two states.
Solutions have to be practical, reasonable, and enforceable.
Mayors in cities near me have promulgated "EXECUTIVE ORDERS" that are enforceable only within the boundaries of their tiny little municipalities. Rhode Island has thirty nine (39!) different cities and towns, several just slightly larger than one square mile. These local poo-bahs think that they are emperors when in fact they are nothing more than the Head Raccoon at the lodge with a self-generated false sense of power. They look and sound like the fools that they are.
Right after we close all the interstates, lets order everyone to the seashore with a teaspoon. It's only because the rate of compliance is too low that we have not yet stopped the tide from coming in!
Again, there are numerous choke points that would shut down the highways. As I mentioned, how many ways are there for New Englanders to cross the Hudson? I can only think of five bridges but there may be another one or two I am forgetting. Two of them ,Bear Mountain and the Rip Van Winkle bridge are mostly local bridges.
In much of the west, the interstates are the only roads that connect various cities. Take Las Vegas, as an example. Try heading east without taking an interstate. There are two bridges over the Colorado River if you are heading towards I-40. I-15 has the California Border Protection station just south of Primm. Other than that, there is a dirt road that goes from Goodsprings over the mountains that eventually gets you to I-15 somewhere in the middle of nowhere.
Where I live, if you want to go to Tuscon, Phoenix , Vegas or California, it's the interstate or pretty much nothing. Going east, it's I-40 or Arizona 80, a desolate leftover from pre-interstate days with exactly one gas station from where it starts at I-40 in Benson to the New Mexico border some 140 miles away. It's one lane in both direction and is a notorious speed trap that could easily be shut down if needed.
Quote: AlanMendelsonI'm afraid a new shutdown in Vegas is inevitable. And since the holiday season between Thanksgiving and Christmas is traditionally slow, this would have less economic consequence.
https://www.reviewjournal.com/news/politics-and-government/nevada/sisolak-restrictions-to-slow-spread-of-covid-19-coming-very-soon-2186014/
Alan,
A person can now purchase a do-it-yourself C-virus test kit. Nothing gets sent to a lab. It's like a do-it-yourself drug test someone can do at home. There is no way to do tracing on people who test positive, unless the test taker chooses to do so. Someone can present their home-done negative test if needed to get hired at a new job, but NV never counts -- or even knows about -- that test.
Lotsa opportunity for chicanery, too. Someone wants a particular job, but must demonstrate a negative test. That person tests positive, and perhaps should not be in that job because of C-virus. Another family member takes the test and has a negative test that the person presents as their own.
As I see it, the bottom line is that we cannot control the virus without timely, effective tracing of new C-virus cases. And states will increasingly find difficulty in identifying the new-case count because of home testing. The data becomes increasingly unreliable because there is no way to reliably identify all new C-virus cases. Pandora's Box has been thrown open in such a way we cannot close it.
Close the casinos if you want to do it, but doing so may have small effect on the pandemic overall. Fauci predicted "wildfire," and here it is. Start putting the overflow in tents outside or enclosures in hospital parking garages. We are such toast. (And I gamble. I'm generally an optimist.)
Am I missing something?? Anyone?? Hullo??
Frankly, close the restaurants and bars and other businesses for three weeks as well.
Quote: ChumpChangeWe won't make it to February as a society.
Duly noted and quoted. Nominated for post of the year.
Quote: billryanIf the President shut down the interstate highway system... A national lockdown... would be both legal and fairly simple to enforce.
That's what this guy said. "SHUT DOWN THE INTERSTATE HIGHWAY SYSTEM."
My comments are solely about how impossible that would be, and that it would in no way stop the spread at state borders.
Agreed, where there are limited points of crossing - rivers with a fixed number of bridges and tunnels, you could, at great expense, barricade those crossings.
Ignoring the Hudson River, which for much of it's length is NOT a state border, how many crossings are there between NY and Vermont?
Assuming you would use the Hudson as a natural barrier, what happens to the people EAST of the Hudson living between it and CT, MA and VT? They're New Yorkers too.
Practical solutions should be considered and debated. Barricading the onramps to I-95? Get real.
In my business , two of my largest suppliers are both in the Dallas area. Mycomicshop and Heritage Auctions. During the last lockdown, MCS was ordered to close but Heritage was allowed to stay open. Why was one shut down and the other allowed to stay open? Heritage auctions guns a few times a year and gun sellers were classified as essential services.
In anticipation of another lockdown, how many business owners are now studying the list of essential business's and figuring out how to add a product line in order to be deemed essential.
In my case, my business remains closed to the public but I could open and stay open in a lockdown simply by adding milk to the items I sell. As it turns out, there is not a store selling milk within a two mile radius of my address so by adding it to my wares, I could qualify as an essential business. Or I could stock a few rifles and do the same.
Quote: billryanBars have to close by ten PM, because evidently your chances of catching the virus increase after midnight. Of course, they don't actually have to close at ten, they can't serve after that. .
That is the most ridiculous idea that I have seen so far. If bars are spreading the disease, close them down. Limiting ours is ridiculous.
Registering your license plate as an essential worker! What a thought!Quote: ChumpChangeWith toll roads reading license plates, it'd be easy to issue tickets for people being on the road during a road closure. If it's too snowy, that may be your only hope.
Quote: billryanAgain, there are numerous choke points that would shut down the highways. As I mentioned, how many ways are there for New Englanders to cross the Hudson? I can only think of five bridges but there may be another one or two I am forgetting..
Ferry to LI from Bridgeport or New London.
Quote: VegasriderFerry to LI from Bridgeport or New London.
Sure. Now you have to get off Long Island, which puts you in the same situation as before. That's assuming the ferries would be open for non-essential traffic.
Back in the 1970s, they built a nuclear power plant and were starting to build a second on Long Island. Then Three Mile Island happened and it dawned on people that there were about a dozen traffic lanes to evacuate the whole population. The only thing that has changed on LI highways since then is an HOV lane was added.
You'd be better off heading north to Canada.
Quote: billryanSure. Now you have to get off Long Island, which puts you in the same situation as before... You'd be better off heading north to Canada.
You need an atlas. It would show clearly that Long Island is part of the state of NY, and that heading north from Long Island you'd need to cross Long Island Sound.
Your idea, I assumed, was to prevent travel across state lines. I'm betting that you didn't do too well in geography class. Good thing you weren't around to advise Columbus. We'd all be speaking Narragansett.
Quote: racquetYou need an atlas. It would show clearly that Long Island is part of the state of NY, and that heading north from Long Island you'd need to cross Long Island Sound.
Your idea, I assumed, was to prevent travel across state lines. I'm betting that you didn't do too well in geography class. Good thing you weren't around to advise Columbus. We'd all be speaking Narragansett.
I was responding to the suggestion that a New Englander suggesting they could take a ferry to LI as a way of getting out of New England. I've never mentioned closing state borders. I said you can easily restrict traffic on interstates by closing off the choke points. The Hudson River is such a checkpoint. A dozen cops could seal every crossing from NYC to Albany. Come out west and see how few crossings there are on the Colorado. Then you have this giant hole called the Grand Canyon that you can't drive over, under or through. Unlike the metropolitan areas of the NorthEast, there are very few backroads in the west that will get you places. I've tried. I wanted to drive a vehicle from Vegas to Bisbee that had a top speed of forty. Searched for days for such a road. It doesn't exist.
Reading is FUNdimental.
Quote: racquetSolutions have to be practical, reasonable, and enforceable.
From enforcement perspective, I would say the non-compliance rate on Covid-19 prevention measures/regulations is similar to the non-compliance rate on the speed limit regulations. Despite the very high level difficultly in enforcing Covid-19 and speed limit regulations, both type of regulations had saved many lives. So the enforceability on Covid-19 prevention measures should not be a big concern. The much larger issue is the practicality and reasonableness of Covid-19 prevention measures/regulations when the economy and quality of life are taken into considerations.
Various Covid-19 prevention measures as mask wearing, social distancing, crowd size, movement, self-quarantine/isolation, partial or complete closure can be extremely difficult to enforce, or may not be enforceable in certain locality/situation. But the facts are these measures had demonstrated certain degree of high/medium/low effectiveness in controlling the spread of Covid-19. And the difficultly problem for society is to balance the benefit of controlling Covid-19 spread vs. the adverse impact on the economy and the quality of live.
So fast forward the two weeks is up this Tuesday and they have already announced there is going to be some new restriction, so we are left guessing as to whether that might be bar and restaurants. Or Casinos. Or what.
Personally, I am hoping to avoid another casino shutdown right now for selfish reasons. I have a ton of free play offers for December. Over 5 grand and still waiting on two casino mailers. That is a very high amount for the limited machine play that I do. I didn't particularly play more in September/October which would have generated these higher offers. I think several places have upped their offers in an attempt to get more players in.
So I have had such a lousy year with my blackjack results, up $8800 after being in the red most of the year and have no plans for anymore blackjack play this year, That I would really like to add 5 or 6 grand from this free play to my machine play total. I mean I am not planning on playing anything to generate future offer, I just want to collect my free play for December. I feel I can pop into a casino in the morning hours when they aren't crowded, play a machine away from other patrons, for 5 minutes, collecting my free play, with minimal risk, But the way the year has gone, casinos will shutdown Tuesday and I will lose those free play offers. :/
Quote: SOOPOOMy county is ‘locking down’ tomorrow. Schools going all virtual. Restaurants only take out. But apparently MOST businesses will still be open. Another fake lockdown to look like something is being done.
This is Buffalo yesterday, patriots
standing up to the loss of their
businesses. The Enforcers trying
to break up a meeting of 50 local
business owners on private property.
Quote: EvenBobThis is Buffalo yesterday, patriots
standing up to the loss of their
businesses. The Enforcers trying
to break up a meeting of 50 local
business owners on private property.
Thanks Bob. To me, the police response was pathetic. They had absolutely no plan! When they go in, they should state the law they believe is being broken, and alert the lawbreakers what the consequences will be. "Anyone not putting a mask on will be issued a ticket." Or... "anyone not leaving peacefully will be arrested for violating the Governor's executive order" Or... "please don't yell at us or we will cower in retreat..."
OOPS.... they chose the third....
Whatever the legality of restrictions imposed by an individual state, the concept has to be driven by state political boundaries, not by geography. The same goes for restrictions imposed by towns, cities, and counties. The mayors of two non-adjacent cities in RI have imposed lockdowns stricter than those in surrounding jurisdictions. The political boundaries of these two municipalities, in multiple instances, run down the center of a city street. One side of the street is locked down, and the other side of the street, in a less-restrictive neighboring city, is not. You can eat, drink and be merry on only the even-numbered buildings of a street, but not on the odd-numbered locations on the other side of the street.
Can no one admit the absurdity of suggesting that it makes sense to restrict activity on one side of the Hudson River in upstate New York from activity on the other? Or that it's not ridiculous to place barriers on the bridges over the Hudson so as to enforce such rules?
Where are we? In East Berlin? Can we expect to read about folks tunneling under the Hudson on their way to freedom?
Quote: DRichI am hoping the casinos will stay open and they restrict eating, drinking, and smoking on the casino floor and require 100% mask use at all times.
Nice thought and probably a good idea. Never happen. If this Governor didn’t accept the potential for spread and ban smoking months ago....he’s not going to now. Casino bosses will never agree to a smoking ban, even short term.
Quote: TDVegasNice thought and probably a good idea. Never happen. If this Governor didn’t accept the potential for spread and ban smoking months ago....he’s not going to now. Casino bosses will never agree to a smoking ban, even short term.
If the choice is staying open with smoking ban and restaurants and bars closed, vs closing casinos entirely, they will accept the smoking ban short term.
Quote: racquetI think comparisons between COVID restrictions and either seat-belt or smoking restrictions do not work. People not wearing seatbelts do not cause other people to not wear seatbelts. That tendency does not spread. Same way with smoking. My smoking may harm me, and I guess you as well, second hand, but my smoking does not spread the "disease" of smoking among non-smokers. If I'm a smoker with COVID, you might catch the virus from me, but doubtful the insatiable desire to light up a Chesterfield.
Whatever the legality of restrictions imposed by an individual state, the concept has to be driven by state political boundaries, not by geography. The same goes for restrictions imposed by towns, cities, and counties. The mayors of two non-adjacent cities in RI have imposed lockdowns stricter than those in surrounding jurisdictions. The political boundaries of these two municipalities, in multiple instances, run down the center of a city street. One side of the street is locked down, and the other side of the street, in a less-restrictive neighboring city, is not. You can eat, drink and be merry on only the even-numbered buildings of a street, but not on the odd-numbered locations on the other side of the street.
Can no one admit the absurdity of suggesting that it makes sense to restrict activity on one side of the Hudson River in upstate New York from activity on the other? Or that it's not ridiculous to place barriers on the bridges over the Hudson so as to enforce such rules?
Where are we? In East Berlin? Can we expect to read about folks tunneling under the Hudson on their way to freedom?
Canada just announced borders closed till.... https://www.washingtonpost.com/travel/2020/11/20/us-canada-border-closure-covid/
Which sucks for a guy I know with cancer. https://www.gofundme.com/f/cancer-treatment-access-amid-self-isolation-order?pc=fb_co_emailupdate24&rcid=r01-160574166172-1e9d38cefd904432&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook&utm_campaign=p_email%2B3201-24hr-reminder-v5&fbclid=IwAR3Aez6nN9Fs3LMvA7C3d8ENiUOrHvDxLFGLjzfNM4r3yRk4dBaGb4xAyDo
Toronto on 28 day at least shutdown
Quote: SOOPOO
Thanks Bob. To me, the police response was pathetic. They had absolutely no plan! When they go in, they should state the law they believe is being broken, and alert the lawbreakers what the consequences will be. "Anyone not putting a mask on will be issued a ticket." Or... "anyone not leaving peacefully will be arrested for violating the Governor's executive order" Or... "please don't yell at us or we will cower in retreat..."
OOPS.... they chose the third....
What happened was a version of the scene in "Tombstone" after the shootout and they tell the sheriff "I don't think I will let you arrest us today."
Some business owners, bothering nobody, and Karen calls the cops. who decide to hassle them. To meet like this is a Constitutional right. The cops knew if they arrested them they (cops) would come out on the wrong side of it as far as PR goes. They are fighting for their livelyhood and the cops are going to issue a mask ticket?
