Zuga
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Zuga
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September 21st, 2014 at 8:49:34 AM permalink
Quote: AxelWolf



BTW are the mods going to start getting paid or have they already?



Quote: rdw4potus

Caught Zuga's "my employee" comment earlier and wondered the same thing.



In reference to LCB employees, they are content writers, programmers, designers, SEO experts etc that are on our payroll.

We do have several Mods at the forum as well , they all started as volunteers and were later on given more duties for which now they are being paid for ( ie content writing, backend updates, research etc ).

Quote: AxelWolf



I'm just wondering if they will now be paid by the new owners upon continuing. If so, I imagine its going to get strange around here.
Every move they make, everything they say, is going to be meet with skepticism.

You don't bite the hand that feeds you.



All WOV Admins are still volunteering with an exception of JB who is programmer.

As far as them being paid at some point , I do not see a problem in that, nor that would be considered as conflict of interest.

For instance, all our LCB Mods have the freedom to post and comment as they see fit. We do not censor nor control them. Obviously they do have to follow some business etiquette and our own forum rules ( esp since they have to set an example ) but that is about it. What they do get paid for is what I have explained in my above comments.

Obviously the site would have to start generating some income in order to be financially responsible to pay some kind of bonus or salary to the staff.
However I wouldnt go ahead of myself here. We just bought the sites and yet to get to know the community here as well as all the Admins.


cheers
Zuga
"All it takes for evil to prevail is for good people to do nothing "
chickenman
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September 21st, 2014 at 8:56:06 AM permalink
It would be well if the mods posted less IMO, or certainly more relevant comments. Jousting and parsing certain members' words just doesn't pass the taste test.
Zuga
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September 21st, 2014 at 9:00:10 AM permalink
Quote: 1BB

Early summer, like June or July, makes more sense for something like this. How does one even begin to evaluate what a web site is worth?

Zuga, I just read the About Us section on your web site and I am very impressed. Your talented team is so young and hip! Not a stuffed shirt in the group. I have no doubt that LCB will soon become a household word. I was going to say best of luck but I get the feeling that you guys make your own luck.

Here's hoping that all our forum members can overcome their apprehension and make a smooth transition to whatever path they choose.



I believe Josh got in contact with Mike end of May or early June. The way how things usually work in this industry is that you pay for the last 1.5-2 yrs earnings that the website generated.
Obviously this model could not be applied to WOO and WOV, but knowing the sites we saw the potential in monetizing thembetter, and doing so without changing the mission of the site(s).
So while we do things to improve the sites ( one example is making them mobile friendly ) and doing the marketing, Mike will remain as the head of the content and consultant.

I thank you for the kind words, and yes we have one helluva team back on LCB. I myself started as a Mod at the forum and prior that i use to be an advantage player ( bonus whore as we call it ).

cheers
Zuga
"All it takes for evil to prevail is for good people to do nothing "
rdw4potus
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September 21st, 2014 at 9:14:41 AM permalink
Quote: Zuga


So while we do things to improve the sites ( one example is making them mobile friendly ) and doing the marketing, Mike will remain as the head of the content and consultant.



Have you attempted to use the sites on a mobile device now? I find them better to use on my android devices than many "mobile optimized" sites. I think most of us would (much) rather deal with tap-to-zoom and pinch-to-zoom issues than lose easy access to content through the over-simplification that comes with most mobile site implementations.
"So as the clock ticked and the day passed, opportunity met preparation, and luck happened." - Maurice Clarett
Zuga
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September 21st, 2014 at 9:20:02 AM permalink
Quote: rdw4potus

Have you attempted to use the sites on a mobile device now? I find them better to use on my android devices than many "mobile optimized" sites. I think most of us would (much) rather deal with tap-to-zoom and pinch-to-zoom issues than lose easy access to content through the over-simplification that comes with most mobile site implementations.



What we gonna do is make the responsive design ( it will be scalable without breaking the structure of the site ).

JB was assigned to do it.
"All it takes for evil to prevail is for good people to do nothing "
Zuga
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September 21st, 2014 at 9:27:54 AM permalink
Here is the wiki article on it : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Responsive_web_design
"All it takes for evil to prevail is for good people to do nothing "
AxelWolf
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September 21st, 2014 at 9:37:49 AM permalink
Quote: Zuga

In reference to LCB employees, they are content writers, programmers, designers, SEO experts etc that are on our payroll.

We do have several Mods at the forum as well , they all started as volunteers and were later on given more duties for which now they are being paid for ( ie content writing, backend updates, research etc ).



All the WOV Admins are still volunteering with an exception of JB who is programmer.

As far as them being paid at some point , I do not see a problem in that, nor that would be considered as conflict of interest.

For instance, all our LCB Mods have the freedom to post and comment as they see fit. We do not censor nor control them. Obviously they do have to follow some business etiquette and our own forum rules ( esp since they have to set an example ) but that is about it. What they do get paid for is what I have explained in my above comments.

Obviously the site would have to start generating some income in order to be financially responsible to pay some kind of bonus or salary to the staff.
However I wouldnt go ahead of myself here. We just bought the sites and yet to get to know the community here as well as all the Admins.


cheers
Zuga

I don't see a problem with it either. However It would certainly give the current mods a reason to blindly support your entire operation. Hoping for a permanent paid position. A reason to kiss butt.

I'm sure you understand that LBC is now like a unwanted Step-dad who just move in with the entire family. People have known each other for years. Some Kids have have already ran away.

Axiom has probably turned to drugs already.

I heard Bob is so upset, he accidentally got a players card.
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
Neutrino
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September 21st, 2014 at 9:54:49 AM permalink
Winaday casino is promoted on LCB? I thought winaday was blacklisted on WoO for having rigged software
AxelWolf
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September 21st, 2014 at 10:05:24 AM permalink
Quote: Neutrino

Winaday casino is promoted on LCB? I thought winaday was blacklisted on WoO for having rigged software

I already said that.


ps. When you made yourself a new sockpuppet account, you said, you hit greedy goblins for some ungodly amount( 10k or 12k)
Were you lying? Its important to me to know the truth about that specifically the rest I didn't care about.
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
terapined
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September 21st, 2014 at 10:25:27 AM permalink
Here is what I would like to see with the online casinos.
1st off the costs to run an online compared to a land based casino is minimal.
Due to the little overhead, online casinos, if trusted, could in a way, out compete land based casinos.
Take Pai Gow poker, paid 5 per cent commission at the highly rated by LCB Miami club casino just like a land based casino.
Bottom line, its a total rip off, and this from the highest rated US casino by LCB
Why not 1 per cent, even better 1/2 per cent.
I mean cmon, no dealer, no drinks, no atmosphere, I feel the 5 per cent commission is horrible.
At 1 per cent or 1/2 per cent, still a healthy profit to be made, especially if business grows by making a move like this.
With the low overhead, every rake in every game should be slashed.

I would like to see LCB rank casinos by rake. Forget the bonuses, make them compete for LCB customers by shaving the rake or edge.
If I see that at LCB or somebody can show me where this type of comparison is on the site, it would improve my opinion of this whole online casino thing.
Cmon LCB, get these online joints to cut the rake, its only fair.
Buzzard
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September 21st, 2014 at 10:41:15 AM permalink
" In reference to LCB employees, they are content writers, programmers, designers, SEO experts etc that are on our payroll.

We do have several Mods at the forum as well , they all started as volunteers and were later on given more duties for which now they are being paid for ( ie content writing, backend updates, research etc ).


Will that research include updating the section on USA casinos, which based on Colorado is outdated and full of errors ?Anyone using those links to websites about Colorado casinos will arrive in front of an empty building about 10- 25% of the time.
Shed not for her the bitter tear Nor give the heart to vain regret Tis but the casket that lies here, The gem that filled it Sparkles yet
Zuga
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September 21st, 2014 at 10:45:55 AM permalink
Quote: Buzzard




Will that research include updating the section on USA casinos, which based on Colorado is outdated and full of errors ?Anyone using those links to websites about Colorado casinos will arrive in front of an empty building about 10- 25% of the time.



It will be looked into it . thanx for the heads up
"All it takes for evil to prevail is for good people to do nothing "
Buzzard
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September 21st, 2014 at 10:53:08 AM permalink
I live in Colorado. I can provide info as to which closed and when as well as updated info. Just have someone PM me.

I can receive PMs while under suspension, just can not respond. So they would have to include an email address.

Not that I think I might be suspended by the new management. Perish the thought. LOL
Shed not for her the bitter tear Nor give the heart to vain regret Tis but the casket that lies here, The gem that filled it Sparkles yet
1BB
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September 21st, 2014 at 11:35:34 AM permalink
Quote: Buzzard

I live in Colorado. I can provide info as to which closed and when as well as updated info. Just have someone PM me.

I can receive PMs while under suspension, just can not respond. So they would have to include an email address.

Not that I think I might be suspended by the new management. Perish the thought. LOL



Buzz, you're an acquired taste. What can we say?
Many people, especially ignorant people, want to punish you for speaking the truth. - Mahatma Ghandi
4ofaKind
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September 21st, 2014 at 11:43:05 AM permalink
Quote: 4ofaKind

Sometimes a suspicion is all you need to protect yourself from possibly getting ripped off, but that certainly isn’t grounds to confirm gaffed.

It’s almost impossible to prove a smartly gaffed software program without being able to view all the play that went through it. Of course the gaffed online software exposed and confirmed here at the WOV by Michael and others was ridiculously rigged. If you could expose a gaffed game with as little I think it was less then 20k of play is absurd. That’s just a real stupid greedy operator / programmer.

Technology is so advanced today the un-regulated online options to gaff are endless, without ever being detected.

Land based casinos would kill for a half of a percentage point in their favor. Their blackjack rules are endlessly changing and adding new options, along with all the effort trying to minimize their exposure against counters who also are fighting for that percentage point.

Their (land based) slot machines (based on denomination) all average out in the 90’s rtp. They don’t have to; in fact I think in Vegas they can legally be set as low as 78%. Don’t quote me on that since I’m too lazy to confirm that number but it’s definitely down there. The only reason their set in the 90’s is because at the end of the month the total dropped and held amounts are available via the regulators who are monitoring them. Educated slot players review these numbers all listed on the back pages of magazines like Casino Player, etc. Regular consistent players also would notice the differences when the changes are big. So all the casinos are forced to be competitive or end up like Revel. Don't think for one minute the operators wouldn't prefer to set their slots at the legal lowest possible if they could get away with it.

In fact I read somewhere a study done with slot players and slot machines. They lined up 5 machines with all different rtp settings and gave each player an equal amount of money to play all of them. I think like 95% of them were able to identify the biggest and the second biggest payer.

The point I’m trying to make here is that there is an endless battle between the casinos and the players fighting for a percentage point or two. Online casinos obviously couldn’t gaffe the game to the point of absurdly obvious like the one’s exposed and expect to retain players or not get caught. They’ll have big winners just like land based worthy of pr advertising.

Without a life changing win most everyone are prepared to lose their money in the long run. Mathematically 99% will at table games, and 100% certainly at programmed computer games.

The difference is let’s say a 100K gambling budget would last that person based on their type of play on average 5 years before that person busts out. Now instead with different un-regulated, and un-authorized settings that same 100K only lasts the same player 4 years. (These numbers and outcomes are just an example, so math geniuses please don’t attack me.) Now take those numbers and multiply it by billions and billions of dollars that are changing hands online every year. A single percentage point or two or three makes a huge difference in profits.

All I want confirmed for fact is that I’m losing my money at the right pace which I’m happily and willingly to lose for my personal entertainment. I don’t want anyone holding and controlling the outcomes in their hands not willing to show me what it’s going to cost me to play and take the chance of getting lucky.

This is my opinion when it comes to un-regulated online gaming in general. Not to include all the added risks that come with playing from the USA. As we all know that's a whole other topic that certainly and automatically adds additional percentage points in their favor.



@ Zuga

It’s obvious you can’t address or debate anything I said in my post above, which is an indication like Casinomeister you and your staff could give a rats ass about a confirmed fair game for the players, so just ignore it. I reviewed the LCB site and no doubt it’s just another Casinomeister on steroids, except it has a lot of misinformation we already are pointing out only after one day.

You mentioned you were a bonus whore, and since that dried up I guess you now found a way to prey on the innocent idiots giving them hopes of riches with all kinds of free money in the form of bonuses. Since bonus whoring dried up for you, it couldn’t have possibly dried up for them.

If you can’t make any money at it any longer it just don’t make sense why you would think others could. Wait a minute … they can’t. But you sure could because for them to get the bonuses they have to link through your site with your code making certain you get your cut of their losses for as long as they play wherever they sign up.

I give you credit for at least not advertising you’re an advocate for fair play. I also give you credit for finding a way to jump on the online gaming band wagon and make enough money to actually pay 2.3 million dollars for a site that was all but dried up.

I’m also certain this will be my last post here because the last thing you need for promotions is anyone with an honest factual view of what’s really going on. If not I’d be interested in writing articles for your sites.

P.S. If possible please buy out Casinomeister as soon as possible so we could keep it all under one roof.
Buzzard
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September 21st, 2014 at 11:47:59 AM permalink
Quote: 1BB

Buzz, you're an acquired taste. What can we say?



Hey, when you buy a site, I thought the contents were included. That's what my lawyer said. Of course when I got sentenced to 132 years and said I would not live long enough to serve that term, he promised the Judge I would do the best I could.
Shed not for her the bitter tear Nor give the heart to vain regret Tis but the casket that lies here, The gem that filled it Sparkles yet
Buzzard
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September 21st, 2014 at 11:50:58 AM permalink
Looks like the odds on me being suspended first under new ownership, have now been tilted in 4 of a Kind's direction.

Who said censorship was dead ???
Shed not for her the bitter tear Nor give the heart to vain regret Tis but the casket that lies here, The gem that filled it Sparkles yet
rdw4potus
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September 21st, 2014 at 11:52:40 AM permalink
Quote: Buzzard

Looks like the odds on me being suspended first under new ownership, have now been tilted in 4 of a Kind's direction.

Who said censorship was dead ???



You both lost to Axiom, who was suspended for cursing about the announcement itself:-)
"So as the clock ticked and the day passed, opportunity met preparation, and luck happened." - Maurice Clarett
rdw4potus
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September 21st, 2014 at 11:53:48 AM permalink
Quote: 4ofaKind

for a site that was on the balls of it ass.



Is that a thing? If so, it it ass like donkey, or should I be picturing some sort of really odd tumorous growth?
"So as the clock ticked and the day passed, opportunity met preparation, and luck happened." - Maurice Clarett
Buzzard
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September 21st, 2014 at 11:57:08 AM permalink
Suspension by and or for the new ownership is what the betting line is about. But perhaps that may not occur for 4 if a kind.

This is a forum and hopefully will remain one with the free exchange of ideas and opinions.

I am hoping history will repeat itself.

TITO STOPS CENSORSHIP

Prague radio says that the President of Yugoslavia (Marshal Tito) has announced a decree abolishing postal and newspaper censorship
Shed not for her the bitter tear Nor give the heart to vain regret Tis but the casket that lies here, The gem that filled it Sparkles yet
4ofaKind
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September 21st, 2014 at 11:57:40 AM permalink
Quote: rdw4potus

Is that a thing? If so, it it ass like donkey, or should I be picturing some sort of really odd tumorous growth?


Thanks, corrected it. Not sure what I was thinking, actually forgot that old business saying.

It's been real guys.
Buzzard
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September 21st, 2014 at 11:59:52 AM permalink
awww come on don't be a Sissy. Stick around !
Shed not for her the bitter tear Nor give the heart to vain regret Tis but the casket that lies here, The gem that filled it Sparkles yet
4ofaKind
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September 21st, 2014 at 12:02:56 PM permalink
Would love to have my opinions heard, since I believe they really could help people. But these type of sites have to silence anyone that don't agree and makes them look bad. Remember it's about the money ... nothing else.
1BB
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September 21st, 2014 at 12:23:12 PM permalink
Yes, stick around. You may be surprised. These guys didn't get where they are by being petty and vindictive. Give 'em a chance.
Many people, especially ignorant people, want to punish you for speaking the truth. - Mahatma Ghandi
Zuga
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Zuga
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September 21st, 2014 at 2:14:27 PM permalink
Quote: 4ofaKind

@ Zuga

It’s obvious you can’t address or debate anything I said in my post above, which is an indication like Casinomeister you and your staff could give a rats ass about a confirmed fair game for the players, so just ignore it. I reviewed the LCB site and no doubt it’s just another Casinomeister on steroids, except it has a lot of misinformation we already are pointing out only after one day.

You mentioned you were a bonus whore, and since that dried up I guess you now found a way to prey on the innocent idiots giving them hopes of riches with all kinds of free money in the form of bonuses. Since bonus whoring dried up for you, it couldn’t have possibly dried up for them.

If you can’t make any money at it any longer it just don’t make sense why you would think others could. Wait a minute … they can’t. But you sure could because for them to get the bonuses they have to link through your site with your code making certain you get your cut of their losses for as long as they play wherever they sign up.

I give you credit for at least not advertising you’re an advocate for fair play. I also give you credit for finding a way to jump on the online gaming band wagon and make enough money to actually pay 2.3 million dollars for a site that was all but dried up.

I’m also certain this will be my last post here because the last thing you need for promotions is anyone with an honest factual view of what’s really going on. If not I’d be interested in writing articles for your sites.

P.S. If possible please buy out Casinomeister as soon as possible so we could keep it all under one roof.



What do you want me to say? If you do not trust online casinos then do not gamble online and stick to brick and mortar casinos.

I can tell that you already formed your opinion so I aint going to try to convince you otherwise. I do not see the purpose tbh nor a reason to even debate it about with you.

I am not going to try to sell you anything here. Nor try to convert you . Same goes to LCB visitors. They are already online players, and they look for specific type of entertainment.

We did not invent online bonuses, the market was already there. It existed long before LCB.

It is a tuff market, and online casinos compete against each other. And how do they do that? By offering bonuses is one way to do it.

So what do we do at LCB? We offer an extra bonus if you sign up via our link, or even a no deposit bonus . So whats the problem here?

We get our players the higher value for their money or even free bonus money, more than what they would get by directly going to XYW casino. Now We are not forcing anyone to take them exclusive bonuses . It is their free will.

The name of the game is called gambling and we are not advertising any "systems" or "sure wins". And if you are not prepared to lose your money then you should not be gambling at all. Period.

And speaking of fair play, we look after our membership. We have 150 casino Reps on board that are there to assist our membership in case of any questions or issues. We have direct casino support section, we have a warning list and we are also in direct communication with the number of casinos on day to day basis. We managed to " force" many online casinos to change their T&Cs to be more player friendly.
So what would you say if Im to tell you that we have successfully resolved hundreds of player issues in the past 7+ years? what would you say to the fact that we got hundreds of thousands of dollars paid to our visitors?
Does that sounds like someone who doesnt give a rats ass about their members?

I see that you mentioned CasinoMeister few times and tbh i dont know what is your beef with them nor Im keen to learn. My own policy is not to comment on other sites.

Quote:


I’m also certain this will be my last post here because the last thing you need for promotions is anyone with an honest factual view of what’s really going on. If not I’d be interested in writing articles for your sites.



And this right here, proves how little do you know about LCB, me and how we do things, and how we plan on running the forum here.

cheers
Zuga
"All it takes for evil to prevail is for good people to do nothing "
Mission146
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September 21st, 2014 at 11:28:35 PM permalink
Quote: AxelWolf

I don't see a problem with it either. However It would certainly give the current mods a reason to blindly support your entire operation. Hoping for a permanent paid position. A reason to kiss butt.

I'm sure you understand that LBC is now like a unwanted Step-dad who just move in with the entire family. People have known each other for years. Some Kids have have already ran away.

Axiom has probably turned to drugs already.

I heard Bob is so upset, he accidentally got a players card.



I obviously can't speak for Face and BeachBumBabs in this regard, but I, personally, already have a full-time job. I'm just going to continue to do what I do, say what I say and Administrate the way I Administrate and if the new ownership sees fit to compensate me in terms of a bonus/salary, then that's cool. Hopefully, everything will be a good fit and they'll decide that I do a decent job as an Administrator/Contributor here.

I can say that I'm not going to be kissing any part of anyone's anatomy, I initially volunteered to help Administrate at this Forum because I enjoyed the community and I felt that Mike was overwhelmed with everything he was doing and trying to keep a handle of behavioral-type stuff around here. From there, I learned more about advantage play (you and I have even worked together, as most know) and I've contributed a few Reviews and done some Math for people. I also worked on some fan-fiction, "The Ultimate System," which I really need to get around to finishing.

The bottom line is that I started here because I enjoy this place and I am continuing here because I enjoy this place. If the new ownership decides to compensate me for what I already do, cool, if they can find more for me to do that does not compromise my integrity (and I have time to do it) and they choose to compensate me for that, cool. If I continue to do exactly what I do and am left basically to act on my own judgment (as I have been for the last year or more) and the new ownership deems that unworthy of compensation, I'm not worried about it.

Long story short, the promise that I can make is that the second anyone tells me to say something I do not believe or to do something I don't want to do, I'm out...but I don't think that's going to happen. For the time being, my opinion remains that new ownership is highly reputable.
https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/gripes/11182-pet-peeves/120/#post815219
Mission146
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September 21st, 2014 at 11:38:12 PM permalink
Quote: terapined



I would like to see LCB rank casinos by rake. Forget the bonuses, make them compete for LCB customers by shaving the rake or edge.
If I see that at LCB or somebody can show me where this type of comparison is on the site, it would improve my opinion of this whole online casino thing.
Cmon LCB, get these online joints to cut the rake, its only fair.



I don't know that they necessarily have the power to effectuate that, but it would probably be a nice thing to have on the site with respect to game Rules for each casino...and they may already have that somewhere, I haven't spent much time there in recent years.

I get the gist of what you're saying, though, and I tend to agree in many ways. I'm not going to say I wouldn't play anything there, necessarily, but I'm certainly not going to eat a 5% rake on PGP.

The two things about Bovada that always irritated me were:

1.) The Keno was horrible. There's absolutely no reason for sub-90% paytables...and these were VERY sub-90%.

AND

2.) Table Games had a $1.00 minimum bet! Two words: Railroad Pass. $1.00 minimum bet, live Craps, free drinks.

While an affiliate site, though, I think LCB is also something of a watchdog. The main focus is on outing no-pay/slow-pay casinos, poor customer service, and as much as practicable, casinos offering games where the odds are not what they appear to be (rigged software). As with a Video Poker player in a brick-and-mortar casino who sits down at a 6/5 JoB machine when there is a 9/5 or 9/6 JOB just on the other side of the house, as long as the game is as it's presented, it's a fair game.
https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/gripes/11182-pet-peeves/120/#post815219
terapined
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September 22nd, 2014 at 4:34:38 AM permalink
Quote: Mission146

I don't know that they necessarily have the power to effectuate that, but it would probably be a nice thing to have on the site with respect to game Rules for each casino...and they may already have that somewhere, I haven't spent much time there in recent years.

While an affiliate site, though, I think LCB is also something of a watchdog. The main focus is on outing no-pay/slow-pay casinos, poor customer service, and as much as practicable, casinos offering games where the odds are not what they appear to be (rigged software). As with a Video Poker player in a brick-and-mortar casino who sits down at a 6/5 JoB machine when there is a 9/5 or 9/6 JOB just on the other side of the house, as long as the game is as it's presented, it's a fair game.



They absolutely have to ability to list casinos due to rake and rules.
They brag that they have casino reps right there on the site.
Too me the most important information when choosing to gamble is the rake, commission , edge ect.
Theses bonuses are just a gimmick.
They actually brag that a lot of their bonuses are exclusive.
How about really helping online gamblers, exclusive rake cuts, now that's a real bonus.
Your example about video poker, ok.
I can go to the Wiz's web site, you see the pay tables and become an educated gambler.
Some people can use that information, some wont and will play those terrible games, but at least the info is out there.
Does LCB, which can easily get the info on rakes and rules, choose to post that info like the Wiz?
All LCB has to do is post a list of online casinos and their rakes, casinos will see the list and maybe that's an area they want to compete.
All companies want to be top dog.
Cmon LCB, if you really cared about your people. that list would be on the front page.

I'm on their board over there asking where the information is on rakes, so far no answer to that particular question.
The rake and rules and honesty is the most important information regarding online casinos, not gimmick bonuses.

A real problem with the web site is land casino ratings and I know why.
Take my local casino, Seminole Hard Rock Tampa.
Go to American Casino guide that does not pay for posts, honest reviews of this rip off joint.
Go to LCB, all the reviews are 4 or 5 stars, well duh, LCB pays chips for ratings , reviews and comments.
If your 1/2 way around the world and never visited the casino, its in you interest to read the ridiculous glowing review and post 5 stars agreeing , cha ching, just earned LCB chips.
AxelWolf
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September 22nd, 2014 at 5:46:36 AM permalink
Quote: terapined

They absolutely have to ability to list casinos due to rake and rules.
They brag that they have casino reps right there on the site.
Too me the most important information when choosing to gamble is the rake, commission , edge ect.
Theses bonuses are just a gimmick.
They actually brag that a lot of their bonuses are exclusive.
How about really helping online gamblers, exclusive rake cuts, now that's a real bonus.
Your example about video poker, ok.
I can go to the Wiz's web site, you see the pay tables and become an educated gambler.
Some people can use that information, some wont and will play those terrible games, but at least the info is out there.
Does LCB, which can easily get the info on rakes and rules, choose to post that info like the Wiz?
All LCB has to do is post a list of online casinos and their rakes, casinos will see the list and maybe that's an area they want to compete.
All companies want to be top dog.
Cmon LCB, if you really cared about your people. that list would be on the front page.

I'm on their board over there asking where the information is on rakes, so far no answer to that particular question.
The rake and rules and honesty is the most important information regarding online casinos, not gimmick bonuses.

A real problem with the web site is land casino ratings and I know why.
Take my local casino, Seminole Hard Rock Tampa.
Go to American Casino guide that does not pay for posts, honest reviews of this rip off joint.
Go to LCB, all the reviews are 4 or 5 stars, well duh, LCB pays chips for ratings , reviews and comments.
If your 1/2 way around the world and never visited the casino, its in you interest to read the ridiculous glowing review and post 5 stars agreeing , cha ching, just earned LCB chips.

The most important aspect should be getting paid if you do win.There's Nothing worst than winning and having to hold you're breath and wondering if you will really get paid.

Some online casinos use their complex T&C to get you on a technicality and no pay you. Some bonuses are fine. But, Some online casinos have 10 different bonus structures with tricky complicated rules that make you believe you're getting a wonderful deal, when in fact its set up where its next to impossible to come out ahead, they even cap the amount you can win very low, its equivalent to getting a bunch of free worthless spins or playing in play money mode.

I can't stand how they make it SO, SO easy to deposit, but when you go to cash out they want a copy of ID, CC , Banking information, utility bill etc etc
and say its for your safety and fraud reasons. Well if that's the case, why not ask for all of that at the beginning?

It's a stall tactic plain and simple. Most people just say screw it and keep playing, who is going to do all that crap for a few hundred dollars? What grandmother just wanting to play slots is ever going to do all that BS, or even knows how to?
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
Beethoven9th
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September 22nd, 2014 at 6:05:46 AM permalink
Quote: terapined

I'm on their board over there asking where the information is on rakes, so far no answer to that particular question.
The rake and rules and honesty is the most important information regarding online casinos, not gimmick bonuses.

If you don't like the site, then don't go there. I'll never understand why you have so much trouble figuring out this simple way to solve this and other problems.
Fighting BS one post at a time!
Zuga
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Zuga
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September 22nd, 2014 at 7:40:14 AM permalink
Quote: terapined

They absolutely have to ability to list casinos due to rake and rules.
They brag that they have casino reps right there on the site.
Too me the most important information when choosing to gamble is the rake, commission , edge ect.
Theses bonuses are just a gimmick.
They actually brag that a lot of their bonuses are exclusive.
How about really helping online gamblers, exclusive rake cuts, now that's a real bonus.
Your example about video poker, ok.
I can go to the Wiz's web site, you see the pay tables and become an educated gambler.
Some people can use that information, some wont and will play those terrible games, but at least the info is out there.
Does LCB, which can easily get the info on rakes and rules, choose to post that info like the Wiz?
All LCB has to do is post a list of online casinos and their rakes, casinos will see the list and maybe that's an area they want to compete.
All companies want to be top dog.
Cmon LCB, if you really cared about your people. that list would be on the front page.

I'm on their board over there asking where the information is on rakes, so far no answer to that particular question.
The rake and rules and honesty is the most important information regarding online casinos, not gimmick bonuses.



You fail to understand one thing. LCB is different kind of site. What you see as a gimmick our visitors see as a value to their deposits. And not to mention no deposit bonuses we got on offer ( hows that for a value woot! ).

So hell yeah , ofc We gonna brag about our exclusives. That is our trademark as much as the odds are trademark of WOO.

I have to stress out even tho to you this might be the most important info, to some1 else it is not.

But yes you are right, we do have the ability to list the house edge and percentage on the games and rules. And actually it is a good idea and we will definitely look into it. :)
Quote: terapined


A real problem with the web site is land casino ratings and I know why.
Take my local casino, Seminole Hard Rock Tampa.
Go to American Casino guide that does not pay for posts, honest reviews of this rip off joint.
Go to LCB, all the reviews are 4 or 5 stars, well duh, LCB pays chips for ratings , reviews and comments.
If your 1/2 way around the world and never visited the casino, its in you interest to read the ridiculous glowing review and post 5 stars agreeing , cha ching, just earned LCB chips.



This is where you are way off. The LCB chips were introduced early this year. The comments section and ratings existed long before we launched our loyalty program.

And thats just it, it is a rewards program. Almost every land based casino has their comp points and rewards. So what we have is nothing different. We reward our loyal membership for their input. We do not seek them to praise casinos, and our T&Cs state these reviews have to be genuine player experience.

Do we get the abuse of our chip system? Yes it does happen, as it is in human nature to try to cheat the system and/or take an advantage of it.

But that goes with the territory.

cheers
Zuga
"All it takes for evil to prevail is for good people to do nothing "
AxelWolf
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September 22nd, 2014 at 7:51:13 AM permalink
Quote: Beethoven9th

If you don't like the site, then don't go there. I'll never understand why you have so much trouble figuring out this simple way to solve this and other problems.

It's not about that. He wants it to be better.If no one voices their concerns nothing will change. People want a place they can trust. Why this site had the following and quality it did.

It's not easy to make a killing and be 100% unbiased.
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
Zuga
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September 22nd, 2014 at 7:53:17 AM permalink
Quote: AxelWolf

The most important aspect should be getting paid if you do win.There's Nothing worst than winning and having to hold you're breath and wondering if you will really get paid.

Some online casinos use their complex T&C to get you on a technicality and no pay you. Some bonuses are fine. But, Some online casinos have 10 different bonus structures with tricky complicated rules that make you believe you're getting a wonderful deal, when in fact its set up where its next to impossible to come out ahead, they even cap the amount you can win very low, its equivalent to getting a bunch of free worthless spins or playing in play money mode.



Indeed a lot of online casinos have complex terms and conditions. but we gotta make a distinction here between those complex terms directed at preventing an abuse of the bonus promotion, and those complex terms directed at misleading the players.

The latter one happens at the rogue casinos, whos intent is to make it nearly impossible to cash-out. And it usually refers to freebies. This is why there are warning/blacklists about those casinos.
Quote: AxelWolf


I can't stand how they make it SO, SO easy to deposit, but when you go to cash out they want a copy of ID, CC , Banking information, utility bill etc etc
and say its for your safety and fraud reasons. Well if that's the case, why not ask for all of that at the beginning?

It's a stall tactic plain and simple. Most people just say screw it and keep playing, who is going to do all that crap for a few hundred dollars? What grandmother just wanting to play slots is ever going to do all that BS, or even knows how to?



Actually you would not believe the amount of player fraud happening . Creating multiple accounts, playing under different identities , money laundering, charge backs etc. This is why the verification process is needed.

And yes they can ask for the docs in advance , and some casinos tried to do exactly that. But what that did is it pissed off players. They wanted to deposit and play immediately and not go thru verification process before the play and then wait for a day or two for their accts to get approved.

Btw almost every online casino will verify your identity and all the docs if you wish to send them before you actually make a deposit.
"All it takes for evil to prevail is for good people to do nothing "
AxelWolf
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September 22nd, 2014 at 8:41:25 AM permalink
Quote: Zuga

Your site seems to promote bonus whoring. Most online casinos are against this. They normally call it bonus abuse. Many online casinos have various veg rules about this very thing. Obviously I haven't read all your top promoted casinos T&C's.

I know things are taken on a case by case basis but in general how do you deal with a casino that uses bonus whoring or just claiming someone took advantage of a good promotion as an excuse not to pay.

Example T&C
XXXX reserves the right to review the transaction records and logs at its discretion, FOR ANY REASON WHATSOEVER . If, upon such review, it appears that there are player/s are participating in strategies that XXXXX in its sole discretion deems to be abusive, XXXX reserves the right to suspended the players account.
XXXX shall be under no obligation to refund to you any remaining balance.
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
Zuga
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September 22nd, 2014 at 8:55:13 AM permalink
Quote: AxelWolf

Your site seems to promote bonus whoring. Most online casinos are against this. They normally call it bonus abuse. Many online casinos have various veg rules about this very thing. Obviously I haven't read all your top promoted casinos T&C's.

I know things are taken on a case by case basis but in general how do you deal with a casino that uses bonus whoring or just claiming someone took advantage of a good promotion as an excuse not to pay.
.



So when it comes to the exclusives we set up, the rules have to be clear, without any hidden clauses or fine prints.
If the rules are not clear then we would not run that exclusive.

When it comes to their standard bonus promotions, then we do go case by case, and upon receiving the player complaint we get in touch with the casino in case.
If they quote that FU clause as we call it ( pardon my French ) then we would issue the warning.

But I have to stress out that in most cases we would manage to resolve the complaint even if they try to quote the bonus abuse.

As long as the player is within promotional T&Cs we expect casinos to pay them fair and square.

But I have to say it has been a while since we received a bonus abuse complaint. It probably has to do with players keeping clear from the casinos we have on our warning list.

P.s.

I have to add that some players are indeed the abusers. What that means is, they either open multiple accts and play wiht the same promo over and over again. Or in case where they keep on playing with consecutive freebies without making a deposit in between the free chips.
"All it takes for evil to prevail is for good people to do nothing "
AxelWolf
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September 22nd, 2014 at 9:00:02 AM permalink
Quote: Zuga

So when it comes to the exclusives we set up, the rules have to be clear, without any hidden clauses or fine prints.
If the rules are not clear then we would not run that exclusive.

When it comes to their standard bonus promotions, then we do go case by case, and upon receiving the player complaint we get in touch with the casino in case.
If they quote that FU clause as we call it ( pardon my French ) then we would issue the warning.

But I have to stress out that in most cases we would manage to resolve the complaint even if they try to quote the bonus abuse.

As long as the player is within promotional T&Cs we expect casinos to pay them fair and square.

But I have to say it has been a while since we received a bonus abuse complaint. It probably has to do with players keeping clear from the casinos we have on our warning list.

The Casinos you add to your warning list do you still keep affiliate links and deals with them?
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
AxelWolf
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September 22nd, 2014 at 9:12:43 AM permalink
Quote: Zuga


I have to add that some players are indeed the abusers. What that means is, they either open multiple accts and play wiht the same promo over and over again. Or in case where they keep on playing with consecutive freebies without making a deposit in between the free chips.

Yes I was not talking about that. They have every right to disallow this. That should be be clearly stated as multiple accounts bonus abuse and as my example shows many are veg.

Example of a popular casino bad situation

XXXX began banning and locking players out of their accounts and confiscating the winnings. A XXXXX thread appears shortly after the bonus and players are up in arms about XXXXXX ridiculous tactics.

Player accounts were locked, and the deposits were deducted from accounts that used the bonus and winnings were also purged. Cash outs of pending bonus wins were not processed.

What was more shocking is that XXXXX was punishing some players by only confiscating their winnings and not refunding the losses that the players incurred while playing at the casino! So, they could be down a lot of undeserved money depending on how many times they used the unlimited bonus.

Even players who deposited just once or twice during the three hour period had their winnings confiscated, as well. Not just the people who deposited many times and earned thousands off the promotion.
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
Zuga
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September 22nd, 2014 at 9:12:46 AM permalink
it depends on the type of the warning and severity of the offense.

For some we would have their links killed, for the rest no. However the warnings are clearly visible, some have pop up messages additionally warning users about the issues.

It is crucial to understand that we believe in educating our visitors, providing them all the info. It is up to them given all the info to make an educated decision.

If they still choose to neglect the warnings then it is their prerogative. However even in those cases we still have the ability to assist them in case of the complaint.

However when it comes down to casinos on our blacklist , it is where we have no means to help the players and those casinos are to be avoided at all cost.
"All it takes for evil to prevail is for good people to do nothing "
AxelWolf
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September 22nd, 2014 at 9:28:05 AM permalink
To be clear i'm not rallying against playing online I actually support it. I want reasons I should play online. I want confidence I'm safe if I abide by the T&C'S

It's great casinos get put on a warning list but that doesn't help the people who got screwed.

I believe the fact that the Wizard didn't want to take the chances people might get burnt is what made him and the site popular.

He choose well with BV/BD Rarely a compliant.
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
Zuga
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September 22nd, 2014 at 9:47:49 AM permalink
Quote: AxelWolf

To be clear i'm not rallying against playing online I actually support it. I want reasons I should play online. I want confidence I'm safe if I abide by the T&C'S

It's great casinos get put on a warning list but that doesn't help the people who got screwed.

I believe the fact that the Wizard didn't want to take the chances people might get burnt is what made him and the site popular.

He choose well with BV/BD Rarely a compliant.



I hear you, and understand you dont want to get burned. No one wants that.

Lets put it this way,most of the complaints concerning rogue casinos we receive are coming from the first time visitors to our website, who are seeking help and found our site via search engines or thru recommendation.

Most of our members and visitors know where not to play , thanx to the info published on the website and the forum. If they by any chance play at xyw casino on the warning list, then it is their conscious decision knowing for instance their withdrawal might get delayed ( but still paid ). And knowing they can reach out to the Rep at the forum or ask one of the Mods to help them out.
"All it takes for evil to prevail is for good people to do nothing "
Beethoven9th
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September 22nd, 2014 at 11:31:07 AM permalink
Quote: AxelWolf

It's not about that. He wants it to be better.

Nah, I know terapined oh so well. He likes to complain about things...lol ;)
Fighting BS one post at a time!
GWAE
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September 22nd, 2014 at 11:42:04 AM permalink
Quote: Zuga

Or in case where they keep on playing with consecutive freebies without making a deposit in between the free chips.



Cool kat crushed me on this one. Long ago I made some deposits with them and never cashed out. I stopped playing online but they sent me a free offer in my email. I think it was something like $50. I played through that and lost it all. A little while later they sent me another free offer and I took it. I got super lucky and turned it into approx $7000 playing only slots. I figured there would be an issue cashing out so I played a ton to get a bunch of coin in. When I went to cash out they denied the request saying that I took 2 free play offers in a row without a deposit in between. I was quite annoyed but I never expected to be paid.
Expect the worst and you will never be disappointed. I AM NOT PART OF GWAE RADIO SHOW
Zuga
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September 22nd, 2014 at 12:00:02 PM permalink
Quote: GWAE

Cool kat crushed me on this one. Long ago I made some deposits with them and never cashed out. I stopped playing online but they sent me a free offer in my email. I think it was something like $50. I played through that and lost it all. A little while later they sent me another free offer and I took it. I got super lucky and turned it into approx $7000 playing only slots. I figured there would be an issue cashing out so I played a ton to get a bunch of coin in. When I went to cash out they denied the request saying that I took 2 free play offers in a row without a deposit in between. I was quite annoyed but I never expected to be paid.



Yeah i heard so many similar stories....

The standard in the industry is that you cannot claim more than one free chip in a row without making a deposit in between. And thats fair IMO. Where else can you get something for nothing i.e. free chips.
The standard is also that every free chip has a max cash-out rule, e.g. you can cash-out up to $100 on $25 NoDep.

Why we always advise members to double check the T&Cs.

But then again one may argue why would they send you the promotional email in the first place knowing you won't be able to cash-out?
They just piss off players ...

I did ask some casino Reps about this.. and the usual reply was that they send out those mailers to their whole database. Which is a stupid thing to do given the rules..

I guess some of the "fishy" casinos just want to lure you in hoping you won't win off of a free chip and then expecting you would make a deposit.
"All it takes for evil to prevail is for good people to do nothing "
rxwine
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September 22nd, 2014 at 12:01:24 PM permalink
Quote: GWAE

Cool kat crushed me on this one. Long ago I made some deposits with them and never cashed out. I stopped playing online but they sent me a free offer in my email. I think it was something like $50. I played through that and lost it all. A little while later they sent me another free offer and I took it. I got super lucky and turned it into approx $7000 playing only slots. I figured there would be an issue cashing out so I played a ton to get a bunch of coin in. When I went to cash out they denied the request saying that I took 2 free play offers in a row without a deposit in between. I was quite annoyed but I never expected to be paid.



Ack, though if all a online casino did was welch on big wins on their bonus play that would still make for some nice profits over land based casinos. I can see way too many players simply resigned to the fact that winning big on a bonus play wasn't actually thousands of dollars in their pocket and just letting those go.

And, like I say, even if that's the only way they cheated players, it would still save them a whopping amount of money over time.

They saved thousands with you? Or so it seems.
There's no secret. Just know what you're talking about before you open your mouth.
GWAE
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September 22nd, 2014 at 12:07:43 PM permalink
Quote: rxwine

Ack, though if all a online casino did was welch on big wins on their bonus play that would still make for some nice profits over land based casinos. I can see way too many players simply resigned to the fact that winning big on a bonus play wasn't actually thousands of dollars in their pocket and just letting those go.

And, like I say, even if that's the only way they cheated players, it would still save them a whopping amount of money over time.

They saved thousands with you? Or so it seems.



Yeah I never expected to get paid. After they sent me the explanation of why I wasn't getting paid I understood but thought it was idiotic that they would even send me the offer.

However, what did make no sense is that they locked my account after that. For no reason they just disabled me. Not that I was going to play again anyways. If they would have said, hey we will be you $500 even though we shouldn't I can pretty much guarantee that I would have given it all back in time but since they lost my confidence I would never have played there again anyways.

Not trying to complain about online casinos, just sharing a story. I have played in some since and may play again if I ever become not poor.
Expect the worst and you will never be disappointed. I AM NOT PART OF GWAE RADIO SHOW
AxelWolf
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September 22nd, 2014 at 1:52:37 PM permalink
Quote: Zuga

Yeah i heard so many similar stories....

The standard in the industry is that you cannot claim more than one free chip in a row without making a deposit in between. And thats fair IMO. Where else can you get something for nothing i.e. free chips.
The standard is also that every free chip has a max cash-out rule, e.g. you can cash-out up to $100 on $25 NoDep.

Why we always advise members to double check the T&Cs.

But then again one may argue why would they send you the promotional email in the first place knowing you won't be able to cash-out?
They just piss off players ...

I did ask some casino Reps about this.. and the usual reply was that they send out those mailers to their whole database. Which is a stupid thing to do given the rules..

I guess some of the "fishy" casinos just want to lure you in hoping you won't win off of a free chip and then expecting you would make a deposit.

Win a day your top 7th casino has the same thing and rules

Bonus Cash Out Terms:
In general the maximum CASH OUT for any no deposit bonus received is 2x the bonus amount or minimum withdrawal amount, whichever is higher, for players who have not made a deposit in the past 30 days, unless terms and conditions are stated otherwise on a particular bonus. For example: if you receive a $25 free chip the max amount you can cash out is $50. Further, no cash out is allowed if a deposit was not made in between receiving two no deposit bonuses.

OBVIOUSLY they should NOT let you use a free chip (easy to program in the system, simple warning: sorry you're unable to use the current code offer until you have made a successful deposit ) if you have no chance to get paid. Its unreasonable to expect normal people to read through all the T&C's.

THIS RULE IS ABSOLUTE BS: 10. Any player not logging in to their Win A Day account for a period of 365 days will result in account removal and all records will be deleted, including profile information, balance and any deposits in the account. Any funds remaining in such account will be forfeited.

WTF, SERIOUSLY. How about the just send a check, or turn the money to a treasury. better yet just let people keep accounts as long as they wish.Someone might have a life tragedy and logging on to a casino for$200 is the last thing they need to worry about.
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
Buzzard
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September 22nd, 2014 at 2:36:21 PM permalink
" Regarding Buzard: Thanks for whipping him into shape. His sense of humor and sarcasm are so far out that often I don't know what the F he's talking about - much less knowing what's sarcasm and what's serious. "

Gee, DJ, I had no idea you had such a low opinion of me. I can only imagine that since Zuga has not yet been Americanized, that he
might think I am a trouble maker. Let me set the record straight. ZUGA'S HOUSE ZUGA'S RULES.

I like the looks of that ZUGA'S HOUSE ZUGA'S RULES. I should start a thread with that title and properly introduce myself.

Thanks for the constructive criticism, DJ

ZUGA'S HOUSE ZUGA'S RULES.
Shed not for her the bitter tear Nor give the heart to vain regret Tis but the casket that lies here, The gem that filled it Sparkles yet
MrV
MrV
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September 22nd, 2014 at 5:46:49 PM permalink
Quote: Buzzard

. Let me set the record straight. ZUGA'S HOUSE ZUGA'S RULES. . . I like the looks of that ZUGA'S HOUSE ZUGA'S RULES. . .ZUGA'S HOUSE ZUGA'S RULES.



Aw, that's so sweet, you ought to change your name to "Zugar."
"What, me worry?"
richbailey86
richbailey86
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September 22nd, 2014 at 6:04:33 PM permalink
I'm going to stay positive. I read a lot here but do not post too much.

That being said I will offer my two cents.

A smart business man who advertises for online casinos would not in a million years pay 2 and a half million dollars for a series of sites promoting truth in gambling, without thinking they could capitalize on ALL the Wiz followers. They will spread that stuff here and it will be an attempt to draw people in.

Come on now
An idea whose time has come cannot be stopped by any army or any government. – Ron Paul
Buzzard
Buzzard
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Joined: Oct 28, 2012
September 22nd, 2014 at 6:20:24 PM permalink
Quote: MrV

Aw, that's so sweet, you ought to change your name to "Zugar."




Be careful, be very careful. Or your name may be in red soon. The secret administrators are watching.
Shed not for her the bitter tear Nor give the heart to vain regret Tis but the casket that lies here, The gem that filled it Sparkles yet
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