Pando
Pando
Joined: Jul 24, 2010
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July 20th, 2014 at 8:30:20 PM permalink
I sometimes play this game on a single zero layout. I realise it is just
a RNG (or pseudo RNG) and not a genuine game of roulette.

I have read every available thread of information about it that I can find
and some people say that it operates as a slot machine with a fixed
percentage pay out as set by the regulations of the authority of the
country concerned. Just like VP or any other slot.

I believe this to be true but I want to know if the outcome on a particular
spin is detrimental to the casino, can the software determine this, and then
reject the number chosen by the RNG and pay out on a number that carries
less liability for the casino.

Hopefully there may be a software engineer out there that has worked on
one of the machines.

Thank you in advance.
bigfoot66
bigfoot66
Joined: Feb 5, 2010
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July 20th, 2014 at 8:51:22 PM permalink
There is close to zero chance that you will ever encounter a rigged electronic gaming device in Nevada. In other words, the odds are the same as in a real roullette game.
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AxelWolf
AxelWolf
Joined: Oct 10, 2012
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July 20th, 2014 at 11:05:46 PM permalink
Quote: bigfoot66

There is close to zero chance that you will ever encounter a rigged electronic gaming device in Nevada. In other words, the odds are the same as in a real roullette game.

What if they are classified as a SLOT I wonder?
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
Pando
Pando
Joined: Jul 24, 2010
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July 20th, 2014 at 11:30:45 PM permalink
I was thinking that if the SLOT has a fixed percentage of take out, then surely there
must be a mechanism to ensure that the casino does that correctly.
Therefore there must be some way to pay or not pay certain outcomes.
Just like there would be in any other SLOT game.
tringlomane
tringlomane
Joined: Aug 25, 2012
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July 21st, 2014 at 12:50:00 AM permalink
Quote: AxelWolf

What if they are classified as a SLOT I wonder?



Video poker is often classified as "slots"...returns are lumped together with slots in nearly every state. But there is a zero chance you'll encounter a rigged electronic roulette game in Nevada (that's legal) because of Section 14.040 subsection 2 (b) of the Nevada gaming regulations:

(b) For gaming devices that are representative of live gambling games, the mathematical
probability of a symbol or other element appearing in a game outcome must be equal to the
mathematical probability of that symbol or element occurring in the live gambling game. For other
gaming devices, the mathematical probability of a symbol appearing in a position in any game
outcome must be constant.
Croupier
Croupier
Joined: Nov 15, 2009
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July 21st, 2014 at 3:05:00 AM permalink
In the UK we dont have that luxury. In betting shops up and down the land there are Fixed Odds Betting Terminals that represent roulette but, as you can tell by the name function like slots. These FOBTs are coming in for all sorts of bad press here, but it doesnt stop people playing them.
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DJTeddyBear
DJTeddyBear 
Joined: Nov 2, 2009
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July 21st, 2014 at 9:28:50 AM permalink
Quote: AxelWolf

What if they are classified as a SLOT I wonder?

They are classified for that exact purpose - to CLASSIFY them. Generally for reporting and taxation purposes. NOT for any 'rigged' return purpose.
I invented a few casino games. Info: http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ 覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧 Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
AxiomOfChoice
AxiomOfChoice
Joined: Sep 12, 2012
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July 21st, 2014 at 4:48:55 PM permalink
Quote: Pando

I have read every available thread of information about it that I can find
and some people say that it operates as a slot machine with a fixed
percentage pay out as set by the regulations of the authority of the
country concerned. Just like VP or any other slot.



That's not how VP or slots work either (at least, not in Nevada)
ThatDonGuy
ThatDonGuy
Joined: Jun 22, 2011
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July 22nd, 2014 at 6:08:02 PM permalink
Quote: Pando

I believe this to be true but I want to know if the outcome on a particular spin is detrimental to the casino, can the software determine this, and then reject the number chosen by the RNG and pay out on a number that carries less liability for the casino.


You make it sound like every symbol on a particular reel of a slot machine normally has an equal chance of showing up. This is not the case; it's possible for the symbols right next to the jackpot symbol to come up, say, 10 times as much as the jackpot, so it looks like you had a "near miss". The casinos "limit their liability" by having the reels set up so that the average result is less than the amount the player put into the machine for each spin.

Note that, in Nevada, this applies only to actual slot machines; video poker, or any other video game that uses electronic versions of (for example) cards, dice, or roulette wheels, has to be simulated accurately (so, in VP, each card is equally likely to be the first card, each remaining card is equally likely to be the second card, and so on).
AxiomOfChoice
AxiomOfChoice
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July 22nd, 2014 at 6:13:42 PM permalink
Quote: ThatDonGuy

You make it sound like every symbol on a particular reel of a slot machine normally has an equal chance of showing up. This is not the case; it's possible for the symbols right next to the jackpot symbol to come up, say, 10 times as much as the jackpot, so it looks like you had a "near miss". The casinos "limit their liability" by having the reels set up so that the average result is less than the amount the player put into the machine for each spin.

Note that, in Nevada, this applies only to actual slot machines; video poker, or any other video game that uses electronic versions of (for example) cards, dice, or roulette wheels, has to be simulated accurately (so, in VP, each card is equally likely to be the first card, each remaining card is equally likely to be the second card, and so on).



There's something that I've never really understood about that law. Without looking up the exact wording, it says something about how anything that simulates a real gambling game must have the same odds as the real game. So, anything with cards, dice, etc must have fair odds. So, how come this doesn't apply to wheel spins (eg, wheel of fortune slot machine bonus games). There are definitely real gambling games where physical wheels are spun (eg, big six).

So how come they can get away with a rigged virtual wheel, but not rigged virtual dice?

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