RonC
RonC
Joined: Jan 18, 2010
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April 1st, 2014 at 6:36:39 PM permalink
Quote: endermike

False. He was an editor one year and president another of the Harvard Law Review. He graduated magna cum laude from Harvard Law.



"His election to the Harvard Law Review won him fame, and to some, showed evidence of his brilliance, even though all it showed is that he was elected. (Obama may very well have not been admitted to the Harvard Law Review on merit, but through its affirmative action program, as Obama himself noted. He did so in writing to a fellow student who had criticized the policy in the pages of the Harvard Law Record. His election to the Harvard Law Review came only after other law reviews had already had black editors. So concerned with diversity was the Review that it even flirted with abolishing grade-based selection entirely in 1996.)"

"The system produced classes where only one-third of the class did not receive honors. For the class of ’95, a whopping 71.3 percent of the student body graduated with honors, doubling the number of students graduating with honors since 1972 and tripling the numbers receiving magna cum laude."

Affirmative action and a time when schools were trying to do away with silly little things like GPAs...

Still no great list of scholarly accomplishments. I didn't say there weren't some...but he isn't "brilliant" at all...

http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/2012/08/05/The-Mainstream-Media-s-Treatment-of-Obama-s-and-Romney-s-Grades-Compared
RonC
RonC
Joined: Jan 18, 2010
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April 1st, 2014 at 6:36:41 PM permalink
Quote: endermike

False. He was an editor one year and president another of the Harvard Law Review. He graduated magna cum laude from Harvard Law.



"His election to the Harvard Law Review won him fame, and to some, showed evidence of his brilliance, even though all it showed is that he was elected. (Obama may very well have not been admitted to the Harvard Law Review on merit, but through its affirmative action program, as Obama himself noted. He did so in writing to a fellow student who had criticized the policy in the pages of the Harvard Law Record. His election to the Harvard Law Review came only after other law reviews had already had black editors. So concerned with diversity was the Review that it even flirted with abolishing grade-based selection entirely in 1996.)"

"The system produced classes where only one-third of the class did not receive honors. For the class of ’95, a whopping 71.3 percent of the student body graduated with honors, doubling the number of students graduating with honors since 1972 and tripling the numbers receiving magna cum laude."

Affirmative action and a time when schools were trying to do away with silly little things like GPAs...

Still no great list of scholarly accomplishments. I didn't say there weren't some...but he isn't "brilliant" at all...

http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/2012/08/05/The-Mainstream-Media-s-Treatment-of-Obama-s-and-Romney-s-Grades-Compared
FinsRule
FinsRule
Joined: Dec 23, 2009
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April 1st, 2014 at 7:23:28 PM permalink
If I had to guess, I'd say Obama has a top 10 presidential IQ
endermike
endermike
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April 1st, 2014 at 8:47:36 PM permalink
Probably one of the few times someone has said that a Harvard Law grad isn't brilliant. But let's dig a little bit further and see if we can find some objective facts and see where they lead.

There is no definitive proof whether it was affirmative action or not which gain him admittance to being an editor. Either way the fact is he was picked which is a meaningful honor any year.
Quote: RonC, using a single Breitbart article as 90% of his response

"The system produced classes where only one-third of the class did not receive honors. For the class of ’95, a whopping 71.3 percent of the student body graduated with honors, doubling the number of students graduating with honors since 1972 and tripling the numbers receiving magna cum laude."

First he graduated in 1991, which while the inflationary facts are still present I would assume that Breitbart pulled the most extreme one they could. Why do I assume this? Because they don't cite any sources while making a factual error (like using the wrong year's stats).

Let's finish this quote you choose to truncate.
Quote: The one (biased) article which makes up 90% of RonC's reply

The system produced classes where only one-third...While receiving magna cum laude is impressive, it’s a lot less impressive if one in six students win it.

Even if I grant you the anachronistic stat: One out of six among Harvard Law grads.Pretty damn impressive. All this despite his extra-curricular load.

If you don't believe those are a great list of scholarly accomplishments, before he was 30, you don't know what is. He only stayed in academia after graduating for a short while (about 6 full time years and then about 8 part time). He was a lecturer, not a researcher. He was well regarded by his students and other faculty.

http://www.law.uchicago.edu/media

http://content.time.com/time/politics/article/0,8599,1835238,00.html

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/07/30/us/politics/30law.html?pagewanted=all

http://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2011/sep/09/barack-obama-was-my-teacher

http://schoolsofthought.blogs.cnn.com/2013/02/25/my-view-when-the-president-was-my-professor/


I make no claims he is the smartest president ever, however, the idea that he isn't really smart is lunacy.
Dicenor33
Dicenor33
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April 1st, 2014 at 9:06:52 PM permalink
President does not have to be smart. It's advisors he relies on, that's what counts. The people you surround yourself with makes a difference in presidency. Wisdom and ability to see ahead of the crowd makes great presidents. You listen to all types of opinions scholars present you, and you choose the one which shapes your policies. Obama is not great, nor he is bad, he is average. He'll leave no trace, people like him don't shape history.
soxfan
soxfan
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April 1st, 2014 at 9:17:32 PM permalink
Quote: FinsRule

If I had to guess, I'd say Obama has a top 10 presidential IQ



Obama is a creature of affirmative action, plain and simple. I've NEVER heard him say anything particularly intelligent and I'd wager heavily that his iq is one of the lowest of any sitting president, hey hey.
" Life is a well of joy; but where the rabble drinks too, all wells are poisoned!" Nietzsche
FinsRule
FinsRule
Joined: Dec 23, 2009
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April 1st, 2014 at 9:37:18 PM permalink
Quote: soxfan

Obama is a creature of affirmative action, plain and simple. I've NEVER heard him say anything particularly intelligent and I'd wager heavily that his iq is one of the lowest of any sitting president, hey hey.



Lowest and highest of any sitting president, lol. Hey, hey!
soxfan
soxfan
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April 1st, 2014 at 10:06:50 PM permalink
Quote: FinsRule

Lowest and highest of any sitting president, lol. Hey, hey!



I read once that the JFK had the lowest iq of any president, at about 105, and I'd wager heavily that obama's iq is in that range and certianly no higher than 110, hey hey.
" Life is a well of joy; but where the rabble drinks too, all wells are poisoned!" Nietzsche
endermike
endermike
Joined: Dec 10, 2013
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April 1st, 2014 at 10:08:48 PM permalink
Quote: Dicenor33

President does not have to be smart. It's advisors he relies on, that's what counts. The people you surround yourself with makes a difference in presidency. Wisdom and ability to see ahead of the crowd makes great presidents. You listen to all types of opinions scholars present you, and you choose the one which shapes your policies.

I agree.

Quote: Dicenor33

He'll leave no trace, people like him don't shape history.

This I'm not so sure. I think there will be some things from his presidency which will shape the current century.

1) His policies and handling of drone warfare has been fascination (if at times infuriating). That will be a precident which will echo over the foreseeable future. While the next president may reject his choices, the shaping of international law on this issue is ongoing.
2) The ACA will tough for anyone to remove. Much like other social welfare programs its true effects will only be (even partially) understandable in the decades to come. It may well get the US on the road to a more nationalized health system.
3) His choices in information gathering programs may well change the course of how we view privacy on in the digital age. Should a terror act be successful on US soil in the next decade this will undoubtedly be revisited.
4) He will have brought 2 wars to a close.
5) The debts under him have been massive. He took over a train wreck economy and decided to try to spend his way out. We probably will never know if his policies made things get better faster or slower, but either way he will oversee one of the longest periods of dropping unemployment. Whether that is simply regression to the mean or skillful management, I'm a bit cynical, but it will be part of his legacy.

There are other issues which we don't even recognize as important yet. The consequences of his choices will be better understood eventually and then judgement will be passed properly.
endermike
endermike
Joined: Dec 10, 2013
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April 1st, 2014 at 10:21:31 PM permalink
Quote: soxfan

I read once that the JFJ had the lowest iq of any president, at about 105, and I'd wager heavily that obama's iq is in that range and certianly no higher than 110, hey hey.



If you want I will take that action. But I assume you were being hyperbolic. If you do want to bet I think you will be bucking a much higher HE than at baccarat.

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