is Rick Santorum running for president?
He's either trying to sell books, or he's trying to get his own talk show on Fox News, but he's not serious about running for president. (His previous Fox News gig was just as a contributor, not a host.)
A politician who is serious about running for president does not insult the 99% of American women under the age of 44 who have used contraceptives. A politician who is serious about running for president does not insult the husbands and boyfriends of the 99% of American women who have used contraceptives. It's rude.
How's he going to convince any moderates or independents to vote for him?
But I never felt he thought of himeslf as a serious candidate. I think he may be looking at a VP slot or some cabinent post. He is a young guy so needs to remind people he is available.
Michelle Bachmann probably would like to kick Perry in the groin. She was at her highest point winning that straw poll over all her rivals and Perry entered the race and stole all the oxygen on nearly the same day.
(the news media just ran to follow Perry's cowboy parade)
Then Perry somehow managed to stumble shortly out of the gate. Adding insult to injury. Not that she likely had a chance, but still.
Quote: renoHow's he going to convince any moderates or independents to vote for him?
He has a long list of comments that make him virtually anethema to most of the population. People like this run to improve their recognition level.
He served two terms as a Representative, two terms as a Senator, and then was defeated by the largest percentage of the population in 26 years. He has no political future, and is improving his status as a Fox News star.
Quote: renoHow's he going to convince any moderates or independents to vote for him?
He has a long list of comments that make him virtually anethema to most of the population. People like this run to improve their recognition level.
He served two terms as a Representative, two terms as a Senator, and then was defeated by the largest percentage of the population in 26 years. He has no political future, and is improving his status as a Fox News star.
Congratulations, Rick!
Quote: pacomartinI still think that supporters of extreme candidates know that Iowa is the place to try and make their candidate get the attention they want. I see Iowa as a clear victory for Romney (despite the virtually tied vote). Of the centrist candidate he beat Gingrich and Perry. Santorum and Ron Paul will get some media attention now, but so will their outrageous statements. Huntsman should quit now.
What is extreme about Santorum? Please cite some statements or positions.
Quote: AZDuffmanWhat is extreme about Santorum? Please cite some statements or positions.
Santorum actually has an opinion about whether my wife and I use contraceptives. As I mentioned in the first post of this thread, he considers contraceptives "dangerous" and "not OK". That's extreme.
Quote: renoSantorum actually has an opinion about whether my wife and I use contraceptives. As I mentioned in the first post of this thread, he considers contraceptives "dangerous" and "not OK". That's extreme.
Having "an opinion" is extreme? Given that several contraceptives have been pulled from the market over the years some people can natually be expected to think they are dangerous. Has he tried to ban them? If not then I would file it under "opinions-everybody has them."
If that is the worst about him we would be pretty well off if he were elected. Better than the current administration that wants me to help pay for those contraceptives and in fact has forced me to do so.
Quote: AZDuffmanI would file it under "opinions-everybody has them."
He's entitled to his opinion. And I'm entitled to label his opinion wacko crazy extreme. It is wacko crazy extreme to criticize responsible adults for using birth control.
Quote: AZDuffmanBetter than the current administration that wants me to help pay for those contraceptives and in fact has forced me to do so.
Would the taxpayer benefit if every woman on welfare was using birth control? Would the taxpayer benefit if there were fewer children attending public schools?
Quote: renoWould the taxpayer benefit if every woman on welfare was using birth control? Would the taxpayer benefit if there were fewer children attending public schools?
Aint the question. Birth control is not something "insurance" should be paying for. If someone wants to use it the need to open their wallet and use it, not expect their health insurance to cover it.
We have a method of controling the "poor woman on welfare having kids" problem that is proven to work. It is the "family cap" or IOW no more raises in welfare when you have more kids. It is amazing how people seem to become more responsible when it is their wallet they have to open.
Quote: renoAs I mentioned in the first post of this thread, he considers contraceptives "dangerous" and "not OK". That's extreme.
Check out this online dictionary www.wordnik.com
Look up santorum!
Quote: AZDuffmanGiven that several contraceptives have been pulled from the market over the years some people can natually be expected to think they are dangerous. Has he tried to ban them?
I am surprised to learn that not only has Santorum not tried to ban contraceptives, he's done the opposite: as a Senator he voted for Title X, which provides government subsidies for birth control. I think it's weird that Santorum has criticized people who use birth control while simultaneously spending my taxdollars to give away free birth control. But maybe I ought to applaud the guy for separating his personal values from his Senate voting record.
The funny thing about this race is that Romney is criticized for being a flip-flopping chameleon for his inconsistent record on abortion, while Santorum has been praised for his consistency on abortion. But this is unfair to Romney! In 1995 Santorum told Philadelphia Magazine that he was pro-choice all his life until he ran for Congress... and then he changed his mind.
Right after he accepts the nomination at the Republican convention, he is going to use the word, "Macaca". I saw the script.
Quote: klimate10Rick Santorum is not running for President. He is trying to win GOP nomination, so that he can hand the Presidency to Obama for 4 more years.
Right after he accepts the nomination at the Republican convention, he is going to use the word, "Macaca". I saw the script.
Haha, yeah pretty much. Santorum winning the nomination is Obama's wet dream.
Perry would have been even more ideal, but the GOP base isn't THAT dumb.
Quote: AZDuffmanWhat is extreme about Santorum? Please cite some statements or positions.
Santorum recently criticized Obama for encouraging Americans to go to college. It's hard to believe that he would say such a weird thing, and it makes me very sad to watch his audience applaud him. There was a time in American history when Republicans valued higher education, now they mock it.
Apparently Santorum's concern is that colleges will indoctrinate our gullible children and make 'em librul. That's an insult to the kids. I knew plenty of bright, hard-working conservatives in college and they turned out just fine. Santorum himself has a bachelor's degree and two post graduate degrees, I hope he's not ashamed of his own education.
Quote: renoSantorum recently criticized Obama for encouraging Americans to go to college. It's hard to believe that he would say such a weird thing, and it makes me very sad to watch his audience applaud him. There was a time in American history when Republicans valued higher education, now they mock it.
He was more saying that not everyone needs to go or should even go. What with about 20% of students not coming back for sophmore year and a little over 50% graduating he has a point, lots of money is wasted there. Then look at the OWS loons with all the liberal art degrees that they are saying they "can't get a job with their degree" and it is a waste for even more. So perhaps Slick Rick has something there?
I knew a guy went to college, dropped out second semester. Later learned a trade and did fantastic. College is not only not for everybody, it is not even for the majority.
Quote: AZDuffmanWhat is extreme about Santorum? Please cite some statements or positions.
1. “In every society, the definition of marriage has not ever to my knowledge included homosexuality. That’s not to pick on homosexuality. It’s not, you know, man on child, man on dog, or whatever the case may be.” —Rick Santorum , speaking to a reporter in 2003, who said, "I’m sorry, I didn’t think I was going to talk about ‘man on dog’ with a United States senator, it’s sort of freaking me out.”
2. "One of the things I will talk about, that no president has talked about before, is I think the dangers of contraception in this country.... Many of the Christian faith have said, well, that's okay, contraception is okay. It's not okay. It's a license to do things in a sexual realm that is counter to how things are supposed to be." —Rick Santorum, interview with CaffeinatedThoughts.com (October 2011)
3. "I don't want to make black people's lives better by giving them somebody else's money; I want to give them the opportunity to go out and earn the money." —Rick Santorum, campaigning for president in Iowa (January 2012)
4. "President Obama wants everybody in America to go to college. What a snob ... Oh, I understand why he wants you to go to college. He wants to remake you in his image.” –Rick Santorum, speaking to a Tea Party group in Michigan (February 2012)
5. “Earlier in my political career, I had the opportunity to read the speech, and I almost threw up.” –Rick Santorum, on JFK's 1960 speech about the importance of separation of church and state (October 2011)
6. "The question is — and this is what Barack Obama didn't want to answer — is that human life a person under the Constitution? And Barack Obama says no. Well if that person — human life is not a person, then — I find it almost remarkable for a black man to say, 'We're going to decide who are people and who are not people.'" —Rick Santorum, CNS News interview (January 2011)
7. “I think the Democrats are actually worried he (Obama) may go to Indonesia and bow to more Muslims.” –Rick Santorum, Fox News interview (May 2010)
8. “[Gay marriage] is an issue just like 9-11... We didn't decide we wanted to fight the war on terrorism because we wanted to. It was brought to us. And if not now, when? When the supreme courts in all the other states have succumbed to the Massachusetts version of the law?” –Rick Santorum, interview with the Allentown Morning Call (February 2004)
9. "Is anyone saying same-sex couples can't love each other? I love my children. I love my friends, my brother. Heck, I even love my mother-in-law. Should we call these relationships marriage, too?" –Rick Santorum, in a Philadelphia Inquirer column (May 2008)
10. "The idea that the Crusades and the fight of Christendom against Islam is somehow an aggression on our part is absolutely anti-historical. And that is what the perception is by the American Left who hates Christendom. ... What I'm talking about is onward American soldiers. What we're talking about are core American values." –Rick Santorum, campaigning for president in South Carolina (February 2011)
Bonus quotes:
"The reason Social Security is in big trouble is we don't have enough workers to support the retirees. Well, a third of all the young people in America are not in America today because of abortion.” –Rick Santorum, during a Republican presidential debate (May 2011)
“You can say I’m a hater. But I would argue I’m a lover. I’m a lover of traditional families and of the right of children to have a mother and father… I would argue that the future of America hangs in the balance, because the future of the family hangs in the balance. Isn’t that the ultimate homeland security, standing up and defending marriage?” –Rick Santorum, quoted in the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette (July 2004)
“We have brave men and women who are willing to step forward because they know what’s at stake. They’re willing to sacrifice their lives for this great country. What I’m asking all of you tonight is not to put on a uniform. Put on a bumper sticker. Is it that much to ask? Is it that much to ask to step up and serve your country?” —Sen. Rick Santorum (R-PA), during his losing 2006 re-election bid, urging supporters to put a Rick Santorum bumper sticker on their cars
Quote: WongBo1. “In every society, the definition of marriage has not ever to my knowledge included homosexuality. That’s not to pick on homosexuality. It’s not, you know, man on child, man on dog, or whatever the case may be.” —Rick Santorum , speaking to a reporter in 2003, who said, "I’m sorry, I didn’t think I was going to talk about ‘man on dog’ with a United States senator, it’s sort of freaking me out.”
2. "One of the things I will talk about, that no president has talked about before, is I think the dangers of contraception in this country.... Many of the Christian faith have said, well, that's okay, contraception is okay. It's not okay. It's a license to do things in a sexual realm that is counter to how things are supposed to be." —Rick Santorum, interview with CaffeinatedThoughts.com (October 2011)
3. "I don't want to make black people's lives better by giving them somebody else's money; I want to give them the opportunity to go out and earn the money." —Rick Santorum, campaigning for president in Iowa (January 2012)
4. "President Obama wants everybody in America to go to college. What a snob ... Oh, I understand why he wants you to go to college. He wants to remake you in his image.” –Rick Santorum, speaking to a Tea Party group in Michigan (February 2012)
5. “Earlier in my political career, I had the opportunity to read the speech, and I almost threw up.” –Rick Santorum, on JFK's 1960 speech about the importance of separation of church and state (October 2011)
6. "The question is — and this is what Barack Obama didn't want to answer — is that human life a person under the Constitution? And Barack Obama says no. Well if that person — human life is not a person, then — I find it almost remarkable for a black man to say, 'We're going to decide who are people and who are not people.'" —Rick Santorum, CNS News interview (January 2011)
7. “I think the Democrats are actually worried he (Obama) may go to Indonesia and bow to more Muslims.” –Rick Santorum, Fox News interview (May 2010)
8. “[Gay marriage] is an issue just like 9-11... We didn't decide we wanted to fight the war on terrorism because we wanted to. It was brought to us. And if not now, when? When the supreme courts in all the other states have succumbed to the Massachusetts version of the law?” –Rick Santorum, interview with the Allentown Morning Call (February 2004)
9. "Is anyone saying same-sex couples can't love each other? I love my children. I love my friends, my brother. Heck, I even love my mother-in-law. Should we call these relationships marriage, too?" –Rick Santorum, in a Philadelphia Inquirer column (May 2008)
10. "The idea that the Crusades and the fight of Christendom against Islam is somehow an aggression on our part is absolutely anti-historical. And that is what the perception is by the American Left who hates Christendom. ... What I'm talking about is onward American soldiers. What we're talking about are core American values." –Rick Santorum, campaigning for president in South Carolina (February 2011)
Bonus quotes:
"The reason Social Security is in big trouble is we don't have enough workers to support the retirees. Well, a third of all the young people in America are not in America today because of abortion.” –Rick Santorum, during a Republican presidential debate (May 2011)
“You can say I’m a hater. But I would argue I’m a lover. I’m a lover of traditional families and of the right of children to have a mother and father… I would argue that the future of America hangs in the balance, because the future of the family hangs in the balance. Isn’t that the ultimate homeland security, standing up and defending marriage?” –Rick Santorum, quoted in the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette (July 2004)
“We have brave men and women who are willing to step forward because they know what’s at stake. They’re willing to sacrifice their lives for this great country. What I’m asking all of you tonight is not to put on a uniform. Put on a bumper sticker. Is it that much to ask? Is it that much to ask to step up and serve your country?” —Sen. Rick Santorum (R-PA), during his losing 2006 re-election bid, urging supporters to put a Rick Santorum bumper sticker on their cars
I don't see much extreme here at all, unless it is somehow "extreme" to think marrige is one man and one woman.
To me it is more being an extremist to say drilling for oil somehow will not help get more supply and women have a right to free birth control.
Quote: AZDuffmanTo me it is more being an extremist to say... women have a right to free birth control.
As Santorum explained to Greta Van Susteran, he voted to give women free birth control paid for by taxpayers. I agree that it's hard to keep track of Santorum's position on birth control because when he's not voting to give it away for free, he's criticizing married couples who have non-procreative sex.
AZDuffman, I get the sense you're only defending Santorum because he plays for your team. If a liberal loon like Rev. Al Sharpton had said that all non-procreative sex was against God's will or if Michael Moore had criticized Bush for encouraging every American to go to college, you'd be scowling at their foolishness. (And you'd be right!) George Washington warned us against partisanship. I'm guilty of this too, because in my mind the Republicans bailed out the banks, and in your mind the Democrats bailed out the banks, but the truth is that both parties did it.
Quote: renoAZDuffman, I get the sense you're only defending Santorum because he plays for your team. If a liberal loon like Rev. Al Sharpton had said that all non-procreative sex was against God's will or if Michael Moore had criticized Bush for encouraging every American to go to college, you'd be scowling at their foolishness. (And you'd be right!) George Washington warned us against partisanship. I'm guilty of this too, because in my mind the Republicans bailed out the banks, and in your mind the Democrats bailed out the banks, but the truth is that both parties did it.
I am defending him because I like several things he has said as I think they make sense. Number one I liked best was he said to end all of these programs that teach welfare recipients to "get to work on time and be a good employee" because Wal-Mart and McDonald's do that already. Similarly, quit training the same people for some kind of "office" job because at entry level those jobs go to people with good work history-even if MCD or WMT-than someone trying to get off welfare.
People keep saying "political parties are the problem" but they say it as if people with common interests or beliefs will never work togther. Reminds me of a caller to Limbaugh after Columbine who said, "We need to get the cliques out of the schools" and Rush rightly said she was living in Fantasyland if she thought that would be possible as people clique up no matter where you go.
I do lots of side jobs right now, and what amazes me is how fast people do clique up. One of my gigs is on-call banquet server work. And within an hour, people are working and talking to like-people! You don't even have to say what you do, the natural gravitation is amazing. I end up teaming with other college-educated professionals working for extra money and the less educated workers team up with their same kinds. When I moved to AZ the east-coast transplants and SoCal/Paciffic NW transplants all found each other, and stayed together as groups.
If people group on this level, to think it will not happen in government is to dream.
Quote: renoMuch to my surprise, Mr. Santorum had a great day today in the Hawkeye state. Apparently Iowa's Republicans either: A) hate birth control, or B) are hypocrites.
Congratulations, Rick!
As I resident of Iowa I almost felt embarrassed that Bachmann won the straw poll, even though it doesn't mean much. And it saddens me that someone like Santorum would get a lot of support here.
I also hate that Iowa is considered a high conservative republican state. I don't ever want to be affiliated with that.
For the speaking circuit, book contracts, Fox TV show.
Pick all that apply.
(2) On contraception: this can't be a win for Santorum. Contraception is wide-spread, among all religions, and while the "pill" opened up the sexual revolution, there isn't any turning back now. Overpopulation is a problem in this world, and contraception is the only way your are going to stop it, not restraint. Look at how fat Americans are. Look at how fat I am! We're incapable of restraint.
(4) Dumb point. Plenty of Americans who go to college turn out as republicans. My wife went to college, graduated from Berkeley actually, and is a staunch republican. I would be that pretty much every republican in congress, in the senate, in state senates are college educated. Really dumb point. All that Santorum's really saying there is that Republicans are dumb.
(5) Church and state better be separated.
(9) Really misses the understanding between romantic love and friendship love. Obviously gay couples love each other as much as heterosexual couple do. Very naive point.
Santorum should concentrate on the issues of the day. We get it, he's ultra-conservative, but if you focus on that, he won't win the Republican nomination and won't stand a chance in the election. Right or wrong, most Americans have given up on Roe v Wade, and have accepted that abortion in some form will always be legal in the US. Pretty much all Americans, especially parents of teenagers have accepted contraception as a very excellent alternative to abstinenace, right or wrong. Gay marriage is a fight worth having I suppose, but it's a divisive issue.
It's the economy (still), stupid.
And that shithead Rick Santorum won't condemn Rush.
Santorum's drivel
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--Ms. D.
According to the latest data I can find (link here)
There are 62 million women between the ages of 15-44 in the United States. 62% of these women are using a contraceptive method (38.2 million). Another 31% are pregnant or sterile and do not require contraception. 7% are not using a method.
The data further goes on to state that there are 10.7 million American women on the pill, 10.4 million have had tubal ligations, 6.2 million make the men use condoms, 3.8 million males have vasectomies, and 2.1 million women use IUDs. The other "methods" include rhythm (300,000) and withdrawal (2 million).
I guess my thought is that if you don't want to get pregnant, and your health insurance provider doesn't cover it, then go and get the pill on your own, or go to an agency where the pill is provided for cheaper than the full cost. Really, covering the cost of contraceptive pill at $15 - $50 / month drives up the cost of health insurance for everyone else and it's really a minority of the health care population who is being covered.
I'm wondering, if my significant other can't go on the pill, will the doctor prescribe me condoms?
Virtually ALL women (<99%) have used a contraceptive in their lifetime, which is why Santorum is absolute insane to speak out against them (unless he wants to alienate women) and why Obama's poll numbers haven't changed among the Catholic population.
Or am I just being an ignorant ass?
Hopefully my 2 emails and phone call helped tip the balance.Quote: David Friend, CEO of Carbonite
No one with daughters the age of Sandra Fluke, and I have two, could possibly abide the insult and abuse heaped upon this courageous and well-intentioned young lady. Mr. Limbaugh, with his highly personal attacks on Miss Fluke, overstepped any reasonable bounds of decency. Even though Mr. Limbaugh has now issued an apology, we have nonetheless decided to withdraw our advertising from his show. We hope that our action, along with the other advertisers who have already withdrawn their ads, will ultimately contribute to a more civilized public discourse.
On the one hand, the ultra-right agenda reaches into women by forcing unnecessary medical procedures, so much so that Virginia almost passed a law that would have forced women to be legally raped in order to get an abortion. So, the right wants us to pay tax dollars to enforce these barbarian laws.
On the other hand, when a woman needs contraception for a medically necessary reason, as Fluke was explaining, then she's a slut and a prostitute. Likewise, it is much more cost effective to fund the pill for contraception than to pay welfare to that unwanted child for however long, thus saving tax dollars.
Hard to believe the total lack of logic.
Then Rush apologizes with: "My choice of words was not the best, and in the attempt to be humorous, I created a national stir. I sincerely apologize to Ms. Fluke for the insulting word choices." Don't apologize for your choice of words, just f***ing apologize to the woman, unconditionally.
--Ms. D.
Quote: DorothyGaleHe called every woman in the country who uses birth control a slut and prostitute who should post movies of themselves having sex.
Rush has inflicted serious damage to the Republican brand this week. How come these clowns haven't figured out that women can vote? Either Rush is far dumber than we thought, or his goal is to get Democrats elected.
I find him about as funny as a trip to the dentist, but other people are happy enough to listen to his brand polemic. This is just Rush doing his job... possibly badly in this case if it causes ad money to desert his show.
Quote: renoRush has inflicted serious damage to the Republican brand this week. How come these clowns haven't figured out that women can vote? Either Rush is far dumber than we thought, or his goal is to get Democrats elected.
Maybe a 3rd option. He's spewed so much crap
for so long he can't control what he says any
longer.
In any event, I saw a news blurb that he has
apologized to the young lady. So clearly the
backlash from the advertisers got his attention.
Quote: renoRush has inflicted serious damage to the Republican brand this week. How come these clowns haven't figured out that women can vote? Either Rush is far dumber than we thought, or his goal is to get Democrats elected.
I really doubt this. By your logic Alec Baldwin and Tina Fey (plus others) did damage to the Democrat Brand by their treatment of Sarah Palin.
What Rush did was make the point that women who want to use birth control should pay for it themselves, not expect me to do so. And he is 100% correct on that point.
Maybe he used the word "slut" because conservatives are routinely called "racist-sexist-bigot-homophopes" and he figured that is how liberals liked to be communicated with?
POTUS Santorum or Romney can repeal this nonsense in 2013......
Quote: AZDuffmanI really doubt this. By your logic Alec Baldwin and Tina Fey (plus others) did damage to the Democrat Brand by their treatment of Sarah Palin.
What Rush did was make the point that women who want to use birth control should pay for it themselves, not expect me to do so. And he is 100% correct on that point.
Maybe he used the word "slut" because conservatives are routinely called "racist-sexist-bigot-homophopes" and he figured that is how liberals liked to be communicated with?
POTUS Santorum or Romney can repeal this nonsense in 2013......
"I really doubt this. By your logic Alec Baldwin and Tina Fey (plus others) did damage to the Democrat Brand by their treatment of Sarah Palin" >>> Yep, I agree.
It should be SAME RULES FOR EVERYONE, right guys? ;)
Ken
Quote: thecesspitWhat about the pill used for cases which help prevent very painful gynacological problems? This was one tye cases the lady in question was campaigning for, but the Catholic schools insurance would not pay for it as it was birth control...
If it isn't covered it isn't covered and you know that going in. So the lady needs to pay for it herself. Just because it is "the pill" is no different than if they choose not to pay for any other type of covereage. There are other employers out there.
The real answer should be eliminate all of these "mandated coverages" and let the insurance companies offer a wide range of coverage, then wean people off the employer paying and you just get a higher base salary but have to buy your own coverage. See how many people would "favor" those plans when they see the bill come out of their own pocket.
Quote: AZDuffmanIf it isn't covered it isn't covered and you know that going in. So the lady needs to pay for it herself. Just because it is "the pill" is no different than if they choose not to pay for any other type of covereage. There are other employers out there.
It's often hard to know what IS covered by a plan. It would be odd that certain medicines for prevention of a certain type of problem weren't covered. I realize there's a lot of exceptions and if-ands-buts in healthcare.
Generally on -birth control- being covered or not, I think it's a fine statement for a company to make. I'd find it odd to say "well we can't prescribe you drug X as it has these two effects, and though we are using it for something other than birth control, we can't give it to you, cos we don't cover birth control". I -personally- don't think there's any problem with medical coverage covering birth control.
The Pill is free under the National Health Service in the UK. It's not free in British Columbia, but you can get assistance to pay for the cheapest brands, and the cost is around $30/month for the standard pill... which is not for everyone.
Quote:The real answer should be eliminate all of these "mandated coverages" and let the insurance companies offer a wide range of coverage, then wean people off the employer paying and you just get a higher base salary but have to buy your own coverage. See how many people would "favor" those plans when they see the bill come out of their own pocket.
Remember in this case, it was about the coverage mandated/given by the college. These aren't always items people have control over. Not everyone has free and easy transfer of movement between work. That said, I would say user pays all coverage could work. If it's cheap and broad enough to cover the majority.
The answer is either a) non-employment led medical coverage or b) full state-led coverage (the "european model"). I do agree that the option c used in the US (as you've described it) is neither fish, not foul and serves no-one very well. I also agree that we can argue until the next 30th of February about on option a over option b. I think we know my general view on that anyways.
Quote: AZDuffmanWhat Rush did was make the point that women who want to use birth control should pay for it themselves, not expect me to do so. And he is 100% correct on that point... POTUS Santorum or Romney can repeal this nonsense in 2013......
Hey AZDuffman, does it bother you that Santorum voted to give away free free birth control at the taxpayers' expense?
Here's the transcript from his February 16th appearance on Fox News:
GRETA VAN SUSTEREN: "In terms of your views on contraception and your religious beliefs -- and everyone comes to the office of the president with certain religious beliefs -- is it something that would in any way -- you know, be -- would it -- I mean, is there any way it would be imposed on the American people? Or is it something that's -- you know, how would we see it in policy, if at all?"
SANTORUM: "Well, good. I -- you know, just look at my record. I mean, I have been criticized by -- by -- I think it was Governor Romney or maybe it was Congressman Paul's campaign for voting for contraception, that I voted for funding for it, which is -- I think it's -- I think it's Title 10, which is -- which I have voted for in the past, that provides for free contraception through organizations, even like Planned Parenthood. And so, you know, it's funny that on the conservative side, I'm getting ripped for having voted for this."
***
(Earlier in the interview, Santorum said, “I’ve had a consistent record on this of supporting women’s right to have contraception. I’ve supported funding for it.” In 2006, Santorum struck much the same note, saying that “from a governmental point of view I support Title X, I guess it is, and have voted for contraception, although I don’t think it works. I think it’s harmful to women.”)
Quote: thecesspit
Remember in this case, it was about the coverage mandated/given by the college. These aren't always items people have control over. Not everyone has free and easy transfer of movement between work. That said, I would say user pays all coverage could work. If it's cheap and broad enough to cover the majority.
The problem we have today is that we do not have "health insurance" what we have is some kind of "health service plan" that calls itself insurance. Similar to if you buy a service plan for an automobile or appliance and some things are covered and some are not but you want some assurance that your payments will be level in good months and bad.
"Insurance" means coverage for the unexpected loss. Now look at some things "health insurance" covers. Birth control; massages; gym memberships; substance abuse; who knows how many more. The poor guy who just wants hospitalization in case of an accident or serious illness is SOL under what Obama proposes. And not just Obama, most states require all this non-insurance "insurance" to some extent or another.
It is as if you walked onto the car lot wanting a Hyundai to get you back and forth to work and the salesman says, "Sory, AZD, but you can't buy one anymore. IO can offer you a nice BMW 3-Series with 100% maintainence for the first 4 years." At the same time, the government says we all have to buy an "approved" car or be sent to prison for not doing so. Then when so many people cannor afford the "approved" car the government says, "well, cars cost too much, so we will take over the car companies and you all now must take the bus."
Give me freedom, not "free stuff."
Quote: renoHey AZDuffman, does it bother you that Santorum voted to give away free free birth control at the taxpayers' expense?
It doesn't make me happy, though it is nearly impossible to not vote for a bill with at least something you disagree with if you are in the Legislative Branch. (Unless you vote "present" like a certain someone, which means you didn't do anything.)
My "perfect" candidate will never show up. Anyone who has had to hire someone for a job knows you never get all you are looking for. I would never want to be POTUS myself--too much handshaking and photo opps. I'd rarely want to leave the office, I hate to be the center of attention and hate being photographed or video-recorded.
Quote: AZDuffmanThe problem we have today is that we do not have "health insurance" what we have is some kind of "health service plan" that calls itself insurance. Similar to if you buy a service plan for an automobile or appliance and some things are covered and some are not but you want some assurance that your payments will be level in good months and bad.
"Insurance" means coverage for the unexpected loss. Now look at some things "health insurance" covers. Birth control; massages; gym memberships; substance abuse; who knows how many more. The poor guy who just wants hospitalization in case of an accident or serious illness is SOL under what Obama proposes. And not just Obama, most states require all this non-insurance "insurance" to some extent or another.
It is as if you walked onto the car lot wanting a Hyundai to get you back and forth to work and the salesman says, "Sory, AZD, but you can't buy one anymore. IO can offer you a nice BMW 3-Series with 100% maintainence for the first 4 years." At the same time, the government says we all have to buy an "approved" car or be sent to prison for not doing so. Then when so many people cannor afford the "approved" car the government says, "well, cars cost too much, so we will take over the car companies and you all now must take the bus."
Give me freedom, not "free stuff."
You'd be happy to hear, that in Socialist BC, my medical plan I have to pay for does not cover massages, birth control, gym membership. I suspect it does help people recovering from substance abuse, but having seen the lower East Side of Vancouver, not very well. Prescription drugs are partly subsidized. This does mean some of the newer drugs are not available. Standards of basic health care are good. Acute health care is not as good as a comparable level in the states, and Chronic problems range from very well done, to abysmal. Chronic is the real doozy in any system... if you have an existing condition, it's hard to get coverage, and may make it hard for you to work, to earn the money to pay the coverage you may need to deal with long term health issues.
My work's extended health plan does cover massages, sports injuries, glasses, hearing, dental, the first $1200 of drugs, 80% of costs of broken bones (plastic casts and crutches are not free under standard health care) and plenty of other useful and less useful things (depending on your point of view). I can opt out of it if I so choose, but I'm happy enough my dental and optical are sorted, plus I can avail myself of physio work if needed when I inevitably damage myself while running.
It's all why I think the US health care system is crazy messed up, and I'm tending to view that Obama-care has been so badly compromised (by Obama himself as well as others) it's an even worse mess than your current system. Which still manages to deliver very high standards of care in a lot of cases (cancer surivival rates, for instance, are about 3-4% better than in the Great White North, though that gap has closed in the last decade).
Quote: thecesspit
It's all why I think the US health care system is crazy messed up, and I'm tending to view that Obama-care has been so badly compromised (by Obama himself as well as others) it's an even worse mess than your current system. Which still manages to deliver very high standards of care in a lot of cases (cancer surivival rates, for instance, are about 3-4% better than in the Great White North, though that gap has closed in the last decade).
It is "messed up" here because the people who consume the service are rarely the ones paying for it.
Lets imagine a Vegas example. Suppose my employer sends me on a business trip to Vegas and tells me I have $40 to use for food per day. Chop it however I like it is $40. So I might have coffee and a donut for breakfast and hit the buffet at Bellagio for dinner. Or I might just go to the coffee shop and have three normal meals. Or I might eat very light the first two days then hit whatever the nicest steakhouse Wynn has to offer. The latter might require me to add something from my own kick, which I might very well do since I enjoy a really good steak dinner.
Now imagine my employer says I have a $15 per day "food deductible" and after that they will cover the difference up to a pre-determined amount per day, say $100. Under this plan I will have a Bellagio Buffet for dinner and breakfast, then go to Wynn for my steak dinner, and load up all around. I "buy" the food buy my employer pays for it, excepting the deductible.
IOW, the consumer has zero incentive to shop at all. If we enforced some kind of transparancy in pricing, say require providers to put the cost what constitutes 80% of procedures online, people might actually care about the difference. Since most medical care is nonemergency this would work out well with a medical savings account.
Just to give some insight, Planned Parenthood and other organizations provide free or discounted birth control to many women in many different regions in our country. We don't need taxpayer money doing something that is already handled by private companies.
Romney - 447
Santorum - 233
Gringrich - 130
Paul - 46
Huntsmann - 2
Unallocated - 118
Gringrich getting being Santorum would appear to be the best way the right of party could compete against the left of the party right now. But I don't know if the remaining states are more Newt than Rick.
Mississippi seems to have been a tie for all purposes apart from the shouting, with 10 delegates each to the three front runners, and 10 Unallocated. How those filter out, I don't know.
Romney isn't out of it yet, and it could yet require some jockeying with Mitt by one of the two other runners at the end to give them a clean acclimation at the RNC.
President Rick could be just the ticket
Quote: Mitt Romney effectively rules out Rick Santorum as running mateIf Mitt Romney wins the Republican presidential nomination, he'll have many options for a running mate. His current rival, Rick Santorum, probably won't be one of them. Romney said as much Monday when Neil Cavuto asked him on Fox Business if he would choose a candidate to his right in order to win the election. "Well that would preclude, of course, Rick Santorum," Romney said. "Because, I mean, look at his record. I find it interesting that he continues to describe himself as the real conservative. This is the guy who voted against the right to work, this is the guy who voted to fund Planned Parenthood, this is the person who voted to raise the debt ceiling five times. ... It's my way of saying that Rick Santorum is not a person who is an economic conservative, to my right. I'm saying I'm a conservative, I give him credit for being a conservative, but not a fiscal conservative. His record does not suggest he's got the fiscal conservative chops that I have."
I hope that Ron Paul does the decent thing and quits once he is incapable of winning. I also hope that Gingrich will quit before the big set of primaries on 6 June. I think they should give someone a chance at the majority.
I think it is great that the republicans can't come to a consensus, that they think they need to run as far to the right
As possible exposes how out of touch with the mainstream they really are.
Social conservatism is a thinly veiled agenda of divisiveness, bigotry, narrow mindedness and hatred.
I sincerely hope that it costs them the election.
I don't necessarily think Obama has earned the right to be re elected, but he is far more attractive than any of the republican buffoons
Quote: WongBo
Social conservatism is a thinly veiled agenda of divisiveness, bigotry, narrow mindedness and hatred.
Do you prefer the grape or the cherry Kool Aid? Are
you reading right from the Dem talking points list or
do you have it memorized?
I know from first hand experience with assholes like Rick Santorum who was my senator when I lived in PA.
Anti woman, anti gay, anti immigrant, anti minority,
Pro life, pro gun, pro death penalty....most of the civilized world rejects those viewpoints
