Is it time to change the Statler and Waldorf policy?

Quote: Paradigm

Before you change the S&W rule, institute a new rule that strictly enforces the "gaming threads only" purpose of the Forum. Bet your "sticky decisions" here go down exponentially!

Quote: Paradigm

Perhaps not and I took your advice as well and blocked what I wasn't interested in, thanks for that.

But the DT threads are the ones that create 90% of the problems for the Admins around here.

Going 100% gambling has been brought up for years. By a vast majority, those who commented prefer open discussion. There's just so much you can say about gambling, and in between, to keep the site alive, off topic must exist.

As of now, JB and Wiz have given you that very ability. Block everything non gambling. You can right now have what you desire. But I fear your experience will be very quiet.

And I have to giggle at the constant comments about "DT threads". Over there, we have already talked religion, abortion, gun laws (including a very intense discussion immediately following Newtown), politics, terrorism, immigrants,... in fact, I can't think of one "hot button" issue that hasn't already come up. Number of page long spats between members? 0. Number of suspensions over childish behavior? 0. Number of posters leaving in a huff claiming to never return? 0.

Makes one think the problem is not the postings, but the posters.

Quote: Face

Going 100% gambling has been brought up for years. By a vast majority, those who commented prefer open discussion. There's just so much you can say about gambling, and in between, to keep the site alive, off topic must exist.

well put.

I'd also add this: if you talk to people about any particualr subject, you will find you want to know some of them and talk to them about other things as well., and that you want to share other things with these people. Gambling isn't some special sterile realm that admits only gambling discussions and nothign else. Whye else have WoVCons and other meet-ups arranged through this site at all? Not to mention how little gambling actually gets talked about during WoVCon.

Over the first three years of this forum's existence, a community fomred about it. Come DT and in part it split or got quieter. Not to say WoV is ruined, but it's not the community it once was. it got turned largely sterile and impersonal.

Quote:

And I have to giggle at the constant comments about "DT threads". Over there, we have already talked religion, abortion, gun laws (including a very intense discussion immediately following Newtown), politics, terrorism, immigrants,... in fact, I can't think of one "hot button" issue that hasn't already come up. Number of page long spats between members? 0. Number of suspensions over childish behavior? 0. Number of posters leaving in a huff claiming to never return? 0.

Makes one think the problem is not the postings, but the posters.

No. It's all down to there being about 5 active psoters at all.

deleted

Quote: Face

There's just so much you can say about gambling, and in between, to keep the site alive, off topic must exist.

Possibly true, but people can try to add or relate gambling to each and every topic somehow. For instance, the JJ thread was started with blackjack chippies in mind.

What color is your cat and what's your favorite recipe, is kind of dumb and cluttering.

Some people don't even try to talk about gambling. If there is a place set up to talk about dumb absolutely non gambling related kind of stuff, why don't people who want to talk about that stuff, use that place to do it?

Quote: Nareed

No. It's all down to there being about 5 active psoters at all.

You may have a point, but I still think there's more to it. I mean, boymimbo and AZDuffman should have statues erected of themselves. Those two go at it over every single topic. I mean EVERYTHING. And over all these years, not one spat, not one suspension, and I could easily imagine them sharing a beer at WoVCon East. There are many of us that can and do compose ourselves in the same manner. It's really not that hard, and it shouldn't take even more rules and more work for the admins to make it work.

Quote: AxelWolf

Possibly true, but people can try to add or relate gambling to each and every topic somehow. For instance, the JJ thread was started with blackjack chippies in mind.

What color is your cat and what's your favorite recipe, is kind of dumb and cluttering.

Dumb to you, perhaps. And some of these things I find dumb as well. But some enjoy it, and it is of no energy whatsoever for me to prevent myself from clicking on things for which I have no interest.

I'm biased, of course. I am a huge off topic poster. 99% of gaming and gambling is of no interest for me. But while I don't like it, it is my career and I have a wealth of knowledge from the other side of the table. I've added a bit to gaming threads here and there, and have further had conversations in private about same. But if not for off-topic and the discussions therein, I'd likely not visit as there would be nothing here of interest, and my pool of knowledge, albeit small in the grand scheme, would be lost. I suspect others would be the same.

You have all the tools necessary to customize the site as you see fit. You have the power of self to prevent clicking on stuff you don't like. I am completely and utterly unable to understand the problem some of you face =/

Quote: Face

You have all the tools necessary to customize the site as you see fit. You have the power of self to prevent clicking on stuff you don't like. I am completely and utterly unable to understand the problem some of you face =/

Some people are not content with having things their way, they need others not to have things their way also.

deleted

Quote: Face

You may have a point, but I still think there's more to it. I mean, boymimbo and AZDuffman should have statues erected of themselves. Those two go at it over every single topic. I mean EVERYTHING. And over all these years, not one spat, not one suspension, and I could easily imagine them sharing a beer at WoVCon East. There are many of us that can and do compose ourselves in the same manner. It's really not that hard, and it shouldn't take even more rules and more work for the admins to make it work.

Erected statues, ha ha ha (couldn't resist). I did get suspended once, though, for some insult, I forget what. It wasn't at AZ, though.

Mike/Wiz:

It is nice of you to ask before changing the mod standard.

It's good to understand what the house rules may be and what they may change to.

SFB

How can one change their vote?

I voted on page 1, but now that I have read the arguments (and, alas, also the drivel), I'd like to change my vote.

Quote: boymimbo

Erected statues, ha ha ha (couldn't resist). I did get suspended once, though, for some insult, I forget what. It wasn't at AZ, though.

You gave a blanket "Screw you" in frustration over someone (definitely not AZD) who was critical over what was some very in depth research done by yourself. It was a case of "elder members held to a higher standard".

Goes to show how far the bar has fallen. An indirect "screw you" used to warrant a ban for a long time member with zero history of issues. It was a much different place back then.

Quote: Face

You have all the tools necessary to customize the site as you see fit.

What? Nooooooo! I have thousands of ideas still...

We could have this when you come to the board in the setup area:

Select one or more of the below topics. (check box) The ones you select will be the only topics you see. The default is everything (do not activate select feature)

Betting Systems
Craps
Dice Setting
Online Gambling
Poker
Slots
Sports Betting
etc
etc.,

See, custom board. You wouldn't have to see categories you don't like.

maybe someone could take the time to explain to me why you would want to come into a gambling forum and make 99.9999 percent of your posts about non gaming, I mean in all fairness why come in? you can't find somewhere else to take this. For example, there are forums for strippers, if anyone went in there and made a post about obama or religion the would have the post deleted immediately, I 100 percent agree that there should be a subset of off topic that should not clutter our main forum- obviously nareed and some others do not really care what others think- I mean do we really want to get to the point where I post a topic of thoughts not the effects of romaine? I am not asking for anything out of line- this is a gaming forum- if you are not interested in gambling and the like why in the world would you bother coming on here- clearly the wizard recognized this and created a new website dt- however since some of the posters need more attention they felt it did not apply to them and it was ok to just keep posting here

Quote: rxwine

We could have this when you come to the board in the setup area:

Select one or more of the below topics. (check box) The ones you select will be the only topics you see. The default is everything (do not activate select feature)

Betting Systems
Craps
Dice Setting
Online Gambling
Poker
Slots
Sports Betting
etc
etc.,

See, custom board. You wouldn't have to see categories you don't like.

But why saddle JB with even more programming? Why cost Wiz more money to pay JB to do so? Why is any of this even an issue?

Everyone has access to a premier site, one which gives them access to industry insiders, high level AP players, big chip players, frequent fliers and travelers, game protection pros, game production pros, and the brain power to answer or solve any question you may have. This site has further gone to lengths to allow you to customize it exactly the way you want it. It has further employed people on a completely volunteer basis to keep it neat and tidy. It doesn't even have any of those blasted pop up ads to bother your eyes and/or slow your connection. This is all given to you for the low, low price of completely free.

Yet, even giving all that, people still find complaint, still pine for more?

Everyone wants cake. No one wants to make it.

Quote: strictlyAP

maybe someone could take the time to explain to me why you would want to come into a gambling forum and make 99.9999 percent of your posts about non gaming, I mean in all fairness why come in? you can't find somewhere else to take this. For example, there are forums for strippers, if anyone went in there and made a post about obama or religion the would have the post deleted immediately, I 100 percent agree that there should be a subset of off topic that should not clutter our main forum- obviously nareed and some others do not really care what others think- I mean do we really want to get to the point where I post a topic of thoughts not the effects of romaine? I am not asking for anything out of line- this is a gaming forum- if you are not interested in gambling and the like why in the world would you bother coming on here- clearly the wizard recognized this and created a new website dt- however since some of the posters need more attention they felt it did not apply to them and it was ok to just keep posting here

"Now, when I say these are three things you have to accept, I mean you have to accept them. Because if you don't accept them upfront, they'll happen to you anyway. And then you'll end up writing one of those documents that says "Oh, we launched this and we tried it, and then the users came along and did all these weird things. And now we're documenting it so future ages won't make this mistake." Even though you didn't read the thing that was written in 1978.... That's part of the problem that the John Hegel theory of community -- community leads to content, which leads to commerce -- never worked. Because lo and behold, no matter who came onto the Clairol chat boards, they sometimes wanted to talk about things that weren't Clairol products.

""But we paid for this! This is the Clairol site!" Doesn't matter. The users are there for one another. They may be there on hardware and software paid for by you, but the users are there for one another."

Clay Shirky, "A Group is its Own Worst Enemy

Quote: strictlyAP

maybe someone could take the time to explain to me why you would want to come into a gambling forum and make 99.9999 percent of your posts about non gaming, I mean in all fairness why come in? you can't find somewhere else to take this. For example, there are forums for strippers, if anyone went in there and made a post about obama or religion the would have the post deleted immediately, I 100 percent agree that there should be a subset of off topic that should not clutter our main forum- obviously nareed and some others do not really care what others think- I mean do we really want to get to the point where I post a topic of thoughts not the effects of romaine? I am not asking for anything out of line- this is a gaming forum- if you are not interested in gambling and the like why in the world would you bother coming on here- clearly the wizard recognized this and created a new website dt- however since some of the posters need more attention they felt it did not apply to them and it was ok to just keep posting here

It's nice to hear off-topic discussions from a bunch of gamblers. Most specialized forums have an off-topic forum which usually gets a lot of great threads simply because everyone shares the same hobby. 2+2's OT was my mainstay for a few years because I used to play poker.

For the record, the thread that generated the most suspensions was all about one bet.

You may now return to your regularly scheduled topic-drift posting.

Quote: Face

Quote:

See, custom board. You wouldn't have to see categories you don't like.

But why saddle JB with even more programming? Why cost Wiz more money to pay JB to do so? Why is any of this even an issue?

I'd rather make suggestions since people are complaining instead of just complaining. Nobody has to do anything, obviously.

How can I help you?

: )

correct but just like pocket fives it was easily separated

Quote: Buzzard

" “He’s aces — always pleasant, gets along with everyone, everyone likes him,” said one neighbor. “He’s a professional, suit and tie, works lots of hours.”

Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/mob-attorney-punches-man-steakhouse-article-1.1510921#ixzz2tafXPtAc

Reminds me of another lawyer who is Aces !

I didn't see nuthin' or hear nuthin'

Quote: Nareed

For the record, the thread that generated the most suspensions was all about one bet.

Indeed, a bet of personal challenge. And we had a very similar bet in Mission's nuggets, which was also about personal challenge. In both, there was support. There was also a healthy bit of condemnation and judgement. Yet one garnered the record in suspensions, the other went off without a hitch.

Perhaps it is the posters and not the postings? ;)

Quote: strictlyAP

maybe someone could take the time to explain to me why you would want to come into a gambling forum and make 99.9999 percent of your posts about non gaming,

That has not happened here. But I would gladly explain if you first explain why you don't simply block the off--topic thread.

Quote: rxwine

I'd rather make suggestions since people are complaining instead of just complaining. Nobody has to do anything, obviously.

How can I help you?

: )

I know, and it's not a bad idea. I just think some self sufficiency is the order of the day, rather than expecting someone else to spend their resources to fix a problem that you're entirely capable of addressing yourself =)

Quote: Paradigm

Perhaps not and I took your advice as well and blocked what I wasn't interested in, thanks for that.

But the DT threads are the ones that create 90% of the problems for the Admins around here.

And 90%= of the FUN>

I suppose that a post I made yesterday morning over in the Did-you-send-JJ-a-PM? thread might have been the seed that created this S&W poll thread. At the time of yesterday's post, there was discussion about whether the suspension of Roger for a sarcastic barb was justified. I commented that I thought his post met the Statler and Waldorf criterion and noted that forum rules seemed to be changing without announcement.

If my post was, indeed, the reason that the Wizard is asking about making a formal change in the rules, then I suppose I should make some comment here.

I find a lot of bickering/fighting on this forum to be really annoying. I would like to see pleasant behavior all around, and the long-running, train-wreck-drama threads irk me. I even made a suggestion one time that the HB challenge thread should be closed because of the number of people who had been suspended due to comments they made in that thread. I think I likened closing the thread to shutting down a bar where the proprietors are doing everything legally but patrons keep getting shot by other patrons.

On the other hand, I think a forum in which discussions are so restricted that members cannot make teasing jibes at one another would be boring as all get-out.

I voted to keep the Statler and Waldorf policy (and try to encourage the few jerks that tend to stink up this place to refine their behavior just a bit.)

i do not block it because occasionally someone post something in there that is gaming relative, its that plain and simple, and I'm not trying to attack you just curious why if you have zero interest in gaming why you would post here

Quote: strictlyAP

i do not block it because occasionally someone post something in there that is gaming relative, its that plain and simple, and I'm not trying to attack you just curious why if you have zero interest in gaming why you would post here

Check your premises.

i give up, honestly you are the person i stay away from in person and just roll my eyes, have a great life and obviously there is a reason you want to pm me and then not allow pms yourself, you come across as ( completely censored) and ill leave it at that

Quote: aceofspades

I didn't see nuthin' or hear nuthin'

Bruce is 65 years old and his opponent was much younger. I think that why he hit the guy before he could get out of his chair. I mean, if the guy was gonna get up to fight, why let him? My dad worked for the harbormaster and started carrying a gun first time at age 72. Told me it was because it took longer to heal now.I will be 74 in May, almost as strong as ever, but less stamina.
Be interested to see Bruce's defense. I changed in my 50's without even knowing it. I had always been a "hands-on" type of guy. Some
young punk at work made a threatening move towards me. I waved him in with my left hand and he had second thoughts. We settled it amicably.
But as I left work, I became aware that my right hand was sliding across the desk, while my left waved, come on in . And I was trying to decide whether to grab the hole puncher or the stapler to whack him up alongside the head.
Just saying as you grow older, you grow wiser OR NOT !

Quote: strictlyAP

i give up, honestly you are the person i stay away from in person and just roll my eyes, have a great life and obviously there is a reason you want to pm me and then not allow pms yourself, you come across as ( completely censored) and ill leave it at that

I'm not the one making unwarranted assumptions about other people.

Item: I don't have "zero interest in gaming." Seriously, do you think someone who has vacationed in Vegas every year but one for the past 7 and has "zero interest in gaming"?

Item: This is not a 100% gambling forum, nor has it ever been.

Item: I do allow PMs. The bug that prevents a blocked user from sending a PM to the blocker is not my fault.

I am still willing to answer your query, but not if you are going to approach it with the wrong ideas entrenched already.

Quote: AxiomOfChoice

If we are nominating people (seriously), I think that Babs would be a great choice.

I didn't realize that my opinion carried so much weight around here!!! :D

Quote: Nareed

Item: I do allow PMs. The bug that prevents a blocked user from sending a PM to the blocker is not my fault.

That makes no sense if you are replying to his posts and if you know this is the case, why PM him in the first place knowing full well he cannot reply.

Quote: Nareed

I'm not the one making unwarranted assumptions about other people.

Item: I don't have "zero interest in gaming." Seriously, do you think someone who has vacationed in Vegas every year but one for the past 7 and has "zero interest in gaming"?

Item: This is not a 100% gambling forum, nor has it ever been.

Item: I do allow PMs. The bug that prevents a blocked user from sending a PM to the blocker is not my fault.

I am still willing to answer your query, but not if you are going to approach it with the wrong ideas entrenched already.

................. The lady doth protest too much, methinks

I think the non-gambling threads are given life because they have the most amount of disagreement. Clearly, AZ and Beethoven are wrong about ObamaCare and Global Warming, and it can be proven so (so I think, they obviously think differently), and the thread grows because frankly, there are times when there is little going on of interest around here. The same was true of the HB challenge.

A blackjack, craps, or other gambling system can be debunked pretty quickly with math and statistics. New gaming ideas are interesting. Questions about gambling conditions have mostly been answered and probably could be answered with the search function within this site. AP plays have been quelled here in order to stop the casinos personnel who read this site from removing the AP play.

Our longest threads are those with debate, be it a gambling system, Ahigh's back and forth self-wondering about whether Craps could be AP or not, or the contentious issues in the country (ObamaCare, the election, Global Warming, etc).

The shortest threads are those with no interest.

I think DT can and should be given life. I'm over there now.

Quote: Doc

I suppose that a post I made yesterday morning over in the Did-you-send-JJ-a-PM? thread might have been the seed that created this S&W poll thread. At the time of yesterday's post, there was discussion about whether the suspension of Roger for a sarcastic barb was justified. I commented that I thought his post met the Statler and Waldorf criterion and noted that forum rules seemed to be changing without announcement.

If my post was, indeed, the reason that the Wizard is asking about making a formal change in the rules, then I suppose I should make some comment here.

I find a lot of bickering/fighting on this forum to be really annoying. I would like to see pleasant behavior all around, and the long-running, train-wreck-drama threads irk me. I even made a suggestion one time that the HB challenge thread should be closed because of the number of people who had been suspended due to comments they made in that thread. I think I likened closing the thread to shutting down a bar where the proprietors are doing everything legally but patrons keep getting shot by other patrons.

On the other hand, I think a forum in which discussions are so restricted that members cannot make teasing jibes at one another would be boring as all get-out.

I voted to keep the Statler and Waldorf policy (and try to encourage the few jerks that tend to stink up this place to refine their behavior just a bit.)

I sat in my chair, hysterically laughing at this post before I could even finish it. First you compared two people fighting in a thread to a trainwreck and that you find trainwrecks annoying, which I found amusing. Then you intimated that it was legal to support an overweight woman, but preferable to be in a gunfight, so it would be better if neither options were available. At which point I lost control.

I am pleased that as a newcomer here you are able to find such entertainment in this forum. Perhaps your entertainment is enhanced by creative reading. I think that if you re-read my post, you will find that I never compared people fighting to a trainwreck. (I did say that people fighting and train-wreck dramas both annoy/irk me, but that is quite different.) I can't even guess how you came up with the notion that I thought being in a gunfight was preferable to anything, particularly being preferable to providing support to a woman.

I note that you joined this forum less than two weeks ago but imply that you are familiar with some of the discussions that took place here years ago. Is it possible that you participated here some time ago under a different name? There has been a lot of that going around here lately.

For the record, the referenced thread was more of a tire fire than a train wreck.

More like an ambulance, or Aceofspades would not have been chasing it.

Quote: Face

You may have a point, but I still think there's more to it. I mean, boymimbo and AZDuffman should have statues erected of themselves. Those two go at it over every single topic. I mean EVERYTHING. And over all these years, not one spat, not one suspension, and I could easily imagine them sharing a beer at WoVCon East.

Boy, you must hate pigeons. :-)

Quote: Mosca

For the record, the referenced thread was more of a tire fire than a train wreck.

True story, when the big tire fire hit here in 1990 NY Times story here, the two idiot kids that did this ended up at the group home I was working at. They were just typical teenage idiots who thought lighting a fire would be fun, not realizing that burning 14,000,000 tires would have such an impact on the environment.

But I'm off topic, hey hey.

Quote: Doc

On the other hand, I think a forum in which discussions are so restricted that members cannot make teasing jibes at one another would be boring as all get-out.

I think part of the fun of my trip reports are EvenBob's posts rooting against me, including posting photos in an effort to distract me or show his feelings about my wins or losses — although, if I am on full tilt, I do make it known I am not in the mood for his posts — but, as in life, if I want the good, I have to accept the bad

Here's my take:

Why not differentiate between "ex officio" and "upon complaint".

"Ex officio" suspensions would only happen responding to the gravest of offences, while a suspension "upon complaint" would require the alleged insultee to report the infracting post to the moderators - then a strict no insults and no ad hominem policy should apply. No complaint - no action. (There is always the option of warning somebody if a post is close to an ex officio suspension.)

Quote: Canyonero

Here's my take:

Why not differentiate between "ex officio" and "upon complaint".

"Ex officio" suspensions would only happen responding to the gravest of offences, while a suspension "upon complaint" would require the alleged insultee to report the infracting post to the moderators - then a strict no insults and no ad hominem policy should apply. No complaint - no action. (There is always the option of warning somebody if a post is close to an ex officio suspension.)

What you're talking about (and I'm just learning the finer points, so this is my impression only) is very similar to what's happening now as to ex officio. But part of the moderator job is to take the onus off of a complainer and enforce the house rules without the need of a complaint; after all, it's public. If the decision is taken out of the members' hands by a preponderance of the evidence (the post/thread/PM) then that allows a person to stand up for themselves without having to be a "whiner" or "tattler" or whatever. The other part is to try and make an impartial call on both parties' behalf; if someone is offended, that doesn't automatically mean an offense was committed. I think a 2 tier application for "strict no insults and no ad hominem" based on whether the complaint was made would be a very slippery slope if S&W were otherwise in effect, and sort of sets a trap for a poster, though they would have to have said something at least questionable to spring it.

Part of how I can tell the moderation on this board has been so good previously is that most of it occurs without leaving a ripple. The ugly stuff flares every couple of months, but gets taken care of, and considering how much traffic there is, that's a pretty good rate for a forum.

Quote: boymimbo

True story, when the big tire fire hit here in 1990 NY Times story here, the two idiot kids that did this ended up at the group home I was working at. They were just typical teenage idiots who thought lighting a fire would be fun, not realizing that burning 14,000,000 tires would have such an impact on the environment.

But I'm off topic, hey hey.

When we were teenagers in the early '70s, a couple of my friends went down to one of the old coal mines in southern Allegheny County. They filled a hole with trash and paper, and poured gasoline in it and ran away.

It is still smoldering.

Riiight... and your Linda-Lovelace-obsessed friend witnessed Watergate, too, I'm sure.

Quote: strictlyAP

i do not block it because occasionally someone post something in there that is gaming relative, its that plain and simple,

I'll let you in on a secret: 99.999% of all threads in the off-topic area will be about off-topic subjects. If you don't want to see that, you should block it. If you don't want to block it in the off-off-off-chance you might miss something that's not actually off-topic, then accept the trade-off you chose to make and have the dencency not to complain about every single off-topic thread psoted to the off-topic area.

Quote:

and I'm not trying to attack you just curious why if you have zero interest in gaming why you would post here

I ask again: do you think I would vacation in Vegas every year if I had zero interest in gaming? Check your premises. Furhter, do you think I would read a site called the Wizard of Odds, then follow that into a message board, if I had zero interest in gaming? Really, you need to check your premises. Contradictions do not exist, you know.

I'm just not fanatical nor deeply interested in gaming. it's something I do for an extended period of time once a year. It's relaxing and thrilling at the same time, I like it, I enjoy it, it helps me bleed off a lot of stress and frustration accumulated over the rest of the tyear, and best of all I can afford it.

My interest in gaming is how to best employ my gaming money at games I enjoy. This does not mean AP, which carries a lot of philosophical and moral issues, and it does not mean only playing the absolute lowest-edge game I can find whether I enjoy it or not. Thus no BJ of any kind (I don't like it), nor slot machines, nor many other things. It also means knowing which VP to play, where, and most important how, finding out about new games, finding out the cost of such games, etc.

I posted more about gambling five years ago when the board first opened. I've learned most of what I want and need, though sometimes I can apply that to other areas (I'm considering a very exact analogy of VP as an application of the Moral Luck problem, for example). But over the course of posting about VP, craps, and even BJ believe it or not, one comes to know a bit, a tiny bit, about the other people here. Then I want to get to know some of them better. then I want to share things with them, openly and haphazzardly, perhaps. Things like history and my love of it, my very unexpected (to me) knack for cooking and how much I enjoy it, the latest sceince fiction book I've read, and so on. Others feel exactly the same, or want the same things, so they post here on other topics as well.

This was also the one community I moved in at the time I basically solved my gender issues where I felt confortable coming out. And that means a great deal to me. WoV will always have a special place in my heart just for that, and for how many people here responded, and how nice some were to me when meeting me in person at WoVCon ][ and ]I[.

To term WoV a mere "gambling board" si to dimminish it and to trivialize its most valuable aspects, even if those aspects rankle the committed APs who want a pure, sterile space.

Does that answer your question?

Quote: Nareed

I'll let you in on a secret: 99.999% of all threads in the off-topic area will be about off-topic subjects. If you don't want to see that, you should block it. If you don't want to block it in the off-off-off-chance you might miss something that's not actually off-topic, then accept the trade-off ?

No one should have to make that a trade off.

Personally I don't care if its a 100% gambling and math forum or not, I can live in both worlds. Less talk about gambling is probably a benefit to me and good things will last longer.

I still don't understand why Threads started that have NOTHING to do with any type of math, Vegas, casinos, gambling cant be done at that other site you guys talk about. Its one thing getting off topic and Moving in other directions, one can simply bow out and move on. But, if people intentionally/or not, start topics that lead others to believe it has to do with gambling. Its a bitch to click an ditch after having to read the first post.

Once again talking about dogs and cooking have no place on this site like this IMO. Its not my site, so I have no say.

I do have a feeling Mike dose want less NON related gambling topics. So if you respect him, respect that. If not, keep on keeping on. TBH, I think I have started a few non related gambling topics, Did you PM JJ poll is the only one I can think of.

Quote: Nareed

I posted more about gambling five years ago when the board first opened. I've learned most of what I want and need, though sometimes I can apply that to other areas (I'm considering a very exact analogy of VP as an application of the Moral Luck problem, for example). But over the course of posting about VP, craps, and even BJ believe it or not, one comes to know a bit, a tiny bit, about the other people here. Then I want to get to know some of them better. then I want to share things with them, openly and haphazzardly, perhaps. Things like history and my love of it, my very unexpected (to me) knack for cooking and how much I enjoy it, the latest sceince fiction book I've read, and so on. Others feel exactly the same, or want the same things, so they post here on other topics as well.

This was also the one community I moved in at the time I basically solved my gender issues where I felt confortable coming out. And that means a great deal to me. WoV will always have a special place in my heart just for that, and for how many people here responded, and how nice some were to me when meeting me in person at WoVCon ][ and ]I[.

To term WoV a mere "gambling board" si to dimminish it and to trivialize its most valuable aspects, even if those aspects rankle the committed APs who want a pure, sterile space.

So beautifully put, I wish I had wrote it myself =)

I, too, came here for gaming. Being a fresh faced casino employee, I needed knowledge, and needed it fast. WoO and WoV gave me everything I needed and more, and like most everyone here, I established relationships with people. While new gaming knowledge is slow to come and often fades to zero, those relationships remain.

And just like Nareed's "coming out", I too have put myself out there. My entire divorce is completely cataloged somewhere around page 40 of the Recent Threads list. A certain member was there for me and took the time to contact me when my g/f was diagnosed with a brain tumor. Several more have been invited into my town and into my personal life by way of my DT threads, all of which caused us to bond and become more than just "internet strangers" on a mere "gambling board".

So we talk. If something is about gaming and "in my wheelhouse", so to speak, I'll hop in and offer anything I can. But gambling is not my thing, and questions about things I consider myself learned in are few and far between. So in the meantime, we talk. Fishing, cooking, the nature of infinity, how ghey a Miata is, whether counting should start at "0" or "1", what .999... really means, what happens if you drill a hole through the Earth, who can best pick NFL games, and how much we all wish the Patriots plane would just crash already. We talk.

And it's a beautiful thing =)

Dam I cant even Finnish typing something before me or someone gets suspended. Ouch! if you suspend JJ and we will have no Women left other then BBB, But she dose not count since she has turned to the dark side;)

The "community" of WoV only exists because of the "off-topic" stuff.

Sorry, you can only grouse about your gambling losses for so long...

And, for that matter, only one thing for too long.

There are ALOT of members here for a lot of different reasons., I like to play Craps, I want to learn how to play better, learn stick calls when I play at home, and how to make payouts simpler so that I don't look stupid in front of my friends.

And Face pointed out, some folks here were a real help with his Divorce and his G/F's illness.

*I* however, am *not* a member of the community. *I* come and go and post and read when I can. I am that guy at the other end of table who buys in for $100 and then sevens out and busts quickly. Nobody really notices as the game continues. But the dealers (mods) and boxman (Wiz) will be here tomorrow and the next day. The regulars come around and ask about the weather, and the *others* like me, drop in, shoot a little and then move on till we can return again.

Its not about a sterile gambling site. Its not about the times that suspensions may fly for whatever reason. Its about folks being comfortable finding what they need when they drop by....

SFB