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NowTheSerpent
NowTheSerpent
Joined: Sep 30, 2011
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June 1st, 2012 at 7:04:08 AM permalink
Quote: Paigowdan

It is hard as hell - and a REALLY long road - to get a game out from a cocktail napkin sketch to the casino floor. Everybody makes sacrifies. Every game designer needs to know it is not for the faint-hearted or the dreamer, and usually, more than often, ends in failure. But, you shouldn't have missed it for the world, and with NO regrets for trying and as getting as far as you did. Without such projects, many would have been vegetating in front of a late-night HBO movie eating Dorito's if not better distracted with this personal game design mission, so such an endeavor if not successful, it is still successful in many ways. My wife used to think I was f*cking nuts. Now she knows better and goes shopping. And it took YEARS!



This sounds like the stuff of a new cinema verite reality series for A&E. Seriously.
Paradigm
Paradigm
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June 7th, 2012 at 1:36:15 PM permalink
Looking forward to hearing about the upcoming SHFL focus group happening next Tuesday. All the participants should be excited about the opportunity to get knowledgeable feedback on your creation.

Spend time thinking of questions you would like to ask the group of participants regardless of how the game scores. What do you want to know about your game from industry professionals that have just played your game for the first time? What do they think is strong about your game? What are it's weaknesses?

My guess is that Roger will allow you just a few precious minutes to ask the group questions.....to me this is the most important part of the day for participants so be prepared with what you want to get answered in that limited window of time.

There will be very few opportunities where you are able to demonstrate your game to complete strangers with industry knowledge and are not also trying to sell them on installing the game. Take full advantage of it!
DJTeddyBear
DJTeddyBear
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June 7th, 2012 at 1:43:54 PM permalink
Ding, ding, ding!!!!

Paradigm has given you nuggets of pure wisdom right there.

Do not focus on the numeric score - even if you score the highest.

And certainly don't focus on the score if you scored the lowest.

As the person who got that bottom of the barrel score last time, I can tell you it was momentarily disheartening. But hearing the reasons for those low scores was fantastic.

It's like I've been telling family and friends who ask: They liked it well enough to tell me why they hate it. But now I can fix it.

And fix it is what I've been doing. Look for an announcement of my new version and updated website in a few days.
I invented a few casino games. Info: http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ 覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧 Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
buzzpaff
buzzpaff
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June 7th, 2012 at 2:54:53 PM permalink
I think the only thing worse than my performance at Focus 1 was the feedback session at same.

FEEDBACK : The return of information about the result of a process or activity; an evaluative response:

The point system was like most points system. More indicative of failure than success . A student who scores well
on tests in school may not succeed in that field, but F's usually indicate a student does not have a basic knowledge
of the subject.

Feedback is invaluable in that often the scores are not really good indicators. How else to explain a game of Switch's
only scoring 25 points above my abysmal -20 and Money Suit 31 actually scoring 10 points below me ? And both of
those games are already in casinos.

The evaluators, those who remained , were asked about the 14 games they has played for 5 minutes each in the preceding
hour and a half. Twiice Roger had to remind them of the scores and insist they had to say something about the game in
fairness to the inventors. Not exactly the perfect way to solicit feedback.

When feedback was given it was usually only by 2 or 3 people, often the same 2 or 3. I know Roger is a great inventor, sharp
as a tack, etc. And his input was invaluable. But still, all in all, the feedback process sucked !

I congratulate Roger on his new format of 20 minutes this time and only 6 games presented. It is always easy to criticize or spend
someone else's money. But I have attended 30-40 focus groups in Denver. Any where from Stouffer's Lasagna to Shingle Shots.

At almost all of those I was asked to fill out a feedback form at the conclusion, rating the product, label price, etc. Would be nice
if the evaluators in the future were to be given 5 minutes to fill out a form immediately after playing a game. One of those generic
LIKED MOST >>> LIKED LEAST etc. About various subjects like Rules Easy To Understand, I Would Play This Game, Etc.

Ok Mr Lubin Fire when ready !
DJTeddyBear
DJTeddyBear
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June 7th, 2012 at 5:18:00 PM permalink
Buzz -

Maybe the feedback format was bad (in your eyes) because you've participated in a variety of consumer product tests and Roger probably hasn't, and/or Roger has had success with the format in the past, and/or it's hard to compare a casino game focus group to a consumer product focus group.

On the other hand, considering how we were told that the valuators are all intelligent casino employees who really know what gamblers want, I agree that they should have been able to provide better feedback.

For the record, I believe the best feedback I got was when I spent an hour with Roger, two days after the event.

On that note, I suggest all the participants in the event next week, do just that. Make an appointment now to meet with Roger before you leave town. Do it!

In the meeting I had, not only did Roger give me great info and guidance, but he was (contrary to what some people might expect) very hospitable and gentlemanly.

And he even showed me a game that wasn't part of the focus group. It's friggin' fantastic, but he swore me to secrecy.
(Hey Roger! Is it OK to talk about that yet?)
I invented a few casino games. Info: http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ 覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧 Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
buzzpaff
buzzpaff
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June 7th, 2012 at 5:54:09 PM permalink
" For the record, I believe the best feedback I got was when I spent an hour with Roger, two days after the event."

I agree but I also know how valuable Roger's time is. I did not take him up on his generous offer of a 30 minute phone call.

Actually I emailed him my own feedback of my game and my performance.

If anybody needs a laugh I will post it here. Free prime rib dinners come and go, but even Roger's clock only has 24 hours in a day !
Paigowdan
Paigowdan
Joined: Apr 28, 2010
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June 7th, 2012 at 6:11:04 PM permalink
Quote: buzzpaff

" For the record, I believe the best feedback I got was when I spent an hour with Roger, two days after the event."

I agree but I also know how valuable Roger's time is. I did not take him up on his generous offer of a 30 minute phone call.

Actually I emailed him my own feedback of my game and my performance.

If anybody needs a laugh I will post it here. Free prime rib dinners come and go, but even Roger's clock only has 24 hours in a day !



I think what Buzz is saying is that that the feedback loop for the inventors could have been better for the session. I am looking forward to a longer session with the players, so that I have time to ask questions. After dealing the third hand last time, I had like 20 seconds, or something too short. One comment was a gem, and it made for changes on a game.
Beware of all enterprises that require new clothes - Henry David Thoreau. Like Dealers' uniforms - Dan.
buzzpaff
buzzpaff
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June 7th, 2012 at 6:19:39 PM permalink
Exactly what i meant. Just think if 15 evaluators has filled out a card, with space for best feature, least liked, etc.
What a great value that would have added to the process !!

Damn, Dan Lubin agreed with me. Least I can do is post my feedback on my game here. LOL



Hi Roger
Thought I would save you some time and do my own feedback. You can verify how accurate it is with the DEPUTY assigned to my table.

1st 10 minutes :
Buzz rambled on for 4 or 5 minutes and was all over the place with rules, HE, history etc. The only thing worse than his pitch,
was his attempting to deal pitch BJ. The only positive thing was all the cards remained on the table.

2nd 10 minutes
Buzz cut his pitch to 2 minutes and almost explained the rules, almost. The DEPUTY suggested Buzz deal a face up game
and again no cards hit the floor, but several did wind up under the place mat. He did such a poor job of explaining the rules,
one evaluator asked about the push 22 rule on the felt.

3rd 10 minutes
Buzz would have given those minutes to moneysuit31 had he the opportunity. He got the rules in this time as the Deputy asked
if his game could be played multi-deck. The previous session Buzz had dealt a pair of aces to a player but the other two aces
were exposed. So much for the WOW factor of split aces. On the next to last round, Buzz finally noticed that most of the dealers
had bet $10 on each hand, as is usual in a lot of casinos if you play more than one hand at a table minimum. Buzz dealt one
more hand, then asked the DEPUTY " Please tell me I only have 14 seconds left " The deputy said " You have 40 seconds"and
Buzz cheerfully said " Close enough ". He would have said that if the DEPUTY had said 2 minutes and 40 seconds.

If you get a chance check with the Deputy and let me know if I missed anything.

Thanks for a GREAT learning experience,
Buzz
buzzpaff
buzzpaff
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June 8th, 2012 at 7:06:12 AM permalink
I was sorta looking forward to Evevbob's comment on my feedback. Guess that won't be happening for a while !
Pacman
Pacman
Joined: Dec 7, 2011
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June 8th, 2012 at 7:41:07 AM permalink
Quote: DJTeddyBear

And he even showed me a game that wasn't part of the focus group. It's friggin' fantastic, but he swore me to secrecy.
(Hey Roger! Is it OK to talk about that yet?)


Yes.

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