Deuces Wild Strategy Question
Quote: mechmat12345I do not understand the strategy chart on wizardofodds.com when you have 3 deuces. What does,"Non-pair discarded," and "Pair 9 or less discarded mean?" I really don't understand what I am supposed to do with anything but a Royal.
my first suggestion is to be sure you are using this , it is more newbie friendly
also, realize what is above trumps what is below.
Quote: mechmat12345I do not understand the strategy chart on wizardofodds.com when you have 3 deuces. What does,"Non-pair discarded," and "Pair 9 or less discarded mean?" I really don't understand what I am supposed to do with anything but a Royal.
I agree that you should be starting with the simple strategy. You are confused by a penalty card situation, which beginners always have a hard time understanding.
The question at hand is what is better, three deuces or a pat five of a kind? It is a close play, and depends on what kind of five of a kind it is. I know they all pay 15x in full pay deuces wild, but the value of three deuces is affected by what you throw away. If the five of a kind is tens or higher (lets say jacks), then if you throw out the jacks then it becomes harder to form a wild royal with the three deuces. You would never get one in the two suits of the pair of jacks. That is enough to lower the value of the three deuces below 15x.
Quote: mechmat12345I do not understand the strategy chart on wizardofodds.com when you have 3 deuces. What does,"Non-pair discarded," and "Pair 9 or less discarded mean?" I really don't understand what I am supposed to do with anything but a Royal.
"Non-pair discarded," - Keep the deuces and discard the other two cards if they are not a pair.
"Pair 9 or less discarded mean?" - Keep the deuces, and discard the other two cards unless they are 10/10, jack/jack, queen/queen, king/king, or ace/ace.
Quote: WizardIf the five of a kind is tens or higher (lets say jacks), then if you throw out the jacks then it becomes harder to form a wild royal with the three deuces. You would never get one in the two suits of the pair of jacks. That is enough to lower the value of the three deuces below 15x.
Wizard,
I rely on your calculations tremendously in my video poker play. However, I believe you made an incorrect statement here. You can still pull a Wild RF in the discarded Jack suits when dealt 3 deuces. All you'd need to draw are two of the 10-Q-K-A in the same suit, you don't need a Jack with the wild cards. I agree the odds of pulling the Wild RF in the discarded suit are longer, but obviously not "never".
Quote: damule56... I believe you made an incorrect statement here. You can still pull a Wild RF in the discarded Jack suits when dealt 3 deuces. All you'd need to draw are two of the 10-Q-K-A in the same suit, you don't need a Jack with the wild cards. I agree the odds of pulling the Wild RF in the discarded suit are longer, but obviously not "never".
Strictly speaking, it is correct to say you cannot get a royal flush keeping "two suits" and then drawing. I don't believe the Wizard meant to suggest keeping the 5 of a kind with Jacks.
This is certainly a non-intuitive area for Deuces Wild.
Compare the two instructions. The instruction is to keep 3 wild cards and discard all else except made royal flush [wild] in the 'simple set' of strategy, without mentioning the closely valuable kept 5 of a kind. In the non-simple, it spells out that you are actually to discard made 5 of a kind, which is non-intuitive in the extreme!
from the 'non-simple':
"3 deuces only, non-pair discarded (15.059204)"
"3 deuces only, pair 9 or less discarded (15.057354)"
both instances trump keeping 5 of a kind made with 3 deuces:
"5 of a kind (15.0000)"
The one thing you never do is discard deuces. Hopefully I have this right!
Simple
Non-simple
4 of a kind pays 5
Straight Flush pays 9
5 of a kind pays 15
Wild Royal pays 25
4 deuces pays 200
You have 5 of a kind with a pair of Jacks.
If you keep it, you win 15.
If you toss the pair, you get the following EV:
4D = 46/1081 x 200 = 8.51
WR = 32/1081 x 25 = 0.74
5K = 67/1081 x 15 = 0.93
SF = 118/1081 x 9 = 0.98
4K = 818/1081 x 5 = 3.78
Total = 14.94
When you throw away a pair in the royal category, the number of royal flush combinations drop.
If you tossed a pair of say, 8s in stead, you would have 40 ways for a wild royal instead of 32, with an EV on the Wild Royal of 0.925, while the EV on the SF drops from .98 to .916.
This brings the expected value of tossing two 8s from 14.94 to 15.06 which makes the rationale for the decision.
I think the Wizard is saying, correctly, that you "would never get one of the two suits of the pair of jacks". He didn't say that you would never get a Wild Royal, just that it becomes harder.
When you are playing a more frequent pay table where the 4 of a Kind pays only 4, always keep the 5 of a Kind.
