RealizeGaming
RealizeGaming
Joined: Aug 1, 2013
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June 12th, 2020 at 2:21:35 PM permalink
Hey everyone.

We are back working on a new Trade N' Place version. In this version we are only concentrating on playing the horizontal lines instead of our previous versions where we used both the horizontal and vertical pay lines.

We have included the special tools in the lower button on the right hand side where you can simulate a number of games, use the auto picker, etc.

Our main concern right now is trying to find a good pay scale. For the wager right now we have it set to 5 credits per hand for a total of 15. We can easily double this to allow for the "power" of the trade card to take the total wager to 30 credits, but if we do this we would really like the payouts to be entertaining for the player. We will also be removing the 3x and 2x royal as we progress through this current build.

As always, any help is greatly appreciated.

Demo: https://www.realizegamingllc.com/dev/tradeNPlace3x1/

Mission146
Mission146
Joined: May 15, 2012
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June 12th, 2020 at 3:12:02 PM permalink
Quote: RealizeGaming

Hey everyone.

We are back working on a new Trade N' Place version. In this version we are only concentrating on playing the horizontal lines instead of our previous versions where we used both the horizontal and vertical pay lines.

We have included the special tools in the lower button on the right hand side where you can simulate a number of games, use the auto picker, etc.

Our main concern right now is trying to find a good pay scale. For the wager right now we have it set to 5 credits per hand for a total of 15. We can easily double this to allow for the "power" of the trade card to take the total wager to 30 credits, but if we do this we would really like the payouts to be entertaining for the player. We will also be removing the 3x and 2x royal as we progress through this current build.

As always, any help is greatly appreciated.

Demo: https://www.realizegamingllc.com/dev/tradeNPlace3x1/



I apologize, but I do not have a favorable opinion of this game. You're a very nice guy and I enjoy many of your games, so I hate saying that.

Most wins are substantially less than the amount bet. If I wanted that, I would play a slot machine and it would undoubtedly be more fun. I actually have to take my time and think about what I'm doing to lose anyway. Also, the paytable is horrendous. The game would be more engaging if three results did not pay the same amount.

I actually hated even the concept, at first, but after playing thirty or forty hands decided the underlying concept is basically tolerable. I think most people are just going to be so confused by the game, at first, that they won't last long enough to give it 30-40 hands' chance. I assume this would compete with video poker, but I consider it way too much of a departure. People at least understand the underlying mechanics of video poker...and they don't change much---make the best five-card hand.

The house edge is going to need to be absolutely disgusting for a pseudo video poker game, because it's not even going to be able to be played at half the speed.

I also think there's going to be a pretty big potential for unintentional mistakes just because of how many steps there are, that'll tick some people off.
Vultures can't be choosers.
SOOPOO
SOOPOO
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RealizeGaming
June 12th, 2020 at 4:32:23 PM permalink
Played 75 rounds. Was up so RTP was over 150%. Maybe I was on the good side of variance, but had one short royal, multiple straight flushes and 3 of a kinds. Maybe I liked it because it seemed like easy money.

I do agree with Grumpy Mission that winning 20% of your bet back is an unpleasant result, maybe moreso than losing your entire bet, if that can make sense to you.

If anyone is confused by the game they shouldn't be in a casino, let alone be allowed to hold a job down. With the current paytable you basically go for a short royal at all costs, if not possible then try for a straight flush. Not really complicated. If a 3 of a K is obvious to make, then make it!

I liked the MORE complicated version of horizontal and vertical.
gordonm888
gordonm888 
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June 12th, 2020 at 5:36:24 PM permalink
I like this new version and the new paytable, and I personally think the compromise of "horizontal only" is just fine, The game still has lots of complexity.

1. The graphical layout of the 3x3 matrix has spaces between the columns and no spaces between the rows. This tends to draw my eye towards looking at the columns in the matrix rather than the rows. You might want to experiment with this.

2. I have no problem with routinely winning 3,6 or 9 units on the 15 unit wager.. The big wins, Trips and SF, come along often enough and the high pairs, straights and flushes feel like they are important to slow the bleeding. Players will need to recognize pairs, straights and flushes are an important part of the players equity and fight hard for them.

3. 15 M for three short royals?! Wow, that might be an issue for any casino -internet or land-based. Variance can be a bitch. BTW, your game statistics uses 5 M for the 3X Short Royal whilst your payout table uses 15 M.
So many better men, a few of them friends, were dead. And a thousand thousand slimy things lived on, and so did I.
ksdjdj
ksdjdj
Joined: Oct 20, 2013
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RealizeGaming
June 12th, 2020 at 5:46:50 PM permalink
Quote: RealizeGaming

(snip)We will also be removing the 3x and 2x royal as we progress through this current build.
(snip)


Quote: gordonm888

I like this new version and the new paytable, and I personally think the compromise of "horizontal only" is just fine, The game still has lots of complexity.

1. The graphical layout of the 3x3 matrix has spaces between the columns and no spaces between the rows. This tends to draw my eye towards looking at the columns in the matrix rather than the rows. You might want to experiment with this.

2. I have no problem with routinely winning 3,6 or 9 units on the 15 unit wager.. The big wins, Trips and SF, come along often enough and the high pairs, straights and flushes feel like they are important to slow the bleeding. Players will need to recognize pairs, straights and flushes are an important part of the players equity and fight hard for them.

3. 15 M for three short royals?! Wow, that might be an issue for any casino -internet or land-based. Variance can be a bitch. BTW, your game statistics uses 5 M for the 3X Short Royal whilst your payout table uses 15 M.


I agree with all of your post, but I think they may be getting rid of the "3x short royal" (and "2x short royal")
RealizeGaming
RealizeGaming
Joined: Aug 1, 2013
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Mission146
June 14th, 2020 at 5:49:02 AM permalink
Mission146, no need to feel bad about expressing your thoughts. I appreciate hearing what you think and value your thoughts even if it is not in agreement with my game, so never feel bad about telling me exactly what you think.

Ideally, I would like to go back to this type of pay scale for the game:
Straight Flush 40 to 1
Three of a Kind 30 to 1
Straight 6 to 1
Flush 4 to 1
Pair 1 to 1

If we could somehow get close to this, it would have that three card poker feel with the addition of using the trade card. I think this would really help the appeal of the game. I would also like to experiment with a 30 credit wager for the game because it would provide us with more flexibility on the pay scale and it allows us to have the trade card appear quite often.
RealizeGaming
RealizeGaming
Joined: Aug 1, 2013
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June 14th, 2020 at 6:00:19 AM permalink
Quote: gordonm888

I like this new version and the new paytable, and I personally think the compromise of "horizontal only" is just fine, The game still has lots of complexity.

1. The graphical layout of the 3x3 matrix has spaces between the columns and no spaces between the rows. This tends to draw my eye towards looking at the columns in the matrix rather than the rows. You might want to experiment with this.

2. I have no problem with routinely winning 3,6 or 9 units on the 15 unit wager.. The big wins, Trips and SF, come along often enough and the high pairs, straights and flushes feel like they are important to slow the bleeding. Players will need to recognize pairs, straights and flushes are an important part of the players equity and fight hard for them.

3. 15 M for three short royals?! Wow, that might be an issue for any casino -internet or land-based. Variance can be a bitch. BTW, your game statistics uses 5 M for the 3X Short Royal whilst your payout table uses 15 M.



Gordonm888,

1. Thanks. I wish we would have started with this version since I have a hard time looking at just the horizontal lines after using both horizontal and vertical lines in the previous version. This version should make it easier to understand and play the game.

2. I also don't mind getting paid a lower amount for some hands...at least I'm getting some of my money back. I would like to adjust the pays so that they are different. Maybe a 5 for a straight, 3 for a flush, and 2 for a high pair. This difference may help when playing the game because it gives a definite order for the values of each hand.

3. If I remember correctly, we only were able to get few 2x royals in our 2 billion simulations and the 3x royal may not have appeared at all. We will be removing them at some point and may replace them with a four of a kind bonus.

We will be back with an update later this week.
RealizeGaming
RealizeGaming
Joined: Aug 1, 2013
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June 16th, 2020 at 6:35:48 AM permalink
We've updated the pay table and we know we will need to change it again, but here is our current version.

A few things so far:
1. I like the variance of pays between the high pair, flush, and straight.

2. Our RTP is way too high. We've talked about changing changing the straight flush to 100 and the 3 of a kind to 75. I'm not sure where that will put us, but we will test it to find out.

3. Our current appearance of the trade card is around 80%. Should we adjust that to a lower setting to keep a higher pay scale or keep the card appearance how it is right now and maybe offer 2 place cards if no trade card appears?

Any other observations or suggestions are appreciated.

Demo: https://www.realizegamingllc.com/dev/tradeNPlace3x1/

SOOPOO
SOOPOO
Joined: Aug 8, 2010
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June 16th, 2020 at 6:53:27 AM permalink
Quote: RealizeGaming

We've updated the pay table and we know we will need to change it again, but here is our current version.

A few things so far:
1. I like the variance of pays between the high pair, flush, and straight.

2. Our RTP is way too high. We've talked about changing changing the straight flush to 100 and the 3 of a kind to 75. I'm not sure where that will put us, but we will test it to find out.

3. Our current appearance of the trade card is around 80%. Should we adjust that to a lower setting to keep a higher pay scale or keep the card appearance how it is right now and maybe offer 2 place cards if no trade card appears?

Any other observations or suggestions are appreciated.

Demo: https://www.realizegamingllc.com/dev/tradeNPlace3x1/



I played 40 rounds. RTP 540%. I mean this without malice.... how can you have a 'math' guy devise such a paytable? I mean, you are not even in the same ballpark, same city, or same state! Wouldn't the guy proposing a paytable have to at least do 5 minutes of checking before he gives it to you?
RealizeGaming
RealizeGaming
Joined: Aug 1, 2013
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June 16th, 2020 at 7:03:33 AM permalink
We usually work backwards when building our games. We have an idea of how we want the game to play and then we adjust it as needed to make sure the math fits. In this particular game we are trying to keep the pay scale similar to three card poker, but the addition of the trade card is extremely powerful, as we are finding out.

The picture from above is the simulator results from the game after 1000 hands. Once we adjust the RTP to a desirable number, we then simulate it a billion times to give us an even more accurate result. That is how we eventually get our RTP for each game.

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