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AxelWolf
AxelWolf
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Forager
September 2nd, 2019 at 11:38:08 AM permalink
Quote: billryan

It's how people lose money. If you were to play 100 spins on a really bad 100 play video poker machine at $5 a pop, you'd cash out much more than $300 90% of the time, maybe 95%.
I value free play at about 85%, and would certainly pay more than 60% for any in amounts that make it worth my while.

GO AWAY BILL!!!
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
odiousgambit
odiousgambit
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September 2nd, 2019 at 12:08:20 PM permalink
I am not an expert on this, and get a headache real quick trying to look into it when I do. The smartest way to play, which is certainly not the same thing as the safest way to play. By safe I mean being sure to get "something" . This means almost everybody does it wrong [I believe]

The $500 in freeplay, if not restricted to even money bets, is worth many, many multiples of $500, or I am greatly mistaken. ........... editing this, I was mistaken

However, there is risk of not getting anything but your money back, but there is no risk of losing money. This last bit I believe is the key factor to grasp.

[edit: forget that quote]

If not restricted, the smartest way to play means the value of the $500 is close to 100%

For example, playing one number in 00 roulette for the full amount, the value is the odds of hitting that number times $500, minus the odds of losing times $500. But note that the odds of losing are zero.

thus, [$500 * 35] * [1/38] -0 = $460.52
460.52/500 = 92%

500 * 35 * 1/37 -0 = 472.97
472.97/500 = 94.6% for single zero roulette

I have asked the Wizard to delve into this on such things as his live you-tube videos, but he never does. I actually wonder if it is considered best that nearly everyone does it wrong from the perspective of certain wolfish APs etc.
Last edited by: odiousgambit on Sep 2, 2019
the next time Dame Fortune toys with your heart, your soul and your wallet, raise your glass and praise her thus: “Thanks for nothing, you cold-hearted, evil, damnable, nefarious, low-life, malicious monster from Hell!” She is, after all, stone deaf. ... Arnold Snyder
darkoz
darkoz
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September 2nd, 2019 at 12:20:28 PM permalink
Quote: AxelWolf

You would sell your $500 in free play for around $300?

I would have to think about it, sounds a little steep for the buyer to me, however, let me know if you ever find yourself with a bunch of free play you are looking to sell. It might be very generous of me, but, I think I might be able to do about 67% of face value. That's only because I like you. I just hope you would really appreciate just how generous that would be of me. It really breaks my heart to see a fellow gambler stuck with free play that's holding him back from his favorite table games. #BIGHEARTAXELWOLF



For AP's I agree. Thats overpriced.

But not for ploppies.

Consider the Sands bus hustlers sell their $45 freeplay for $40.
For Whom the bus tolls; The bus tolls for thee
Lovecomps
Lovecomps
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September 2nd, 2019 at 1:46:46 PM permalink
Clarify something for me. Did you win $500 worth of machine play, one time bet chips, or play until you lose them chips?

It you have either version of promotional chips I'd play craps with a partner, offset, and turn it into $500 real money minus the occasional 12.

If it was just machine play then I'd give the whole thing to my wife and let her enjoy it.
The best things in life are not free.
beachbumbabs
Administrator
beachbumbabs
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September 2nd, 2019 at 3:52:21 PM permalink
I'm assuming it was machine play only. I would have done exactly what you did, coin through 1 time on the best paytable VP you knew how to play. I think 800 cash on 500 fp is a very nice return. Congrats.
If the House lost every hand, they wouldn't deal the game.
AxelWolf
AxelWolf
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September 2nd, 2019 at 5:37:50 PM permalink
Quote: darkoz

For AP's I agree. Thats overpriced.

.

The bus fumes must be a record high's today.

That was pretty much a joke of an offerI was making. Under right cucustances I would pay 99.5% of face value for free play. I have no idea why you( TMFWSAPOTEC) agree that's too high of an offer for an AP? Facepalm*
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
darkoz
darkoz
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September 2nd, 2019 at 6:07:52 PM permalink
Quote: AxelWolf

The bus fumes must be a record high's today.

That was pretty much a joke of an offerI was making. Under right cucustances I would pay 99.5% of face value for free play. I have no idea why you( TMFWSAPOTEC) agree that's too high of an offer for an AP? Facepalm*



"Under the right circumstances" is a pretty big disclaimer.

Under general circumstances I wouldn't pay more than 50% face value.

Also, many casinos here on the East Coast disallow freeplay at e-games, VP and VBJ.

So if u think paying 99.5% face value for some slot machine freeplay is a great value... well, I guess thats why I am the one most feared by casinos.

EDIT: and I think any letter designations longer than LMFAO should be disallowed. I have no idea whst TMF...blah blah blah means.

DOUBLE EDIT: Take out the S. I am well known. Not secretive
For Whom the bus tolls; The bus tolls for thee
MaxPen
MaxPen
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September 2nd, 2019 at 6:17:34 PM permalink
Quote: darkoz



EDIT: and I think any letter designations longer than LMFAO should be disallowed. I have no idea whst TMF...blah blah blah means.

DOUBLE EDIT: Take out the S. I am well known. Not secretive



This right here sums up alot. Contradict much?
darkoz
darkoz
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September 2nd, 2019 at 6:29:27 PM permalink
Quote: MaxPen

This right here sums up alot. Contradict much?



Yes, its called AP cover play.

Make the casinos think you are their best customer

Meanwhile rape them silly.

AP is all about contradiction
For Whom the bus tolls; The bus tolls for thee
AxelWolf
AxelWolf
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billryan
September 2nd, 2019 at 7:29:32 PM permalink
Quote: darkoz

"Under the right circumstances" is a pretty big disclaimer.

Under general circumstances I wouldn't pay more than 50% face value.

Also, many casinos here on the East Coast disallow freeplay at e-games, VP and VBJ.

So if u think paying 99.5% face value for some slot machine freeplay is a great value... well, I guess thats why I am the one most feared by casinos.

EDIT: and I think any letter designations longer than LMFAO should be disallowed. I have no idea whst TMF...blah blah blah means.

DOUBLE EDIT: Take out the S. I am well known. Not secretive

Where did I say paying 99.5% of FP was great value? I said, under the right circumstance I would buy it for that price. Obviously, thats not a deal I would be seeking out. Most AP's and many non AP's know what I'm talking about in undstanding there's +EV there. It doesn't surprise me that you don't.

Let me give you an example. Recently there were some full pay $2 and 1 5 play duces wild at the DTG. They clock in at little over 100.7 %. Assuming you were there playing anyways or wanted to. If you were to buy a large amounts of free play from someone for 99.5% of face value, you would increase your hourly significantly.

The fact that you wouldn't buy free play for more than 50% is very telling. That will make a great chapter in your book.

51%+ would be a fantastic deal on just about any slot machine in the United States. Obviously 99.5% would only be +EV rare circumstances.

p.s. I would name that book chapter for you, however, I'm sure it would get me suspended.
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪

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