return on single line 8/6 ult x BPD

I should figure this out myself, but feeling lazy. I believe 8/6 JOB is 98.5%. Anyone know what 8/6 BPD single line returns?

LTFG.

Don't think it's listed anywhere, but I've been wrong before. Note that I'm looking for ultimate x single line returns.

If you know the multipliers, it can be figured out using WOO VP strategy engine thing.

https://wizardofodds.com/games/video-poker/tables/ultimate-x/

99.70%

single line, not multiline. it's not listed there, and it has to be lower than 99.57%. i realize that the wizard calculator may give a rough approximation. it's not like i didn't read the 17 page academic paper linked to on that page, or looked at multiple sources. i was just hoping someone would have the IGT listed return rather than posting something condescending.

Do you know the multipliers?

Quote: tongni

single line, not multiline. it's not listed there, and it has to be lower than 99.57%. i realize that the wizard calculator may give a rough approximation. it's not like i didn't read the 17 page academic paper linked to on that page, or looked at multiple sources. i was just hoping someone would have the IGT listed return rather than posting something condescending.

Actually with single line, the return would be slightly higher than 3-line with exactly the same multipliers. The reason why 5/10 line returns are higher are the better multipliers on quads/SF/Royal.

But unfortunately for single line games, they are deceiving as hell, because they often offer lower multipliers than the 3 line games for non-quad or better payouts!

Videopoker.com lets you play single line Ultimate X with BPD, but instead of the flush being 11X as in 3-line, it's 10X! This is likely what it is on a Five Star Poker game as well.

So that leads to a multiplier independent return of 98.77% via JB's analyzer.

I’m the guy who wrote that 17 page academic paper you mention. I recently used that methodology to verify ALL the IGT multi-line returns listed by The Wizard of Odds (out to the 6 digits listed by the Wizard). Using the multipliers for single line games used by VideoPoker.com, I computed the following returns, including for BPD. The table below gives the game, pay table, return, and multipliers (ordered the same way as the wizard’s):

Jacks or Better 8/6 0.985730379 2 2 2 12 10 7 4 3 2 1
Jacks or Better 8/5 0.972583465 2 2 2 12 10 7 4 3 2 1
Jacks or Better 7/5 0.961122353 2 2 2 12 10 7 4 3 2 1
Jacks or Better 6/5 0.949665302 2 2 2 12 10 7 4 3 2 1
Bonus Poker 7/5 0.980913703 3 3 3 3 3 12 10 7 4 3 2 1
Bonus Poker 6/5 0.969440023 3 3 3 3 3 12 10 7 4 3 2 1
Bonus Poker Deluxe 8/6 0.98823501 2 2 2 12 10 7 4 3 2 1
Bonus Poker Deluxe 8/5 0.974692508 2 2 2 12 10 7 4 3 2 1
Bonus Poker Deluxe 7/5 0.963247289 2 2 2 12 10 7 4 3 2 1
Bonus Poker Deluxe 6/5 0.951808095 2 2 2 12 10 7 4 3 2 1
Double Bonus 9/6/5 0.981117523 2 2 2 2 2 12 10 7 4 3 2 1
Double Bonus 10/6/4 0.977620541 2 2 2 2 2 12 10 7 4 3 2 1
Double Bonus 9/6/4 0.966230347 2 2 2 2 2 12 10 7 4 3 2 1
Double Bonus 9/5/4 0.952713913 2 2 2 2 2 12 10 7 4 3 2 1
Double Double Bonus 9/6 0.992909183 4 4 4 4 4 4 4 12 10 7 4 3 2 1
Double Double Bonus 9/5 0.97931429 4 4 4 4 4 4 4 12 10 7 4 3 2 1
Double Double Bonus 8/5 0.968022718 4 4 4 4 4 4 4 12 10 7 4 3 2 1
Double Double Bonus 7/5 0.956805032 4 4 4 4 4 4 4 12 10 7 4 3 2 1
Deuces Wild 25/15/9/4/4/3 0.990473225 2 2 2 3 11 7 5 5 3 2 1
Deuces Wild 20/12/10/4/4/3 0.978770043 2 2 2 3 11 7 5 5 3 2 1
Deuces Wild 25/16/13/4/3/2 0.968076795 2 2 2 3 11 7 5 5 3 2 1
Deuces Wild 20/10/8/4/4/3 0.96212958 2 2 2 3 11 7 5 5 3 2 1
Joker Poker 50-17-7-6-5 0.982380313 2 2 2 2 2 6 6 5 4 3 2 1
Joker Poker 50-16-7-6-5 0.973786886 2 2 2 2 2 6 6 5 4 3 2 1
Joker Poker 50/15/7/6/5 0.965198863 2 2 2 2 2 6 6 5 4 3 2 1
Joker Poker 40/20/5/4/3 0.956637252 2 2 2 2 2 6 6 5 4 3 2 1

If you have other multipliers, please advise. I don’t recall seeing any single-line, Ultimate-X games in real casinos.

Quote: GaryJKoehler

I’m the guy who wrote that 17 page academic paper you mention. I recently used that methodology to verify ALL the IGT multi-line returns listed by The Wizard of Odds (out to the 6 digits listed by the Wizard). Using the multipliers for single line games used by VideoPoker.com, I computed the following returns, including for BPD. The table below gives the game, pay table, return, and multipliers (ordered the same way as the wizard’s):

Jacks or Better 8/6 0.985730379 2 2 2 12 10 7 4 3 2 1
Jacks or Better 8/5 0.972583465 2 2 2 12 10 7 4 3 2 1
Jacks or Better 7/5 0.961122353 2 2 2 12 10 7 4 3 2 1
Jacks or Better 6/5 0.949665302 2 2 2 12 10 7 4 3 2 1
Bonus Poker 7/5 0.980913703 3 3 3 3 3 12 10 7 4 3 2 1
Bonus Poker 6/5 0.969440023 3 3 3 3 3 12 10 7 4 3 2 1
Bonus Poker Deluxe 8/6 0.98823501 2 2 2 12 10 7 4 3 2 1
Bonus Poker Deluxe 8/5 0.974692508 2 2 2 12 10 7 4 3 2 1
Bonus Poker Deluxe 7/5 0.963247289 2 2 2 12 10 7 4 3 2 1
Bonus Poker Deluxe 6/5 0.951808095 2 2 2 12 10 7 4 3 2 1
Double Bonus 9/6/5 0.981117523 2 2 2 2 2 12 10 7 4 3 2 1
Double Bonus 10/6/4 0.977620541 2 2 2 2 2 12 10 7 4 3 2 1
Double Bonus 9/6/4 0.966230347 2 2 2 2 2 12 10 7 4 3 2 1
Double Bonus 9/5/4 0.952713913 2 2 2 2 2 12 10 7 4 3 2 1
Double Double Bonus 9/6 0.992909183 4 4 4 4 4 4 4 12 10 7 4 3 2 1
Double Double Bonus 9/5 0.97931429 4 4 4 4 4 4 4 12 10 7 4 3 2 1
Double Double Bonus 8/5 0.968022718 4 4 4 4 4 4 4 12 10 7 4 3 2 1
Double Double Bonus 7/5 0.956805032 4 4 4 4 4 4 4 12 10 7 4 3 2 1
Deuces Wild 25/15/9/4/4/3 0.990473225 2 2 2 3 11 7 5 5 3 2 1
Deuces Wild 20/12/10/4/4/3 0.978770043 2 2 2 3 11 7 5 5 3 2 1
Deuces Wild 25/16/13/4/3/2 0.968076795 2 2 2 3 11 7 5 5 3 2 1
Deuces Wild 20/10/8/4/4/3 0.96212958 2 2 2 3 11 7 5 5 3 2 1
Joker Poker 50-17-7-6-5 0.982380313 2 2 2 2 2 6 6 5 4 3 2 1
Joker Poker 50-16-7-6-5 0.973786886 2 2 2 2 2 6 6 5 4 3 2 1
Joker Poker 50/15/7/6/5 0.965198863 2 2 2 2 2 6 6 5 4 3 2 1
Joker Poker 40/20/5/4/3 0.956637252 2 2 2 2 2 6 6 5 4 3 2 1

If you have other multipliers, please advise. I don’t recall seeing any single-line, Ultimate-X games in real casinos.

Now we just need strategies for each game.

Quote: AxelWolf

Now we just need strategies for each game.

Stop holding an Ace kicker on all pairs, Axle. Trust me.

Quote: GaryJKoehler

Bonus Poker 7/5 0.980913703 3 3 3 3 3 12 10 7 4 3 2 1
Bonus Poker 6/5 0.969440023 3 3 3 3 3 12 10 7 4 3 2 1
If you have other multipliers, please advise. I don’t recall seeing any single-line, Ultimate-X games in real casinos.

I could've sworn I saw a 7/5 BP game with different multipliers. I think maybe it was 11 for the full house? Anyway, it was at a CET property on the strip. And the payback would be less than the 98.09% you indicated, so I'm not sure it would be worth analyzing.

Quote: GaryJKoehler

...I don’t recall seeing any single-line, Ultimate-X games in real casinos.

Next time I'm at Firekeepers in Michigan, I'll get a picture of one. They are on some Five Star machines.

Quote: redjohn

Stop holding an Ace kicker on all pairs, Axle. Trust me.

I don't play enough UX without a significant edge where I can't fade mistakes compared to the edge and short sessions. So I haven't really took the time to investigate all 10 coin strategies on all the games. There's a few different variations and I know they are not as easy as some. I can usually get close and make an educated guess but I would like to confirm. Especially if something suddenly comes up that has a 2% , 3% 4% edge not knowing it could seriously hurt you on UX

Deuces wild seem especially tricky. Anyone have a strategy card for that?

FYI I'm not talking 5 coin vulture strategy.

Quote: teddys

I could've sworn I saw a 7/5 BP game with different multipliers. I think maybe it was 11 for the full house? Anyway, it was at a CET property on the strip. And the payback would be less than the 98.09% you indicated, so I'm not sure it would be worth analyzing.

True, but simple enough to compute:

Bonus Poker 7/5 0.975338052 3 3 3 3 3 11 10 7 4 3 2 1
Bonus Poker 6/5 0.963932408 3 3 3 3 3 11 10 7 4 3 2 1

Quote: Ibeatyouraces

Next time I'm at Firekeepers in Michigan, I'll get a picture of one. They are on some Five Star machines.

That would be great. I'm always on the lookout for new pay tables/multipliers.