'Croupier' The Movie

I just saw this again on the late show. I have some questions. A couple times in the movie, the dealer completely turns his back on the players. Is that allowed in the UK? It will get you fired in the States. or in serious trouble. At the end of his shift, the dealer has the money from the hold box spread out on the table and he's counting it. Is that common practice in the UK? In the States, the boxes are collected at intervals by armed guards and the money is taken to the counting room, where its dealt with under strict scrutiny. Do they really let dealers count the money in the UK?

Hollywood takes a lot of liberties with historical facts, - as well as the procedural facts with detailed industry procedures.
Nowhere is a dealer suppose to turn away from the table or chip rack while on the game, but this is more slightly more lenient on Roulette, as the chip rack is off to the side behind the wheel. Still, really.

The Internet site www.IMDB.com (the Internet movie database) has, for every film produced, a "goofs" section where they list factual inconsistencies (such as a movie that takes place in the 1950's which shows a 1961 Chevy car driving by, etc.) - that the vast majority of viewers wouldn't notice.

Quote: Paigowdan

(the Internet movie database) has, for every film produced, a "goofs" .

I checked that already. How about dealers counting the hold?

100% right on that.
Dealers are never supposed to see, touch, handle, or even think about the money after they push it into the table's drop box or "can" with the paddle.
Complete and utter fiction. If it ain't tip money, we don't go anywhere near it. The house's drop cans are delivered by armed security guards to the count rooms, where count teams in body aprons tally it up.
We never see the count team members or surveillance crews, and would be sacked for collusion, for having a friendly chat with these guys on casino premises.
None of our business, we just dummy-up and deal.

Quote: Paigowdan

Complete and utter fiction. If it ain't tip money, we don't go anywhere near it. .

In the movie somebody tries to tip him and he says in the UK, dealer can't take tips. True or not. He also says he's not allowed to talk to the players, even if they ask questions.

Quote: EvenBob

In the movie somebody tries to tip him and he says in the UK, dealer can't take tips. True or not. He also says he's not allowed to talk to the players, even if they ask questions.

We are now, but taking tips has only been allowed for a couple of years now.

As to dealers counting the money, we do, but in a secure count room, not on the tables.

Quote: Croupier

We are now, but taking tips has only been allowed for a couple of years now.

Do you make as much in tips as dealers do in the States?

>the dealer completely turns his back on the players.
Pure utter Hollywood. Dealers last night for sure if he did that.
>the dealer has the money from the hold box spread out on the table and he's counting it.
Collection of drop boxes in Vegas is by specific time registered with the Gaming Commission. Failure to adhere to precise timing gets noticed. Even in a GoForYourOwn joint, dealer does not count his money.
Some dealers have alleged that houses count dealer's toke boxes in dim lighting and without toke committee representatives being present.
Count room procedures are quite strict. There are no customers around so security never has to worry about a misinterpretation or some sort of drunken behavior. Anything wrong in a subterranean count room and its dealt with instantly.

Quote: FleaStiff

Some dealers have alleged that houses count dealer's toke boxes in dim lighting and without toke committee representatives being present.

I forget where, but once, late at night, I saw several dealers around a closed craps table, sorting and stacking chips, with a supervisor watching.

I asked. They were counting tokes.

In the sports book we always counted our own till at the end of the shift. At one place we just turned the money over to the supervisor after he cleared it and he brought it to the cage. At another place we had to call security when we were done and we were escorted to the cage and the cage verified the count.

Quote: DJTeddyBear

I forget where, but once, late at night, I saw several dealers around a closed craps table, sorting and stacking chips, with a supervisor watching.

I asked. They were counting tokes.

Sounds like it could've been Ballys LV. Happens there by the poker room around 3am.

Quote: FleaStiff

>the dealer completely turns his back on the players.
Pure utter Hollywood. Dealers last night for sure if he did that.
>the dealer has the money from the hold box spread out on the table and he's counting it.
Collection of drop boxes in Vegas is by specific time registered with the Gaming Commission. Failure to adhere to precise timing gets noticed. Even in a GoForYourOwn joint, dealer does not count his money.
Some dealers have alleged that houses count dealer's toke boxes in dim lighting and without toke committee representatives being present.
Count room procedures are quite strict. There are no customers around so security never has to worry about a misinterpretation or some sort of drunken behavior. Anything wrong in a subterranean count room and its dealt with instantly.

The film isn't Hollywood though... it's Pinewood (well actually on checking it was filmed in Westphalia, Germany and on location in the UK and South Africa). So the LV rules are kinda moot here.

I'll leave it to the UK dealers on here to discuss the accuracy... I know tips are very recent in the UK, and they don't make up as much of the wage packets as the US dealers seem to make. Many of the whales don't tip on their 10-25 thousand hands of blackjack. They don't have chips small enough.

Finally saw the movie "Croupier". I'd say most of us here should see it, good movie.

I wound up with some comments and questions that are bugging me, though. Your Input appreciated, anyone, but especially from some real dealers.

21 loses to dealer BJ, or? ... The first time we see Jack deal BJ, someone who doubled on 11 and hit 21 gets all his money taken by Jack when the dealer gets BJ. As far as I can tell, that's a rule nowhere. Are we to assume Jack got pleasure out of cheating the player? It seems too prominently shown to be a mistake by the movie makers.

The sex scenes bothered me. And not for the reason that such a statement might make you think. There was a nothing but bad sex the whole movie. Once he becomes a dealer, sex with his wife ends it seems. In the Greek joint, Jack catches some chick that gave him the come-on servicing another customer. But when the camera pans down, the woman, who is on top and seemingly fully engaged, is actually dry humping the guy. WTF? If that was supposed to be showing they were having real coitus, the director screwed it up totally. You know, like having them take off their clothes. When Jack actually succumbs to temptation with a female dealer who has been after him, it's a violent rape scene, and she LIKES it. WTF? When Jack finally goes to bed with the mysterious temptress, they don't have sex due to his scruples. WTF?

Ironically, apparently Croupiers as sex partners are greatly in demand by sexy women, according to this movie. Jack just screws it up. In fact Jack's big problem is he wants to be a professional, a paragon of a dealer, but temptation is everywhere, and not just from sexy customers he is supposed to be avoiding. All, any, and every kind of temptation abounds for a dealer. A dealer seems practically doomed to get sucked into some shit. Is life as a dealer really like that?

The rest are spoilers. If you havent seen the movie, I'd quit with this thread, as someone will possibly discuss a spoiler openly. But I will ask. Please use spoiler cover in commenting on the below

If it's no peak blackjack, all bets lose to a dealer blackjack, all doubles and splits. This rule was in effect in UK card rooms as I recall at the time the movie was made.

Quote: thecesspit

If it's no peak blackjack, all bets lose to a dealer blackjack, all doubles and splits. This rule was in effect in UK card rooms as I recall at the time the movie was made.

Well! Thanks, I just couldnt find that information at all, not even on the Wizard's variant page. Must be costly to the HE.

I need to watch this movie again, the first time through my girlfriend's roommate at the time was cooking dinner and I lost a lot of dialogue. Is it still on Netflix Instant?

Yes its still on Netflix. Just watched it again not to long ago.

21 Losing to dealer's BJ is correct, not a scam. Players initial bet and the double fall.

Dry Hump scene: Remember Matt said "Just Girls"... and that is what they were depicted as. A quickie in the Loo. Just Girls. I thought it was badly filmed but probably suggestive of the guy being so stoned he might as well get dry humped as anything else.

Goes to police? No, she goes to her former lover who is a CID officer she knew when she was a WPC before she was fired.

Croupier's sex: Yes, he raped the dealer he was attracted to... and her body consented even before her mind caught up with it. As Matt said: Just Girls.

Croupier being in sexual demand: Not really. Middle aged women asked about his after shave but his refusal of conversational banter is based solely on Spins Per Hour.

Low amount of bribe... no its a reasonable amount for a shill. Remember, it was to be half in advance and half later. Did you figure out where the later half came from?

Quote: FleaStiff

Low amount of bribe... no its a reasonable amount for a shill. Remember, it was to be half in advance and half later. Did you figure out where the later half came from?

PS: I still think the bad sex all around was intentional

Quote: odiousgambit

Show Spoiler

I didn't think he collected the other half. But I figured out his father was behind the whole thing, had the scam in mind when he got him the job in the first place.

PS: I still think the bad sex all around was intentional

Perhaps. What director would want to depict good sex if they are "just girls". It was a scene of drugs and money. Who is in the scene and who is observing it and apart from it.