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likeplayingcrapsandbj
likeplayingcrapsandbj
Joined: May 17, 2010
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May 18th, 2010 at 8:25:29 AM permalink
I agree with you. They screwed up in CA with having playing cards match the dice after the throw to get around the law(I will not play or go to a CA casino because of that.) I will not play rapid craps. It is not craps! So what you can sit, half the fun is jumping and yelling and high 5ing when you win. Nothing beats the feeling of throwing a $5 chip on a hard way and it hits the next roll!!!!!!!!! It is a good way to meet women also!!! You take that away and what is the point anymore.
Last Man at the Table
DJTeddyBear
DJTeddyBear
Joined: Nov 2, 2009
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May 18th, 2010 at 8:55:14 AM permalink
From Paco's post on the prior page:
Quote: pacomartin

THE MACHINE STOPS
by E.M. Forster (1909)

THE AIR-SHIP

Imagine, if you can, a small room, hexagonal in shape, like the cell of a bee....

OK. I finally got a chance to read the whole story.

What's your point?
I invented a few casino games. Info: http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ 覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧 Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
goatcabin
goatcabin
Joined: Feb 13, 2010
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May 18th, 2010 at 9:19:37 AM permalink
Quote: likeplayingcrapsandbj

I agree with you. They screwed up in CA with having playing cards match the dice after the throw to get around the law(I will not play or go to a CA casino because of that.) I will not play rapid craps. It is not craps!



What do you mean "they screwed up"? What would have had them do instead? It's card craps or nothing, unless the law is changed.
Cheers,
Alan Shank
Cheers, Alan Shank "How's that for a squabble, Pugh?" Peter Boyle as Mister Moon in "Yellowbeard"
DJTeddyBear
DJTeddyBear
Joined: Nov 2, 2009
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May 18th, 2010 at 9:35:42 AM permalink
He's saying that since there are mechanical roulette tables - tables that use a real wheel and ball that falls randomly, but not launched by a human - that they could just as easily use two dice in an electrically operated pop-o-matic.

Would the law allow players to flip the switch that causes the mechanics to pop the pop-o-matic? Probably not. But real dice is still more preferable to the card dice system currently used.
I invented a few casino games. Info: http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ 覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧 Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
goatcabin
goatcabin
Joined: Feb 13, 2010
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May 18th, 2010 at 9:52:44 AM permalink
Quote: DJTeddyBear

He's saying that since there are mechanical roulette tables - tables that use a real wheel and ball that falls randomly, but not launched by a human - that they could just as easily use two dice in an electrically operated pop-o-matic.



I may be wrong, but I think the California law says that the result of a game cannot be determined by dice, period. In at least two of the card-craps methods in use in CA, the player does throw dice, but they do not directly determine the result; rather, they "point" in one way or another, to a card or two cards that give the "dice" result.

As a "C" programmer, I see a parallel to pointers, variables that contain a memory address where the value of interest is found.
Cheers,
Alan Shank
Cheers, Alan Shank "How's that for a squabble, Pugh?" Peter Boyle as Mister Moon in "Yellowbeard"
goatcabin
goatcabin
Joined: Feb 13, 2010
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May 18th, 2010 at 6:16:40 PM permalink
Colusa Casino, which I believe was the first California casino to offer craps, no longer has it. They used what I consider the best method, where two regular dice were used to point to one card in each of two sets of A-6. I played there a few times, and it was quite smooth. I don't know why they dropped it, but I assume it was lack of interest.

The card craps at Cache Creek seems to be quite popular, and has been going for several years. They use two decks of 36, alternating, and pick the card selected by rolling two dice, a blue one with 1s and 3s, and a red one with 2s and 4s. The deal two cards, one in a blue square and one in a red; the die with the higher number select which color card is turned over.

Of course, I would prefer a regular craps game, but it's 15 miles vs. the drive to Reno and staying over.
Cheers,
Alan Shank
Cheers, Alan Shank "How's that for a squabble, Pugh?" Peter Boyle as Mister Moon in "Yellowbeard"
BigTip
BigTip
Joined: May 25, 2010
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May 25th, 2010 at 3:19:25 PM permalink
I'm new to the site and saw this thread. When I first heard about it I was excited to play it because of all the reasons people have stated, but....

.....electronics craps is crappy! There I said it. It just sucks. Okay, I was feeling pretty good (that's code for being a bit wasted) by the time in the evening when I sat down to play, and maybe that clouded my opinion. But I really do think it sucks. Why? Because it was too damn slow. The irony right? But it is. When you roll a number, the guy puts it into the machine. Then he has to wait to make sure everyone has time to make another bet. Screw that! Give me the dice and let me go baby. I didn't have that problem with my MONSTER roll I had earlier that night at Casino Royale. I rolled, the dealer paid folks, BOOM! I flung'em again. That's how this SHOULD have been.

Also, it sucks because one of the presumed advantages, was that there would be no dealer errors. But I did encounter an error. It was that they said that my entire bet on one roll, I had made for the dealer! I had made a line bet with full odds, that won, but then all of a sudden I had hardly any money in my account. WTF!? So now the game slows down even more for them to handle that problem. Just bullcrap. The girl next to me had a similar problem about disappearing money. She got disgusted and left.

AND the drink service sucked. There was a girl at the table that was perturbed as much as I was. She quickly joined me as I started a "We ain't playin' until we are drinkin' " boycott. I wasn't committed to the boycott though, so I started a "We want drinks" chant. The table was more into that one. After I said, "For Pete's sake, who ya gotta blow around here to get a drink." we finally got some beverages. So maybe that lack of beverage service tainted my opinion of the table too.

I would not play it again, even though I walked with about a $5 profit. I would play Rapid Roulette again though, and I have multiple times now. It actually does what it touts itself as doing. It speeds up the game and makes it accurate. I never play real roulette though. My group plays Rapid Roulette as a social/drinking activity.
konceptum
konceptum
Joined: Mar 25, 2010
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May 25th, 2010 at 7:47:20 PM permalink
I took an opportunity play Rapid Craps this past weekend at Bill's Gambling Hall. My two cents follow.

My first bit of surprise was the concept of handing bills to the dealer, who then inputted my numbers into a computer, that gave me my balance on my screen. I'm not sure why the system doesn't just have a bill collector and a payout ticket system like any other slot machine. I would say this concept slows down the game.

In addition, if someone is done playing, instead of receiving a print-out ticket, the dealer has to count out the appropriate chips to the player. Again, slowing down the game.

I found the user interface to be relatively easy to use. I did make one mistake. The dealer caught the mistake, but did not do a good job in explaining what I had done wrong. I figured it out after the next roll. I have previous experience using the virtual craps computers at the local Indian casinos here in Phoenix, so I'm sure that helped in my using this system. Even so, I had several problems with the way the computer system worked. Some concepts were not very intuitive, as far as the user interface goes.

A couple of times the dealer did not press whatever button is required to "open up the betting", thus slowing down the game some more.

I think I would be surprised if this Rapid Craps caught on in casinos. Much like the Excalibur's attempt at computerized poker tables, I think this will last a while, and then fizzle out. I don't even particularly see why the casino would enjoy Rapid Craps. I understand that they may be saving money on craps dealers, but they are losing money on other concepts.

I noticed that Rapid Craps only had room for 14 players. A regular craps table will accommodate 16 players.

Dealers have a harder time soliciting tips with Rapid Craps. While I understand that some players severely dislike dealers who solicit tips, I at least understand why they would want to do so. At a normal craps table, if I throw in a dealer bet of some kind, the dealers are gracious and acknowledge the bet. In addition, I'm sure they are hoping that such acknowledgement will also notify other players of the possibility of placing bets for the dealers. Since Rapid Craps dealer bets are on the individual screens, it is not possible for other players to even know that such a bet has been placed for the dealers.

In the same manner, high house-edge bets that are encouraged by dealers and/or other players will not be made by the players. Example: At a regular craps table during this past weekend, a particular shooter was a hot streak. At several points, he would throw out $5 for the "hot" yo-11. Just about every other player at the table would throw in $5 on the same bet, just because the shooter did. The yo-11 never hit. Such an event would be difficult to replicate at a Rapid Craps table. Someone would have to make the bet and then verbally announce they were making the bet. I never saw any person playing Rapid Craps verbally announce any of their bets. There was no reason to do so.

The lack of dealer tips, and essentially, lack of real dealer interaction, I think provides for bored dealers. At the time I was playing, there were 2 dealers. One who ran the computer, and one whose only job seemed to be picking up the dice that gone thrown off the table. At other points, the 2 dealers just talked with each other, paying little to no attention to the players. Granted, this is a case of customer service, and could be addressed in differing manners by various casinos, however, I don't see any reason why dealers would get excited by this game, and thus I don't see any real change in this level of service.

I don't particularly see Rapid Craps as being any easier to use or easier to understand than regular craps. I think that new players can be encouraged by a regular craps table, see the excitement of the game, and can be encouraged and talked into various bets by live dealers.
DJTeddyBear
DJTeddyBear
Joined: Nov 2, 2009
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May 25th, 2010 at 8:17:08 PM permalink
Quote: konceptum

A couple of times the dealer did not press whatever button is required to "open up the betting", thus slowing down the game some more.

Hmmm.... Sounds like one of the problems I had the last time I played Rapid Roulette. I talked about it here: http://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/gripes/1548-bad-rapidroulette-experience/


Quote: konceptum

I noticed that Rapid Craps only had room for 14 players. A regular craps table will accommodate 16 players.

According to the ShuffleMaster website, it can be configured for up to 20 players. On the flip side, RapidRoulette can be configured for 254 players!
I invented a few casino games. Info: http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ 覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧 Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
RPToro
RPToro
Joined: Apr 10, 2010
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May 25th, 2010 at 8:26:16 PM permalink
I walked into Bill's this weekend while in Vegas for one reason - to take a look at this Rapid Craps table. I've been playing craps for a couple years now, and have a good understanding of the game (thanks to this site & wizardofodds.com).

I didn't play RC, just observed it for a couple of minutes. The one thing that stood out to me, as with others, was the slow pace of the game. Where I really noticed it was a specific situation - when a point has already been established and the shooter rolls a 3, for example. In a normal game, very little (if anything at all) happens; dice go right back to the shooter except for a couple of bets that might need to be settled. In RC, it seemed like the timer lasted the same between each throw, regardless of the outcome.

I don't mind waiting @ a real table when a number hits (not point) such as a hard 6, and all kinds of bets get paid out, presses and parlays occur, etc... THAT'S exciting to see. But when a 3 gets rolled and one player loses a come bet and one wins a field bet, lets get the dice back out and shoot again!!!

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