Poll

7 votes (25%)
4 votes (14.28%)
10 votes (35.71%)
10 votes (35.71%)
2 votes (7.14%)
8 votes (28.57%)
6 votes (21.42%)

28 members have voted

lilredrooster
lilredrooster
Joined: May 8, 2015
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August 25th, 2019 at 1:29:32 AM permalink
a lot of the chatter here has referred to harness racing tracks

that's a totally different thing - yes they are dying

but not thoroughbred racing

yes many little tracks are gone because bettors betting big want to bet into big pools so the parimutuel system doesn't shoot them in the foot

once again, at the big, popular tracks gigantic sums are being wagered

yes, attendance is down - people don't want to go except for the huge events - they prefer the convenience of betting on computer - but wagering levels are strong

I generally only bet by computer. I don't pay for parking, gas, admission or a program. I don't pay $6.00 for a bottle of water - I'm comfortably waiting for the next race I want to bet which may be hours away - no wasting my time driving around trying to avoid getting killed by the aggressive maniacs on the roads where I live - because of this betting racing is much, much better than it used to be

gamblers love gigantic payoffs - racing has very successfully morphed their betting platform so that gamblers have opportunities for gigantic payouts in the Pick 6, Pick 5, superfectas and several other gimmicks - racetrack management actually got something right in that regard






if you want to talk about the future of horse racing you can't consider harness racing and thoroughbred racing together and come to any logical conclusions

you have to consider them separately to make any reasonable judgements
Last edited by: lilredrooster on Aug 25, 2019
"but I don't care too much for money..........money can't buy me love".............. the Beatles
Boz
Boz
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August 25th, 2019 at 6:21:38 AM permalink
Quote: AxelWolf

I've seen a few articles about guys who REALLY LOVE THEIR HORSES.




https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enumclaw_horse_sex_case

One of my favorite stories ever.

Still laugh about them just dropping the guy off at the hospital.
billryan
billryan
Joined: Nov 2, 2009
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August 25th, 2019 at 7:27:40 AM permalink
Quote: lilredrooster

a lot of the chatter here has referred to harness racing tracks

that's a totally different thing - yes they are dying

but not thoroughbred racing

yes many little tracks are gone because bettors betting big want to bet into big pools so the parimutuel system doesn't shoot them in the foot

once again, at the big, popular tracks gigantic sums are being wagered

yes, attendance is down - people don't want to go except for the huge events - they prefer the convenience of betting on computer - but wagering levels are strong

I generally only bet by computer. I don't pay for parking, gas, admission or a program. I don't pay $6.00 for a bottle of water - I'm comfortably waiting for the next race I want to bet which may be hours away - no wasting my time driving around trying to avoid getting killed by the aggressive maniacs on the roads where I live - because of this betting racing is much, much better than it used to be

gamblers love gigantic payoffs - racing has very successfully morphed their betting platform so that gamblers have opportunities for gigantic payouts in the Pick 6, Pick 5, superfectas and several other gimmicks - racetrack management actually got something right in that regard






if you want to talk about the future of horse racing you can't consider harness racing and thoroughbred racing together and come to any logical conclusions

you have to consider them separately to make any reasonable judgements



Evidently, you don't consider Belmont, Aqueduct or the Meadowlands to be big popular tracks because outside of Belmont Stakes week, none of them draw flies.
sabre
sabre
Joined: Aug 16, 2010
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August 25th, 2019 at 7:43:16 AM permalink
The desire to watch animals run around in a circle and "study" race forms to decide which one to make a wager with an absurd amount withheld from the betting pool has nothing to do with patience. I think it has a good deal to do with intelligence.
ThatDonGuy
ThatDonGuy
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August 25th, 2019 at 8:35:29 AM permalink
Quote: billryan

NASCAR and NHRA should adopt a parimutual betting format. Street racing produces some big wages, I think it might translate into pro racing. If I can legally bet on Nick Diaz, why not let me bet on a driver.


You can bet on NASCAR races at pretty much any sports book, albeit not pari-mutuel. I can see two problems with trying to do it at tracks; one, it would be too hard to implement; two, considering how many drivers are in teams, it would be too easy to rig a result if there was enough bet money involved. (They say that they don't do that now because each driver has his own sponsor, but there just isn't enough incentive for it at the moment, especially with the "we won't disqualify anybody for failing a post-race inspection - we don't want the fans to have to wait until the next day to find out who won" mentality that NASCAR has.)

Quote: bobbartop

With all due respect, that's a bunch of horse crap. I'll tell you exactly why those tracks closed, and it's not because of abuse, which is only in your imagination. Horse racing has declined, because all the fkg little morons nowadays have to have their instant gratification, their x-boxes or whatever they're called, they walk on the street not looking where they're going because they've got their face glued to their i-phones texting each other. The generation of today doesn't have the patience to sit a half hour between races, or use their brains to study the Form, the kids now days need everything NOW NOW NOW. Gimmee gimmee gimmee. This generation sucks.


I don't know about other tracks, but Bay Meadows was taking up a substantial amount of Silicon Valley real estate.
For those of you who just replied, "What about the other tracks in the Bay Area?", Golden Gate Fields is pretty much on swampland, and the rest of the tracks are part of fairgrounds deep in the suburbs.
billryan
billryan
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August 25th, 2019 at 8:45:12 AM permalink
Quote: ThatDonGuy

You can bet on NASCAR races at pretty much any sports book, albeit not pari-mutuel. I can see two problems with trying to do it at tracks; one, it would be too hard to implement; two, considering how many drivers are in teams, it would be too easy to rig a result if there was enough bet money involved. (They say that they don't do that now because each driver has his own sponsor, but there just isn't enough incentive for it at the moment, especially with the "we won't disqualify anybody for failing a post-race inspection - we don't want the fans to have to wait until the next day to find out who won" mentality that NASCAR has.)


I don't know about other tracks, but Bay Meadows was taking up a substantial amount of Silicon Valley real estate.
For those of you who just replied, "What about the other tracks in the Bay Area?", Golden Gate Fields is pretty much on swampland, and the rest of the tracks are part of fairgrounds deep in the suburbs.



That was Roosevelt Raceways curse. It sat on prime real estate and after chopping off a few small outcroppings to raise capital, they kept running in the red and had nothing left to sell but either the parking lots or the grandstand. On the Brightside, it created over thousand apartments and a couple thousand permanent jobs. Gaining access to newly created roads also alleviated a growing traffic problem.
bobbartop
bobbartop
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August 25th, 2019 at 10:57:05 AM permalink
Quote: ThatDonGuy



I don't know about other tracks, but Bay Meadows was taking up a substantial amount of Silicon Valley real estate.



Same with Santa Anita. I guess Hollywood Park too.
'Emergencies' have always been the pretext on which the safeguards of individual liberty have been eroded.
lilredrooster
lilredrooster
Joined: May 8, 2015
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August 25th, 2019 at 12:39:40 PM permalink
Quote: billryan

Evidently, you don't consider Belmont, Aqueduct or the Meadowlands to be big popular tracks because outside of Belmont Stakes week, none of them draw flies.



Belmont draws huge off track wagering during all of their meets - Saratoga draws both large crowds and huge wagering every single day it operates

Meadowlands is mainly for harness and has moved almost all of its thoroughbred racing operations to Monmouth

as I said, to correctly assess the situation it's necessary to consider thoroughbred racing separately

you point only to failures in the industry - most corporate projects are a mixture of successes and failures

to say that thoroughbred racing is failing is false - it's compressing - not failing



you mentioned Aqueduct - 𝐨𝐧 𝐚 𝐖𝐞𝐝𝐧𝐞𝐬𝐝𝐚𝐲 in April, 2019 in 𝐣𝐮𝐬𝐭 𝐨𝐧𝐞 crummy little maiden race Aqueduct handled $141K in the win, place, show pool, $70K in the exacta pool, $37K in the trifecta pool and $15K in the superfecta pool


does that sound like failure to you?


http://www.equibase.com/premium/chartEmb.cfm?track=AQU&raceDate=04/17/2019&cy=USA&rn=1





outside of the U.S. thoroughbred racing is flourishing in England, France, Ireland, Australia and Japan

Hong Kong is a very special place for racing - an average of $17.4 million (U.S. value) is bet on each race

The Hong Kong Jockey Club Charities Trust donated a record $3.6 billion in 2014 to support the different needs of the society and contribute to the betterment of Hong Kong.
Last edited by: lilredrooster on Aug 25, 2019
"but I don't care too much for money..........money can't buy me love".............. the Beatles
Boz
Boz
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August 25th, 2019 at 3:29:59 PM permalink
Any chance Billy is Fez from the old Ron and Fez show?

Would explain a lot.
bobbartop
bobbartop
Joined: Mar 15, 2016
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August 25th, 2019 at 4:21:40 PM permalink
Quote: lilredrooster


to say that thoroughbred racing is failing is false - it's compressing - not failing




You argue a good point. Compressing, not failing, not bad.

My two cents is that the new customers are not there like the sport used to enjoy. YOUNG PEOPLE, are not into it. For one thing, it's not enough action for this generation. When I was a boy, and I mean a really young boy, instead of playing cowboys and Indians I would get on my swing set or the teeter totter and pretend to be a jockey riding an imaginary race horse. Wtf, I was maybe 6 or 7 years old. I knew the horses' names. lol Native Diver, Gun Bow, Kelso. I would call their names like I was an announcer. I was 6 years old. That ain't gonna happen no more. Kids aren't interested, and their parents don't take them to the track. There's no one to teach them about the game.

Another thing, all the small tracks that are history now, the small track circuit used to feed into the big circuit. The big circuit needs the support of the small tracks, the fair meets, etc. And what are you going to do with a 5-year old $2500 Claimer? Not Belmont. Not Del Mar.

By the way, you bring up Hong Kong, I meant to say that earlier. Huge handles! Wow.
'Emergencies' have always been the pretext on which the safeguards of individual liberty have been eroded.

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