2018 Kentucky Derby and Triple Crown

I think Justify beats Pharoah in the hypothetical Belmont. But only because he has the better jockey.

Can a horse, for example, Justify, stud while still racing or does a horse have to be officially retired before spreading his seed?

There is no rule against it. But he will be doing his thing 2-3 times a day, and that’s just much more important than the racing.

There have been instances of horses that were retired to stud, found infertile, and brought back to racing. Battle of Midway is latest example.

Horses have raced while in foal (pregnant), but I don’t think any horse has raced after giving birth.

Quote: aceofspades

Can a horse, for example, Justify, stud while still racing or does a horse have to be officially retired before spreading his seed?

I believe the short answer is probably, usually, mostly, as far as I know: yes he can do that thing, and no he isn't necessarily required to first formally declare that he's stopped doing that other job, aside from the practical logistical and financial reasons for doing so. I can't quite give a completely definitive answer, because never having been in any aspect of the bloodstock business there may be complications under some circumstances that I'm not aware of. I'm not aware of any universal rule that would speak to this. And off hand I can't think of a specific example involving a male horse that's exactly what you're suggesting, even though I vaguely think there's probably been a few. But, FWIW::

1. According to some published reports the owners of Justify have already sold his breeding rights, which is not unusual. But of course the breeding season in the northern hemisphere won't start for months, beginning early next spring when the mares on this continent will begin going into heat. So that transaction doesn't preclude him continuing to race before beginning his stud duties, possibly including the Breeders' Cup this fall if the parties are in agreement to allow it.

NY Times on the sale of his breeding services: https://www.nytimes.com/2018/06/10/sports/justify-breeding-rights.html
The Paulick Report on that reported transaction: https://www.paulickreport.com/news/triple-crown/justify-racings-75-million-horse/

2. Maybe more to the point of the question, I am aware of at least several mares in the last ten years or so that have given birth to foals and returned to the track, and even sometimes (rarely) raced while in-foal (just slightly pregnant, so to speak). So if somebody tries to tell Justify he can't screw & run, he should sue.

EDIT: To be clear, and after now having read the Fin reply above, I completely agree that this is very unlikely to be considered as an option for the practical reasons mentioned. At this level the real money is in the breeding shed, and it isn't sensible to mess around with that, by somehow keeping him in training for simultaneously chasing what is now relative chump change.

Quote: aceofspades

Can a horse, for example, Justify, stud while still racing or does a horse have to be officially retired before spreading his seed?

As has been posted, he can, but won't. Horses have an 11 month gestation timeframe. So studs really get going in Spring (Jan-May). The goal is to have a healthy foal drop early in the year. A horse of his caliber will be "working hard" during the breeding season (no joke) with no time for training/racing.

I was also wondering if a sire ever raced any of his progeny ( probably not since they would be retired )

Quote: aceofspades

I was also wondering if a sire ever raced any of his progeny ( probably not since they would be retired )

There is plenty of "inbreeding" going on. So horses are racing against members of their "family" all the time.

Quote: Keeneone

There is plenty of "inbreeding" going on. So horses are racing against members of their "family" all the time.

Right but I meant like if a 4 year old impregnated a mare and then the 3 year old eventually raced against the 7 year old sire

Quote: aceofspades

Right but I meant like if a 4 year old impregnated a mare and then the 3 year old eventually raced against the 7 year old sire

I admit it is an interesting question. Father vs Son (or somehow Father vs Daughter). I would highly doubt it in thoroughbreds, but do not know the actual answer. Maybe it has happened in greyhound racing or other forms of show horse related events (dressage/cattle/polo etc.)?

don't know either but wake at noon would be a possibility

Quote: ontariodealer

don't know either but wake at noon would be a possibility

Wow. Awesome horse with a crazy (and sad) ending to his life. The breeder/owner Bruno Schickedanz still going strong in the sport. Interesting stuff to learn, thanks.

I always thought it would be interesting to race clones, have them keep racing from different posts, but clones aren't allowed anyway. Even then, differences might just be due to clone errors.

Quote: onenickelmiracle

I always thought it would be interesting to race clones, have them keep racing from different posts, but clones aren't allowed anyway. Even then, differences might just be due to clone errors.

I am pretty sure cloned mules have raced against each other.

In quarter horses, semen is frozen. So there are dead horses still making babies.

Quote: aceofspades

Justify retires

Sorry to see it was necessary. Still better than allowing the chance he breaks down on the track. He will have many fine descendents.

Uhh, duhhhhhhh.

Quote: DrawingDead

...<SNIP>

And when I take my hands off my eyes I have nothing more than guesses about how much the latest Balifornia Frankenhorse will outperform his peers, for how long. He will probably continue to run spectacularly well, until the day he suddenly very much doesn't do that at all, when the ride from all the 'training' with magic oats is over, and the physiological bill for his period of brilliance is suddenly due. But I'm pretty sure Meester Baffert doesn't really know all the nuances of the slope of that dosage/performance/time curve, so I sure don't, since what I believe this is really about isn't exactly the kind of thing that can be rigorously studied and openly documented in the cold light of day with a large well controlled study population.

...<SNIP>...

The performance enhancement 'benefit' of juicing animals, human or equine, is known to come with costs. One of which is that the time window for cashing in can often be limited before hitting a performance wall, achieving temporary artificial short term peak performance at the expense of some portion of future ability. And at the expense of soundness, health and lifespan. And especially with young not yet grown-up adolescent athletes like this, likely also causing the creation of issues with basic growth and development including bones & joints & connective tissue as well as pulmonary/cardio problems.

So, duh.

No good thing happened here.