Any other successful slot ploppies?
Despite this borderline obsession, I'm not an AP. Quite the opposite actually. Most of my casino time is spent on not only slots, but large flashy modern themed slots. I know these are among the worst bets in a casino, but I genuinely enjoy the games with great theming, and the comps that come along with slot play.
The interesting part is, I'm a few hundred ahead on these games lifetime. I'm not under any illusion that it's anything other than blind, stupid luck, or that this will continue forever ... but right now I'm ahead and getting increasingly better comps. Ploppy train full steam ahead!!!!
Unless you keep accurate records of all play, not much to go on. I keep records of all my play (tables, slots, video poker, sports, misc.). Last year, near the end, I thought I was losing quite a bit. When I went through my records I figured out I was actually ahead way more than I thought I was behind. The brain plays funny tricks on you, making you think you're ahead when you're really behind, or vice versa.
What does lifetime include? Once a month for 20 minutes with a $20 here and there, or daily play with a few bills?Quote: gamerfreakI've had an unusual interest with gambling and casinos ever since I was a child. Not so much the act, but the topic itself. My closet is overflowing with books from this list. I consume content from GWAE, AP heat, and this site on a daily basis, and I feel I have a decent handle on gambling math.
Despite this borderline obsession, I'm not an AP. Quite the opposite actually. Most of my casino time is spent on not only slots, but large flashy modern themed slots. I know these are among the worst bets in a casino, but I genuinely enjoy the games with great theming, and the comps that come along with slot play.
The interesting part is, I'm a few hundred ahead on these games lifetime. I'm not under any illusion that it's anything other than blind, stupid luck, or that this will continue forever ... but right now I'm ahead and getting increasingly better comps. Ploppy train full steam ahead!!!!
That was enough to make me a lifetime winner for years, as I never played with more than a $200 bankroll.
Just when I was about even, I hit a jackpot on Tabasco. That put me up for another two or three years. Eventually, gravity caught up to me. It just took longer then normal.
I'm down approx $100 on craps and $90 on Pai Gow Poker this past year. Haven't kept good records of VP but I never do well.
I would say I play an average 5 hours slots total each month. A little less than that on the tables. I don't really mix it up, pretty much all $0.01 mega themed machines and 3CP.
I didn't mean to insinuate I was getting rich off this, I'm not a big time player at all. Also no big jackpots that skew these averages. The most I've won is $300 on gremlins. I just think that I've been really lucky, especially when you add the comps.
I also think part of doing alright on bad games has been self control and money management. I know these don't change the house edge, but I usually have a pretty tight bankroll which avoids me losing my shirt in any one session, and I almost always walk away when if I'm up $50-$60, which pretty much guartees a few winning sessions. I've been lucky in that I've had more good sessions than bad sessions. It's luck and only luck, I'll probably lose the farm next year.
What's your average bet and speed when you play?Quote: gamerfreakI have 2 years records, I'm up approx $90 last year and about $120 this year. I'm also up about $75 this year on ante-only 3 card poker. So lifetime and hundreds may be a little exaggerated.
I'm down approx $100 on craps and $90 on Pai Gow Poker this past year. Haven't kept good records of VP but I never do well.
I would say I play an average 5 hours slots total each month. A little less than that on the tables. I don't really mix it up, pretty much all $0.01 mega themed machines and 3CP.
I didn't mean to insinuate I was getting rich off this, I'm not a big time player at all. Also no big jackpots that skew these averages. The most I've won is $300 on gremlins. I just think that I've been really lucky, especially when you add the comps.
I also think part of doing alright on bad games has been self control and money management. I know these don't change the house edge, but I usually have a pretty tight bankroll which avoids me losing my shirt in any one session, and I almost always walk away when if I'm up $50-$60, which pretty much guartees a few winning sessions. I've been lucky in that I've had more good sessions than bad sessions. It's luck and only luck, I'll probably lose the farm next year.
$300 as your biggest hit suggests you are playing 1 coin/penny per line. If you are playing "mega themed slot machines" that's usually 50 lines.
I'm assuming when you play you watch the reels spin out and dick around a little. You probably average 10 spins a minute.
After 120 hours of play at -14%, you say you are beating slots without any abnormal hits(Actually $300 as your biggest hit seems low) after 72k spins.
you should be down about 5k.
If after 72k spins someone was running 14% worst than they should be on a slot machine they should call gaming because that would suggest it was gaffed.
Did Alan Mendelson put you up to this?
Quote: AxelWolfWhat's your average bet and speed when you play?
$300 as your biggest hit suggests you are playing 1 coin/penny per line. If you are playing "mega themed slot machines" that's usually 50 lines.
I'm assuming when you play you watch the reels spin out and dick around a little. You probably average 10 spins a minute.
After 120 hours of play at -14%, you say you are beating slots without any abnormal hits(Actually $300 as your biggest hit seems low) after 72k spins.
you should be down about 5k.
If after 72k spins someone was running 14% worst than they should be on a slot machine they should call gaming because that would suggest it was gaffed.
Did Alan Mendelson put you up to this?
Right I get the math doesn't work out. But I think if you made a plot of slot gamblers similar to me there would be outliers in either direction, one of them being me.
I do think my behaviors contribute though. Like you said I play slowly and usually the minimum amount per spin. And I think that very few people walk when they are only up a few dollars, I have no problem doing that.
Luck exists in the form of variance and I've just been really lucky when it comes to slots and less lucky at games like craps and pai gow that are theoretically better games. But that's the thing about outliers, they don't represent the likely theoretical outcome.
Walking away ahead or not with multiple sessions over 72k spins is meaningless.Quote: gamerfreakRight I get the math doesn't work out. But I think if you made a plot of slot gamblers similar to me there would be outliers in either direction, one of them being me.
I do think my behaviors contribute though. Like you said I play slowly and usually the minimum amount per spin. And I think that very few people walk when they are only up a few dollars, I have no problem doing that.
Luck exists in the form of variance and I've just been really lucky when it comes to slots and less lucky at games like craps and pai gow that are theoretically better games. But that's the thing about outliers, they don't represent the likely theoretical outcome.
I think I read something somewhere that gaming control requires a 100k spin test to be within 1%.(needs to be fact checked)
You have 72k spins and you are off by 13% to 15%.
I'm sure someone like ME could reasonably estimate just how staggering your results are.
Quote: AxelWolfWalking away ahead or not with multiple sessions over 72k spins is meaningless.
I think I read something somewhere that gaming control requires a 100k spin test to be within 1%.(needs to be fact checked)
You have 72k spins and you are off by 13% to 15%.
I'm sure someone like ME could reasonably estimate just how staggering your results are.
There's a couple things throwing this off.
I'm at far less than 72k spins. Partially because that estimate is for 120 hours of play per year (5 hours a month is 60/year).
The other part is that I'm thinking about it, and I believe I average way less than 10 spins a minute over a 5 hour session. I take my time and take breaks to look at my phone and whatnot, I am with my girlfriend and we are drinking, I skip around and play a lot of different machines, and the themed slots I like have a ton of feature modes that suck up some time. I also put in some 3CP play most sessions.
Overall after 2 years I would say, based on my points balance, I'm at $20k-$30k coin in, which is way less than 72k spins.
My records are also off in that the dollar amounts split between 3CP and slots is an estimate. I only count the money in my wallet before/after a trip and record the delta. I definitely put in more hours of slot play, but it's possible the 3CP contributed to more winning or break even sessions than slots.
Lost my shirt on craps.
I need to stop playing these low HE games.
For whatever it's worth, I triggered the wheel feature 7 times, and got the John Snow Wall 6/7 times.
Other games that were good to me were Big Bang Theory and The New Willy Wonka. Games that took me down a bit were Walking Dead, and Sphinx 3D.
3CP was decent, at $10 ante/play only I came out +$30 for about 3 hours of play. For whatever reason, the 3CP at Bally's Wild West was a $10 minimum, where it is usually $5 (along with every other game there).
I was trying to play craps all night but there was absolutly no space at any table besides the $25 minimums. Literally the same people at every table over my 8 hour session, no one freakin moved.
I was watching the table and some guy dropped a chip, so I let him know and he started talking to me and saying certain bets he was placing were for me. He Kept rubbing my belly for good luck. It was a little weird.
So before the next come out roll I asked if I could squeeze in (it was a little tight but there was enough space) and him and another player absolutely flipped their lid. They weren't shooting or anything so I'm not sure what bad JuJu I was bringing by asking if there was some space. Superstitious Craps players are the worst.
Quote: SiegfriedRoyIs there a way to find the odds on all the probabilities on all the wheel combinations? Is there a chart somewhere you can find probability of hitting the progressive on a given slot, or the bonus, etc. etc.?
There is a couple people have done just for example purposes to explain how slots work but for the most part no. People who chase progressives probably have some decent estimates in their personal records but they certainly aren't going to share. There are also PAR sheets (relevant design docs for the slots) but those are private as well although they get leaked occasionally.
Quote: DiscreteMaths2There is a couple people have done just for example purposes to explain how slots work but for the most part no. People who chase progressives probably have some decent estimates in their personal records but they certainly aren't going to share. There are also PAR sheets (relevant design docs for the slots) but those are private as well although they get leaked occasionally.
Thanks for the heads up. I figured it was closely guarded.
Quote: SiegfriedRoyThanks for the heads up. I figured it was closely guarded.
If you want to try and figure it out, the Wiz has some posts on www.wizardofodds.com where he attempts to figure it out without par sheets.
Deconstructing Megabucks is one, there are other digital reel and mechanical reel examples.
Quote: AxelWolfWhat's your average bet and speed when you play?
$300 as your biggest hit suggests you are playing 1 coin/penny per line. If you are playing "mega themed slot machines" that's usually 50 lines.
I'm assuming when you play you watch the reels spin out and dick around a little. You probably average 10 spins a minute.
After 120 hours of play at -14%, you say you are beating slots without any abnormal hits(Actually $300 as your biggest hit seems low) after 72k spins.
you should be down about 5k.
If after 72k spins someone was running 14% worst than they should be on a slot machine they should call gaming because that would suggest it was gaffed.
Did Alan Mendelson put you up to this?
Here is my 2017 Win/Loss from CET for the small amount of slot play I put in last year. I’d need to check my notes but this is for about $15k coin in, most of which was on Game of Thrones. My biggest single hit was only in the $300 range.
That’s about +$2k from Theo by my calculation.
If anyone would like me to rub their screen while they play, I’m more than willing.
Quote: gamerfreakH
If anyone would like me to rub their screen while they play, I’m more than willing.
Some people rub, some knock. Then there's the ones the bang the machine so hard if you're sitting on opposite side the whole damn bank shakes.
Rubbers, knockers, and bangers.
sounds dirty.
She bet $1 straight up on an e-roulette game and won $35. Then she put $5 in a slot machine and won a bonus round for $8.
She then declared gambling to be totally dumb and never gambled again.
That’s about the only way to be ahead lifetime on slots.
Quote: rxwineSome people rub, some knock. Then there's the ones the bang the machine so hard if you're sitting on opposite side the whole damn bank shakes.
Rubbers, knockers, and bangers.
sounds dirty.
I know a couple who rub the screen with a $20 bill. I've also sat next to a lady who handled what I thought were Rosary Beads while she played slots.
Or explain to me the people who pull their players card out because they're not winning. Not to be confused with people who just never use the card to start with. What a bunch of morons. Work all week, blow your brains out at the slots every other week, and never use the card. On a crowded night at my local casino I can see whole rows of people with NO card in their machine, despite the fact that the casino can be quite generous.
Quote: gamerfreakIf anyone would like me to rub their screen while they play, I’m more than willing.
That’s what you young whippersnappers are calling it now a days?
uncleQuote: onenickelmiracleLock it link, major $5385. That's high enough to try. What do I know.
Quote: RSQuote: gamerfreakIf anyone would like me to rub their screen while they play, I’m more than willing.
That’s what you young whippersnappers are calling it now a days?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gj3AgSZEXMo
Quote: onenickelmiracleLock it link, major $5385. That's high enough to try. What do I know.
What DO you know? I found a Lock-It Link on Sunday that the 4 progressive jackpots were $13,546, $882, $64, and $13. Max bet 500, multi-denom. Those were the .01 amounts.
Worst-performing machine I have played in years. Lost $700, coin-in was just less than 1k. Time ran out so I had to quit when they closed the casino. Never hit a bonus. Got 1 3-center reel symbols (door knockers?), selected the bats over 6 free spins. Think it was called Bats, Cats, and Hats. That did ok, won $135, but otherwise a completely dead game.
I thought the numbers looked +ev, but I'm terrible at calculating that. You're saying 5k+ is good on these? Never played one before.
Never seen a lock it link progressive... the jackpots are "usually" around:Quote: beachbumbabs...I thought the numbers looked +ev, but I'm terrible at calculating that. You're saying 5k+ is good on these? Never played one before.
Grand: $14k
Major: $1.2k
Minor: $50
Miny: $10
Not sure I worded them all correctly, and the bottom 2 change with your denomination... also these are what I'd consider an "average" for the ones I've seen. I'd play a lock it link that had a major at ~$5400...
Quote: Romes
Not sure I worded them all correctly, and the bottom 2 change with your denomination... also these are what I'd consider an "average" for the ones I've seen. I'd play a lock it link that had a major at ~$5400...
I don't think I would without specific probability information. It's possible that those machines, "Shouldn't normally get that high," but still have not run enough, "Cycles," without hitting to be good. There are any number of second-level jackpots that could look like they are through the roof and basically mean nothing.
I'm not saying it's good, I'm not saying it's bad, I'm saying I don't know. $5,400 at base $1,200 is certainly not enough information for me personally to make an assumption, though.
Besides, even if it is good, can probably get the same $$$ EV in less expected time on multiple much lower plays with far less risk.
I guess what I intentionally meant to leave vague is: You're right, if all the information you had was $5400 at a $1200 base, that's not enough... That being said, I'd play a lock it link with a $5400 major (prefer it to be a bit higher though).Quote: Mission146I don't think I would without specific probability information. It's possible that those machines, "Shouldn't normally get that high," but still have not run enough, "Cycles," without hitting to be good. There are any number of second-level jackpots that could look like they are through the roof and basically mean nothing.
I'm not saying it's good, I'm not saying it's bad, I'm saying I don't know. $5,400 at base $1,200 is certainly not enough information for me personally to make an assumption, though.
Besides, even if it is good, can probably get the same $$$ EV in less expected time on multiple much lower plays with far less risk.
Meadows casino if anyone is interested.
