Poll

4 votes (44.44%)
3 votes (33.33%)
2 votes (22.22%)
4 votes (44.44%)
4 votes (44.44%)
3 votes (33.33%)
3 votes (33.33%)
3 votes (33.33%)
1 vote (11.11%)
4 votes (44.44%)

9 members have voted

Wizard
Administrator
Wizard
Joined: Oct 14, 2009
  • Threads: 1433
  • Posts: 24587
August 17th, 2022 at 3:06:29 AM permalink
My latest video from the 2022 Table Game Protection and Table Games Conference is up. This one is by our very own SphinxOfCups. That said, let's try to be nice.


Direct: https://youtu.be/kaAyp3rMOmE

The question for the poll is would you play Rule Out!
It's not whether you win or lose; it's whether or not you had a good bet.
gordonm888
Administrator
gordonm888
Joined: Feb 18, 2015
  • Threads: 57
  • Posts: 3874
August 17th, 2022 at 8:30:17 AM permalink
This is a game that uses non-standard decks of cards. It's hard to form an opinion about how much fun this game is without an understanding of the rules and the various decks used in the game.

Is there any online statement of the Rule Out rules?

How many jokers in the deck?

And where can we find information on the composition of the "rules deck?" Is the "rules deck" reshuffled each time?
So many better men, a few of them friends, are dead. And a thousand thousand slimy things live on, and so do I.
gordonm888
Administrator
gordonm888
Joined: Feb 18, 2015
  • Threads: 57
  • Posts: 3874
August 17th, 2022 at 8:43:34 AM permalink
Also, there are 21 different optional side-bets. Holy Craps! Twenty of these side-bets were not explained in the video.
So many better men, a few of them friends, are dead. And a thousand thousand slimy things live on, and so do I.
Wizard
Administrator
Wizard
Joined: Oct 14, 2009
  • Threads: 1433
  • Posts: 24587
August 17th, 2022 at 9:07:53 AM permalink
Quote: gordonm888

Also, there are 21 different optional side-bets. Holy Craps! Twenty of these side-bets were not explained in the video.
link to original post



Yes, that is my bad for not asking about them. Hopefully Sphinx will come along to answer all questions.
It's not whether you win or lose; it's whether or not you had a good bet.
SphinxOfCups
SphinxOfCups
Joined: Sep 2, 2021
  • Threads: 2
  • Posts: 44
August 17th, 2022 at 10:07:39 AM permalink
Hi there, that's me and my game! Very excited to be able to show it to all of you. I definitely learned a lot from this conference so some things have changed slightly, most specifically with the layout design and non-standard card faces.

Quote: gordonm888

This is a game that uses non-standard decks of cards. It's hard to form an opinion about how much fun this game is without an understanding of the rules and the various decks used in the game.

Is there any online statement of the Rule Out rules?

How many jokers in the deck?

And where can we find information on the composition of the "rules deck?" Is the "rules deck" reshuffled each time?
link to original post


It's definitely a unique game, and the non-standard cards can make it feel a bit daunting, but they are only handled by the dealer and are fully public-knowledge, with only 15 different cards, so I try to keep things as simple as possible. The game is really intended to target newer players who don't know a good Poker hand or Basic Strategy, so they still have to learn a new game, but the mechanics and the strategy are approachable and easily identifiable after a hand or two.

We do have a website at www.novelgamesstudios.com, which has the Rack Card, Rules of Play, and a playable demo. I can also give a brief statement here if needed, but to answer some of your direct questions:

The game is played with 2 Jokers per deck. We were playing with a 6-deck shoe at the conference, so we had 12 Jokers total in there. The Jokers are of course technically countable, but a combination of a high house edge on the side bet and a house rule limiting the side bet wager to not-more than the main bet help keep it from being beatable.

The Rule Deck's composition is listed on the table, what you mistook below as optional side bets. All 15 are displayed for the player to be able to make an informed decision about their trade. Although, once you have the strategy down, players don't really need to pay attention to the chart, making Rule Out! great to play with friends as it's easy to hold a conversation while playing.

Each Rule Deck contains exactly 15 cards, 1 of each, and is shuffled every hand. At the conference, we used a shoe of shuffled Rule Decks with cut cards between each deck, so after each hand, the remaining 12 cards of that deck get burned, and they all get discarded together to be shuffled later. However we've found that neither a shoe with cut cards or 1 deck shuffled every hand have a significant advantage when it comes to time between hands.

Quote: gordonm888

Also, there are 21 different optional side-bets. Holy Craps! Twenty of these side-bets were not explained in the video.
link to original post


I can see your confusion here, but as explained above there's only the one side bet, on the Joker. The chart on the table was designed to allow for relatively easy legibility so players could feel informed, while offering a wide play space for the players' cards (in the new layout design, not shown here). There's certainly a possibility for the rule squares to become side bets if the game becomes popular, but definitely prioritizing getting the core gameplay out there right now.
Wizard
Administrator
Wizard
Joined: Oct 14, 2009
  • Threads: 1433
  • Posts: 24587
August 17th, 2022 at 10:21:50 AM permalink
Quote: SphinxOfCups

I can see your confusion here, but as explained above there's only the one side bet, on the Joker. The chart on the table was designed to allow for relatively easy legibility so players could feel informed, while offering a wide play space for the players' cards (in the new layout design, not shown here). There's certainly a possibility for the rule squares to become side bets if the game becomes popular, but definitely prioritizing getting the core gameplay out there right now.
link to original post



Yes. Now it is coming back to me. I should have made it clear in the video about the unique "rule out" cards and how they were clearly indicated on the layout.
It's not whether you win or lose; it's whether or not you had a good bet.
ChumpChange
ChumpChange
Joined: Jun 15, 2018
  • Threads: 76
  • Posts: 3404
August 17th, 2022 at 10:43:56 AM permalink
I don't like the rules. They aren't pre-determined. They come out at you from a blind deck of cards. I'd have a better chance at the Squid Game.
SphinxOfCups
SphinxOfCups
Joined: Sep 2, 2021
  • Threads: 2
  • Posts: 44
Thanks for this post from:
ChumpChange
August 17th, 2022 at 11:21:33 AM permalink
Quote: ChumpChange

I don't like the rules. They aren't pre-determined. They come out at you from a blind deck of cards. I'd have a better chance at the Squid Game.
link to original post


The cards in your hand aren't predetermined either, so that's an interesting through-line especially for a gambling game, but you're certainly welcome not to like it--no game is for everyone.

As I said in the video, following the optimal trading strategy (which is really easy to identify and doesn't require careful consideration of what all possible rules could come out, far from it), the house edge comes down to about 1-1.5%. No spoilers for Squid Game but it seems to me like that is designed to have a 99% house edge. Take your pick.

If you can tell red from black, you can play this game at the smallest possible edge.
Wizard
Administrator
Wizard
Joined: Oct 14, 2009
  • Threads: 1433
  • Posts: 24587
Thanks for this post from:
SphinxOfCups
August 17th, 2022 at 12:40:39 PM permalink
Quote: ChumpChange

I don't like the rules. They aren't pre-determined. They come out at you from a blind deck of cards. I'd have a better chance at the Squid Game.
link to original post



The rules are quantified. I know the video didn't state the composition of the dealer deck, but Sphinx said it is disclosed at the table.

Only one player out of 456 survived. It's comparing apples to oranges, but Rule Out has a house edge of about 1.5%, which isn't bad for a new game.
It's not whether you win or lose; it's whether or not you had a good bet.
charliepatrick
charliepatrick
Joined: Jun 17, 2011
  • Threads: 36
  • Posts: 2670
Thanks for this post from:
SphinxOfCups
August 17th, 2022 at 12:58:17 PM permalink
Quote: Wizard

...The rules are quantified...

Their site has a document ( https://www.novelgamesstudios.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/05/Rule-Out-Rules-of-Play.pdf ) with most of the details.

  • Jump to: