AlanMendelson
AlanMendelson
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December 10th, 2020 at 10:58:59 AM permalink
There are four sides to the top used to play Dreidel during Hannukah. Given a fair dreidel without bias would a casino do well offering Dreidel as a table game?

The four sides are as follows:
1. Take the whole pot
2. Take half the pot
3. Your entry goes into the pot
4. Nothing happens-- no win or loss

It appears to me the casino would have a 25% chance of winning on each player's spin; a 25% of no outcome; a 25% chance of losing all wins and a 25% chance of losing half of all wins.

But Dreidel is a parimutual game, so I think the best strategy for the casino would be having a commission on each bet or win, similar to the vig on 4 and 10 in craps or the banker bet in Baccarat.

What does the Minyan say?
Last edited by: AlanMendelson on Dec 10, 2020
DeMango
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December 10th, 2020 at 11:20:26 AM permalink
Alan: I bet you could take the whole pot 18 times in a row!
When a rock is thrown into a pack of dogs, the one that yells the loudest is the one who got hit.
darkoz
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December 10th, 2020 at 11:45:16 AM permalink
I'm waiting for the Dreidel Bias proponents to come forward
For Whom the bus tolls; The bus tolls for thee
SOOPOO
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December 10th, 2020 at 11:51:14 AM permalink
Quote: darkoz

I'm waiting for the Dreidel Bias proponents to come forward



If you google ‘dreidel setting class’ you will find my video. I prefer the ‘flying hay’ to the ‘torquing nun’ set. I have been backed off from more Hanukkah parties than I care to remember. I have rolled ten ‘gimmels’ in a row, verified by the International Society of Dreidel Rollers.
Hunterhill
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December 10th, 2020 at 12:22:08 PM permalink
If I deposit 50k will you let me watch you win?
Also I want to see what kind of watch you have.
The mountain is tall but grass grows on top of the mountain.
AlanMendelson
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December 10th, 2020 at 12:33:51 PM permalink
I didnt want to get into Dreidel bias, but I'm pretty sure the Shin side has more mass.
Wizard
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December 10th, 2020 at 1:07:44 PM permalink
I bet on the symbol that looks like pi.
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
PokerGrinder
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December 10th, 2020 at 1:09:09 PM permalink
As a Jewish man this is my new favourite thread 😂
You can shear a sheep a hundred times, but you can skin it only once. — Amarillo Slim Preston
darkoz
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December 10th, 2020 at 1:13:10 PM permalink
Quote: Hunterhill

If I deposit 50k will you let me watch you win?
Also I want to see what kind of watch you have.



Ask me what type of watch I have and I will pull out my cell phone
For Whom the bus tolls; The bus tolls for thee
SOOPOO
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December 10th, 2020 at 1:25:44 PM permalink
Quote: Hunterhill

If I deposit 50k will you let me watch you win?
Also I want to see what kind of watch you have.



In general I end up paying those who watch me, in the form of lunch or such! Sometimes a new friend from here will buy me lunch.

I do not wear a watch, but do own a ‘Jules Jurgensen ‘ gold watch that my grandfather was given as a retirement gift from the IBEW around 1965. I think it’s worth less than $1k. I have faint recollections of playing dreidel with my grandfather from 50 years ago. Pretty sure we kids won what was called ‘Hanukkah Gelt’, which were chocolates wrapped to look like gold coins.
darkoz
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December 10th, 2020 at 1:38:43 PM permalink
Quote: SOOPOO

In general I end up paying those who watch me, in the form of lunch or such! Sometimes a new friend from here will buy me lunch.

I do not wear a watch, but do own a ‘Jules Jurgensen ‘ gold watch that my grandfather was given as a retirement gift from the IBEW around 1965. I think it’s worth less than $1k. I have faint recollections of playing dreidel with my grandfather from 50 years ago. Pretty sure we kids won what was called ‘Hanukkah Gelt’, which were chocolates wrapped to look like gold coins.



They still have those chocolate gold coins around.

I see them usually at Disneyland around the Pirates of the Caribbean ride.

Of course in that situation they aren't Hannukah Gelt but Pirate booty
For Whom the bus tolls; The bus tolls for thee
AlanMendelson
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December 10th, 2020 at 1:54:38 PM permalink
I think we need to invent a Pentagon shaped table to accommodate four players plus the dealer who will collect the vig on each bet. Is 5% like the vig on craps buy bets and the baccarat banker's bet acceptable?

Does each player get to choose his dreidel from a group of five like in craps?

Is there a rule about the number of turns to determine a valid spin?

If the Dreidel lands in the bank of chips is it no spin?

Do the cocktail waitresses serve Manischewitz?
AlanMendelson
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December 11th, 2020 at 12:08:31 AM permalink
Quote: Wizard

I bet on the symbol that looks like pi.



Not a bad choice as the Hebrew letter that resembles pi represents winning half the pot.

I suggest you only gamble at Dreidel with a tribe member to advise you.

To be sure the tribe member is giving you good advice be sure he's wearing a Rolex and a huge Chai or Jewish star in gold around his neck.
Wizard
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December 11th, 2020 at 10:08:40 AM permalink

Direct: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DtlLHwk9_Rw

To be honest, I'm confused whether the purposes of the dreidel is for gambling or to teach kids the Hebrew alphabet? Do all dreidels have the same four letters or can they have any of them?
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
PokerGrinder
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December 11th, 2020 at 10:29:12 AM permalink
Always the same 4 letters.
You can shear a sheep a hundred times, but you can skin it only once. — Amarillo Slim Preston
Gialmere
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December 11th, 2020 at 10:41:24 AM permalink
Quote: PokerGrinder

Always the same 4 letters.


Aren't the dreidels in Israel lettered slightly different from those sold elsewhere?
Have you tried 22 tonight? I said 22.
VladAlex1
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December 11th, 2020 at 4:53:29 PM permalink
Here is link for the dreidel stickers
Save-Scale for the small Print- Cut - Stick

https://photos.app.goo.gl/uUCChqBD3gyjsPvAA

Enjoy game
Happy Hanukkah
I’d rather have to be a lucky player than good one.
VladAlex1
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December 11th, 2020 at 5:03:39 PM permalink
On the four sides of the dreidel appear four letters from the Hebrew alphabet:

Nun (נ)
Gimmel (ג)
Hey (ה)
Shin (ש)

Together nun, gimmel, hay and shin translate to “a great miracle happened there.”

Steps:
1. Divide the ante equally amongst all players.

2. Everyone takes a turn at spinning the dreidel, the one with the highest spin has first turn. Note: nun is highest, then gimmel, hey, and shin. If there is a tie, those who tied spin again.

3. Everyone puts one token of the ante into the middle (the pot).

4. Spin the dreidel once — depending on the side it lands on, you give or get tokens from the pot.

Shin: put one more token in the pot
Nun: do nothing
Gimmel: take all tokens from the pot
Hay: take half of all tokens lying in the pot. In case of an odd number of tokens, round up.

5. Pass the dreidel on to the next player after your turn is finished in a clockwise direction.

6. Keep playing until someone wins by collecting all the tokens.

7. If you run out of tokens, you are either "out," or you may ask another player for a loan.

Don't own a dreidel? Make it out of paper!

Print
https://www.cbc.ca/kidscbc2/content/pdf/kidscbc_makedreidel.pdf
I’d rather have to be a lucky player than good one.
VladAlex1
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December 11th, 2020 at 5:09:24 PM permalink
instruction video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EkTLN1T17p4&ab_channel=Howcast
I’d rather have to be a lucky player than good one.
Doc
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December 12th, 2020 at 9:31:05 AM permalink
Quote: Wizard

I bet on the symbol that looks like pi.


Quote: AlanMendelson

Not a bad choice as the Hebrew letter that resembles pi represents winning half the pot.


Quote: VladAlex1

On the four sides of the dreidel appear four letters from the Hebrew alphabet:
Nun (נ)
Gimmel (ג)
Hey (ה)
Shin (ש)


This post is being offered by a Gentile who has never spun a dreidel and who knows approximately zero about Jewish culture, tradition, language, or even the alphabet. However, the posts above reminded me of some very recent experiences in my life, so I thought I would share them for your entertainment and/or boredom.

On Wednesday evening 12/9 (a day before this thread was even started), my wife and I re-watched our Blu-ray recording of the 1995 film “Get Shorty”, staring John Travolta, Gene Hackman, Rene Russo, Danny DeVito, Dennis Farina, and a number of other very-well-known actors. During that viewing, I observed something I had never noticed before: throughout the film the low-end-movie producer, Harry Zimm (played by Gene Hackman), is wearing a gold necklace with a pendant that looked (to me) like the lower-case Greek pi, perhaps a bit like the Wizard thought the dreidel included a symbol that looked like pi. In the film, there is never any mention of the necklace.

After watching the film, I read the IMDB entry for this film to see whether there were any interesting features I had missed once again. In the trivia section of that site, there is a post that says, “Although Harry Zimm (Gene Hackman) is never explicitly referred to as being Jewish, throughout the film, he is shown wearing a necklace with a pendant in the shape of the Hebrew word 'chai' (life).”

O.K., so the pendant really showed a full Hebrew word, not just a single Greek letter. According to Wikipedia, that word is spelled with two characters, Yod and Chet. Together (if this comes through properly in a forum post), they look like: חי . Perhaps you can visualize how I confused the combination with a Greek pi when seeing them on a pendant in a movie. In my Gentile ignorance, I suspect that this “Chet” is the same as the character “Het” (listed elsewhere in Wiki as a Hebrew character) and the same as the “Hey” stated in VladAlex1’s post above.

Anyway, when I read that at IMDB, I was reminded of the song from the wedding in the play and film “Fiddler on the Roof”, with the repeated lyrics:

“To life, to life, l'chaim
L'chaim, l'chaim, to life.”

Ain’t it amusing how a good supply of ignorance can connect the topics of a musical play/film, a gangster-wants-to-become-a-movie-producer film, a Hanukkah tradition, a proposed casino game, and a complexity of ways to try to represent Hebrew characters using the English language and Roman alphabet (a word derived from two Greek letters)?
Last edited by: Doc on Dec 12, 2020
PokerGrinder
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December 12th, 2020 at 10:32:18 AM permalink
Quote: Doc

This post is being offered by a Gentile who has never spun a dreidel and who knows approximately zero about Jewish culture, tradition, language, or even the alphabet. However, the posts above reminded me of some very recent experiences in my life, so I thought I would share them for your entertainment and/or boredom.

On Wednesday evening 12/9 (a day before this thread was even started), my wife and I re-watched our Blu-ray recording of the 1995 film “Get Shorty”, staring John Travolta, Gene Hackman, Rene Russo, Danny DeVito, Dennis Farina, and a number of other very-well-known actors. During that viewing, I observed something I had never noticed before: throughout the film the low-end-movie producer, Harry Zimm (played by Gene Hackman), is wearing a gold necklace with a pendant that looked (to me) like the lower-case Greek pi, perhaps a bit like the Wizard thought the dreidel included a symbol that looked like pi. In the film, there is never any mention of the necklace.

After watching the film, I read the IMDB entry for this film to see whether there were any interesting features I had missed once again. In the trivia section of that site, there is a post that says, “Although Harry Zimm (Gene Hackman) is never explicitly referred to as being Jewish, throughout the film, he is shown wearing a necklace with a pendant in the shape of the Hebrew word 'chai' (life).”

O.K., so the pendant really showed a full Hebrew word, not just a single Greek letter. According to Wikipedia, that word is spelled with two characters, Yod and Chet. Together (if this comes through properly in a forum post), they look like: חי Perhaps you can visualize how I confused the combination with a Greek pi when seeing them on a pendant in a movie. In my Gentile ignorance, I suspect that this “Chet” is the same as the character “Het” listed elsewhere in Wiki as a Hebrew character) and the same as the “Hey” stated in VladAlex1’s post above.

Anyway, when I read that at IMDB, I was reminded of the song from the wedding in the play and film “Fiddler on the Roof”, with the repeated lyrics:

“To life, to life, l'chaim
L'chaim, l'chaim, to life.”

Ain’t it amusing how a good supply of ignorance can connect the topics of a musical play/film, a gangster-wants-to-become-a-movie-producer film, a Hanukkah tradition, a proposed casino game, and a complexity of ways to try to represent Hebrew characters using the English language and Roman alphabet (a word derived from two Greek letters)?


Not bad investigating... for a gentile 😂
You can shear a sheep a hundred times, but you can skin it only once. — Amarillo Slim Preston
Gialmere
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December 13th, 2020 at 11:07:23 AM permalink


Have you tried 22 tonight? I said 22.
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