6 card Pai Gow Poker

I was playing Pai Gow Poker last night, and another player was talking about a recent trip to Vegas. He was going on and on about a 6 card variant where only one card is put in the smaller hand. Does anyone have experience with that game? Where can I find it in Vegas? Any idea what the house edge is?

Sounds like Mini Pai Gow.

LOL. I looked through the entire Pai Gow Poker section of the WOO site, and didn't even look for another game page. Thank you:-)

Quote: rdw4potus

I was playing Pai Gow Poker last night, and another player was talking about a recent trip to Vegas. He was going on and on about a 6 card variant where only one card is put in the smaller hand. Does anyone have experience with that game? Where can I find it in Vegas? Any idea what the house edge is?

Are you STILL at HSI?? Did you move in there? :-)

Quote: ruascott

Are you STILL at HSI?? Did you move in there? :-)

LOL. Back home in MN now. Playing at Canterbury Park up here. It's a little less fun than at HSI, but players can touch their cards at any time, so it moves a lot faster. Also, commissions are rounded down to the nearest $.50, so there's basically no house edge if I bet $15/hand and bank whenever I can at a full table.

I might be back down in KY in mid-August. If I do go, I'll try to set it up so I'm there sat-thurs so I can try the deck at the grand vic.

Quote: Wizard

Sounds like Mini Pai Gow.

So I'm reading this page, when I came to an interesting comment:

Quote:

It took me months of pestering dealers to arrive at this understanding of the house way. Still, I could be mistaken. If the above is not correct, I welcome correction.

It is my understanding that you can request to look at the dealer's reminder card / cheat sheet upon request, just to make sure that the dealer actually is following the "House Way". And if the dealer / floorperson refuses, that you can go to Gaming and report it and/or request it.

Am I wrong?

Does that only apply to regular Pai Gow Poker? If so, why?

From:
http://www.wsgc.wa.gov/docs/game_rules/mini_pai_gow.pdf

Quote:

House Ways
1) No Pair - Dealer MUST play the highest ranking card in the High Hand, the second highest ranking
card in the Low Hand and the remaining cards in the High Hand.
2) The Dealer may NOT break apart any sets or made hands. The Dealer may not break apart any
one pair, two pairs, three of a kind, straights, flushes, full houses, four of a kinds, straight flush or
royal flush in order to play a higher card in the Low Hand. Once the dealer has played the set, he
must use the highest-ranking kicker as his low hand.
3) 1st clarification to rule #2 - If the Dealer has two three of a kinds in his hand he will play three of the
lower ranking card and two of the higher ranking card (Full House) as the high hand in order to
play the higher ranking card in the Low Hand.
4) 2nd clarification to rule #2 - If the Dealer has 3 pair, he will play the lower ranking two pairs as the
high hand and the highest ranking card of the 3rd pair in the second highest hand.
- 3 -
5) 3rd clarification to rule #2 – If the Dealer has a 6-card straight or flush, the Dealer must use the
highest ranking card as the low hand and use the lower ranking straight or flush as the high hand
Important Notes
1) The Joker can only be used as an “Ace” or a “Wild Card” to complete Straights or Flushes; it is
acceptable for a Player to play Ace high as the high hand and Joker as the low.
2) If the Player’s High Hand ties the Dealer’s High Hand, this is considered a loss for the Player.
3) For the Low Hand, all ties of Two through Ace are considered a loss for the Player.
4) If, in the Low Hand, the Player has a Joker and the Dealer has an Ace, this is considered a win for
the Player in the Low Hand.

I've bolded the line that says low hand ties included aces are a win for the dealer. Player will win Joker vs. Ace tie. This is the only thing I noticed is different than what's on The WoO site.

Quote: DJTeddyBear

It is my understanding that you can request to look at the dealer's reminder card / cheat sheet upon request, just to make sure that the dealer actually is following the "House Way". And if the dealer / floorperson refuses, that you can go to Gaming and report it and/or request it.

Am I wrong?

Does that only apply to regular Pai Gow Poker? If so, why?

I think you are indeed wrong. I've asked for house ways in pai gow poker lots of times, and am rebuffed about 90% of the time. Usually they say that players may inquire how the house would play a specific hand, but can't just see the whole strategy.

I strongly oppose this, by the way. I think players should have the right to know the rules of what they are playing. The most ridiculous such request was at the Tropicana in Atlantic City. They had a piece of paper showing the basic rules of pai gow poker, which said in small print that the house way was available upon request. So I requested it, the floorman produced it from a drawer in the pit, but noticed it didn't have the phone number for Gambler's Anonymous on it, so he couldn't let me read it. I suggested he just write the phone number on it himself, but he did not oblige.

Quote: miplet

I've bolded the line that says low hand ties included aces are a win for the dealer. Player will win Joker vs. Ace tie. This is the only thing I noticed is different than what's on The WoO site.

I think they play by different rules in Washington than Vegas. It was made very clear to me here that ace-ace ties are a push, except a joker-ace tie goes to the player when the player holds the joker.

Quote:

House Ways
...
Important Notes
1) The Joker can only be used as an “Ace” or a “Wild Card” to complete Straights or Flushes; it is
acceptable for a Player to play Ace high as the high hand and Joker as the low.
2) If the Player’s High Hand ties the Dealer’s High Hand, this is considered a loss for the Player.
3) For the Low Hand, all ties of Two through Ace are considered a loss for the Player.
4) If, in the Low Hand, the Player has a Joker and the Dealer has an Ace, this is considered a win for
the Player in the Low Hand.

The two points I put in yellow seemed contradictory, until I really thought about it.

If you're dealt something like 2367A* you can play it one of three ways:

236A* 7 has a terrible low and a pair of Aces for a relatively easily beatable high. It may push, but just as easily lose.
2367* A has a great low, but a crappy high. It will probably push, with a slim chance of a win as well as a chance to lose. It will lose if the dealer has a pair or better, with an Ace singleton. It will WIN if the dealer doesn't have a minimum of Ace Eight high for the high hand.
2367A * has the ultimate low with a crappy high. It has a guaranteed minimum of a push. It has the same chance to win if the dealer doesn't have Ace Eight minimum.

VERY interesting.

Quote: DJTeddyBear

If you're dealt something like 2347A* you can play it one of three ways:

234A* 7 has a terrible low and a pair of Aces for a relatively easily beatable high. It may push, but just as easily lose.
2347* A has a great low, but a crappy high. It will probably push, with a slim chance of a win as well as a chance to lose (It will lose if the dealer has a pair or better, with an Ace singleton.)
2347A * has the ultimate low with a crappy high. It has a guaranteed minimum of a push. It will WIN if the dealer doesn't have a minimum of Ace Eight high for the high hand.

VERY interesting.

Isn't your first scenario a wheel straight with a 7 up?

Quote: rdw4potus

Isn't your first scenario a wheel straight with a 7 up?

OOPS. I'll edit it....

I have no idea what the house edge is, but it seems that the chance of a copy in the low (one-card) hand is HUGE, given that that card will almost always be in the 10-A range. Since you cannot win then, and will lose half of the time (tying the other half), this would seem to impart a DRASTIC house edge. I wouldn't touch this game with my ten-foot pole.

Quote: rdw4potus

I was playing Pai Gow Poker last night, and another player was talking about a recent trip to Vegas. He was going on and on about a 6 card variant where only one card is put in the smaller hand. Does anyone have experience with that game? Where can I find it in Vegas? Any idea what the house edge is?

When I was there in February, Mini Pai Gow was available at Flamingo. They also have it at Harrah's Kansas City and Ameristar St. Charles.

If you're allowed to play the joker in the low, I play it that way. For some reason, I don't think you're allowed to where I play. If not, then of course I'm playing the wheel.

Quote: Wizard

Sounds like Mini Pai Gow.

Sorry for the old bump, but I just played a version called "6 card fortune pai gow poker" that allows the player to "double down" on any hand, but in order to qualify, the dealer high hand must be at least a pair of eights. Any chance the odds can be updated to reflect this variant (or perhaps a new page could be added?) The game appears on the BallyMaster website

I played the 6-card Fortune pai gow at Downstream Casino last night, was down about 30-45 bucks before receiving a hand with all four aces. Sure enough, the dealer had the Joker in his hand as part of a straight. I split the hand as trip aces, with an ace up top. Pushed the main bet, but got 50-1 for the Fortune. But that joker would have looked even better in my hand, as part of a 1,000-1 payday XD

Quote: cestanl

I played the 6-card Fortune pai gow at Downstream Casino last night, was down about 30-45 bucks before receiving a hand with all four aces. Sure enough, the dealer had the Joker in his hand as part of a straight. I split the hand as trip aces, with an ace up top. Pushed the main bet, but got 50-1 for the Fortune. But that joker would have looked even better in my hand, as part of a 1,000-1 payday XD

Nice hand! Could you post or PM more about that casino, please (assuming it's the one just south of the KS/MO state line in OK). We're staying there a couple of nights in March (family wedding).