binary128
binary128
Joined: Nov 5, 2011
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September 13th, 2013 at 3:46:53 PM permalink
I just received the following request from a customer concerning our European Roulette game.

Quote: customer

However your European Roulette don't seem to allow free spins, a bet is always required before the wheel could be spun. Any plans to allow free spins so that it is similar to other casinos?


I don't understand this at all, How could a player hope to make money unless there is a bet on the table?

They also reference "other casinos", but I have never seen anything like this anywhere else. (Of course, I haven't actually been looking for it.)

Can anyone help me out here?

Chris
wudged
wudged
Joined: Aug 7, 2013
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September 13th, 2013 at 4:00:26 PM permalink
Some players like to look for trends - bet same as last, opposite last, etc.
thecesspit
thecesspit
Joined: Apr 19, 2010
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September 13th, 2013 at 4:04:17 PM permalink
Quote: binary128

I just received the following request from a customer concerning our European Roulette game.


I don't understand this at all, How could a player hope to make money unless there is a bet on the table?

They also reference "other casinos", but I have never seen anything like this anywhere else. (Of course, I haven't actually been looking for it.)

Can anyone help me out here?

Chris



I have seen at least one site (whose name I forget) that allowed you to effectively bet 0 on most games.

There's Baccarat players, for example, that would like to see patterns before betting. I can imagine roulette players would like to 'chart' the table first.

I'd imagine this is behaviour you'd like to encourage... as in an online casino, the cost to you for spin with no action is so marginal it is effectively 0.
"Then you can admire the real gambler, who has neither eaten, slept, thought nor lived, he has so smarted under the scourge of his martingale, so suffered on the rack of his desire for a coup at trente-et-quarante" - Honore de Balzac, 1829
EvenBob
EvenBob
Joined: Jul 18, 2010
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September 13th, 2013 at 4:23:54 PM permalink
Many players use systems that don't require a bet
on every spin. There are ways around the no free
bets rule. Play on a 10 cent table and bet red and
black at the same time. When the zero appears you
only lose 20 cents. When you see a bet you like,
you can make a larger wager. Some B&M casinos
won't allow you to bet B&R at the same time, there
are ways around that, too.
"It's not enough to succeed, your friends must fail." Gore Vidal
binary128
binary128
Joined: Nov 5, 2011
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September 14th, 2013 at 8:07:22 AM permalink
Quick response - If what the player wants to do is to just spin the wheel (for mapping, trends, bias, what have you) without having any money on the table, I have no problem providing that at all.

However - is this indeed exactly what this customer is referring to?

Of course, we have our "Play for Free" casino, but everybody knows that all of those free casinos are rigged :(

I find that incredibly frustrating - and not just for the amount of time and trouble we go to to make sure that the game play experience is IDENTICAL. (We even added a Play Log system to the "Play for Free" product a few months ago, which proved to be a non-trivial accomplishment. Thank you all for noticing.)

But the only product of ours that I routinely play is the "Play for Free" demo on our web site - I have half a dozen of what I'll label "favorite games". And of course I always prefer to play on a rigged product.

Chris
lojo
lojo
Joined: Jun 24, 2013
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September 16th, 2013 at 11:40:33 PM permalink
Quote: binary128

Quick response - If what the player wants to do is to just spin the wheel (for mapping, trends, bias, what have you) without having any money on the table, I have no problem providing that at all.

However - is this indeed exactly what this customer is referring to?

Of course, we have our "Play for Free" casino, but everybody knows that all of those free casinos are rigged :(

I find that incredibly frustrating - and not just for the amount of time and trouble we go to to make sure that the game play experience is IDENTICAL. (We even added a Play Log system to the "Play for Free" product a few months ago, which proved to be a non-trivial accomplishment. Thank you all for noticing.)

But the only product of ours that I routinely play is the "Play for Free" demo on our web site - I have half a dozen of what I'll label "favorite games". And of course I always prefer to play on a rigged product.

Chris


The guy is looking for a weakness, simple as. Of course it makes no sense but let him have his fun. Show him, if she is a bonafide customer, your credentials proving free play is the same as real money and toss the tosser a dime to try to show it isn't true. If it is a wanker nary mind, people are superstitious and it could be one. Actually, you could make a marketing blitz of it! Say, if you and your numbers people put up something like Michael did (so long ago I forget the parameters) and offers free games AS A CHALLENGE (beat my RNG) maybe this silliness would go to sleep once and for all. But, seeings as how you brought it up, I'm guessing it ain't just a wanker asking - unless you're a bit bored? hehe.

You shouldn't have to go to any time or trouble to make sure this and that are identical - it should be the same maths. So I misread that. I didn't notice the Play Log system. Cool.

There is no difference between "systems" and trying to beat the RNG. People will look for a weakness because of the Hero incident. There is meme out there, urban legend. The maths always win. Capitalize on it is all I am suggesting. Challenge the fools!
binary128
binary128
Joined: Nov 5, 2011
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September 19th, 2013 at 5:39:45 AM permalink
Quote: lojo

You shouldn't have to go to any time or trouble to make sure this and that are identical - it should be the same maths. So I misread that. I didn't notice the Play Log system. Cool.


Yes, the math algorithms are exactly the same. But the applications (Play for Free and Play for Real) are different in dozens of little ways.

One records all data in a remote database, the other doesn't. One records all data relative to some player credentials, the other doesn't. One sends money back and forth to a parent account, the other doesn't. (Until a little while ago, one had a 500-game play log, while the other didn't.) Access control, launch into a game, exit control, and so forth - all different.

It is all of these little differences to which I was referring. These differences manifest in the compiled code, the server VBScript, the client JavaScript, the client ActionScript, the client Flash, the Help system, etc.

Even with all of these differences, the player's overall gaming experience should be identical.

Otherwise, you're right - the math that defines all game results is identical - copy and paste.

Bottom line - I've decided to put "add free spins in Roulette" on our "To Do List". It makes no difference to me, and we're in business to give the Players what they want.

Chris
binary128
binary128
Joined: Nov 5, 2011
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September 20th, 2013 at 12:26:09 PM permalink
Quote: lojo

Actually, you could make a marketing blitz of it! Say, if you and your numbers people put up something like Michael did (so long ago I forget the parameters) and offers free games AS A CHALLENGE (beat my RNG) maybe this silliness would go to sleep once and for all.


I've thought about something like that on and off through the years.

The thing is - I never figured out how to actually work it. I know I'd need to run it off the Galewind web site, as I don't think Pinnacle would be up for it. We do have a "Play for Real" demo that is available on the site, but I need to assign you an ID (and provide a URL) for you to get in.

I could see the whole thing turning into a mess (either that, or nothing happens at all).

Maybe I'll just think about it for a few more years.

Chris
lojo
lojo
Joined: Jun 24, 2013
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September 20th, 2013 at 4:25:35 PM permalink
Quote: binary128

I've thought about something like that on and off through the years.

....
Maybe I'll just think about it for a few more years.

Chris


hehe, yeah that's probably the best way 'forward' for something like that without a pure path to ROI for entering the quagmire (someone did NOT just say giggity giggity!)

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