bet = totalLosses*5
I dunno. Lemme know if I am right?
Quote: TorghattenSomewhere you can short BCs?
You'll probably never be able to short actual bitcoins. Eventually there will be bitcoin backed securities though.
The WIR Bank is an independent complementary currency system in Switzerland that serves small and medium-sized businesses and retail customers. It exists only as a bookkeeping system, with no scrip, to facilitate transactions. WIR has 62,000 members. Total assets are approximately 3.0 billion CHF, as of 2005. It has an ISO currency code is CHW. WIR has a stable history,and has remained fully operational during times of general economic crisis.
The Swiss Franc is nominally not supposed to exceed it's celing of 20% over the Euro. A Swiss Franc is currently 7% over the US dollar.
Quote: PITdoodDoes anyone here have any experience/interest in bitcoin-based gambling? It seems to me that bitcoins circumvent the US online gambling laws, which target the bank transactions rather than the gambling itself. I signed up for a site called Dragon's Tale (dragons.tl), which is attempting to do just that. It has a MMO theme to it, but all the 'quests' are gambling games - some luck-based, some skill-based. Also, they 'faucet' out some kSats (.00001 btc) to get you started. This was actually what first got me interested, as I just wanted to have some bitcoins. The game is currently in alpha, and it looks great so far. Wondering what everyone here thinks about this
There are quite a few. Most are just EV- games that you can't defeat. But there is some good poker selection and the skill level is really bad. A lot of it is just people gambling away their coins.
Sealswithclubs is okay.
Quote: djatcIs bitcoin mining worth the hassle? I have an extra computer that I don't mind leaving a program on all day I could allocate to this..... and my rent includes utilities so I won't pay anything extra.
Yes, it is worth the hassle if you are willing to invest at least $600 in graphics cards (get 2x 7950) and install them in the extra computer. It is not worth the hassle with an extra crappy computers you have laying around. Those won't mine worth a damn.
Your profit expectation is very good if you can externalize the power costs onto your landlord. If bitcoin mining profitability drops due to ASIC then you can switch to litecoin or sell the cards for a small loss.
Quote: djatcIs bitcoin mining worth the hassle?
Depends. It's only a small gain.
http://www.bitcoinx.com/profit/
2xHD7950 at $1,000 rig cost, 500W draw, 1 Ghash/s total gives, per year, $1,460 revenue, $800 minus power cost, but with $1000 for h/w deducted a total loss of $200. With free power a gain of $460.
This is 24/7/365; in practice your uptime and performance will be in 80%-90% range of that.
So it comes down to a few questions:
1. Are you a gamer?
If yes, you can use a pair of 7970's for own entertainment anyway. Just set them to mine coins.
2. Do you live in a cold climate?
If you're in a cold region, heat is no problem.
3. Can you place the mining rig outside?
You don't want the pain of having a heater in your home while you need air conditioning!
The noise from the cards, extra aircon draw, reduced comfort, if you have to deal with that - just isn't worth the yield. In the end it's just $4/day even with free power. And in a separate rig you have to invest in all the parts, platform and PSU.
I still think that it would make sense for a country like Switzerland to create a limited anonymous electronic currency separate from their primary national currency that could absorb some of this pressure. Instead Switzerland is spending billions of dollars trying to keep it's own currency low.
Quote: AhighIt's going to be all about the Butterfly ASIC's for the remaining 11m coins. 50GH/sec.
This assumes that BFL is not a gigantic scam and that they will ever ship products. I've been in Bitcoin for a while and I am not willing to trust them at all.
But ASICs will come, there are other brands.
There's definitely merit to wondering why would you sell something that pays for itself in 10 days?
Quote: bbvk05You'll probably never be able to short actual bitcoins. Eventually there will be bitcoin backed securities though.
If it gets to that point, though, it probably won't be worth it to short them most of the time.
Quote: BitFloor
All trading is currently suspended.
I am sorry to announce that due to circumstances outside of our control BitFloor must cease all trading operations indefinitely. Unfortunately, our US bank account is scheduled to be closed and we can no longer provide the same level of USD deposits and withdrawals as we have in the past. As such, I have made the decision to halt operations and return all funds.
Over the next days we will be working with all clients to ensure that everyone receives their funds. Please be patient as we process your request.
- Roman
founder - bitfloor.com
https://bitfloor.com
I took all but $10 out of here already, expecting they were on shaky ground. I don't even expect to get my $10 back. But interesting development.
Quote: pacomartinThe bitcoin is showing surprising resilience. It is back up at $118.60.
Bitfloor seems to have bitten the dust, but BitCoin is still pretty strong as a digital currency. A few days of craziness in the past, it looks good on a 10-day rolling window average price.
Quote: nezbitthis will crash... its a matter of when. Good luck if you are diving into it.
I searched for put options or sell shorts...couldnt find anything
what did it hit? $260? what was low shortly after? like $50? this count as a drop?...
guess i was way off with the crash... at least it will climb and fall again. Those butterflylabs machines dont/havent shipped yet. not sure whats up with them but something smells fishy with them. Plus if every one has 1.5terahashes, this will make the difficulty go up so fast that if you arent one of the first couple with one of them you will surely miss out on any profit. Plus who has $30,000 to drop on a virutal mining device?
If they were shipping them, i would pick them up and mine litecoin. It will do the same thing as bitcoin. currenlty litecoin is $5/coin and there is tons of them easily mineable just like bitcoins were in their infancy. If you are going to get in on something hit that shit.
Quote: nezbitwhat did it hit? $260? what was low shortly after? like $50? this count as a drop?...
I heard that it very briefly reached $266. It is now trading at $125.40 and I am not sure what the intermediate low was. Most data I see online is averaged over a fairly long period.
Links of interest:
A brief history of failed digital currency.
Stats on changes of electronic money denominated in Euro's which peaked at 4 billion Euros. Electronic money is broadly defined as an electronic store of monetary value on a technical device that may be widely used for making payments to undertakings other than the issuer without necessarily involving bank accounts in the transactions, but acting as a prepaid bearer instrument. In accordance with RegulationREGULATION (EC) No 25/2009 OF THE EUROPEAN CENTRAL BANK the amount outstanding of electronic money issued by euro area MFIs is included within the balance-sheet item "overnight deposits".
If you had some kind of surgical implant to monitor your physical fitness, it would be a great way to save on healthcare costs to allow people to generate money by becoming healthy instead of burning CPU cycles and just using up electricity.
My first day with Nike Fuel I didn't meet my goal. I am the most sedentary of beasts apparently. Although I did get points for driving my car, at least when I had to make a lot of turns.
I'm very curious what it thinks when I ride my motorcycle. I know I am the most physically fit when I am doing a lot of stuff on the motorcycle, but I'm guessing that that would be the maximum way to get the most fuel points.
I think I only got 1300 points yesterday, though.
http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/story/2013/04/26/business-bitcoin-tax.html
I wonder how the US taxman sees it.
Quote: AhighBitCoin is trading between 140 and 160 today. Just curious who else is doing alright with BC? I'm at double my initial investment and thinking of doing my 4th trade now. I can't believe I doubled my initial BC's in a couple of days. Those huge swings have been good to me.
I am killing it as well. Market fluctuations are entirely predictable based on time of day and market patterns. A very inefficient market right now due to difficulty in buying.
No plans at the moment what to do next, but I like having twice the cash that I started with and I'm going to hold that position for a while until another idea inspires me.
I might look into other digital currencies to try to parlay into something different. The amount of cash is still small enough to "toy" with .. I went from $280 to $566 so far.
The lower commissions are part of what makes it fun. Normally this many trades would have cost me $40, but I think I've spent less than $10 total on fees and stuff like that.
http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CDYQqQIwAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.brightsideofnews.com%2Fnews%2F2013%2F5%2F15%2Fbitcoin-exchange-mtgox-has-funds-seized-by-dhs.aspx&ei=bauXUYHUDfbd4AOo_ICQCQ&usg=AFQjCNFuI9qCpFhUKmd8IAQtv2UgQKRxmw&sig2=qjcSM6SICuE2MJnDO9sKRA&bvm=bv.46751780,d.dmg&cad=rja
http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=2&ved=0CD0QqQIwAQ&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.huffingtonpost.com%2F2013%2F05%2F17%2Fbitcoin-operator-accounts-seized_n_3293937.html&ei=bauXUYHUDfbd4AOo_ICQCQ&usg=AFQjCNHGmMCHBPUDgFd1YEx756tTiUYRnw&sig2=i8EkMaK-3ps2OzZfWRK9Hw&bvm=bv.46751780,d.dmg&cad=rja
Washington Post article
ZCore13
Quote: JBThe only reason the U.S. government wants to shut down things like Bitcoin is because they feel threatened by it, and that's all there is to it. They can't stand the thought of not being the superpower of everything in the world.
So its all about ego, not practicality. Who's the 'they'
that feel threatened, do you have any names?
Quote: EvenBobSo its all about ego, not practicality. Who's the 'they'
that feel threatened, do you have any names?
Of course not, but obviously somebody is going after the bitcoin exchanges, so presumably those people and/or their "superiors."
I thought you above all others had the ability to cut through the nonsense and get to the point. I'm rather surprised you can't see that the reason the government wants bitcoin shut down is because it would mean something might exist that they don't have absolute control over. Oh, the horror!
Quote: JBThe only reason the U.S. government wants to shut down things like Bitcoin is because they feel threatened by it, and that's all there is to it. They can't stand the thought of not being the superpower of everything in the world. The moment they feel threatened by anything, they get their friends in the media to help convince the public that the latest fad item is associated with terrorists/criminals/drugs/money laundering, and the unknowing public swallows the bait every single time.
That's just not true. These alternate money systems are put in place for criminals. If you read the history of Bitcoin, that is what it was used for almost exclusively at first. After criminals start using the alternate money system, then they sometimes catch on with the public, but it doesn't change the original reason for them to exist.
They are used to try and hide money, get past Title 31 laws and a multitude of other (mostly illegal) reason.
Your stance on this issue is very short sited.
ZCore13
Quote: Zcore13That's just not true. These alternate money systems are put in place for criminals. If you read the history of Bitcoin, that is what it was used for almost exclusively at first. After criminals start using the alternate money system, then they sometimes catch on with the public, but it doesn't change the original reason for them to exist.
They are used to try and hide money, get past Title 31 laws and a multitude of other (mostly illegal) reason.
Your stance on this issue is very short sited.
ZCore13
Where can I read about this nefarious history of bitcoin from multiple trusted news sources?
I am skeptical about bitcoin being used to hide money. If you've got money that you want to hide, why wouldn't you just hide it? Why go to the trouble of creating a complex virtual currency?
I do concede that bitcoin may be nothing more than a pump-and-dump scheme, but all of these claims about it being used by terrorists sound like the typical fear-mongering the government loves to use to scare people away from something.
Quote: JBWhere can I read about this nefarious history of bitcoin from a trusted news source?
I am skeptical about bitcoin being used to hide money. If you've got money that you want to hide, why wouldn't you just hide it? Why go to the trouble of creating a complex virtual currency?
It's not very difficult to find information on Bitcoins less than stellar use history...
Associated Press Article
The Guardian (UK News)
The Daily Dot (Dot.com News)
You don't just hide money with Bitcoin, you launder it. (Wikipedia definition for money laundering)
This is a HUGE topic in the gaming industry. Casinos have been used for decades in an attempt to launder money. Obtain the money illegally, take it to a casino to exchange for trackable, 1099 or W2G income. Casinos have very strict rules about money transactions, Bitcoin has NONE. Where do you think criminals would prefer to do business?
ZCore13
The bust today of another "fake currency" included 17 different countries cooperating and is said to have been used by 1 million criminals to HIDE income/profits. This is stuff like drug sales, sales of stolen property, identity theft, child porn, credit card fraud and more.
6 BILLION DOLLARS in transactions for these types of thing and others like them.
ZCore13
Quote: Zcore13You're missing the bigger picture. It's not that people are buying drugs (or other things) with the currency, it's the laundering of the money.
The bust today of another "fake currency" included 17 different countries cooperating and is said to have been used by 1 million criminals to HIDE income/profits. This is stuff like drug sales, sales of stolen property, identity theft, child porn, credit card fraud and more.
6 BILLION DOLLARS in transactions for these types of thing and others like them.
ZCore13
Yes, and to JB's point god forbid anything be hidden from the all knowing and mighty power of the government. They are here to protect you after all.
Orwell was right. Just about 30 years too early.
Quote: Zcore13The bust today of another "fake currency" included 17 different countries cooperating and is said to have been used by 1 million criminals to HIDE income/profits. This is stuff like drug sales, sales of stolen property, identity theft, child porn, credit card fraud and more.
The underlined part raises suspicion to me.
Unlike most people, I do not blindly believe everything the government (or anyone else for that matter) says simply because they are the government. They have the ability to claim that anybody is a criminal and is involved with all sorts of illegal things and destroy someone's life on a whim. As someone who is capable of thinking for myself, I can decide whether or not they are being truthful. Until I see actual proof of money laundering via Bitcoin, not just "it happened because the government said so," I will continue to be skeptical about it. Furthermore, shutting down Bitcoin because someone laundered money through it would be like shutting down Toyota because someone was killed by a person driving one; the driver is at fault, not the vehicle. I am in no way trying to condone illegal activities, but Bitcoin does have some nice things about it which regular currency does not.
I still don't think bitcoin can survive though. While money laundering may end up being a big reason, it is all about control. Does anyone here think there exists even the smallest chance that the dollar/euro/yuan go away in the next century into 1 world wide currency? Economics is arguable a more powerful asset to a country and their entire military. No single country is going to give up this power. I could understand some more consolodation like the Euro. There is a benefit for a number of smaller countries to bind together. Obviously recent issues in some countries have brought some of the downsides to light as well.
I feel it would require some independent(as independent as possible) organization to manage it like the world bank for it to become accepted. No government is going to accept places like mt gox to be the controller of a currency.
Quote: soulhunt79I still don't think bitcoin can survive though. While money laundering may end up being a big reason, it is all about control. Does anyone here think there exists even the smallest chance that the dollar/euro/yuan go away in the next century into 1 world wide currency? Economics is arguable a more powerful asset to a country and their entire military. No single country is going to give up this power.
I could understand some more consolidation like the Euro. There is a benefit for a number of smaller countries to bind together. Obviously recent issues in some countries have brought some of the downsides to light as well.
The best way to make money is to "make money". This statement was true even before "fiat" currency existed.
I think many people thought that consolidation of currency would be much more common today. The arab nations circling the Gulf had plans for a consolidated currency.
At 14.5 years old, no one predicted that Cyprus, Estonia, Malta, Slovakia, Slovenia would be the only countries to join the Euro after the notes were distributed. Collectively those 5 countries have roughly the same population as Greece (the last country to join the Euro).
But keep in mind that there are two separate aspects to Bitcoin. The first is that it is not controlled by any government and value is entirely set by the market. The second is anonymous exchange of value. You can have the second aspect without the first. A national currency can move into the second area.
Quote: AhighIt's going to be all about the Butterfly ASIC's for the remaining 11m coins. 1500GH/sec.
what is so special with this machine?
Quote: sevencard2003is there anyone here who can sell me bitcoin INSTANTLY for a bankofamerica transfer without waiting 3-4 days to go thru coinbase? of a small amount of under $50? will pay VIG, but i need some proof u are trustworthy such as history of trustworthiness on other sites.
You should try bitcointalk.org for that. But, if you are new there, I anticipate people will only agree to send you Bitcoins after they have confirmed your deposit, and then you run the risk of being scammed. For mostly solving that you will need to use some well known escrow (available in that same forum).
Quote: Ahighhttp://gizmodo.com/man-forgets-about-buying-27-of-bitcoin-is-now-worth-a-1454150399?utm_campaign=socialflow_gizmodo_facebook&utm_source=gizmodo_facebook&utm_medium=socialflow
Hopefully he sells and does not get greedy, turn half to cash and half to gold.
Anyone know why the price went wild this month?
First mistake was telling the world how much.