Dice taken away from shooter..
Quote: ewjones080This question just came to me recently, when I saw it come close to happening. Say there's one shooter on the table, and he's doing come bets. He's consistently hitting the glass (not really on purpose, just bad aim) or not hitting the back wall, or throwing the dice too high. The stick and box have warned him, but he keeps doing it, so they take the dice away from him. Since he's alone at the table, he can't resolve his come bets. So what should be done with the flat bets. They're supposed to stay up til resolved, which can't be done, so it would be kinda brutal to just take his money, without giving him the chance to win on them. But you also can't let him continue to shoot. What would you do?
The house can hold it for him, and activate it later on a new player, or just return it if the player can't shoot straight and is barred.
Hopefully, that 5 minutes would be enough to let the shooter know I was serious. If not, repeat it for 10 minutes. If it happens a third time, 86 the guy.
I'm not sure what to do about the bets at that point though. Maybe turn them into toke bets?
"Glass" ? What glass?Quote: ewjones080He's consistently hitting the glass
Quote: DJTeddyBearOh. You're not allowed to hit the mirror? That's a new one on me.
I see drunk shooters slam the dice against the mirror all the time. Box and dealers don't care.
Quote: ewjones080They're supposed to stay up til resolved,
Walmart was very popular because they allowed you to return things so easily and frequently and they surely lost some potential revenue doing it. It made them a gazillion dollars (customer service like that...)
So whatever... the casino should return the bet. It's not like they are giving away their money. Customer service goes a LONG way in any business. If they made the bet be resolved, that is having a very short sided business vision and hopefully they go under quickly. Again, customer service is a BIG DEAL.
Quote: ewjones080This question just came to me recently, when I saw it come close to happening. Say there's one shooter on the table, and he's doing come bets. He's consistently hitting the glass (not really on purpose, just bad aim) or not hitting the back wall, or throwing the dice too high. The stick and box have warned him, but he keeps doing it, so they take the dice away from him. Since he's alone at the table, he can't resolve his come bets. So what should be done with the flat bets. They're supposed to stay up til resolved, which can't be done, so it would be kinda brutal to just take his money, without giving him the chance to win on them. But you also can't let him continue to shoot. What would you do?
In fact, I can't believe this is even a question.
The other day at the theater, my son dropped his popcorn, went to the concession stand and asked them to fill it. The gladly did it. Did they loose some money? Of course, but they understand that it is short losses like that, that will bring in longer term gains. It will bring us back to buy a lot more popcorn.
There are plenty of examples where business do the opposite - they nickle and dime everything, never trust the customer, etc. They loose in the end and probably can't figure out what went wrong.
I have been at the table a lot, question a bet that I don't think was quit right (Hey, what happen to my $5 on that hardways?) or whatever. I don't do it to try and screw the casino, and it hasn't happened much, but in most instances, the casino knows they are getting my money eventually anyway, so we discussed it a little and usually, they will give me what I thought was right. It just serves their purposes to do so. I could also ask to have them review the camera (can you do this actually?), but they understand that my 5$ is chunck change compared to the many more red chips I will be laying on the table if they treat me right.
That's a bad analogy.Quote: slackyhackyWalmart was very popular because they allowed you to return things so easily and frequently and they surely lost some potential revenue doing it. It made them a gazillion dollars (customer service like that...)
Typically, people at the return counter at Walmart are relatively well behaved and are reasonable.
Plus, they paid a price for that service: They purchased an item, dragged it home, then dragged it back, and waited on line for the good service you talk about.
The situation at the craps table, where the shooter isn't following simple instructions, is like a customer at Walmart trying to pay with a check, refusing to provide any sort of ID, and then requesting a refund, for cash, before the check clears.
Quote: DJTeddyBearThat's a bad analogy.
Typically, people at the return counter at Walmart are relatively well behaved and are reasonable.
Plus, they paid a price for that service: They purchased an item, dragged it home, then dragged it back, and waited on line for the good service you talk about.
The situation at the craps table, where the shooter isn't following simple instructions, is like a customer at Walmart trying to pay with a check, refusing to provide any sort of ID, and then requesting a refund, for cash, before the check clears.
Maybe a bad analogy in substance, but not in purpose. it is a question of customer service.
Excellent customer service = excellent returns.
Of course I wasn't mis-shooting or anything...It was a $2 game, and I had simply became disgusted with the table since I had been the only shooter at the table for the last hour (with no sign of that changing)
I had a $2 pass-line bet and I asked the box "SO what if I no longer want to shoot...doesn't this bet HAVE to be resolved?" the box answered "If you no longer wish to shoot, then there is no longer a crap game, so that bet becomes a losing bet." We argued back and forth a little bit, and so I just said "Make this $2 a dealer toke." and walked off...to this day, that boxman still doesn't like me...but then again he's just a dick in general...
But from what I gather...the casino CAN ABSOLUTELY just TAKE your money.
Similar to making a bet in Blackjack and just walking away as the cards are dealt...they'll just scoop your money.
Just wondered if others saw it the same way.
With regards to customer service, agreed with the general comments. There are always a few eggs who will take advantage of return policy and use an item and claim that it was unused, or eat the popcorn and claim that it spilled.
In my wife's case, she runs an online business, and she gets returns for goods that have obviously been used. The returns used to really bother my wife because it was lost money for someone who was clearing screwing her. After a while, she began to realize that the protection via a tighter return policy reduced sales significantly overall. Consumers want to know that they can return something that doesn't work for them for whatever reason. Now, she just realizes that some people just take advantage of things and has a balanced approach with these customers. Her return rate I think is ridiculously low, about 2% I estimate.
Quote: ewjones080This question just came to me recently, when I saw it come close to happening. Say there's one shooter on the table, and he's doing come bets. He's consistently hitting the glass (not really on purpose, just bad aim) or not hitting the back wall, or throwing the dice too high. The stick and box have warned him, but he keeps doing it, so they take the dice away from him. Since he's alone at the table, he can't resolve his come bets. So what should be done with the flat bets. They're supposed to stay up til resolved, which can't be done, so it would be kinda brutal to just take his money, without giving him the chance to win on them. But you also can't let him continue to shoot. What would you do?
The bets can stay up til resolved. If the player is no longer there, they technically will continue to be pressed until someone eventually 7-outs, so eventually they will go back to the house.
If someone doesn't want to play according the rules prescribed by the house, why should they get their money back? Would you give the shooter their bets back if they were caught switching the dice with a set they brought from home?
As for hitting the glass, it has been explained to me by the dealers that the mirror could break, or the dice could chip, so the shooter should avoid hitting it if possible.
Ding, ding, ding!Quote: AyecarumbaIf someone doesn't want to play according the rules prescribed by the house, why should they get their money back? Would you give the shooter their bets back if they were caught switching the dice with a set they brought from home?
I understand the "contract" argument, but the dice were take after the shooter violated a different contract: An expectation of acceptable behavior and obeying verbal rules about shooting.
No.Quote: AyecarumbaIf the player is no longer there, they technically will continue to be pressed until someone eventually 7-outs, so eventually they will go back to the house.
Once the bet wins or loses, the "contract" has been satisfied. If the bet won, then it should be paid, and all the chips bagged and locked up until the player returns. If the player does not return to claim them for a reasonable period (6 months?), then and only then does it become abandoned, with a disposition similar to uncashed TITOs.
Quote: DJTeddyBearNo.
Once the bet wins or loses, the "contract" has been satisfied. If the bet won, then it should be paid, and all the chips bagged and locked up until the player returns. If the player does not return to claim them for a reasonable period (6 months?), then and only then does it become abandoned, with a disposition similar to uncashed TITOs.
What happened to, "If it lays, it plays?"
When a bet is resolved as a winner, the original bet can be returned along with the payout.Quote: AyecarumbaWhat happened to, "If it lays, it plays?"
It is only as a courtesy that the original bet stays in play.
Clearly, there has to be some regulation somewhere that states what happens to abandoned bets that resolve as a winner. The answer can't be to press it.
Quote:Walmart was very popular because they allowed you to return things so easily and frequently and they surely lost some potential revenue doing it. It made them a gazillion dollars (customer service like that...)
That analogy stinks like a dung heap in August in Misouri. W-Mart bought seconds, at a reduced price and gambled on fewer returns. You do the QC, but get "a discount" that wasn't the full discount you were entitled to have for buying "seconds".
Quote: 98ClubsThat analogy stinks like a dung heap in August in Misouri. W-Mart bought seconds, at a reduced price and gambled on fewer returns. You do the QC, but get "a discount" that wasn't the full discount you were entitled to have for buying "seconds".
98clubs,
What do you think my point was - or the comparison was?
