Craps rules in Melbourne, Australia, where are rules for NV
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For all of you guys that have been arguing all these years, please show everybody what rules the state of Nevada has on the game craps, and any rules that you can find posted anywhere in the casino about the rules of craps! It didn't take me to long to find these rules for Australia!
While I read about the gaming board told me so, or something like that, please post the rules in the state of Nevada. We don't want hear-say, I want to see it in writing!
In Australia, it says you have to hit the back wall in writing, and everything about the game and how it is going to pay you off if you win a bet. The casinos can't make up their own rules!
http://www.crownmelbourne.com.au/Assets/Files/Craps%20Rules%20Version%204.0.pdf
Craps rules at Harrah's Rincon and at PechangaQuote: superrickCraps rules in Melbourne, Australia
yea, it says a lot of stuff.Quote: superrickIn Australia, it says you have to hit the back wall in writing, and everything about the game and how it is going to pay you off if you win a bet. The casinos can't make up their own rules!
who knows how correct it really is?
They have no pass line or don't pass bet marked on the layout
what gives?
They special?
how about this stuff
YES!!!
5.2.2 The Shooter will continue rolling the dice until the result
of a roll is 7-out or until he/she voluntarily relinquishes
the dice.
(b) If the Shooter relinquishes the dice after a
point has been established and before it has
been resolved (i.e. mid-point), the game will
become void and all players will be given the
opportunity to reduce or remove their wagers
from the table layout. The dice will then be
offered to the next player in turn until the
dice are accepted.
Sally sets the dice and the roll looks good as both dice hit the far wall.
Total is a 4 and that is the point for this game.
Sally says in English
"I voluntarily relinquishes the dice"
the game will become void
Sally picks up her "Win line" bet and winks at the camera
I call this non-Nevada Craps
"down under craps"
I will be there in about 3 weeks
Sally
Quote: mustangsallyI call this non-Nevada Craps
"down under craps"
I will be there in about 3 weeks
If by "there", you mean Melbourne, Crown Casino had another interesting feature when I was there in 2011; all of the "pokies" (slot machines - they get their name from the use of A, K, Q, J, 10, 9 in place of fruit or 7s) had to show the expected payback percentage. (This is not universal in Australia; the machines at Star City Casino in Sydney did not do this.)
yes, mateQuote: ThatDonGuyIf by "there", you mean Melbourne, Crown Casino
it also says thisQuote: superrickIn Australia, it says you have to hit the back wall in writing
5.2 The Roll of the Dice
5.2.1 The Shooter will roll the two selected dice so that they
leave his/her hand simultaneously and strike the end of
the table farthest from him/her.
(a) A roll of the dice is invalid when:-
blah, blah, blah
(b) The Boxperson or Stickperson may invalidate a
roll when:
(i) The dice do not leave the Shooter's
hand simultaneously; or
(ii) Either (or both) of the dice fail to strike
an end of the table; or
(iii) For any other reason the Boxperson or
Stickperson considers the roll to be
irregular.
sounds like Nevada rules again
Sally
Quote: superrickCraps rules in Melbourne, Australia
For all of you guys that have been arguing all these years, please show everybody what rules the state of Nevada has on the game craps, and any rules that you can find posted anywhere in the casino about the rules of craps! It didn't take me to long to find these rules for Australia!
While I read about the gaming board told me so, or something like that, please post the rules in the state of Nevada. We don't want hear-say, I want to see it in writing!
In Australia, it says you have to hit the back wall in writing, and everything about the game and how it is going to pay you off if you win a bet. The casinos can't make up their own rules!
http://www.crownmelbourne.com.au/Assets/Files/Craps%20Rules%20Version%204.0.pdf
Thanks for posting it was a very interesting read. But please read it again -- it says nothing about hitting the back wall. What was written was this:
"The Shooter will roll the two selected dice so that they
leave his/her hand simultaneously and strike the end of
the table farthest from him/her."
End of the table does not necessarily mean hitting the back wall. In fact, this is the current policy at Caesars Palace. They do not enforce the back wall "rule" and instead want to see the dice reach the far end of the table, or the shooter making a good effort to reach the far end of the table.
And I saw the same thing at Red Rock during the 4th of July weekend. There was a shooter with a sling around his arm -- a shooter known to the dealers -- and using that arm in the sling he rolled the dice but they pretty much failed to hit the back wall each time even though they did make it pretty close to the back wall.
If someone just picks up the dice and throws them right away over and over and they come up short, nobody cares.
In fact, slowing down the game from somebody shooting short who is just obviously "picking them up and shooting them" without any thought at all is a big no-no when money is on the table.
Keeping the dice moving becomes priority #1 when the game appears to be fair by a well-trained box man. This can be observed every single day at the Wynn. Rolls come up short roll after roll after roll with no noise at all, and they will tell you, and I have asked, "he obviously an old man and not doing anything wrong, we're not going to bother him" are among the multiple different explanations I have received.
If it is possible, someone who is successfully shooting with an edge (legal or not) is going to do his best to attempt to do his thing very quickly without being noticed.
At Jerry's Nugget on Monday night I saw what a dealer, Sam, referred to as a "dice setter" spend about 15 seconds per shot setting his dice and when he threw them, they looked so sloppy in the air (even though he's trying) that a smart box man would not tell him to hit the back wall. They would tell him, "that was a good roll, bet more."
Discretion is key. Selling the fantasy is probably the smartest thing a good crew could do.
I'm pretty sure Wynn wouldn't be barking at my shot if I had never had the one table dump that one time. Now it appears I have notes in my file forever even though I made no money. They are really watching me and my shot and bark at me every time I shoot at a $50 or $100 table. They have yet to bother me at a $10 table.
Quote: Ahigh
In fact, slowing down the game from somebody shooting short who is just obviously "picking them up and shooting them" without any thought at all is a big no-no when money is on the table.
How does somebody who is shooting short, who just picks them up and throws them, slow down the game? If anything I think picking them up and throwing them -- whether short or to the wall -- is fast.
The people who know what they're doing don't spend 15 seconds setting their dice. It takes an experienced "setter" about two seconds. As the dice are pushed to me I already know how to rotate the dice to get my set. Setting, picking up and tossing is done in almost one continuous motion.
Has anyone ever been told NOT to set the dice? (I was, by the way, at NYNY when I had the dice taken away from me and was told to leave. But besides that single incident it hasn't happened elsewhere.)
Quote: AlanMendelsonI don't understand what you're saying here.
I'm not sure why. I'm talking about the boxman slowing down the game by giving an earful to someone not hitting the back wall when the game is obviously fair and the guy is just some old fart who is obviously not even trying to get an edge.
Quote: mustangsally
5.2.2 The Shooter will continue rolling the dice until the result
of a roll is 7-out or until he/she voluntarily relinquishes
the dice.
(b) If the Shooter relinquishes the dice after a
point has been established and before it has
been resolved (i.e. mid-point), the game will
become void and all players will be given the
opportunity to reduce or remove their wagers
from the table layout. The dice will then be
offered to the next player in turn until the
dice are accepted.
I live in Melbourne, Australia. I am roughly 25 minutes from Crown Casino. I can't beleive they've made such an oversight in their official rules. I am seriously tempted to test it out. However, my only reservation is their right to ban me from the casino for "any reason" even if I have done nothing wrong. The next closest casino is 600km+ away...
I tried to join this forum a while ago, but my only email address was hotmail and it is not accepted here. I created one just to reply to this thread. Furthermore, if there are any other questions that people have regarding craps/casinos/gambling in Australia, I'm more than happy to help out.
I have a thread dedicated to "craps: aussie style" in another crapsforum. This game is addicting.
Quote: MorgueI live in Melbourne, Australia. I am roughly 25 minutes from Crown Casino. I can't beleive they've made such an oversight in their official rules. I am seriously tempted to test it out. However, my only reservation is their right to ban me from the casino for "any reason" even if I have done nothing wrong. The next closest casino is 600km+ away...
I tried to join this forum a while ago, but my only email address was hotmail and it is not accepted here. I created one just to reply to this thread. Furthermore, if there are any other questions that people have regarding craps/casinos/gambling in Australia, I'm more than happy to help out.
I have a thread dedicated to "craps: aussie style" in another crapsforum. This game is addicting.
Welcome, Morgue. It'll be interesting to hear about the game Down Under...:)
Anyway if they banned me again for three days so what, I don't know how else to get my point across to only you, I think most intelligent readers on this board would know, that the Australians use a different vocabulary then we do here in the states. One prime example, they say bonnet for I car hood.
This post was put up for anybody out there and especially you to post the rules here in Nevada for craps, I don't want hearsay it will not hold up in a court of law! Every time there is a question about the rules in Nevada for craps you post a hearsay conversation you had with a gaming agent on the phone, take that to court see how it would hold up, if that agent wasn't there to testify. Then see how a lawyer would tear it apart, without it being in writing and a state statute, if that agent was there!
Quote:
Version 4.0
21 October 2013
(b) The Boxperson or Stickperson may invalidate a
roll when:
(i) The dice do not leave the Shooter's
hand simultaneously; or
(ii) Either (or both) of the dice fail to strike
an end of the table; or
(iii) For any other reason the Boxperson or
Stickperson considers the roll to be irregular.
Even the above set of rules leaves a lot to be desired in favor of the casino. If the box person or stick person didn't like you they could call every roll irregular!
With that said they did one thing that they haven't done in the state of Nevada they came up with a set of rules that you could read, that tried to spell out what was going to be considered a legal roll.
Quote: AlanMendelson
End of the table does not necessarily mean hitting the back wall. In fact, this is the current policy at Caesars Palace. They do not enforce the back wall "rule" and instead want to see the dice reach the far end of the table, or the shooter making a good effort to reach the far end of the table.
For the most part your craps playing world in Las Vegas consists of playing at Caesars Palace. What you are telling everybody here again is nothing but hearsay, show us the rules in writing, by the way the next time you are coming to town , please PM me with your phone number, I will be more than happy to show up at Caesars and see how they apply rules to someone that is on a roll, and is setting the dice! It just might be your lucky day and you can win a four or five point fire bet. The six point fire bets are just a little harder to hit.
It's very funny how the casinos come up with a different rules for someone that is setting the dice and is now about to win a six point fire bet and there is a lot of money being bet on the fire bet.
Now, I surely hope that I didn't insult you in anyway with anything that I wrote! I just want to see anyone post the craps rules for Nevada, that you claim are out there!
You also would have to take into consideration that I play craps in the off hours on empty tables, I will not play on a full table with a bunch of players that don't know what they are doing! So it would require you to come in during the week or be up a 5 am to see if we could find a empty table! Most of the time I will not even play on the weekends, because of my requirements of finding an empty table to play on!
If they do ban me it would be, because I didn't grow up in a perfectly politically correct world, men had thicker skins, and could say what was on their mind. that isn't the case anymore. Damn I'm glad that I grew up in a world were we didn't have to lock our doors, we didn't have to worry about going to the movie without being shot, I could hop on a plane without worrying about some nut case blowing it out of the sky, and my grandchild wouldn't be shot just going to school!
Quote: superrick...Anyway if they banned me again for three days so what, I don't know how else to get my point across to only you, I think most intelligent readers on this board would know, that the Australians use a different vocabulary then we do here in the states. One prime example, they say bonnet for I car hood.
....Now, I surely hope that I didn't insult you in anyway with anything that I wrote! I just want to see anyone post the craps rules for Nevada, that you claim are out there!
...
If they do ban me it would be, because I didn't grow up in a perfectly politically correct world, men had thicker skins, and could say what was on their mind. that isn't the case anymore. Damn I'm glad that I grew up in a world were we didn't have to lock our doors, we didn't have to worry about going to the movie without being shot, I could hop on a plane without worrying about some nut case blowing it out of the sky, and my grandchild wouldn't be shot just going to school!
supperrick,
You certainly didn't say anything that would constitute a personal insult. I'm sorry you would have any doubt about that.
I should mention, however, that there is a Martingale on length of suspensions...it goes 3,7,14,etc. per occurrence. So please do keep posting your thoughts, just avoid the personal insults. I enjoy reading you!
Quote: MorgueI live in Melbourne, Australia. I am roughly 25 minutes from Crown Casino. I can't beleive they've made such an oversight in their official rules. I am seriously tempted to test it out. However, my only reservation is their right to ban me from the casino for "any reason" even if I have done nothing wrong. The next closest casino is 600km+ away...
I tried to join this forum a while ago, but my only email address was hotmail and it is not accepted here. I created one just to reply to this thread. Furthermore, if there are any other questions that people have regarding craps/casinos/gambling in Australia, I'm more than happy to help out.
I have a thread dedicated to "craps: aussie style" in another crapsforum. This game is addicting.
How often do you play at crown? I'm staying there this weekend.
As far as the rules in Australia... perhaps Morgue would like to tell us: does end of the table mean hit the back wall?
When I did those various stories on craps and its rules and interviewed the NGC I was the consumer/business reporter at KCAL Channel 9, one of the two CBS-owned stations in Los Angeles.
Since then I left the news and now own an Infomercial company.
You might have seen me quoted (several times) in the Las Vegas Review Journal for stories about craps, and I think it's because I've done more than a few stories as a reporter on TV and in print and online media about the game.
Yes, as reported many times, Nevada does not have printed or published rules about playing the game of craps. Come to think of it, I don't think there are rules about playing blackjack or roulette either? Does anyone know if such published rules exist?
Quote: AussieYou have to make an attempt to hit the back wall in Australia. They won't worry usually unless the roll doesn't even get close.
Pretty much the same rule or procedure at Caesars Palace, Las Vegas. Thanks.
Quote: AlanMendelson
Yes, as reported many times, Nevada does not have printed or published rules about playing the game of craps. Come to think of it, I don't think there are rules about playing blackjack or roulette either? Does anyone know if such published rules exist?
Thank you Alan,..I wouldn't need a lawyer to punch hole is anything the gaming agent told you in a court of law, it only amounts to hearsay. You can't have a interpretation of something that doesn't exist!
With that said,.. I think that everybody on this board will now know that there are no rules on the game of craps here in Nevada, unlike other states!
Quote: superrickWith that said,.. I think that everybody on this board will now know that there are no rules on the game of craps here in Nevada, unlike other states!
There might be rules, but they just aren't published. There is an official list of "Nevada Gaming Commission Approved Gambling Games" (I wonder what "Wynn Pair Bet" is), and craps is one of them, but none of the games seem to have any sort of "official rules" for them anywhere.
This makes sense when you notice that Crown Casino also has a single set of "rules" for blackjack - S17, blackjacks must pay 3-2, double only on 9-11 (and only on the first two cards, except for DAS), no surrender, resplitting is allowed except for Aces, only one card allowed per split Ace. Imagine the number of different sets of rules you would need just for one Vegas casino.
(Actually, Crown also has something called Vegas Blackjack, which has the same rules except it is double on any two cards and surrender is allowed, but only if the dealer's up card is a 10-value or Ace.)
Quote: AussieCrown has blackjack with both H17 & S17 as well as both BJ pays 3-2 & 6-5. The rules you get depends on the table minimum. $30 min and up will most likely get you S17 & 3-2. I can confirm this weekend if anyone is interested
Another rule I missed: if the player has a blackjack and the dealer's up card is an Ace, the player can take an immediate payout at even money.
Also, except for Vegas Blackjack, which is always 4 decks, all games can have anywhere from 4 to 8 decks.
Here's what else they have, not including Pontoon (which appears to be a variation of Spanish 21) or Vegas Blackjack (mentioned above):
Crown Blackjack - H17
Sports Blackjack - H17, 6-5, player cannot take an even money payoff with a Blackjack and a dealer Ace showing
Premier Blackjack - H17, double on any two cards, DAS (except Aces)
Premium Doubling Blackjack - H17, double on any number of cards, DAS (except Aces)
Blackjack Plus - player 21 always wins (and blackjack from the original two cards pays 3-2 even if the dealer has one), player wins with a 5-card non-busting hand, double on any 2 or 3 cards, DAS (except Aces)
There are also a few side bets:
Magnificent Sevens - dealt a pair of 7s (pays more if the player hits and gets a third 7 and/or the 7s are suited)
Perfect Pairs - dealt a pair
Crown Suits - dealt two cards of the same suit (pays more if the dealer's up card is the same as well)
Blackpot - dealt 6-7, 6-8, or 7-8 (pays more if the player hits and the third card makes 21; if this happens, the side bet, which cannot be increased, pays more on the next hand)
Quote: ThatDonGuyQuote: superrickWith that said,.. I think that everybody on this board will now know that there are no rules on the game of craps here in Nevada, unlike other states!
There might be rules, but they just aren't published.
Apparently, this isn't the first time the question has been asked here.
Quote: MorgueWhat are the limits in the mahogany room? Any other differences?
It's $25/$30 min on the line & numbers. That's the only difference. Hard ways and crap bets are the same as on the main floor. It used to be a tub but they changed it to a full sized table when the room was completely renovated a few years ago.
Quote: mustangsallyCraps rules at Harrah's Rincon and at Pechanga
yea, it says a lot of stuff.
who knows how correct it really is?
They have no pass line or don't pass bet marked on the layout
what gives?
They special?
how about this stuff
YES!!!
5.2.2 The Shooter will continue rolling the dice until the result
of a roll is 7-out or until he/she voluntarily relinquishes
the dice.
(b) If the Shooter relinquishes the dice after a
point has been established and before it has
been resolved (i.e. mid-point), the game will
become void and all players will be given the
opportunity to reduce or remove their wagers
from the table layout. The dice will then be
offered to the next player in turn until the
dice are accepted.
Sally sets the dice and the roll looks good as both dice hit the far wall.
Total is a 4 and that is the point for this game.
Sally says in English
"I voluntarily relinquishes the dice"
the game will become void
Sally picks up her "Win line" bet and winks at the camera
I call this non-Nevada Craps
"down under craps"
I will be there in about 3 weeks
Sally
If you think that's whacked, check this out:
Quote: Crown Melbourne Limited Craps Rulebook Section 5.1.1 (c)If it is discovered that the Shooter does not have a valid Win Line or Don't Win Line bet, he/she will be asked to place a bet no greater than the table minimum on either the Win Line or the Don't Win line in order to continue rolling the dice. (emphasis added)
Point established: 4
Boxperson: "Excuse me, Miss, but you have to make a wager to shoot the dice."
Hmmm. I wonder which one she'd pick?
