Quote: BuzzardI have just received a PM from Hot Blonde saying that she agrees With me !
Uh oh! Divulging contents of a PM? We all know what that means.
I'm also willing to attend the event, assuming it is already going to be well attended, and serve as a judge if requested. I can also supply regulation casino dice upon request.
Quote: WizardSOOPOO suggested I poke my head into this thread. Forgive me for just jumping to the end without reading it. He said there is a challenge that ahigh can roll under 30.5 sevens in 200 rolls. I calculate the probability of achieving this is 30.0741318%. I hear the going line is laying 2 to 1 against. I'm willing to make that bet against trustworthy forum members.
I'm also willing to attend the event, assuming it is already going to be well attended, and serve as a judge if requested. I can also supply regulation casino dice upon request.
I think you missed a little bit in the skimming. The challenge will take place on Ahigh's craps rig, but the roller will be nickolay411.
The bet is between me and Nickolay.
I believe there is also a side bet between tupp and Buzzard.
Aaron is supplying his table and recording equipment, and is planning on broadcasting the event live.
Nickolay has stated that he is already maxed out on his bets, so that will not be an option for you.
However, Aaron has posted that he recently has had success at keeping his 7's numbers under 15%.
Perhaps you can convince Aaron to also make the attempt, and to put up a few dollars in wagers on such.
I'll hammer out the details with the Wiz on the thread here, but it sounds like what he has suggested is pretty reasonable at a glance.
Thanks for joining in, Wiz! It will be fun!
Quote: AhighYeah, I'll work out a bet with the Wizard for sure. I know we can come to some sort of agreement on something that's fair.
I'll hammer out the details with the Wiz on the thread here, but it sounds like what he has suggested is pretty reasonable at a glance.
Thanks for joining in, Wiz! It will be fun!
Work out a bet on the existing 200 rolls, or work out a separate bet between you and the Wizard for your own rolls? Sorry, unclear.
Here is an idea. If ahigh, or anybody, believes he can roll sevens with a probability under 15% then I'll book the following wager based on seven rolls of the dice:
Roll 0 sevens: Pays even money
Roll 1 seven: Push
Roll 2 or more sevens: Loss
Assuming a seven probability of 15% this wager would have a 3.72% advantage. We can repeat this over and over, as long as both parties agree.
By the way, the break-even seven probability would be 15.69%. As long as ahigh can beat that, he has an advantage.
Quote: WizardI'll bet anybody on earth that he/she can't roll sevens with a probability under 1/6, assuming I perceive an advantage worthy of my bother, regulation table, dice, and throw, and I trust I'll be paid if I win (thus ruling out betting with keyser).
Here is an idea. If ahigh, or anybody, believes he can roll sevens with a probability under 15% then I'll book the following wager based on seven rolls of the dice:
Roll 0 sevens: Pays even money
Roll 1 seven: Push
Roll 2 or more sevens: Loss
Assuming a seven probability of 15% this wager would have a 3.72% advantage. We can repeat this over and over, as long as both parties agree.
By the way, the break-even seven probability would be 15.69%.
Next time you or anyone else willing to book a bet like this who is going to be in the South Florida area; Send me a PM.
I will also book ANY worthwhile bets stating that my Horn % is not higher than random.
I will also book ANY worthwhile bets stating that my Hard 4 % is not higher than random.
All bets will be based on a 12 Foot Regulation Craps table with brand new casino dice. No filming/photography of the shooter but feedback to the forum will be strongly advised/appreciated.
Quote: CrapsForeverNext time you or anyone else willing to book a bet like this who is going to be in the South Florida area; Send me a PM.
I will also book ANY worthwhile bets stating that my Horn % is not higher than random.
I will also book ANY worthwhile bets stating that my Hard 4 % is not higher than random.
All bets will be based on a 12 Foot Regulation Craps table with brand new casino dice. No filming/photography of the shooter but feedback to the forum will be strongly advised/appreciated.
We can't get you to fly out to Vegas? March 11 is the date all you 'influencers' can come and take the Wiz's money! It will be a blast!
Quote: SOOPOOWe can't get you to fly out to Vegas? March 11 is the date all you 'influencers' can come and take the Wiz's money! It will be a blast!
SOOPOO, I'll be in Vegas at the end of August....I have no problems taking the bets up at that time.
Quote: CrapsForeverSOOPOO, I'll be in Vegas at the end of August....I have no problems taking the bets up at that time.
Great! I can't wait to see how the March 11 Ahigh/nickolay craps symposium turns out. I am sure the Wiz and you will be able to agree on some interesting wagers after we see how the March 11 fun. I don't have vacation available the end of August, but might proxy Mike a few dollars to bet on my behalf!
He said he doesn't believe in dice control. He said if you look at the slow motion video, the dice are random, and that you can tell from looking basically. He is in the position to be worried about it and he is not worried.
I wanted to have him there as a representative of the casinos on the subject. He is fascinated by the discussion.
Wayne also spent time looking at my die balancer, and we've had a lot of conversations about dice and other details related to craps. He's a great guy that I consider to be a friend.
Anyway, I don't think he will be coming since we're doing this during the day, but maybe I could have another show with him on. He also wanted to bring his beautiful woman and said our ladies might have fun hanging out and "to have something nice to look at" for the show. LOL.
He's a hoot.
I already knew they aren't worried about me and my shot over there and that they don't believe that control is possible. But I think it could create some interesting drama to have all of the DI's, the Wizard, and the casinos represented at the same time discussing whether it's possible or not for the show.
Quote: Ahigh
I already knew they aren't worried about me and my shot over there and that they don't believe that control is possible. But I think it could create some interesting drama to have all of the DI's, the Wizard, and the casinos represented at the same time discussing whether it's possible or not for the show.
"The greatest trick the devil ever played was convincing the world that he did not exist." - Charles Baudelaire
Quote: AhighHe also wanted to bring his beautiful woman and said our ladies might have fun hanging out and "to have something nice to look at" for the show.
If the ladies are wearing bikini's (or better yet, naked) your viewership will increase substantially.
Of course I'm joking. Well, maybe just a little bit. Good luck with the show Aaron!
Anyhoo. I got another Apple bluetooth keyboard and mouse and I'm actually using it right now to post up here from my 55" display from the windows machine that does the broadcasts. So I've got the Macbook Pro and a Windows machine both hooked up each with their own wireless keyboards now which helps a lot with keeping thing functioning as the broadcast proceeds.
I still have a few things to set up and I'll be doing some more shows in the mean time to get my broadcast system tuned in real nice.
I spent most of the day so far just replacing the garbage disposal under the sink as it had a leak in it. That took quite a while. Fun day.
Quote: odiousgambitit'd be nice if the various bets verified as 'on' could be split off into new threads. The moderators could throw in some of the old posts, but the bettors could start the new threads.
I concur.
Quote: thecesspitI concur.
in the event we do not get our wish, this is the link to the first bet
https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/gambling/craps/12600-dice-control/18/#post211282
Occasionally I will have a bad throw when both dice do not hit the back wall.
Is it automatically an invalid throw? What if only one dice hits the back wall? What if I seven out when ONE or BOTH dice do not hit the back wall?
In the casino sometimes these 'Invalid throws' are counted for the player sometimes against them. Sometimes you get warnings.
Shall we say a roll where both dice do not hit the back wall cannot be counted for or against me ? How does everyone feel about having this certain rule which doesn't apply to how they really do it in the Casino?
Would this be easier than setting up some kind of warning system? And having all rolls count until a certain threshold has been reached?
Calling a no-roll after resolution is NEVER done in the casino.
If you can accomplish a roll that lands in a position that would normally bounce off the back wall and they stop dead like they landed in sand, that is a legal throw!
The box can say "all the way down shooter" but not, "NO ROLL" after the resolution is complete.
The reason I want to clarify is because I've never had a "no-roll" called on me before , I have been warned about both dice hitting the back wall but they've always allowed whatever resolution to happen. I have never had the dice taken away from me for not hitting the back wall sometimes a few times in a row...
Quote: nickolay411Occasionally I will have a bad throw when both dice do not hit the back wall.
Is it automatically an invalid throw?
The simplest thing would be to have all such throws called "no-roll" automatically. Let Ahigh or someone else neutral determine if both were in the air and then hit the back wall, his decision final.
Nothing should be on the table for the dice to land on either.
Cocked dice should be "no-roll" as well, but without things in the way that should be rare.
I believe I can represent a box man accurately enough that I think this will be my job.
We could discuss it, but I will only try to do what a regular box man would do.
I won't let Nick do any illegal throws.
I should also note that whether or not he can accomplish the challenge makes no difference to me as this is all for fun.
I won't be betting on the outcome of Nick's performance.
Quote: AhighI will only try to do what a regular box man would do.
I won't be there to make you do it my way [g]. But I will say I don't like how a casino does it. This seems to have something to do with keeping as many rolls going and bets booked as possible. Thus they call the cocked dice and they give warnings about dice not hitting the back wall long before any rolls are "no-roll". I don't see any reason to go that way here, but that is up to Soopoo too.
Of course I don't have any money on this. It's really up to SOOPOO and nickolay411 to negotiate, subject to Ahigh's expert consultation services.
Quote: AcesAndEightsAs my interest is in whether or not dice-influencing is possible under real-world circumstances, I think that Ahigh's intention to act as a real-world pit boss would be the best course of action. If nickolay411 fails to hit the back wall a couple times, I think they should count good or bad. If he makes a habit of it, then he should lose the bet as he is not following the rules of craps (i.e. in a real casino, he would lose the dice in this case)...although I seriously doubt that would happen, as he wants to complete the bet, win or lose.
Of course I don't have any money on this. It's really up to SOOPOO and nickolay411 to negotiate, subject to Ahigh's expert consultation services.
I will defer on this to the Wiz. I would be comfortable with whatever stance Mike takes. If Nickolay would consent to have the Wiz set the final parameters, then I would be ok with that. If you, Nickolay, want to make a proposition as to what the rules should be, just do so. My hunch is they would be acceptable.
By the way, i am hoping a friend who I introduced to craps last vegas trip will be able to make it again. Mike can vouch for her photogenicity.
Quote: SOOPOO
By the way, i am hoping a friend who I introduced to craps last vegas trip will be able to make it again. Mike can vouch for her photogenicity.
sounds yummy
I don't think I should have to lose the entire bet If the dice don't hit the back wall enough times though...
How does something like this sound?
Both Dice hit back wall. X Warnings for Every Y throws. Redo throws if X warnings are exceeded per Y throws.
If I'm not mistaken the Wizard has been present in a similar challenge with Standford Wong. I'd like to hear what he has to say.
-N
Quote: Buzzard" By the way, i am hoping a friend who I introduced to craps last vegas trip will be able to make it again. Mike can vouch for her photogenicity. " Does this mean SOOPOO and HB have kissed and made up ?
Nah, its not HB. It's a coworker who happened to be in Vegas last time I was there. She just happens to be beautiful, too. I don't think HB has shown any interest in this subject.
Quote: sodawaterOK, the question needs to be asked: have you completely lost touch with reality? media coverage? Live, televised, event?
Here is what (probably) is going to happen. Two guys meet up at your house and roll some dice for a few hours, then post about it on the web.
If I am wrong I guess I will watch it on live tv.
I just wanted to bring up this post from January 20th (less than two weeks ago). I had never known anything at all about doing live broadcasts online when I posted about having a crowd of viewers.
Last Tuesday we had 20 concurrent viewers for a full two hours and 130 total viewers for the show.
By the time we get to broadcasting the March 11th event, I hope to have someone to volunteer to operate the ATEM Television Studio hardware from my MacBook Pro and have something that looks very professional for the Wizard's and SOOPOO's event. I will continue to refine my setup so we can do this right!
I got permission to get the day off from work for this event too. Ustream can handle as many viewers as we could possibly hope to expect to receive.
It is shaping up to be quite the event and I am looking forward to everyone's participation. Please help spread the word about the event as we get closer. Also, I don't get ads when I view stuff, so I don't know if it's because I have adblock, or because I have my own show that I don't see ads, but I don't. So you may want to look into how to get around the ads with UStream before the show so you don't miss any of it.
Quote: Ahigh
Last Tuesday we had 20 concurrent viewers for a full two hours and 130 total viewers for the show.
I want to personally congratulate you on your viewership, (I was one of them, but not concurrent) Aaron. It may not seem like that much, but with aggressive promoting, you could easily see a number in the thousands by the time of this event (and for subsequent shows) given your rate of increase.
If I may ask, is that 130 viewers based upon unique IP's, or is it just everytime someone jumps on? If it is the latter, I apologize, but I am at least three (maybe four) of your viewers.
Tupp is going to see if he can make it, and he has experience with TV stuff. I'm a newb with all this gear and HDMI's and mixers and stuff. So I can use some help, especially if Tupp can't make it to work the controls. But most importantly, this is not Ahigh against the WOV. This is a broadcast for the WOV and for you guys to participate in and have a good time.
I am putting a whole lot of effort into trying to make this the most that it can be and I appreciate everyone's support and cooperation!
I have also added incentive funds for nickolay411 that he will get if he achieves his goal. Such a bonus was suggested by Ahigh earlier in this thread.
Looking forward to the event!
I encourage others to pump up the pot for Nickolay. He is really the only one stepping up to the plate here. All these other guys who sell classes are either unaware of what I am doing or are otherwise afraid of being exposed in a live event to the truth of their throwing abilities as graphed out by my software in real time as they perform.
A live performance is truly the only litmus test worthy of being believable and if dice control is possible, it should be trivial to invite those who want to be believed to..
SHOW ME DON'T TELL ME
Hey, maybe you can "accidentally" drop a hive of wasps on her, or "accidentally" run her over with a lawn mower.
That would go viral, and give you the attention you seek.
Just sayin' ...
Quote: MrVI heard that Honey Boo boo might drop by.
Hey, maybe you can "accidentally" drop a hive of wasps on her, or "accidentally" run her over with a lawn mower.
That would go viral, and give you the attention you seek.
Just sayin' ...
I don't know anything about what you're talking about. Is this some show you watch or something?
I came across the program while channel surfing: it is dreadful, and not a program I watch regularly.
http://mrantenna.com/lasvegas/reviews/
This guy is great. I pay zero for television service (I do pay for Netflix streaming though). But I guess I miss out on some quality programming.
You can even see a review I submitted for him as I was one of his first customers. Anyone in Vegas should consider doing this if they want to get rid of this terrible programming out there and/or if you find you pay cable just to watch what is already over-the-air (newcasts, superbowl, and what-not).
Again I will ask you the same question, so is it luck or is it skill when you are shooting?
Quote:
Ahigh
Again, I thought you would already know this. But luck matters the most in the short run, and edge matters the most in the long run (assuming you're flat betting and consistently).
Almost all runs on the craps tables while you have the dice are short. Especially when it is busy and/or when you don't have the table to yourself.
Let me ask you this question relating to the below quote. So are you telling everybody here on this board that if you weren't shooting at home on your own table with no distraction you wouldn't be getting the same results, because in a casino you would have chips in your way, players doing stupid things and what ever else bothers you?
https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/gambling/craps/12748-so-unbalanced-dice-everywhere-or-not/20/
Quote:
Ahigh
Almost all runs on the craps tables while you have the dice are short. Especially when it is busy and/or when you don't have the table to yourself.
So while I'm at it just one more question. Why don't you play when the tables have players on them?
Quote:
Ahigh
The MAJORITY of the time I play in the casino, I am the only one at the table. Sometimes there is one other person. Maybe two.
But when it's full table, to be honest, I do more watching than playing these days.
But if I do play, in the short runs or in crowds, and when I am betting bigger money, I'm gambling just like everyone else and I love it.
Curious minds want to know!!!!!!
Quote: superrickAgain I will ask you the same question, so is it luck or is it skill when you are shooting?
If I continue to get the same results recording my rolls, I would say that it is plausible that I have enough skill to overcome the edge, which means that I can theoretically continue to have a possibility of winning money no matter how often I play provided I don't sign up for too much variance to ruin it for me (IE: odds). This is theoretically the result of theoretical skill. Even under these circumstances, if I take high variance bets, luck will overpower the fact that I have overcome the house edge.
Overcoming an edge and having enough variance with free odds bets to eclipse any small edge on the other bets (whether the player's OR the casinos) are COMPLETELY independent things. Variance, in general, is not my friend. I want to grind up..smoothly.
It seems you don't understand that. Even after 100,000 rolls, with 10x odds, you can still come out ahead because the variance can overpower the edge.
Similarly, if I have twice the edge of the passline bet in my shot (2.82 to my side equating to 1.41% advantage after taking off the house edge) luck can go against me just like it can go against the casino if I bet max odds with my edge!
But on a very serious note, if you don't understand this and I have to explain it to you, something is wrong, bro!! Really! Are you asking me this because you don't understand or because you think I am so skilled that luck doesn't matter. I think maybe you need to get off your little high horse asking questions like this. It doesn't make you look good at all.
Quote: RuperSickSo while I'm at it just one more question. Why don't you play when the tables have players on them?
I like to focus on what I am doing. I also like to interact with the dealers. I also don't like it when there are too many distractions. I don't like it when there are chips in my landing zone. I don't like it when people are running into me.
And just like above, why in the world would you possibly have a legitimate reason to ask me why I prefer an empty table? I like empty tables, dude!
Your dice rolls that you have posted shows you are hitting your points higher than average.Quote: AhighIf I continue to get the same results recording my rolls, I would say that it is plausible that I have enough skill to overcome the edge, which means that I can theoretically continue to have a possibility of winning money no matter how often I play provided I don't sign up for too much variance to ruin it for me (IE: odds).
# points established 463 (ev of 454)
passed: 209 (ev:188) about 2SDs better than average (1 in 38)
missed: 254
total pass: 346
total miss: 335
Just a pass line bettor would be up by betting your rolls. The more odds the higher the profit.
say $5 pass line bets
No odds
+$55 (better than a kick in the groin)
($60 draw-down)
2X odds
+$604
345X odds
+$1,110
10x odds
+$2800
20X odds
+$5545 ($315 draw-down)
100X
+$27,505
($1475 draw-down)
Many Craps players would rather make a few extra come bets instead of taking too high odds
(345X odds tables have many players just taking 1 or 2 X odds, but making more come or place bets - more fun for more action)
or just placing some numbers (like the 6&8 at the minimum)
Their net results will be different
Of course, to duplicate this the next 2400 rolls would be even more impressive. See what happens.
It would be even better to see actual dice rolls from a real casino. That really is the bottom line.
What is stopping you from collecting and posting your actual casino dice rolls?
They insist you place a wager to roll in most casinos.
Because that question is to point out to you and anybody else that doesn't understand what you are doing, it's not the same at home as it is in a casino when you are shooting! For some odd reason you just don't get it. Everything you show is at home with no distractions!
Quote:
Ahigh
I like to focus on what I am doing. I also like to interact with the dealers. I also don't like it when there are too many distractions. I don't like it when there are chips in my landing zone. I don't like it when people are running into me.
Quote:
Ahigh
And just like above, why in the world would you possibly have a legitimate reason to ask me why I prefer an empty table? I like empty tables, dude!
Trust me Ahigh, ever question I ask is only about what you wrote that I see as a way to explain what you are writing just doesn't add up; and to show that you are just random.
They tell me that you always use the same set and that you are not trying to throw 7's on the come out rolls, well if that is true then all the 7's you throw are losers. In your mind or anybody else that can't see that, I feel for them. You can't say just because the seven was a come-out roll and that it didn't changed your SRR, maybe you will have to admit it just like my good buddy The Madprofessor did, that you made a mistake about your SRR., when he defended his SRR of his claim to fame of 28 for years. How embarrassing for the so-called DI's out there. Their hero going down in flames about his SRR!
Now that would have never happened if it wasn't for a very few guys questioning about his SRR of 28 claim to fame.
I don't get offended when someone points out that I'm wrong, everybody is not picking on me by doing so, Grow up!!!!!!!!!! Do all the research you can, then present it to the world even if you do not prove anything at all. Then when someone does question you you will won't have to say it was luck or bad luck, that you rolled those 7's, and it had nothing to do with your research was done at home. Lets see some real data taking from when you play in the casinos and while your at it tell everybody up front that you do not try to roll 7's on the come out rolls!
From Ahigh's posted dice rollsQuote: superrickThey tell me that you always use the same set and that you are not trying to throw 7's on the come out rolls, well if that is true then all the 7's you throw are losers. In your mind or anybody else that can't see that, I feel for them.
...
Lets see some real data taking from when you play in the casinos and while your at it tell everybody up front that you do not try to roll 7's on the come out rolls!
https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/gambling/craps/12821-ahigh-show-tuesday-at-7-30pm-pacific-time/13/#post216796
Total sevens 361 - Seven outs 254 (70.36%) - Seven winners 107 (29.64%)
(107 verified in WinCraps)
The probability of any 7 rolled being a 7 winner is just 165/557 (29.62%)
361 * (165/557) = 106.9389587
Looks dead on without trying
Wow! What is the chance that with 361 7s rolled, exactly 107 of them would be 7 winners??
About 4.5937% or 1 in 22
Yeah, time now for real casino dice roll data
Look, I think in spite of all your criticisms of the Mad Professor, he doesn't have the habit you have of attacking other people.
I'm not surprised that I am being the target of your attacks at this point in time.
I'm glad you're not offended, but I just don't give much value to anything you're saying up here.
In fact, I could call _you_ one of the great "fiction writers" .. and "so-called DI's." You fit the description of your own loathsome terms!