How Easily Executed is Basic Strategy?
August 8th, 2011 at 7:33:22 PM
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I have heard people in my life, and on these posts and websites alike joke about how difficult it can be to not only learn basic strategy, but to actually execute it, "especially after a couple cocktails." For those of you who have been there, even if you memorize basic strategy, how easy is it for a real casino newbie to step up to a table and be able to execute basic strategy? Just wondering, as I will be one of those people in about a month. :) Thanks.
August 8th, 2011 at 7:40:44 PM
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I would say not that hard. Then again, it's easy to assume you're playing well when you don't notice your mistakes. Just practice on the wizards BJ game. If you can play without hints and have minimal errors then you should do fine at the real table. The tables can be intimidating, especially with a quick dealer, but there is nothing wrong with taking your time to think about a decision. Btw, most casinos allow you to use a basic strategy card at the table if you forget.
After a few drinks, well that's another story...
After a few drinks, well that's another story...
August 8th, 2011 at 7:46:54 PM
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Quote: akd1217I have heard people in my life, and on these posts and websites alike joke about how difficult it can be to not only learn basic strategy, but to actually execute it, "especially after a couple cocktails." For those of you who have been there, even if you memorize basic strategy, how easy is it for a real casino newbie to step up to a table and be able to execute basic strategy? Just wondering, as I will be one of those people in about a month. :) Thanks.
I don't think it is difficult at all. There are not many things to remember beyond simple logic. Example: Do not hit if the dealer can bust. Then learn the exception: hit 12 if dealer has 2 or 3. It really is quite simple.
August 8th, 2011 at 7:48:14 PM
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Piece of cake - Solid Blackjack is very easy.
Most hands are completely obvious with a little bit of practice, and rarer hands can be memorized.
Not hard.
Doesn't mean that you'll win. It means you have a good shot at it.
Most hands are completely obvious with a little bit of practice, and rarer hands can be memorized.
Not hard.
Doesn't mean that you'll win. It means you have a good shot at it.
Beware of all enterprises that require new clothes - Henry David Thoreau. Like Dealers' uniforms - Dan.
August 8th, 2011 at 7:54:12 PM
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Correction: ALL casinos allow you to use a strategy card. It's just that some casinos don't want you to place it on the table.Quote: iwannaiguanaBtw, most casinos allow you to use a basic strategy card at the table if you forget.
They also want you to reference the card and make a decision without dilly-dallying. If you're taking more than a second or two to find the answer on the card, and then struggle to decide if you're really gonna follow that advice, then they'll bust your chops.
Note: There are different strategies based upon different rules. The differences are minor, but important, so use the correct card.
I invented a few casino games. Info:
http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ —————————————————————————————————————
Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
August 8th, 2011 at 10:29:25 PM
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Good answer DJ - I had the same question a few years ago and found it pretty easy to fit in.
For a newbie, it's actually more important to get the etiquette right:
Remember that the dealer will wait until the deal is over before taking your money.
LEARN THE HAND SIGNALS
If playing pitch, learn to only use one hand to pick up the cards and signal.
Playing promptly (but not hurriedly) is not just what the casino wants, it's polite to the other players as well.
Be friendly to the other players. You will all win together on a dealer 22 and all lose together on a 21.
Tip the dealer - then they'll know you aren't a counter.
It's OK to use $1.00 chips for tips to the dealer or the drink server.
For a newbie, it's actually more important to get the etiquette right:
Remember that the dealer will wait until the deal is over before taking your money.
LEARN THE HAND SIGNALS
If playing pitch, learn to only use one hand to pick up the cards and signal.
Playing promptly (but not hurriedly) is not just what the casino wants, it's polite to the other players as well.
Be friendly to the other players. You will all win together on a dealer 22 and all lose together on a 21.
Tip the dealer - then they'll know you aren't a counter.
It's OK to use $1.00 chips for tips to the dealer or the drink server.
August 9th, 2011 at 12:13:34 AM
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There are websites that offer an "advisor-on" state wherein any wrong action by you opens up a small text box giving you the correct Hit, Stand, Double, Surrender, Punt response. Some sites can even be set to give you six seconds to respond correctly. The "advisor-off" status and the "six seconds on" status after you've consumed a few drinks just might be a good test.
Now lets face it, no one is really going to be all that impaired after just a few drinks. And no one is really going to be all that distracted by the waitresses beauty. Put a red chip in the circle and heads may turn, put a black chip in the circle and I'll pay attention to my cards.
There probably is a difference between 'home' and 'any casino'. There is certainly a difference between three drinks and nine drinks for most players. Still a bit of slurred speech or vague signals can be dealt with.
Now lets face it, no one is really going to be all that impaired after just a few drinks. And no one is really going to be all that distracted by the waitresses beauty. Put a red chip in the circle and heads may turn, put a black chip in the circle and I'll pay attention to my cards.
There probably is a difference between 'home' and 'any casino'. There is certainly a difference between three drinks and nine drinks for most players. Still a bit of slurred speech or vague signals can be dealt with.
August 9th, 2011 at 1:21:35 AM
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For me it would be very easy to play perfect strategy after any number of drinks but then again I am quite experienced. Although I admit some time ago I forgot how to play 3,3 vs. 7 at live table. I thought the correct move was to hit and I ended up winning the hand, but actually the correct move was to split because of possibility to double down after splitting.
August 9th, 2011 at 4:10:41 AM
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I don't memorize things well. I can only get the fist 7 digits of π
Someday, joor goin' to see the name of Googie Gomez in lights and joor goin' to say to joorself, "Was that her?" and then joor goin' to answer to joorself, "That was her!" But you know somethin' mister? I was always her yuss nobody knows it! - Googie Gomez
August 9th, 2011 at 6:00:57 AM
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I also say it's not that hard, certainly not for the basic basics (e.g., always hit to 17+ against a 7+ up card). Some hands are played differently with single decks vs. double vs. shoes, and that can be a little tricky - especially when I'm playing against different configurations on the same trip. But practice makes perfect, so study up and you'll be fine.
August 9th, 2011 at 7:20:59 AM
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Quote: MarkAbeTip the dealer - then they'll know you aren't a counter.
Never tip. I haven't tipped for decades and no one has ever said anything--and I am a counter.
August 9th, 2011 at 7:41:25 AM
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Quote: matildaNever tip. I haven't tipped for decades and no one has ever said anything--and I am a counter.
I am curious, do you still tip waiters in restaurants, taxi cab drivers, bartenders etc. If you do, what is the distinction you make between those people and the dealers at the casino?
"When two people always agree one of them is unnecessary"
August 9th, 2011 at 7:47:20 AM
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Quote: weaselmanI am curious, do you still tip waiters in restaurants, taxi cab drivers, bartenders etc. If you do, what is the distinction you make between those people and the dealers at the casino?
The distinction is that the others offer a service. Dealers do not. I don't tip blackjack machines either. I also don't tip in Europe.
August 9th, 2011 at 8:25:18 AM
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Quote: matildaThe distinction is that the others offer a service. Dealers do not. I don't tip blackjack machines either. I also don't tip in Europe.
Hm. Don't they offer service in Europe? :)
How do you suppose a dealer does not offer a service, and a waiter does? Do you tip coffee machines then? :)
All the bartender does for you is tilt the bottle and pour some liquid into the glass. You, probably, pay him about a buck for 10 seconds of service, and consider it appropriate. A dealer meanwhile spends hours making sure you are having quality time, yet you feel you are getting no service from him whatsoever?
I am not arguing anything, one way or the other, just trying to understand the rationale behind your position.
"When two people always agree one of them is unnecessary"
August 9th, 2011 at 9:13:49 AM
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Quote: weaselmanHm. Don't they offer service in Europe? :)
How do you suppose a dealer does not offer a service, and a waiter does? Do you tip coffee machines then? :)
All the bartender does for you is tilt the bottle and pour some liquid into the glass. You, probably, pay him about a buck for 10 seconds of service, and consider it appropriate. A dealer meanwhile spends hours making sure you are having quality time, yet you feel you are getting no service from him whatsoever?
I am not arguing anything, one way or the other, just trying to understand the rationale behind your position.
Good questions. Not so easy to give clear cut answers.
Europe is easy. Tipping is not in the culture for the most part, service is added to bills so tipping isn't expected. I've even had tips refused. In general, service workers are actually paid a living wage.
In casinos, the dealer is an arm of the casino. He/she does not entertain me, I am not buying entertainment, I am at work. The dealer provides no service to me. He just takes my money or gives me money. I think it as one business doing business with another business. Generally businesses do not tip other businesses. However, if I played keno, heaven forbid, and I walked up to the counter and placed my bet and later cashed a winner, I would not tip. However if I was in the restaurant and I placed the same bet with a runner and I won and he/she brought me my winnings, I would tip because a service was performed.
You are correct about bartenders. That figures to $360 an hour. I will have to reconsider my bar tipping.
August 9th, 2011 at 9:48:58 AM
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Quote: matildaNever tip. I haven't tipped for decades and no one has ever said anything--and I am a counter.
I'm with you on what will undoubtedly be an unpopular view of tipping. I've kept meticulous records of my blackjack play over the last 4 decades and my tips have been few and far between. I've logged over 600 hours of blackjack so far this year and can proudly say that I've yet to tip and it's got nothing to do with being cheap.
I've played with every dealer type imaginable from tip hustlers and whiners to the nicest human beings on earth, but they're all the same to me- they just deliver the cards.
Away from the blackjack table, I tip appropriately and even generously at times.
August 9th, 2011 at 9:57:50 AM
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I suggest that you take the tipping discussion to the hundreds-of-posts-long, Tipping inside casinos thread.
I invented a few casino games. Info:
http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ —————————————————————————————————————
Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
August 10th, 2011 at 3:08:51 AM
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What I've been doing to learn is to pick one game. I picked single deck H17 because it was an easy cheap trip for me and black jack pays 3:2 still. After I picked my game I wrote down all the basic strategy that I didn't know. A pair of 10's or a pair of 8's were pretty obvious for me so I left plays like that off of my "cheat sheet". whenever I play I have that sheet with me. At home I have it sittig right next to me when I play. When at the casino I keep it in my back pocket so I can reference a play that I'm unsure of after I leave the table. It also helped me to group different cards together on my cheat sheet. For example, ace 2-5 double vs dealer 4-6, otherwise hit.
August 10th, 2011 at 5:39:01 AM
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For a long time I avoided blackjack because of the chore of having to memorize basic strategy. But one day I decided to just bite the bullet and learn it. Then I just practiced it until I had it down smooth, especially the trouble hands (for me) like the soft doubles. There are websites out there that have basic strategy trainers (e.g. google "hit or split") that helped with drills. As for the impact of alcohol i have done some experiments at home and find that a few drinks doesn't cause me to make any errors, just slows me down. But you want to avoid playing when drunk, as then not only are you likely to make errors, you are not even going to realize it!
"Mathematical expectation has nothing to do with results." (Sklansky, Theory of Poker).
August 10th, 2011 at 9:14:14 AM
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I thought BS was very easy to learn, just takes some time and practice.
I try to practice at home or wherever I am at, I use the one of those Roll Up blackjack mats . I review the rules for whatever game I am playing at;
1st on the BS sheet, I note the differences( actually very few), then I deal to myself 5 hands at a time.
At home H17 2D and 6D NS , in Vegas S17 2D NS , S17 6D w/ S. Actually very easy, there are only a few changes
It really helps to know the game offered and the proper play on every hand, before you enter the casino .
As for the alcohol,. I am usually shit drunk or on my way, when playing !! Not as fun for me w/o drinking !! ( Actually boring !!)
Many times so drunk, I wont remember if I won or lost or how much !! (lol)
This has made for some crazy times and wild bets at the tables !!
I have found I can play BS 100 % but cannot count when drunk, and my betting gets a bit wild !!
When I can count, when I am shit drunk , I will have attained my goal !! :)
I try to practice at home or wherever I am at, I use the one of those Roll Up blackjack mats . I review the rules for whatever game I am playing at;
1st on the BS sheet, I note the differences( actually very few), then I deal to myself 5 hands at a time.
At home H17 2D and 6D NS , in Vegas S17 2D NS , S17 6D w/ S. Actually very easy, there are only a few changes
It really helps to know the game offered and the proper play on every hand, before you enter the casino .
As for the alcohol,. I am usually shit drunk or on my way, when playing !! Not as fun for me w/o drinking !! ( Actually boring !!)
Many times so drunk, I wont remember if I won or lost or how much !! (lol)
This has made for some crazy times and wild bets at the tables !!
I have found I can play BS 100 % but cannot count when drunk, and my betting gets a bit wild !!
When I can count, when I am shit drunk , I will have attained my goal !! :)
" If I had the money and the drinking capacity, I'd probably live at a blackjak table and let my life go to hell." Don Pedro
August 10th, 2011 at 9:38:27 AM
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As for tipping , never !!
A few exceptions though:
If I have behaved like an ASS ( while drunk) which I sometimes do, I will tip them out next time I am in , a few reds, maybe a green if I was especially bad.
Just to thank them for being a good sport, and in a way I am fineing myself for the bad behavior.
On occassion, I will also toss chips at the dealer and/or pitboss, if I feel it is warranted. ( shit drunk, get cut off, steaming/losing my ass and the dealer seems to enjoy it ) Usually reds, green a few times. A few times just left my chips on the table after a bad beat !! I know not very smart !!
Also if it is an attractive/built female dealer, and the table has been harrassing her, I will toke her a few reds for being a good sport !!
A few exceptions though:
If I have behaved like an ASS ( while drunk) which I sometimes do, I will tip them out next time I am in , a few reds, maybe a green if I was especially bad.
Just to thank them for being a good sport, and in a way I am fineing myself for the bad behavior.
On occassion, I will also toss chips at the dealer and/or pitboss, if I feel it is warranted. ( shit drunk, get cut off, steaming/losing my ass and the dealer seems to enjoy it ) Usually reds, green a few times. A few times just left my chips on the table after a bad beat !! I know not very smart !!
Also if it is an attractive/built female dealer, and the table has been harrassing her, I will toke her a few reds for being a good sport !!
" If I had the money and the drinking capacity, I'd probably live at a blackjak table and let my life go to hell." Don Pedro
