How long did it take for you to become a WINNING AP ?

What were the improvements you made in your game to turn you into a winner ?

Quote: DonPedro

What were the improvements you made in your game to turn you into a winner ?

mostly, finding dealers that lack confidence and not correcting their mistakes when they err in your favor.

Since 99% of players are just fooling themselves if they say they are an advantage player I feel there should be more choices on the poll..

I like s2dbaker's answer btw

Time? exactly 2 days.

wow ?

Over a year is the last choice? A year is nothing.

good point !!

Quote: DonPedro

What were the improvements you made in your game to turn you into a winner ?

For blackjack, it was becoming proficient with more than one counting method, using the best one for the game at hand and performing it flawlessly. Other improvements were betting within bankroll limits, playing only the best games and resisting the urge to recoup loses by "steaming" or betting recklessly. I also became one of the world's greatest schmoozers and I swear it's better and definitely less costly than most cover plays.

I voted for over a year because it was way over a year for me and yes I'm in that 1%.

I can really relate to and appreciate your 2nd sentence !! " Other improvements were betting within bankroll limits, playing only the best games and resisting the urge to recoup loses by "steaming" or betting recklessly".

That should help a few people out !!

I think it will take me over a year as well, still not there !!

Quote: benbakdoff

I voted for over a year because it was way over a year for me and yes I'm in that 1%.

I'm TOTALLY that 1% too!

`Please define winning AP ? most self described players are merely unpaid prop players for the house. Losing less than other players
or breaking even does not constitute winning. Nor does making less than minimum wage. Winning AP players are like all the guys beating the spread on the NFL. Lots of talk, no proof !

Good point buzzpaff !!!

In my humble opinion a winning AP will:

Be a student and teacher of the game

Travel the world, country, or at least region, looking for better tables.

Plays at least 25 hrs. 2-3000 hands. per week , 8-12000 hands a month, over a 100,000 hands a year.

Show through records more winning months than losing months , the winning months must more than make up for the losing months.

Show a 1-2 % profit of his total action for the year.

Has or could make a make a living playing BJ or at least supplement his income.

What have I left out ?

FYI- I am far from the above but am striving to improve my game !!

Agree with everything except 1-2 % . I doubt even George ( world best BJ player per Ken Uston) can exceed 1.5% in today's
environment.

ok at least 1 %

Thanks for the input ! :)

Anything else ?

That 1% advantage is about 100 times greater than the number of actual advantage players.

So far less than 1 % of players are AP's, I would agree w/ that.

So in todays game, how can we become and AP and what will it take ?

I began Speed Counting in 2010 (learned it in basically a weekend) and, since then I am plus $32k (but in no way do I consider myself an AP at all - just a blackjack player who speed counts)

AP is someone who plays with an advantage. Who plays only when there is an advantage. (except maybe on rare occasions when he gambles with insignificant amount of money for fun or other reason, like buing lottery tickets in a charity event).
There are playres like that and I count myslef in them.
There are very few full time pros. More part timers. And a bit more of occasional players (like once a week players). Still all of them together are probably a lot less than 1% of players.

I rarely used to gamble before I learned to count (like going to a casino 1-2 times a year).
When I found about counting (that was many years ago), it took me about 1-2 months just learning basic and counting at home and practising (say around 30-40 hours of learning and practise). Then I tried those skills in a casino at the lowest limits and slowly build my confidence and increased my limits. Then after about 1.5 years I increased the limits significantly to the point where the income was very decent. Then I learned more advanced skills and then expanded to another game (there are other games except BJ where an advantage exists ouside of the US). I think I was AP from day 1.
I used to travel quite a bit for business purposes in places where there were decent BJ games. So I did not have significant travel expenses as the travel was alerady occuring for another reason.
Now I am playing very liitle (other professional interests pay a lot better and I have very liitle time to play) and maybe that's why I am writing in this forum.


I have met quite a few APs (outside US). I think I can spot one even before I see him playing based on certain characteristics. Some are better than others, some are barely APs (low level of skill). Most are doing it on the side of whetever else they are doing. I met one guy who was a full time pro. (that was about 6 years ago). At that time he was travelling the world playing BJ (Europe, Asia, Latin America).

Amazingly (luckily) the absolute FIRST day of being an AP...
I had read up and practiced at home, for video poker...
First time going to the casino to SERIOUSLY play video poker (10/7 DoubleBonus) I not only hit a 25c royal, the very next day (fri/sat) I hit a DEALT 25c royal!
Nothing like breaking into the business with a bang!