camz1969
camz1969
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January 9th, 2021 at 2:15:45 PM permalink
What are the minimums looking like now for 3:2 shoes on the strip and Fremont? I heard a few months ago that many of the strip casinos had $50 mins for 3:2. Is that still the case? I assume Fremont still has an abundance of 15s and 25s.
TinMan
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camz1969
January 9th, 2021 at 2:55:25 PM permalink
Quote: camz1969

What are the minimums looking like now for 3:2 shoes on the strip and Fremont? I heard a few months ago that many of the strip casinos had $50 mins for 3:2. Is that still the case? I assume Fremont still has an abundance of 15s and 25s.



When I was there late October, CET properties typically had 3:2 for $25. Ballys had it for $15 daytime with surrender. MGM properties I saw (including Excalibur and Luxor) were all 6:5 at least up to $25, possibly higher. Park MGM told me only 3:2 in high limit. Downtown had $10 3:2 at a few places, including Cal. This all may be changed now.
If anyone gives you 10,000 to 1 on anything, you take it. If John Mellencamp ever wins an Oscar, I am going to be a very rich dude.
Gabes22
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January 9th, 2021 at 5:59:31 PM permalink
I was there late September. There was a 3:2 DD game at Treasure Island for $15
A flute with no holes is not a flute, a donut with no holes is a danish
WTflush
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January 9th, 2021 at 7:36:15 PM permalink
Quote: TinMan

When I was there late October, CET properties typically had 3:2 for $25. Ballys had it for $15 daytime with surrender. MGM properties I saw (including Excalibur and Luxor) were all 6:5 at least up to $25, possibly higher. Park MGM told me only 3:2 in high limit. Downtown had $10 3:2 at a few places, including Cal. This all may be changed now.



As of a couple weeks ago this was all still accurate. I'll add that wynn, venetian and sahara are $100 minimum of higher to get 3:2. I'll look around again next week and if I see anything different I'll report back.
Greasyjohn
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January 9th, 2021 at 8:07:37 PM permalink
Quote: Gabes22

I was there late September. There was a 3:2 DD game at Treasure Island for $15



Iím reminded of my only time playing blackjack here, about 2004. Won about $1,400 in 40 minutes in their high limit room playing $25 min, 3:2, S17 game.
ChumpChange
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January 10th, 2021 at 12:23:58 PM permalink
Card Counting at Wynn Casino in Las Vegas
Wynn Casino in Las Vegas is a place where high rollers fill the tables. This helps to hide large bets when counting cards. However, keep in mind that Wynn blackjack games use RFID chips that can track player activity. This can potentially be used to correlate your betting to the count and expose your card counting. The 6-deck blackjack games at Wynn donít deal very deep, so youíre better off sticking to the double deck. I would recommend either playing anonymously or using very heavy cover if youíre getting rated on a players card.

https://www.blackjackclassroom.com/casinos/wynn-casino

6 Deck Blackjack (S17)
Table Limits: $25/$50/$100 minimum Ė $10,000 maximum
Blackjack Rules: dealer stands on Soft 17 (S17), double after split allowed (DAS), resplit aces (RSA), surrender offered

6 Deck Blackjack (H17)
Table Limits: $10/$25 minimum Ė $5,000 maximum
Blackjack Rules: dealer hits on Soft 17 (H17), double after split allowed (DAS), resplit aces (RSA), surrender offered

Double Deck Blackjack Ė Main Floor
Table Limits: $50/$100 minimum Ė $10,000 maximum
Blackjack Rules: dealer hits on Soft 17 (H17), double after splitting allowed (DAS), no resplitting aces, no surrendering

Single Deck Blackjack
Table Limits: $25 minimum Ė $5,000 maximum
Blackjack Rules: dealer hits on Soft 17 (H17), double down after split allowed (DAS), no resplitting aces, blackjack pays 6:5
WTflush
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January 11th, 2021 at 12:04:53 PM permalink
Quote: ChumpChange

Card Counting at Wynn Casino in Las Vegas
Wynn Casino in Las Vegas is a place where high rollers fill the tables. This helps to hide large bets when counting cards. However, keep in mind that Wynn blackjack games use RFID chips that can track player activity. This can potentially be used to correlate your betting to the count and expose your card counting. The 6-deck blackjack games at Wynn donít deal very deep, so youíre better off sticking to the double deck. I would recommend either playing anonymously or using very heavy cover if youíre getting rated on a players card.

https://www.blackjackclassroom.com/casinos/wynn-casino

6 Deck Blackjack (S17)
Table Limits: $25/$50/$100 minimum Ė $10,000 maximum
Blackjack Rules: dealer stands on Soft 17 (S17), double after split allowed (DAS), resplit aces (RSA), surrender offered

6 Deck Blackjack (H17)
Table Limits: $10/$25 minimum Ė $5,000 maximum
Blackjack Rules: dealer hits on Soft 17 (H17), double after split allowed (DAS), resplit aces (RSA), surrender offered

Double Deck Blackjack Ė Main Floor
Table Limits: $50/$100 minimum Ė $10,000 maximum
Blackjack Rules: dealer hits on Soft 17 (H17), double after splitting allowed (DAS), no resplitting aces, no surrendering

Single Deck Blackjack
Table Limits: $25 minimum Ė $5,000 maximum
Blackjack Rules: dealer hits on Soft 17 (H17), double down after split allowed (DAS), no resplitting aces, blackjack pays 6:5



This thread is about blackjack conditions in the post-lockdown era, that article is 4 years old. Safe to assume it's no longer accurate.
fantom
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January 13th, 2021 at 8:01:11 AM permalink
Quote: WTflush

This thread is about blackjack conditions in the post-lockdown era, that article is 4 years old. Safe to assume it's no longer accurate.



You are new here. That explains your confusion. Thread titles have a relevant shelf life of about four posts. At which point the thread has devolved into one of about a half dozen totally unrelated topics that have absolutely nothing to do with either Las Vegas, gambling, or. often, reality.

When browsing, don't rely on the title of a thread to be indicative of anything once it's more than a few days old.

That a cited article is obsolete is also par for the course. You'll note that many of the subtopics referencing specific Las Vegas casinos are also very old. It is also "safe to assume... [they are] no longer accurate."

A few years ago this forum was timely, valuable, and current, with interesting, often accurate posts from many different members.
kewlj
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February 9th, 2021 at 1:54:51 AM permalink
I am not going to get into specifics because it has now been just about 2 months since I have played blackjack anywhere.

I had covid back in April, so when casinos reopened in June, fully recovered, I felt very comfortable playing, knowing I had some kind of immunity for at least some period of time. So I played my usual Vegas rotation (except a couple casinos that remained closed) and even found some new playable games, that weren't in my rotation, pre-covid shutdown.

I played through October when new data showed antibodies began to wane after 5-6 months. (October was 6 months for me). A person probably still has some immunity even after antibodies begin to wane, because there are cells, I think t-cells that retain memory and likely can ramp up antibodies much quicker should they detect a second infection. While that probably wouldn't stop a second infection, it probably would result in a milder case. BUT, being in the higher risk group having had 2 heart surgeries, "probablies" and "mights" are a little too much risk for me. So I ceased my blackjack play.

However, my experience for the time that I played post-covid, was that conditions in Las Vegas were as good or better than anytime, during my 12 years here. Part of that was due to less crowded condition, even though spots at the table were limited to 3 players. Usually you could find a heads up game or at most 1 other player. And like I said, there were a few places I found that the games even improved. Games that were unplayable for me were now playable. And I have heard of a few more since I stopped playing.

Bottom line: I would say post-covid BJ conditions in Vegas were and probably still are, really good. I hate not taking advantage of that right now, but unfortunately it is just a little too much risk for me health-wise. I am going to wait for my vaccine. (16-64 age group with underlying condition) and hope the good blackjack conditions remain.
unJon
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February 9th, 2021 at 3:04:28 AM permalink
Quote: fantom

You are new here. That explains your confusion. Thread titles have a relevant shelf life of about four posts. At which point the thread has devolved into one of about a half dozen totally unrelated topics that have absolutely nothing to do with either Las Vegas, gambling, or. often, reality.

When browsing, don't rely on the title of a thread to be indicative of anything once it's more than a few days old.

That a cited article is obsolete is also par for the course. You'll note that many of the subtopics referencing specific Las Vegas casinos are also very old. It is also "safe to assume... [they are] no longer accurate."

A few years ago this forum was timely, valuable, and current, with interesting, often accurate posts from many different members.



Buzz?
The race is not always to the swift, nor the battle to the strong; but that is the way to bet.
billryan
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February 9th, 2021 at 8:25:44 AM permalink
Quote: fantom

You are new here. That explains your confusion. Thread titles have a relevant shelf life of about four posts. At which point the thread has devolved into one of about a half dozen totally unrelated topics that have absolutely nothing to do with either Las Vegas, gambling, or. often, reality.

When browsing, don't rely on the title of a thread to be indicative of anything once it's more than a few days old.

That a cited article is obsolete is also par for the course. You'll note that many of the subtopics referencing specific Las Vegas casinos are also very old. It is also "safe to assume... [they are] no longer accurate."

A few years ago this forum was timely, valuable, and current, with interesting, often accurate posts from many different members.




This might mean something if it weren't coming from someone who joined in December and who has made under forty posts.
The difference between fiction and reality is that fiction is supposed to make sense.
MJGolf
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February 9th, 2021 at 8:38:01 AM permalink
The simple fact is "post Covid" minimums have increased and conditions have worsened. Even since I was here in Oct, conditions have seriously worsened. Used to be DD games at Caesars properties, with $25 minimums during day and $50 at least at night, you still have 3-2 games (nDAS-hit 17) games. NOW they are almost ALL gone. They are 6-5 monstrosities. With still high limits. At Paris for example, no 3-2 unless playing high limit table DD $100 minimums. Cromwell advertises 3-2 BJ on their signs, so they have to have it, right? Well only during the early hours and they they convert to 6-5. Flamingo seemed to be the same. You can still get 3-2 on 8 shoe games but you have to watch because they will be right next to a 6-5 game. You would think that John Q Public would be able to figure out the difference but apparently NOT.

I will confirm that TI had one $15 DD table but it was limited to 3 players and full the times I walked through. I am here currently for Superbowl and for the couple days after. The Strip is a weird place at moment. Very low class, Los Angeles or Southern Calif clientele. I think it's because they have very cheap room rates. But food prices are very, very high........even from my last trip. And they are limiting capacity in restaurants (or the ones you would like to eat at) to 25%. I do not think I will be back for awhile, even though I have friends here. At least to the Strip.
fantom
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February 9th, 2021 at 9:06:23 AM permalink
Quote: billryan

This might mean something if it weren't coming from someone who joined in December and who has made under forty posts.



Maybe I have been lurking here for a long time without joining. I think that's allowed, and in fact I'll bet a lot of folks do exactly that.

Maybe I am someone who has read thousands of posts, noticing how often, after a few relevant responses, the usual thread degenerates into a back-and-forth between a few habitual posters who spend most of their time either taunting each other or exchange messages as if they were talking on the telephone.

Regardless of how long it appears I have been around here, it did not take me long to wish for a rule on this forum that responses had to be relevant to the topic in question.

But of course that might leave some of you with nothing to talk about,

Here I am, guilty myself of taking this thread off-topic. Let's see if it goes even farther afield...
kewlj
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February 9th, 2021 at 9:29:21 AM permalink
Quote: MJGolf

The simple fact is "post Covid" minimums have increased and conditions have worsened. Even since I was here in Oct, conditions have seriously worsened. Used to be DD games at Caesars properties, with $25 minimums during day and $50 at least at night, you still have 3-2 games (nDAS-hit 17) games. NOW they are almost ALL gone. They are 6-5 monstrosities. With still high limits. At Paris for example, no 3-2 unless playing high limit table DD $100 minimums. Cromwell advertises 3-2 BJ on their signs, so they have to have it, right? Well only during the early hours and they they convert to 6-5. Flamingo seemed to be the same. You can still get 3-2 on 8 shoe games but you have to watch because they will be right next to a 6-5 game. You would think that John Q Public would be able to figure out the difference but apparently NOT.

I will confirm that TI had one $15 DD table but it was limited to 3 players and full the times I walked through. I am here currently for Superbowl and for the couple days after. The Strip is a weird place at moment. Very low class, Los Angeles or Southern Calif clientele. I think it's because they have very cheap room rates. But food prices are very, very high........even from my last trip. And they are limiting capacity in restaurants (or the ones you would like to eat at) to 25%. I do not think I will be back for awhile, even though I have friends here. At least to the Strip.



Well the strip is the strip. lol. It has been mostly unplayable for years. I was mostly talking about the off strip and even downtown locations that are in my rotation when I said as good as anytime since I have been in Las Vegas (12 years).

The only place on the strip that I played post covid was TI in September and October. In addition to the $15 DD game, they have, a $15, 6 deck game with late surrender, or at least did back in Sept/Oct. And yes, they only had 1 DD and 1 or 2, 6 deck tables open on weekdays when I played, but that is all they needed. They were never crowded. I could usually even play heads up.
camz1969
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February 9th, 2021 at 10:58:47 AM permalink
KJ, why have you considered the Strip unplayable? Pre covid there were plenty of beatable $15/25 games. Obviously they werenít great rules but the advantage is you can blend in easy vs some little hole in the wall casino. If you can hop around a lot in short sessions you can get big bets out there without getting caught. Iím concerned about current times though with 6:5. I usually donít rent a car so Iím kind of limited to the Strip and Fremont...sounds like I should stay on Fremont next time I go.
kewlj
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February 9th, 2021 at 11:36:32 AM permalink
Quote: camz1969

KJ, why have you considered the Strip unplayable? Pre covid there were plenty of beatable $15/25 games. Obviously they werenít great rules but the advantage is you can blend in easy vs some little hole in the wall casino. If you can hop around a lot in short sessions you can get big bets out there without getting caught. Iím concerned about current times though with 6:5. I usually donít rent a car so Iím kind of limited to the Strip and Fremont...sounds like I should stay on Fremont next time I go.



Ok, that is probably my bad. When I say "unplayable", that sounds like I am saying "unbeatable", which is not what I am implying. While there is a lot of 6:5 on the strip at most of the Caesars and MGM properties (which basically is unplayable and unbeatable), there are games, 8 decks at lower limits, 6 decks at some higher limits that certainly are beatable, but I don't play. I don't play them because there are better opportunities for me, 6 deck, 3-2 games, some with surrender, with better penetration and less crowded conditions that the strip (during normal times).

I have my rotation which consists of about 10-12 of my best games that weekly, 1 or 2 twice weekly and another 15-20 or so that I consider my supplemental rotation, that I play twice a month. Not as good as my best games, but it stops me from overplaying my best few games.

I should be more careful using unplayable. (technically 6:5 is playable if you use a huge spread). Instead I should say less desirable to me, when there are better opportunities and games.
camz1969
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February 9th, 2021 at 7:15:28 PM permalink
I understand. Do you think some of the casinos in your rotation know by now that youíre a counter and are just tolerant? I donít see how they wouldnít know as frequently as you play for as many years as youíve played. Even in short sessions at different times it seems like after years they would remember you and that you scale bets before leaving. The problem is the casinos with the great rules tend to be the sweatiest. Even just playing greens with no desire of a players card at some places is an obvious red flag to them.
kewlj
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camz1969
February 9th, 2021 at 8:30:41 PM permalink
Quote: camz1969

I understand. Do you think some of the casinos in your rotation know by now that youíre a counter and are just tolerant? I donít see how they wouldnít know as frequently as you play for as many years as youíve played. Even in short sessions at different times it seems like after years they would remember you and that you scale bets before leaving. The problem is the casinos with the great rules tend to be the sweatiest. Even just playing greens with no desire of a players card at some places is an obvious red flag to them.



Definitely some both pit and dealers in my regular rotation recognize me. I am sure they know me as a local or regular player. And more than likely some have me pegged as a card counter. I try to spread it around, play different dealers maybe avoid a pit guy, especially after a bigger score. Even more important is to play short sessions which will result in more smaller wins and losses and less of the really big wins that draw attention and someone has to answer for. That is really what my whole game and plan of attack is about. Identifying and playing levels that are well tolerated and keeping it short, to avoid big wins and losses.

If you do that some, not all, but some pit folks will definitely look the other way. Problems arise when you are creating a situation that they have to answer for.

And there are all sorts of little tricks. I play my regular casinos with a chip inventory. This means I don't have to buy in, which means I have avoided the first interaction between player and pit. Now it is still the pit guys job to come over and ask about a new player, what he bought in for, in my case the dealer will say he started play with chips. Maybe the pit guy will ask me. Maybe he just marks down what I have in front of me at that moment. If he asks, I always inflate, which will make my win seem smaller or loss bigger. Kind of related to rat holing. Now sometimes if it is busy and the pit guy is doing other things like a fill or changing cards, I can get in (with chips in hand) and out without ever interacting with him.

And of course exiting at the shuffle after showing your bigger bets is a must. This mean, they never see me retreat back to smaller or waiting bets at the shuffle, and THAT is the really big tell of a card counter not raising bets. All sorts of players raise bets, progressive players, players chasing losses, players chipping up after wins, all raise bets. AND the casinos love every damn one of them. But a player retreating back to small bets at the shuffle...that is the big tell of a card counter.

So, way to late for the short answer, but yeah, no doubt some pit and dealers recognize me as a regular player, maybe a half assed card counter. But I don't rock the boat and create situations they have to answer for and so far that has equaled longevity.
HiOpt2Poor
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March 28th, 2021 at 10:28:44 PM permalink
Update for February 2021.

Double Deck $50 Minimum Noon to 3 or 4am Friday and Saturday. $25 Min Weekend mornings. Was not there on any weekdays and I didn't see any single deck.
HiOpt2Poor
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March 29th, 2021 at 5:33:24 PM permalink
Sorry My post here about the $50 weekend nights and $25 mornings was for the Wynn Las Vegas Feb 2021
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