Lucca3927
Lucca3927
Joined: Aug 5, 2017
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March 2nd, 2018 at 9:25:57 AM permalink
Hi. I was just wondering if there were any real card counters on the forum- and by that I mean good enough to get backed off from a table? If so, how long do you think it takes to get that way? My guess would be 6-7 months.

Just curious.
"I should have bet black." - Winston Churchill .
billryan
billryan
Joined: Nov 2, 2009
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March 2nd, 2018 at 9:29:28 AM permalink
You are well off the mark.
Lucca3927
Lucca3927
Joined: Aug 5, 2017
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March 2nd, 2018 at 9:30:13 AM permalink
Off the mark in the number of people here or my learning curve estimate?
"I should have bet black." - Winston Churchill .
BlackjackGuy123
BlackjackGuy123
Joined: Jul 27, 2017
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March 2nd, 2018 at 9:36:29 AM permalink
I am a real card counter and have been backed off and banned from a number of casinos. It takes about 50 to 100 hours of solid practice before you can employ hi-lo with an acceptable error rate (1 out of 500 decisions).
Romes
Romes
Joined: Jul 22, 2014
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March 2nd, 2018 at 9:40:15 AM permalink
Quote: Lucca3927

Hi. I was just wondering if there were any real card counters on the forum- and by that I mean good enough to get backed off from a table? If so, how long do you think it takes to get that way? My guess would be 6-7 months.

Just curious.

There are a lot of different types of counters I've... encountered... on this forum. Beginners/learning, intermediate, and a bunch that used to count quite seriously and move on to better opportunities (such as myself). I did get backed off just a month or two ago at a blackjack table though, shockingly enough.

Anyways, on to your next question... The question shouldn't be how long does it take to learn how to count (getting backed off is not a good measurement of counting ability - just go spread $10-$100 at El Cortez without counting and you'll get backed off). The question should be how long does it take to have a winning game. And the answer is: it's different for different people. Some can put hours in every night, some just once per week. Some pick up things faster, and some slower. I've taught dozens of players to count, so if you're looking for an average I'd say if you put in 5 hours per week (either 1 hour per night or two 2.5 hour sessions, etc) it would probably take about a month or two to get pretty proficient, and probably about 3 months to become rather skilled and have a more full understanding of the game.

Learning to count is EASY. Learning the more detailed things about the game such as RoR, kelly, what penetration does to your true count frequencies, how to optimize your spread, etc takes more time. 95% of the time though what you'll find happens is someone learns to just count cards. Then they learn I18... then they think they have are a card counter so they take to the casinos and either get lucky or they don't. Those that get lucky with good variance stick with it and learn more about the game as they progress (such as all the topics listed above). Those who do not think it doesn't work, or just don't care to continue, but sometimes then reevaluate their game to find the rest of the missing pieces. I mention that because that's exactly how I got in to counting. I learned Hi/Low pretty well, learned the I18, and went and just started playing $25 DD games, spreading $25 to 2x$100 in near me and was LUCKY ENOUGH to win 13 sessions in a row. After my first loss that was when I started to evaluate more and realized I had a lot more topics to study/learn. Oh and I was also hideously underfunded and had a session win goal of half my $1,000 bankroll. lol

TLDR: If you're really hardcore in learning/practicing you can have a winning game in about a month. If you're average about 2-3 months. If you're slow paced then longer (perhaps like 4-5 months).
Playing it correctly means you've already won.
AxelWolf
AxelWolf
Joined: Oct 10, 2012
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March 2nd, 2018 at 11:18:54 AM permalink
Quote: Lucca3927

and by that I mean good enough to get backed off from a table? .

NVM.
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
billryan
billryan
Joined: Nov 2, 2009
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March 2nd, 2018 at 11:57:10 AM permalink
I sat down at the El Cortez seven weeks after reading my first book on blackjack. Had BS and basic counting down pat, as well as knowing seven or eight indices.
rdw4potus
rdw4potus
Joined: Mar 11, 2010
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Thanks for this post from:
RogerKint
March 2nd, 2018 at 3:33:32 PM permalink
Quote: billryan

I sat down at the El Cortez seven weeks after reading my first book on blackjack. Had BS and basic counting down pat, as well as knowing seven or eight indices.



... And you were backed off what, like 30 seconds later?
"So as the clock ticked and the day passed, opportunity met preparation, and luck happened." - Maurice Clarett
billryan
billryan
Joined: Nov 2, 2009
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March 2nd, 2018 at 3:47:06 PM permalink
Quote: rdw4potus

... And you were backed off what, like 30 seconds later?



Never been backed off. Either you play the game or you don't.
beachbumbabs
Administrator
beachbumbabs
Joined: May 21, 2013
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March 2nd, 2018 at 7:27:42 PM permalink
Quote: AxelWolf

NVM.



Such restraint!

That's so unlike you.

Out with it. Even I laughed at the assumptions made in the OP.
If the House lost every hand, they wouldn't deal the game.

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