Awall41
Awall41
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August 27th, 2014 at 7:25:26 PM permalink
Hi Everyone,

I have been playing basic strategy for about 4 years now and recently started dabbling in counting. I usually play a $10 table with a 1-8 spread and a $1000 bankroll (replenishable) for the trip. Most trips involve about 8-12 hours of play. My question is should I stay at the $10 table? This is where I usually play, but last week I went up and played at the $25 table. I bought in for $250 (10 minimum bets) and was up and down for a few hours, but then I hit a good deck, I won 6 hands with 2 splits and was playing a 1-6 spread. I walked out with 2k, my biggest win to date. Is this just a lucky fluke or is this a decent strategy I can keep at?

2 deck table
Hit Soft 17
Surrender
4 splits
Double on any cards
3:2 BJ
80-85% penetration

Thanks!
AxiomOfChoice
AxiomOfChoice
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August 27th, 2014 at 7:43:27 PM permalink
It's a lucky fluke.

That doesn't mean that you shouldn't move up. What is your actual bankroll (not just your trip bankroll) and how much are you willing to add to it every month if you are losing? And how often do you play? Are we talking about 1 trip every 2 weeks? Or 1 trip every 3 months?
Awall41
Awall41
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August 27th, 2014 at 8:29:26 PM permalink
My actual bankroll is around $2500 in my gambling account. I go on about 8 trips a year and can add 300-500 a month if I am losing. From the sound of things it seems like I should stick to the $10 table with a 1-8 spread. I felt like the $25 table had better players and much more 1 on 1 with the dealer. I noticed on all my trips in the last year or two that I play better by myself than with a full table.
AxiomOfChoice
AxiomOfChoice
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August 27th, 2014 at 8:45:47 PM permalink
Quote: Awall41

My actual bankroll is around $2500 in my gambling account. I go on about 8 trips a year and can add 300-500 a month if I am losing. From the sound of things it seems like I should stick to the $10 table with a 1-8 spread. I felt like the $25 table had better players and much more 1 on 1 with the dealer. I noticed on all my trips in the last year or two that I play better by myself than with a full table.



Well, you certainly play faster with fewer players. If other players at the table are affecting you, you need to work on that, preferably before moving up. That will come with practice.

If you are going to keep spreading 1-8, that would be a $200 max bet at the $25 table. You can lose your $1000 in a hand. (Admittedly, not likely, but possible). Losing it in 3-4 hands is not that unlikely. Are you ok with that? This is more of a psychological question than a financial one.

How come you only have $2500 if you just won $2k and you took $1k with you. Shouldn't you have come home with $3k just from that one trip?

I'd stay at the $10 level to build some skill until you've won enough that you know you are beating the game, then move up. Make your mistakes for cheap. When you move up, take more money with you. 5 max bets is really nothing, it can go in an instant. If you're not comfortable taking more money at one time (again, psychologically, even if you can afford it financially) then don't move up.
AxelWolf
AxelWolf
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August 27th, 2014 at 8:48:38 PM permalink
2500 is a popular number.
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
Awall41
Awall41
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August 27th, 2014 at 11:08:35 PM permalink
I won't $1750, walked out with $2000 and I used that money to pay for my hotel stay and rest of my vacation.

I think I will work on playing with multiple players at a $10 table and maybe play a 1-10 spread for a little more action. No heat when playing red chips is also a good thing. Maybe if I'm playing well i will move up tables. If I was to play $25 what would be your suggested buy in?
1BB
1BB
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August 28th, 2014 at 3:23:06 AM permalink
Quote: Awall41

Hi Everyone,

I have been playing basic strategy for about 4 years now and recently started dabbling in counting. I usually play a $10 table with a 1-8 spread and a $1000 bankroll (replenishable) for the trip. Most trips involve about 8-12 hours of play. My question is should I stay at the $10 table? This is where I usually play, but last week I went up and played at the $25 table. I bought in for $250 (10 minimum bets) and was up and down for a few hours, but then I hit a good deck, I won 6 hands with 2 splits and was playing a 1-6 spread. I walked out with 2k, my biggest win to date. Is this just a lucky fluke or is this a decent strategy I can keep at?

2 deck table
Hit Soft 17
Surrender
4 splits
Double on any cards
3:2 BJ
80-85% penetration

Thanks!



The rules are okay but it's the penetration that makes this game desirable. Is it NMSE by any chance? I have to wonder how you can put in those hours without any heat. Are you playing rated? Is dabbling another way of saying not really counting?

Bankroll requirements can be simmed by inputting all pertinent data for the game you are playing and it is very accurate. In the absence of that, I'm going to say that I would not be comfortable with a $1000 trip bankroll in this case. Given the hours played and the $100 top bet that you are considering, I would want at least $3000.
Many people, especially ignorant people, want to punish you for speaking the truth. - Mahatma Ghandi
zhakran
zhakran
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August 28th, 2014 at 4:24:28 AM permalink
Where in the name of god do you get a 2 deck game that you can surrender. That's like unheard of.

I"m not asking the casino mind you, just like....the city, state, or country.

80% penetration is also so unlikely I find it hard to believe. 75% is amazing and rare, why would a casino ever give 80% penetration in a deck that already has pretty decent odds for the player. Does not make sense unless they are just a small casino, in which case they are going to be watching even more closely.
1BB
1BB
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August 28th, 2014 at 7:53:26 AM permalink
Quote: zhakran

Where in the name of god do you get a 2 deck game that you can surrender. That's like unheard of.

I"m not asking the casino mind you, just like....the city, state, or country.

80% penetration is also so unlikely I find it hard to believe. 75% is amazing and rare, why would a casino ever give 80% penetration in a deck that already has pretty decent odds for the player. Does not make sense unless they are just a small casino, in which case they are going to be watching even more closely.



Assuming double after split, which wasn't mentioned, I get a house edge of 0.39% using the Wizards calculator. Not the lowest but with that penetration I don't think anyone is going to quibble. It makes no sense to me either unless it's a counter trap. When I hear of something like this I always wait for "the rest of the story". As is, even the most clueless casino is not going to let you camp out on this game.

You can find double deck games with a lower house edge but you'd be hard pressed to find them for less than $50 to $100 minimums.
Many people, especially ignorant people, want to punish you for speaking the truth. - Mahatma Ghandi
Wanderer
Wanderer
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August 28th, 2014 at 4:38:32 PM permalink
Quote: 1BB

Assuming double after split, which wasn't mentioned, I get a house edge of 0.39% using the Wizards calculator. Not the lowest but with that penetration I don't think anyone is going to quibble. It makes no sense to me either unless it's a counter trap. When I hear of something like this I always wait for "the rest of the story". As is, even the most clueless casino is not going to let you camp out on this game.

You can find double deck games with a lower house edge but you'd be hard pressed to find them for less than $50 to $100 minimums.



Where is the Wizard's calculator?
1BB
1BB
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August 28th, 2014 at 4:43:04 PM permalink
Wanderer, click on Wizard of Odds at the bottom of this page and then game calculators at the top of that page.
Many people, especially ignorant people, want to punish you for speaking the truth. - Mahatma Ghandi
Wanderer
Wanderer
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August 28th, 2014 at 5:20:15 PM permalink
Quote: 1BB

Wanderer, click on Wizard of Odds at the bottom of this page and then game calculators at the top of that page.



Thanks. So it's just a calculater to indicate the house edge vs. basic strategy under various table conditions?
1BB
1BB
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August 28th, 2014 at 5:40:01 PM permalink
Quote: Wanderer

Thanks. So it's just a calculater to indicate the house edge vs. basic strategy under various table conditions?



I think you mean rules rather than conditions. The calculator assumes perfect basic strategy. There is software that considers conditions such as penetration and hands per hour among others.
Many people, especially ignorant people, want to punish you for speaking the truth. - Mahatma Ghandi
Wanderer
Wanderer
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August 28th, 2014 at 5:49:44 PM permalink
That's what I meant. Rules/conditions.
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