Blackjack doubling question, the generally accepted rules don't make sense to me..
Generally accepted strategy says to double a hard 10 (7-3, 6-4, 5-5) against dealer hands up to a 9, also says to never split two 10 cards. I cannot reconcile those statements. I've been splitting 10's against dealer showing 5 or 6 and seems to be working out. What am I missing? Please don't slam me just cause I'm a novice... 2F
Indeed, for certain purposes such as easy remembering of the rules... many "lesser strategies" are presented on this site and often used by players simply because some people have mathematical difficulties with "optimal" but can do okay with an abbreviated rule set that although less than optimal is easy to remember and easy to apply without delaying the game or making errors.
20 is a very strong hand vs. 5 or 6. Hell, it's very strong vs. any up card. When you split and your hands end up becoming 15 and 18, for example, then you're not as strong.
Quote: TwoFeathersATLBS.. Not true... I don't count, period. The strategy as stated by almost everyone, they are wrong. Either you double a hard 10 vs a dealer 9 or below, and you split 10s on some combinations, or you don't. You cannot have it work out both ways. Again, I'm calling BS. Big time BS, super BS. I got the math.. And the balls... 2F -ATL
Yup everyone is wrong,you are right,but don`t tell anyone about splitting the tens,we were keeping it a secret.Quote: TwoFeathersATLBS.. Not true... I don't count, period. The strategy as stated by almost everyone, they are wrong. Either you double a hard 10 vs a dealer 9 or below, and you split 10s on some combinations, or you don't. You cannot have it work out both ways. Again, I'm calling BS. Big time BS, super BS. I got the math.. And the balls... 2F -ATL
Quote: TwoFeathersATLThe strategy as stated by almost everyone, they are wrong. Either you double a hard 10 vs a dealer 9 or below, and you split 10s on some combinations, or you don't.
This makes no sense. If you want to play optimally as a non-counter, you always double hard 10 vs 9 or less, and never split 10s. Are you talking about splitting 5s? You never split 5s either; you either double or hit them depending on the upcard just like you would with hard 10.
But you can play however you would like, and special players get dealers telling their bosses how great they play!
Quote: aceofspades
Exactly this.
Quote: Jufo81Interestingly splitting 10's vs. 6 would be the correct move whenever dealer's hole card is any of 7-8-9-10, that is 7 out of 13 times. So splitting 10's ends up being the correct play more than of 50% time. But the average gain in these 7 out of 13 times is less than the average loss in the other 6 out of 13 times (when hole card is A-2-3-4-5-6) making splitting tens suboptimal overall.
You lost me there, Jufo. Do you count?
Quote: 1BBYou lost me there, Jufo. Do you count?
No, I meant without counting.
You should split 10s whenever dealer two-card total is any of Hard 13,14,15,16 (see: https://wizardofodds.com/games/blackjack/appendix/16/ ). With dealer Six upcard and without knowing the hole card it means that splitting 10s will be the correct move 7/13 of time and wrong move 6/13 of time. So interestingly splitting tens is the correct move more often than wrong move, despite having lower EV than standing.
Having a 20 (10,10) v 6 is a very good hand which wins most of the time, pushes rarely and loses infrequently with an EV of around +70%. Ignoring pushes this translates to wining 85% of the time.
Hiting a 10 a single time (spliting 10,10 v 6 means exactly that as any result you get you will not hit again) has an EV of around +30%. Ignoring pushes this translates to wining around 65% of the time.
The Ev of spliting 10,10 v 6 (spliting only once) is 2 X 30% = 60% which is lower than the correct decision of standing with a higher EV at 70%.
And you see the reason for that is that it reduces the possibility of winning from 85% to 65% and even though you get two hands its still does not compensate as the EV is reduced by more than 50% for each hand.
Comparing the Doubling of 10 with Splitting 10,10 is like comparing apples with oranges.
With a 10,10 you already have a very Strong Hand and by spliting it you reduce its power by more than 50% on each of the two hands.
10 v 6 is a weaker hand but still a +EV hand and if you were to hit youonly hit once (any total from 12 you get you do not hit again in BS).
Any time you have a +EV hand (and you would only hit once if you were to hit) you Double as you double the positive Ev.
Quote: Yo11Quote: aceofspades
Exactly this.
I brought some popcorn! Ya want any?
Quote: TwoFeathersATLBS.. Not true... I don't count, period. The strategy as stated by almost everyone, they are wrong. Either you double a hard 10 vs a dealer 9 or below, and you split 10s on some combinations, or you don't. You cannot have it work out both ways. Again, I'm calling BS. Big time BS, super BS. I got the math.. And the balls... 2F -ATL
Here's a little gem from a couple of years ago. Enjoy!
Quote: teddysI did not enjoy. Who can I ask for a refund?
I am disappointed in you teddy, you know it's in the fine print ("NO REFUNDS EVER").
Quote: 1BBHere's a little gem from a couple of years ago. Enjoy!
Dear 1BB
So cute of you to drag up one of my posts from the 'long' past.
But I wonder, maybe others wonder, what the hell you were doing digging around in my underwear drawer?
Were you trying to embarrass me? Pls no, that's way too easy.
Were you trying to make yourself look good, look superior perhaps? 50/50 there.
Do you want the BanHammer yourself? Some friend of yours already posted, repeatedly, how you could get that hammer.
Are you chasing EB in number of posts?
Got no one to stand up for on the suspension list lately?
Having a hard time complaining about the moderator's actions?
Or do you just really think you don't like me?
That thought makes me sad, for a moment, for a moment only.
Quote: TwoFeathersATLWow, had to enter a 40 digit code to join the site and I got it right on the 1st try!
Generally accepted strategy says to double a hard 10 (7-3, 6-4, 5-5) against dealer hands up to a 9, also says to never split two 10 cards. I cannot reconcile those statements. I've been splitting 10's against dealer showing 5 or 6 and seems to be working out. What am I missing? Please don't slam me just cause I'm a novice... 2F
Hey 2F,
In a 6-deck game you'd need about 27 or more 3-6 out of the shoe than 10s to make this a desirable play. This statistic is proven by simulation. If you've had success in the short run that's only variance.
Quote: TwoFeathersATLDear 1BB
So cute of you to drag up one of my posts from the 'long' past.
But I wonder, maybe others wonder, what the hell you were doing digging around in my underwear drawer?
Were you trying to embarrass me? Pls no, that's way too easy.
Were you trying to make yourself look good, look superior perhaps? 50/50 there.
Do you want the BanHammer yourself? Some friend of yours already posted, repeatedly, how you could get that hammer.
Are you chasing EB in number of posts?
Got no one to stand up for on the suspension list lately?
Having a hard time complaining about the moderator's actions?
Or do you just really think you don't like me?
That thought makes me sad, for a moment, for a moment only.
I was reading old posts about blackjack. This is still a gambling forum.
No to all seven of your questions. Don't be sad.
Quote: 1BBI was reading old posts about blackjack. This is still a gambling forum.
No to all seven of your questions. Don't be sad.
I call BS on 1BB.
BS
2F
Quote: TwoFeathersATLI call BS on 1BB.
BS
2F
Yet another post by you where you call BS. Now that's sad.
Quote: 1BBYet another post by you where you call BS. Now that's sad.
But you made no attempt to defend yourself?
You can do better than telling some story about reading old Blackjack threads, can't you?
I got faith in you, don't let me down ;-)
