Basic Strategy differences between decks/rules - a handy chart

I'm studying up for my upcoming trip to Vegas and while I was reviewing basic strategy, I decided to make a handy chart of the plays that aren't the same across the rulesets I care about. For me personally, I only care about the following rules:
6D S17 DAS
6D H17 DAS
2D S17 DAS
2D S17 NDAS
2D H17 DAS
2D H17 NDAS

Personally that covers 99% of the games I'll play (and actually 6D is the same as 8D for this context). I've never been in a situation where there was a 6D NDAS game without something better nearby. Single deck is sufficiently dead that I haven't committed its differences to memory yet...although I really should if I ever go to Reno (or the El Cortez to get backed off :) ).

Anyway, here's what I came up with:

It's kind of sad that these plays aren't completely spinal reflex for me yet, but I haven't been playing much lately :(. These are the plays that I tend to do a "double take" or take more than a second to make my decision, as in my head I think "wait is this table S17 or H17?"

Let me know if I got anything wrong (handy fact checker!). And if this helps you study up, you're welcome!

EDIT: The chart assumes surrender is available, but always has the "back up" option available.

If you ask real nice I can tell you where there's a nice 6D, S17 , with surrender, good pen, and inept floor personnel so you can practice up before vegas. But its on the north end, if I recall your south of seattle.

I believe 6D H17 15 vs 9 is H, not R/H.

Quote: kulin

I believe 6D H17 15 vs 9 is H, not R/H.

You're right, 15 v 9 is never a surrender (well not unless we're talking index numbers). Thanks for the correction, chart adjusted. Anyone else?

The chart looks good. I'm sure you know that there's no need to play any H17 shoe games in Vegas but it's good to know those six changes to basic strategy. You never know when you'll need them.

I know two counters who have been backed off at Mohegan Sun and are now playing the 8 deck H17 game at Foxwoods and they say they are doing okay. I successfully played that game when it was S17. With ASMs, little to no heat and very close to 90% penetration it got the money.

Quote: 1BB

The chart looks good. I'm sure you know that there's no need to play any H17 shoe games in Vegas but it's good to know those six changes to basic strategy. You never know when you'll need them.

I know where most of the S17 shoe games are in Vegas, but are there really enough of them to completely avoid the H17 ones? I plan on playing short sessions, but even in a weekend I figure I'll have to slum it occasionally...

Here's how my basic strategy differs from yours (although I do not take surrender into account):
9 vs 2 - never double
11 vs A - hit (not double) on all S17
16 vs 10 - hit on 6D
A2 vs 5 - double on 6D
A3 vs 4 - never double

Quote: AcesAndEights

I know where most of the S17 shoe games are in Vegas, but are there really enough of them to completely avoid the H17 ones? I plan on playing short sessions, but even in a weekend I figure I'll have to slum it occasionally...

Yes, start with MGM properties. I've seen $10 and certainly $15 minimums at MGM Grand and $25 minimums at Mirage, Monte Carlo, TI and even Bellagio at times all with a .28% house edge.

Quote: 1BB

Yes, start with MGM properties. I've seen $10 and certainly $15 minimums at MGM Grand and $25 minimums at Mirage, Monte Carlo, TI and even Bellagio at times all with a .28% house edge.

Hmm, only one that surprises me in that list is TI, I'll definitely check that out. The last time I played at Monte Carlo I think their only S17 offering was 8D, but that was almost a year ago now.

Excellent chart. I was thinking of making something like this but you saved me the trouble!

Quote: 1BB

Yes, start with MGM properties. I've seen $10 and certainly $15 minimums at MGM Grand and $25 minimums at Mirage, Monte Carlo, TI and even Bellagio at times all with a .28% house edge.

We may be getting into "I'd rather not talk about it" territory, but since you mentioned it, I'll say that I was not successful at finding any S17 games at Monte Carlo or TI on the main floor. I did not venture into the high limit rooms as I was not bankrolled on this trip for anything more than $25 mins (sadly).

My spreadsheet confirms that in December 2011 I played a S17 shoe game at Monte Carlo at a $25 minimum, but I went back to that exact table on my recent trip and it was H17. So either I made a bookkeeping error last year or they recently changed it.

Speaking to Bellagio, it's rather difficult to get a $25 S17 game there. I should have known better, but that was my first stop on Friday night when I got in, and there was a single $50 table and the rest were $100+. I'm sure this is typical for weekend evenings. Aria has quite a few S17 games, but I never saw a single one at less than $50, regardless of time. Maybe on weekdays. I did play at Bellagio on Saturday morning for $25 mins, and was promptly stuck for $1500 :p.

I'm hoping to be bankrolled for $50 games on my next trip to Vegas (day job FTW). It would substantially increase the number of S17 games I could play.

I have been meaning to write up a proper trip report (HB challenge weekend - 10/19 - 10/21) in my WoV blog but haven't gotten around to it. There were really no interesting BJ bits to it anyway.

Quote: AcesAndEights

My spreadsheet confirms that in December 2011 I played a S17 shoe game at Monte Carlo at a $25 minimum, but I went back to that exact table on my recent trip and it was H17. So either I made a bookkeeping error last year or they recently changed it.

I have seen that game flip back and forth a dozen times in my 3 years of living here. They don't change the felt, they have different tables that they move. I have noticed that at the busiest of times, like holiday weekends and when the rodeo is in town next month that it is H17. Other than that I have not seen rhyme nor reason as to when they have s17 and when they have h17. I would love to hear an explanation from someone who works there.

Quote: kewlj

I have seen that game flip back and forth a dozen times in my 3 years of living here. They don't change the felt, they have different tables that they move. I have noticed that at the busiest of times, like holiday weekends and when the rodeo is in town next month that it is H17. Other than that I have not seen rhyme nor reason as to when they have s17 and when they have h17. I would love to hear an explanation from someone who works there.

Thanks J, at least I know my memory isn't going THAT badly.