mwalz9
mwalz9
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July 28th, 2021 at 1:01:39 PM permalink
If this sub-forum isn't the right spot, sorry!

I was just thinking about this today and wanted some insight from some of you. Do you feel like a gambling "addict" can be addicted to gambling and be a "controlled gambler" at the same time?

For instance, I stop at the casino between my house and work 4-5 times a week. I bet on every sporting event I plan to watch, which means I bet on one usually every night. I also, when not watching a sport on TV I have money on, play an online casino game on my tablet at home in the evenings bored. Many people would call that a definite addicted gambler.

However, I never spend money I do not have to lose. I make well over 6 figures a year and have a 6 figure bank account. I have multiple high limit credit cards all with 0 balances and have NEVER used a credit card to gamble at all! I've never struggled financially trying to cover my gambling. EVER!

Could I quit? Maybe. Do I want too? No! I do not feel it is an addiction though. I feel I use it as entertainent, as my main #1 hobby, and feel I have it well under control and have for many, many years.

I guess it's the equivalent of some people being able to socially drink a few beers and then not have one for months and the guy who takes 1 sip and needs 1 every day after that.

Thoughts?

Again, I'm not asking for any help or anything about me personally, just thoughts on if addicted gamblers can be controlled gamblers in general.
MDawg
MDawg
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Thanks for this post from:
mwalz9
July 28th, 2021 at 1:07:26 PM permalink
Coincidentally I just posted this in the other thread.

If you could have seen the hollow dead look in this player's eyes with whom I chanced to cross paths this week, you'd have had to stop for a moment just to be grateful to not be in such a position.

Quote: MDawg

Quote: MDawg

Yet another player latched on to me at some point recently. As usual, turned out to be a mistake. Couldnít help the player and ended up a complete waste of time and energy. Player had already dumped a huge amount elsewhere, and at the casino where I was playing at my private table I helped the player get up well over a hundred K no less than three times, but each time after I went to sleep the player kept going until morning and dumped it all. Notwithstanding a final monster run the player left in the red. After left I tried to talk to the player and player kept saying, ďWhy canít I stop when I am ahead?Ē

Besides the tragicomic comments the player was making while was losing at the tables (ďI lost ______. I neglected my business, my clients, everything. What am I doing here.Ē) I ran into the host I had set the player up with, and host was saying that talked to the player after left town and finally had to say to the player, ďIím just a host, not a therapist.Ē 😟 😅 Sorry, but how tragicomic can you get.


This player has now dumped a cool million between two very short trips. That is astonishing to me. I mean, here I've been in Vegas playing somewhat regularly for over four months, and am actually ahead, and this player dumps a million in a blink of an eye - playing at regular 20K limit tables! What I mean is, if the player had been here four plus months as I have, and dumped a mill, okay, terrible, but not incredible. But to dump that much in just days...wow.

Now, in that player's case, I can't understand why such a person would even keep playing. Claims to have dumped $2M over the past 10 years, and $1M in just the past two very short trips (about a week or even less, each). From what I gather, this player has never won. As in - almost no winning sessions and absolutely no winning trips. Why even keep playing?

Someone like that is a straight gambling addict from the gate.

The more general progression of LOSERMANIA in my opinion works like this. A player might be a disciplined person capable of walking away ahead, and keeping losses small or at worst on par with wins. Then at some point the player loses control and starts losing more than wins. Eventually gets to where the player may never win and just keeps playing until loses it all every time. This is the progression described by the OP. In my opinion, once someone gets to that point of addiction there is no U-Turn and should just quit.

I believe this is the progression described in all addictions - alcoholism, drug addiction, gambling - etc. where once a person crosses the line the only or at least best solution is complete abstinence.

I tell you itís wonderful to be here, man. I donít give a damn who wins or loses. Itís just wonderful to be here with you people. https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/gambling/betting-systems/33908-the-adventures-of-mdawg/
MrV
MrV
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mwalz9
July 28th, 2021 at 1:13:12 PM permalink
I'm no expert, but you gamble very frequently, which is bad, but seem disciplined, which is good.

I suppose the acid test would be to voluntarily stop gambling for a few weeks and see how you adjust to not gambling.

Does your family or friends tell you that you think you have a problem?

There are online quizzes you can take to see if you meet the criteria for a problem gambler.
"What, me worry?"
mwalz9
mwalz9
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July 28th, 2021 at 1:16:28 PM permalink
Makes sense. I didn't see that. Thanks for re-sharing.

I know it's cliche for all addicts to say this, but I have extreme discipline.

If I take $1,000 to the casino and lose $1,000, I am DONE! No ATM, no chasing, I leave!

I also have the discipline to buy in for $1,000, play for the time I wanted to play, and then if I am up, get out the door. I have seldom lost my entire session bankroll, and would guess my lifetime net is somewhere near house edge. I chalk that up as entertainment expense.

All hobbies cost money. Sometimes mine costs more, sometimes it pays me, but long term it costs me about the house edge.

I'm also disciplined in the sense that I could take $50,000 to the casino and lose it and still have plenty of money in my bank, but instead I play $25-$100/hand blackjack, $15-$25 min craps, and my sports bets average between $110 to $550 high end.

I'd say considering my financial situation, I have it controlled. I understand many people do not, and I see these same people in the casinos I frequent.
mwalz9
mwalz9
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July 28th, 2021 at 1:18:45 PM permalink
Quote: MrV

I'm no expert, but you gamble very frequently, which is bad, but seem disciplined, which is good.

I suppose the acid test would be to voluntarily stop gambling for a few weeks and see how you adjust to not gambling.

Does your family or friends tell you that you think you have a problem?

There are online quizzes you can take to see if you meet the criteria for a problem gambler.



I've had people tell me Im definitely addicted, but those that know me best also say it's very controlled. I just wondered if thats in fact possible? Or a paradox?
MDawg
MDawg
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July 28th, 2021 at 1:20:16 PM permalink
I remember when I first started playing as a kid and my credit lines were only mid four figures. I went to the cage to pay my markers and the cashier started to hand me the markers inside an envelope and said, making a face, "Ugh, those aren't yours. Believe me you don't want those."

Sometimes, I wonder how many markers were inside that envelope and whether these days on the occasions where I've had losing sessions if my envelope of markers would exceed what was in that guy's envelope.

And another thing, on one of my recent sessions at a public table there was this kid, who was barely 21, playing Baccarat. I mean the guy did not even look old enough to drink. Was playing "small," just 100 - 200 per hand, and with a $2000. bankroll, pulling out $1000. at a time, that was not even all 100s like he got it from the bank, but fifties and twenties too, and eventually lost it all. Said was a Vegas local. I actually felt for the guy, and tried to tell him about how I didn't gamble at all for many years in order to complete law school and get my career and businesses in order. I mean back when I started playing I somehow managed to almost always win, playing just Blackjack. I have been playing Blackjack since I was an infant practically. And here this kid comes up and dumps $2000. and just gets up and leaves, a Vegas local, obviously destined to come back soon with more. That's not good. I don't like to see very young people get involved with gambling unless they really seem like they can afford it (or at least win at it!), and even then, I don't think it's a good idea.
I tell you itís wonderful to be here, man. I donít give a damn who wins or loses. Itís just wonderful to be here with you people. https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/gambling/betting-systems/33908-the-adventures-of-mdawg/
billryan
billryan
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July 28th, 2021 at 1:58:05 PM permalink
Quote: mwalz9

If this sub-forum isn't the right spot, sorry!

I was just thinking about this today and wanted some insight from some of you. Do you feel like a gambling "addict" can be addicted to gambling and be a "controlled gambler" at the same time?

For instance, I stop at the casino between my house and work 4-5 times a week. I bet on every sporting event I plan to watch, which means I bet on one usually every night. I also, when not watching a sport on TV I have money on, play an online casino game on my tablet at home in the evenings bored. Many people would call that a definite addicted gambler.

However, I never spend money I do not have to lose. I make well over 6 figures a year and have a 6 figure bank account. I have multiple high limit credit cards all with 0 balances and have NEVER used a credit card to gamble at all! I've never struggled financially trying to cover my gambling. EVER!

Could I quit? Maybe. Do I want too? No! I do not feel it is an addiction though. I feel I use it as entertainent, as my main #1 hobby, and feel I have it well under control and have for many, many years.

I guess it's the equivalent of some people being able to socially drink a few beers and then not have one for months and the guy who takes 1 sip and needs 1 every day after that.

Thoughts?

Again, I'm not asking for any help or anything about me personally, just thoughts on if addicted gamblers can be controlled gamblers in general.



Quit any form of gambling for a week. If you aren't addicted you can do it standing on your head.
MrV
MrV
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July 28th, 2021 at 2:14:45 PM permalink
Diagnosis

For a diagnosis of gambling addiction, The DSM-5 states that a person must show or experience at least four of the following during the past 12 months:

Need to gamble with increasing amounts of money to feel excitement
Restlessness or irritability when trying to stop gambling
Repeated unsuccessful attempts to stop, control, or reduce gambling
Thinking often about gambling and making plans to gamble
Gambling when feeling distressed
Returning to gamble again after losing money
Lying to conceal gambling activities
Experiencing relationship or work problems due to gambling
Depending on others for money to spend on gambli


see: https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/15929


I submit that being able to gamble within your means is an encouraging yet not definitive sign that you are not an addict: how well do you do when looking at the above nine factors?
"What, me worry?"
MDawg
MDawg
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July 28th, 2021 at 3:18:44 PM permalink
Well, that player I mention who has dumped a million in past two very short trips left Vegas and came back about ten days or maybe two weeks later, so quit for MORE than a week, but came right back to the exact same degenerate out of control losing as before. Plus it's not like seems to be able to afford that kind of loss. I mean no one wants or likes to lose but this player is acting like going to get offed for taking what might not belong to the player if doesn't win it back.
I tell you itís wonderful to be here, man. I donít give a damn who wins or loses. Itís just wonderful to be here with you people. https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/gambling/betting-systems/33908-the-adventures-of-mdawg/
MDawg
MDawg
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July 28th, 2021 at 3:22:35 PM permalink
I can't tell you how many of the same faces I see in the high limit pits complaining about how they're down -10K, -20K, -50K, or more trying to get it back. I rarely run into anyone who says is up and just deciding when to leave, most of them seem to be chasing losses.

That player I'm referring to is trying to chase a million, and can't even bet more than 20K at a time. How is that ever going to happen? What the player should have done is deposited the whole million at once and asked to play to 50K a hand or some such. Probably never assumed would ever get this deep in the hole or deposit that much money, I assume. ALL IN!
I tell you itís wonderful to be here, man. I donít give a damn who wins or loses. Itís just wonderful to be here with you people. https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/gambling/betting-systems/33908-the-adventures-of-mdawg/

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