Tribal casino in Alabama denies $1.4M jackpot
October 1st, 2017 at 6:34:13 PM
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There wasn't enough information given to make an informed decision whether there was a malfunction or the casino was just stiffing the player. I will say that I think tribal regulation is pretty much a joke. You can't expect the tribe that owns the casino to fairly resolve disputes within it. In any meaningful court, the judge would recuse himself if he felt any conflict of interest.
The fact that the machine kept changing the win amount suggests to me that there actually was a malfunction but it would be nice to have more information.
The fact that the machine kept changing the win amount suggests to me that there actually was a malfunction but it would be nice to have more information.
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
October 1st, 2017 at 6:53:28 PM
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Um, not so fast there...Quote: WizardThe fact that the machine kept changing the win amount suggests to me that there actually was a malfunction.
That final number is just triple the first.Quote: articleThe bingo machine indicated a jackpot of $459,000, then $918,000, and finally settled on a "payout multiplier" of $1,377,000.
The second is double the first.
So "payout multiplier" sounds legit.
I invented a few casino games. Info:
http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ —————————————————————————————————————
Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
October 1st, 2017 at 6:57:24 PM
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But I agree that trying to sue a tribe in tribal court will get you nowhere.
I invented a few casino games. Info:
http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ —————————————————————————————————————
Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
October 1st, 2017 at 7:02:56 PM
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I'm with you there... Sounds like a 3X multipliers of some sort. There is a link in the article and the player said he was betting quarters with only $5 coin in. I've not seen many (any?) quarter machines capable of that large of a jackpot. I did find this so we know the machine will pay over $1M.
October 1st, 2017 at 7:04:06 PM
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I also thought it was ironic that the players name was Mr. Rape.
October 1st, 2017 at 9:42:12 PM
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Aren't payout that big usually from the company that owns the machine, not the casino itself. Seems like they would have been the ones to decide if it was a legit hit or not.
The older I get, the better I recall things that never happened
October 1st, 2017 at 10:37:45 PM
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Particularly since only members of the tribal bar are permitted to appear before a tribal judge and tribal courts are notoriously inept at resolving disputes and do not award punitive damages.Quote: DJTeddyBearBut I agree that trying to sue a tribe in tribal court will get you nowhere.
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:48:01 AM
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I say get rid of the tribal land, sovereignty, immunity, and all the other BS that goes along with it. Don't let them make up their own laws and have their tribal courts.
October 2nd, 2017 at 5:17:06 AM
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Quote: RSI say get rid of the tribal land, sovereignty, immunity, and all the other BS that goes along with it. Don't let them make up their own laws and have their tribal courts.
Tribal properties report to the federal government. This particular casino advertises across state lines: I've seen their billboard in Biloxi.
I'd be trying to get into federal court with interstate fraud claims.
If the House lost every hand, they wouldn't deal the game.
October 2nd, 2017 at 5:29:31 AM
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Does the fact that we are dealing with tribal land mean we will likely never have enough info to know if the machine malfunctioned or if the casino is stiffing the player?
October 2nd, 2017 at 5:48:38 AM
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Quote: beachbumbabsTribal properties report to the federal government. This particular casino advertises across state lines: I've seen their billboard in Biloxi.
I'd be trying to get into federal court with interstate fraud claims.
That was my other thought was to try to take it to federal court, since everything in the USA, tribal or not, falls within the jurisdiction of the feds (I think? clarification anyone?). Although, I don't know much about the court system or what kind of trials the federal court will take on. Can they take on any case that would normally be taken by a state court...or does it have to be a federal crime to take it to a federal court? Or is it something where you can "appeal" (that's not the right word, but yolo) it up the ranks from the low level court to appelate court to 9th circuit to supreme?*
As you can probably tell, I don't know what most of those words mean.
October 2nd, 2017 at 10:08:12 AM
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Quote: beachbumbabsTribal properties report to the federal government. This particular casino advertises across state lines: I've seen their billboard in Biloxi.
I'd be trying to get into federal court with interstate fraud claims.
I agree with Babs. "Interstate fraud" would probably be the most viable line of legal attack. Probably a very small chance of winning, though.
The other route is through the political process and the press. Unfortunately, Alabama does not have a Senator on the Senate's Committee for Indian Affairs. Lisa Murkowski, Arkansas, is the Committee member that is located closest to Alabama. I would have a lawyer write a letter to Murkowski's office charging the Indian tribe with fraud. I would also try to collect information on other people with similar grievances against Indian casinos and then collectively work the news media (of all types).
edit: I have just read the pdf of the "brief of the appellant" which argues why this matter should be heard by the State Court. It is very well researched and written and in my opinion, very persuasive. It is disheartening when the legal system does not work.
Last edited by: gordonm888 on Oct 2, 2017
So many better men, a few of them friends, are dead. And a thousand thousand slimy things live on, and so do I.
October 2nd, 2017 at 10:47:31 AM
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I still say seeking other angles to sue the tribe is a waste of time. My opinion is that if we don't like the lack of legitimate regulation of tribal casinos we shouldn't patronize them or better yet support legislation to open up non-tribal casinos in states that are presently tribal only.
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:11:04 PM
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Quote: WizardI still say seeking other angles to sue the tribe is a waste of time. My opinion is that if we don't like the lack of legitimate regulation of tribal casinos we shouldn't patronize them or better yet support legislation to open up non-tribal casinos in states that are presently tribal only.
This is where my head is at. I'm thinking the best move is simply not to play in a tribal casino.
October 2nd, 2017 at 3:12:29 PM
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Quote: prozemaThis is where my head is at. I'm thinking the best move is simply not to play in a tribal casino.
Even more so if you're am AP.
DUHHIIIIIIIII HEARD THAT!
October 2nd, 2017 at 4:25:49 PM
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Quote: WizardI still say seeking other angles to sue the tribe is a waste of time. My opinion is that if we don't like the lack of legitimate regulation of tribal casinos we shouldn't patronize them or better yet support legislation to open up non-tribal casinos in states that are presently tribal only.
Totally agree. The only thing that keeps U.S. casino corps. in line is the financial risk of losing their licenses.
Is LCB able/willing to rate/endorse land based casinos too?
Vote with your gambling dollars people (and boycott 6:5 too).
Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication - Leonardo da Vinci
October 2nd, 2017 at 4:30:13 PM
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Quote: prozemaThis is where my head is at. I'm thinking the best move is simply not to play in a tribal casino.
I won't go that far. If you play for low stakes, I think you'll be okay. I have played for low stakes in tables games at lots of tribal casinos and never had a problem. The only negative situation was when a security vehicle blocked my car from leaving over taking a picture of the exterior of the casino. I have told that story before.
However, I do say I see no rational reason, other than maybe a misplaced sense of guilt, for tribes to have a monopoly on gaming in so many places. I think a condition to keep the monopoly would be to submit to meaningful outside regulation. The fox is not to be trusted as the regulator of the hen house.
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
October 2nd, 2017 at 4:39:29 PM
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I understand that the Indian casino's refuse to take a NO SAFETY bet on the Super Bowl. DAMN, Now I will probably be suspended. BYEBYE EVERYBODY
October 2nd, 2017 at 4:48:55 PM
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Quote: sixsistersI understand that the Indian casino's refuse to take a NO SAFETY bet on the Super Bowl. DAMN, Now I will probably be suspended. BYEBYE EVERYBODY
Nice try Buzz. Enjoy some time off.
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
October 2nd, 2017 at 6:50:34 PM
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Quote: WizardI won't go that far. If you play for low stakes, I think you'll be okay. I have played for low stakes in tables games at lots of tribal casinos and never had a problem.
So true. And $5-bettor Jerry Rape probably never had a problem either until he won the jackpot. You better than most understand the value of a "sample of one" as a basis determining whether a casino plays fair or not.
I also note an award given at the 14th Annual Casino Marketing and Technology Conference, held last July at the Paris Las Vegas Hotel & Casino. Anyone who attended may recall the Wind Creek Montgomery Casino & Hotel won the Diamond Romero Award for its $250K Birthday Bash Celebration. The Grinch in our story, this property was chosen as the best to fulfill the spirit of John Romero's 45-year crusade for effective, measurable, and accountable casino marketing.
Personally, I seldom play at tribal casinos for all the reasons others don't also. But, I saw Wind Creek billboards (advertising on non-tribal lands the gaming opportunities to be had) when I drove through Montgomery recently. IMHO, the dichotomy between the casino's marketing award, the (perhaps less than accurate) roadside advertisements, and the apparent heads-I-win-and-tails-you-lose treatment of one low-stakes player is striking. Maybe this is what passes for great casino marketing today. If so, it's a sad day for gaming.
