Atlantic City Open Forum
But this is to be expected given how many rooms were taken out of market by casino closures.
http://www.bizjournals.com/philadelphia/news/2015/03/05/atlantic-city-hotel-rates-rise-10-percent.html?page=all
One must keep in mind many casino/hotel rooms are comped. This will skew the occupancy numbers considerably higher.
Casino/Hotels have occupancy rates on average in the 80 percentile.
ALL hotels in A.C. are perhaps on average have less then 50% occupancy rates.
http://www.hotelnewsnow.com/article/14268/Hotel-bets-going-bust-in-Atlantic-City
http://www.nj.gov/oag/ge/docs/Financials/PressRel2014/FINAL4thQTR2014PressRelease.pdf
Taj, Bally's and Caesars saw a drop in Total Revenue in 2014. Bally's had an 82.2 percent occupancy rate for 2014.
Quote: MprtUSA516Anyone curious about overall revenue and hotel occupancy can look here:
http://www.nj.gov/oag/ge/docs/Financials/PressRel2014/FINAL4thQTR2014PressRelease.pdf
Taj, Bally's and Caesars saw a drop in Total Revenue in 2014. Bally's had an 82.2 percent occupancy rate for 2014.
Thank you for sharing this, it brings to light many interesting statistics, such as room occupancy, taxes charged and Atlantic City's overall gross operating profit. (up 44%)
Quote: FatGeezusDon't blame me. I go to AC at least once a week. How many times a year do you go?
Everyday.
Quote: IntheknowEveryday.
Are you Don Guardian?
Quote: vendman1Hi there AC people. I'm trying to organize a much needed long weekend in AC the 24-26th of April, for my wedding anniversary. I can get Friday the 24th and Sunday the 26th comped, at either Taj or Resorts. But neither of them has anything for Saturday at all. Looking around on TR and hotels.com and such has yeilded crappy results as well. I would be willing to buy up to $100 or trade for anyone who can get a comp night at any hotel in AC on Sat the 25th. You'd be making my wife a happy woman. Just PM me and we can work out details. Thanks in advance for anyone that can help.
Just went to Trivago and found seven for less than $100 for April 25th. Don't know anything about the site or if the information is accurate.
Quote: vendman1Hi there AC people. I'm trying to organize a much needed long weekend in AC the 24-26th of April, for my wedding anniversary. I can get Friday the 24th and Sunday the 26th comped, at either Taj or Resorts. But neither of them has anything for Saturday at all. Looking around on TR and hotels.com and such has yeilded crappy results as well. I would be willing to buy up to $100 or trade for anyone who can get a comp night at any hotel in AC on Sat the 25th. You'd be making my wife a happy woman. Just PM me and we can work out details. Thanks in advance for anyone that can help.
Come to Vegas those days for MonkeyFest 2015 instead!!!
Do they have rock concerts, parties, Food fairs, big events or anything?
Don't they have someone in charge of marketing AC and putting on events, inviting movie stars, musicians, athletes?
Doesn't they Mayor get involved in stuff like this?
I never see AC advertising or hear anything positive.
Do they leave everything up to the casinos?
Quote: vendman1Hi there AC people. I'm trying to organize a much needed long weekend in AC the 24-26th of April, for my wedding anniversary. I can get Friday the 24th and Sunday the 26th comped, at either Taj or Resorts. But neither of them has anything for Saturday at all. Looking around on TR and hotels.com and such has yeilded crappy results as well. I would be willing to buy up to $100 or trade for anyone who can get a comp night at any hotel in AC on Sat the 25th. You'd be making my wife a happy woman. Just PM me and we can work out details. Thanks in advance for anyone that can help.
vendman,
Not in AC so can't help you directly, but checked the TR site to see what they're saying to Diamonds about availability. Harrah's has much avail (offered 5 different basic room configurations) but is quoting me $100/night that weekend when usually I'm comped (and comps offered except that weekend). Caesar's is sold out Sat night. Bally's wants $228 for Sat, $49 for Fri & Sun.
Quote: beachbumbabsvendman,
Not in AC so can't help you directly, but checked the TR site to see what they're saying to Diamonds about availability. Harrah's has much avail (offered 5 different basic room configurations) but is quoting me $100/night that weekend when usually I'm comped (and comps offered except that weekend). Caesar's is sold out Sat night. Bally's wants $228 for Sat, $49 for Fri & Sun.
Babs, As you know, like rings, all Diamonds are not created equal. Some Diamonds can get rooms comped 365 a year in AC, including Caesars based on ADT. I am seeing everything comped on these dates. But my wife is a high ADT player who has reduced the amount of visits per year, but still plays as much per trip. She is showing a room in both the Premium (Centurion) or Deluxe comped all nights on these dates. Nothing to be proud of, but it I there. Perhaps some 7 Stars who visit 50 weeks a year may not have a room that weekend either.
No doubt they have become tighter with rooms in AC, but there is no way to compare player to player in their system. Anyone who can figure out how they work in the CZR system could be rich....or perhaps they are and are losing it by playing there. :)
Quote: BozBabs, As you know, like rings, all Diamonds are not created equal. Some Diamonds can get rooms comped 365 a year in AC, including Caesars based on ADT. I am seeing everything comped on these dates. But my wife is a high ADT player who has reduced the amount of visits per year, but still plays as much per trip. She is showing a room in both the Premium (Centurion) or Deluxe comped all nights on these dates. Nothing to be proud of, but it I there. Perhaps some 7 Stars who visit 50 weeks a year may not have a room that weekend either.
No doubt they have become tighter with rooms in AC, but there is no way to compare player to player in their system. Anyone who can figure out how they work in the CZR system could be rich....or perhaps they are and are losing it by playing there. :)
Yeah, I agree. I was trying to give vendman a read on what might really be available up there. Since I haven't been for over 10 years, they have no special love for me in AC beyond the basic Diamond. So to me, Caesar's is sold out; to you, they've got a suite held off the market. Seems typical.
Based on my results, I thought he might find availability at Harrah's specifically, either thru someone with status there or on his own, and not bother with Caesar's/Bally's properties. But as you say, all players are not created equal.
It's funny how things are relative. I'm going to Philly for a weekend in June, and just paid $300ish for a nice center city room at a swanky hotel. That didn't bother me. But for some reason paying $300-400 a night for rooms I normally get for free frosts my cookies. Such is the plight of AC.
So thanks again for all the help and feedback.
Now for a little CET rant. I was low level diamond or at least platnium at CET for a number of years and got good offers. Since my son came a few years ago. My AC trips are less, and I started playing Revel when it opened, because the wife and son liked the hotel so much. Long story short I'm lowly gold now. The only comps I get from them are 2 for 1 buffett offers and mid-week rooms with limited availability. Even when I try to book a supposed offer half the time it's "not available". I'm torn because since the new Horseshoe in Baltimore opened with it's good BJ rules. I playing there quite a bit. So I'm going to make Platnium this year for sure and maybe Diamond. But I'm a little peeved at CET for their skinflint comps. What's a gambler to do.
Resorts: 388
GN: 458
Borgata: 478
Ballys: 389
Harrahs: 378
Claridge: 354
No Listing for Caesars or the Taj at all. They must really be "sold out".
For what it's worth I've tried Trivago(it's a hotel booking site that searches all the other hotel sites for you) a couple of times, including a few days ago. When you try to book a room it forwards you to the website that originally listed the room and you book it through them. Both times I've gone all the way through the booking process only to have the site tell me they "couldn't complete the reservation"...or it was "unavailable at this time". So I don't know how reliable it is. On the other hand, I know others who have had good success with it. Go figure.
Quote: vendman1I was intrigued by 1BB's statement that he found Trivago rooms for under $100 on the 25th. It's weird how those sites work. As of 9:25am eastern here were my Trivago prices for Saturday the 25th:
Resorts: 388
GN: 458
Borgata: 478
Ballys: 389
Harrahs: 378
Claridge: 354
No Listing for Caesars or the Taj at all. They must really be "sold out".
For what it's worth I've tried Trivago(it's a hotel booking site that searches all the other hotel sites for you) a couple of times, including a few days ago. When you try to book a room it forwards you to the website that originally listed the room and you book it through them. Both times I've gone all the way through the booking process only to have the site tell me they "couldn't complete the reservation"...or it was "unavailable at this time". So I don't know how reliable it is. On the other hand, I know others who have had good success with it. Go figure.
Hard to believe they are getting those prices. Just goes to show how much money there is in the Ny-Phil. area. Plus what an exaggeration the 'Death Of AC" talk is.
The only reason to hire a rolling chair that I can see would be for the nostalgia.
Quote: ahiromuI have free rooms at Caesar's LV... and even Bally's AC is trying to charge me $200. You want to know why gamblers are going elsewhere? That's why gamblers are going elsewhere.
I was frustrated by this recently too. But it's all supply and demand. Sometimes all the comps I could want are available. If there is a big concert in town or some other event they are not above jacking the room rates though. Good for them if they can get it. It is hard to understand sometime though. I know there is no way in hell every room in AC is rented for this Saturday...but based on the rates they are charging it sure seems like it.
Quote: vendman1I was frustrated by this recently too. But it's all supply and demand. Sometimes all the comps I could want are available. If there is a big concert in town or some other event they are not above jacking the room rates though. Good for them if they can get it. It is hard to understand sometime though. I know there is no way in hell every room in AC is rented for this Saturday...but based on the rates they are charging it sure seems like it.
The problem is you get 5-10 20somethings coming to AC and packing in a room at $40 a person. Saturdays are slamming with this crowd and the casinos are making money off it. They pay to go in the clubs and drop decent $$'s. This is why I believe the overall revenue and profits in AC casinos are not as bad as the gaming revenues alone.
Not saying it is true in your case, but I hear from people all the time with a $500 gambling budget complaining they cant get a weekend room. The casinos simply see the person paying $400 for the room as more valuable. But they love you on weekdays.
Quote: vendman1I was frustrated by this recently too. But it's all supply and demand. Sometimes all the comps I could want are available. If there is a big concert in town or some other event they are not above jacking the room rates though. Good for them if they can get it. It is hard to understand sometime though. I know there is no way in hell every room in AC is rented for this Saturday...but based on the rates they are charging it sure seems like it.
Gross Room Revenue is more important that occupancy, and is also a function of RevPAR which is Revenue Per Available Room.
The long and short is, if I have 100 rooms and I can sell 60 of them for $200 ($12,000 GRR) then I am better off doing that than guaranteeing myself a sell-out at anything less than $145/night (factoring in expenses). I've always maintained that if your event pricing is such that you end up with 1-5 rooms open towards the end of the night, (which you can still walk-in) then your price point was likely as close to Optimal as you're going to get.
Quote: vendman1I hear you Mission..don't most large properties(I'm thinking casinos here) keep a few rooms on standby even during "sold out" periods just in case a whale rolls in at the last minute? I remember there was a show on A&E a few years ago called Caesars 24/7, and there was one episode where they were freaking out because the hotel was actually and really sold out. Which gave them 0 wiggle room. They were praying a few guests would no show. Which happened, but it still turned out to be a mess if I remember correctly.
I've heard that is a common procedure, but those would be accounted for as rooms held for Marketing. Basically, they have a certain number of, "Market," rooms which are sold on the open market, and I'm suggesting that if you sell out of those, your price was probably too low.
Quote: hail2skinsApril numbers in: brick and mortar down 17 percent from April 2014. Caesars AC took a 33 pct whack, while Harrah's up 17 pct.
http://www.nj.gov/oag/ge/docs/Financials/PressRel2015/April2015PressRelease.pdf
Would love to see the old breakdown to see where Caesars lost so much from last year. That seems like a huge decrease unless they had a bad month or a big winner at the tables.
Quote: BozWould love to see the old breakdown to see where Caesars lost so much from last year. That seems like a huge decrease unless they had a bad month or a big winner at the tables.
Prior to April, Ceasars was up 5% for the cumulative three months Jan-April 2015
The April reduction was all in table games. Slots were about the same. The drop was down by $10 million but the win percentage dropped from 31.8% to 14.8%.
Table game win in April 2014 $19,740,260 on a drop of $62,017,122 (31.8%)
Table game win in April 2015 $7,581,882 on a drop of $51,400,765 (14.8%)
It looks more like April 2014 was unusually lucky for Ceasars. Most of the time the win percentage is nowhere near 30%.
Ceasars Table Games
14.8% April 2015 (Borgota 14.5% | Harrah's 21.4% | Tropicana 18.5% )
20.1% March 2015
26.3% Feb 2015
17.5% Jan 2015
It's a mistake that is frequently made. You see the YoY numbers go down, and you forget the possibility that things could also have gone unusually well for the casino the previous year.
2,517 Slot Machines $12,903,769 win on $136,974,408 played or 9.4% Taj Mahal
1,671 Slot Machines $9,680,974 win on $103,981,529 played or 9.3% Resprts
114 games $2,672,516 win on $20,488,244 drop or 13.0% Taj Majal
69 games $2,498,701 win on $15,034,137 drop or 16.6% Resorts
Dennis Gomes purchased Resorts Atlantic City for $35 million in cash in December 2010, days before the casino was scheduled to shut down.In May 2011, Resorts became the first casino in Atlantic City to market itself to LGBT customers. The resort opened "Prohibition", the city's first gay casino nightclub, as well as hiring a director of LGBT marketing. Slot revenue was under $190K per day when Dennis bought the resort and is at $322K per day today.
So that is $35 million for a resort that in little over 4 years now has gaming revenue over $400K per day
Quote: pacomartinResorts Casino Hotel has nearly caught Trump Taj Majal in gaming revenue. They are down -6.50% in table games, and the slot machines are out-earning Taj Mahal on a per machine basis (although they only have 2/3 as many slot machines).
2,517 Slot Machines $12,903,769 win on $136,974,408 played or 9.4% Taj Mahal
1,671 Slot Machines $9,680,974 win on $103,981,529 played or 9.3% Resprts
114 games $2,672,516 win on $20,488,244 drop or 13.0% Taj Majal
69 games $2,498,701 win on $15,034,137 drop or 16.6% Resorts
Dennis Gomes purchased Resorts Atlantic City for $35 million in cash in December 2010, days before the casino was scheduled to shut down.In May 2011, Resorts became the first casino in Atlantic City to market itself to LGBT customers. The resort opened "Prohibition", the city's first gay casino nightclub, as well as hiring a director of LGBT marketing. Slot revenue was under $190K per day when Dennis bought the resort and is at $322K per day today.
So that is $35 million for a resort that in little over 4 years now has gaming revenue over $400K per day
Gomes is dead and Pro Bar is closed. Everyone used to enjoy "Dennis dough". That's what free slot play was called when he captained the ship.
Quote: pacomartinResorts Casino Hotel has nearly caught Trump Taj Majal in gaming revenue. They are down -6.50% in table games, and the slot machines are out-earning Taj Mahal on a per machine basis (although they only have 2/3 as many slot machines).
2,517 Slot Machines $12,903,769 win on $136,974,408 played or 9.4% Taj Mahal
1,671 Slot Machines $9,680,974 win on $103,981,529 played or 9.3% Resprts
114 games $2,672,516 win on $20,488,244 drop or 13.0% Taj Majal
69 games $2,498,701 win on $15,034,137 drop or 16.6% Resorts
Dennis Gomes purchased Resorts Atlantic City for $35 million in cash in December 2010, days before the casino was scheduled to shut down.In May 2011, Resorts became the first casino in Atlantic City to market itself to LGBT customers. The resort opened "Prohibition", the city's first gay casino nightclub, as well as hiring a director of LGBT marketing. Slot revenue was under $190K per day when Dennis bought the resort and is at $322K per day today.
So that is $35 million for a resort that in little over 4 years now has gaming revenue over $400K per day
I don't think there is one thing along that explains why Resorts is up, but here are a few:
Landshark Bar & Margaritaville
Lack of competition in area- No Showboat & Revel and questions about the future of Taj has sent players that like that section of town to Resorts.
Influence of Mohegan Sun advertising to their customers.
Quote: BozI don't think there is one thing along that explains why Resorts is up, but here are a few:
Landshark Bar & Margaritaville
Lack of competition in area- No Showboat & Revel and questions about the future of Taj has sent players that like that section of town to Resorts.
Influence of Mohegan Sun advertising to their customers.
I'll add generous comps to that list. Unless you're a total deadbeat you can at least score a room most days.
Quote: 1BBI'll add generous comps to that list. Unless you're a total deadbeat you can at least score a room most days.
I'm right there with you on the generous comps thing. I've moved most of my AC action from CET and Taj...to Resorts. So far they've been more then generous.
Quote: vendman1I think another reason Caesars and Bally's are down is. At least for me getting a comp room there has gotten way harder. Used to not be a problem except on Sat nights. Now half the time they want me to pay mid-week off season. My action there is less by about 10-15%, but my comps are way down. I'd say less than half what they used to be.
I agree wholeheartedly....and I think the resort fee hasn't helped those who are Gold and Platinum....they've moved on.
Quote: vendman1I think another reason Caesars and Bally's are down is. At least for me getting a comp room there has gotten way harder. Used to not be a problem except on Sat nights. Now half the time they want me to pay mid-week off season. My action there is less by about 10-15%, but my comps are way down. I'd say less than half what they used to be.
Quote: pacomartinPrior to April, Ceasars was up 5% for the cumulative three months Jan-April 2015
Table game win in April 2014 $19,740,260 on a drop of $62,017,122 (31.8%)
Table game win in April 2015 $7,581,882 on a drop of $51,400,765 (14.8%)
It's a mistake that is frequently made. You see the YoY numbers go down, and you forget the possibility that things could also have gone unusually well for the casino the previous year.
When looking at Year over Year numbers you should make sure last year's numbers are not unusually high. Last April was an extremely high percentage return on table game drop for Ceasars. They did not reproduce those numbers this April. But prior to April they were up 5% over last year's numbers. You tend to overstate your arguments
Percentage change Jan-April 2015 vs Jan-Apr 2014
Trump Taj Mahal -19.5%
Caesars -8.0%
Bally's AC -5.8%
Borgata +4.6
Tropicana +8.4%
Harrah's +13.2%
Resorts +13.4%
Golden Nugget +39.4%
For the first 4 months NJ is at $779m up 3.5% over last year FOR THE SAME CASINOS
PA is at $1042m for the first 4 months, so it is clearly way ahead of NJ. Slots are up by 1.41% from 2014, but table games are up by 7.49%. So clearly PA is continuing to draw more table game players from northern NJ and NYC.
Table games at the four casinos within convenient driving distance of the NJ border (Mt Airy, Sands Bethlehem, PARX, Sugarhouse) are $1.73 million per DAY while they are $1.16 million per day in all the other PA casinos combined.
Quote: 1BBGomes is dead and Pro Bar is closed. Everyone used to enjoy "Dennis dough". That's what free slot play was called when he captained the ship.
My bad. I really missed the boat on this one. But something sparked the turnaround.
Quote: GlamorousGirlI have been driving up to Atlantic City from Virginia every 3-4 months for several years, (love it - can't understand why people go to "local" casinos - it's always worth the drive for us!) and focused the majority of my play at the Taj, primarily because the comps have been generous (especially compared to Caesar's!!!), it's on the Boardwalk (I go for the beach and shopping as well as gambling,) and atmosphere. Resorts is generous, but I don't like the atmosphere much. I like the IDEA of playing at Caesar's because they have properties all over the place, but the comp dollars there looked like about a third or less of what I get at Taj! Now I'm worried about the future of the Taj. I want the tier points I earn to result in an upgrade renewal or upgrade (read: a place stays open!) Later this month, I will be at Taj (3 comped nights), Resorts (to use comp dollars waiting from last trip), Harrah's (2 comped nights - only place I could get a comped room Saturday, July 4), and Borgata (to show my Chairman card for their trade up promotion.) So to get right down to my dilemma, where should I use most of the bankroll I am bringing? I obviously don't want to dilute it by spreading it out evenly. Should I have faith in the Taj? Settle for what I consider "disappointing" comps at Harrah's? Use at the properties I'm not staying at? I hope there are no more closures in Atlantic City and I don't want to play anywhere that will close. I would also ask the statisticians out there, what are the chances!?
So...ummm...Harrah's has "disappointing" comps, but they comped you a summer season weekend room? Seems they were willing to do something that no one else in town would do. Why are you disappointed?
Quote: rdw4potusSo...ummm...Harrah's has "disappointing" comps, but they comped you a summer season weekend room? Seems they were willing to do something that no one else in town would do. Why are you disappointed?
But he prefers to stay on the boardwalk. I can also get weekend at Harrah but we want to be on the beach so we are staying sun to Thursday instead at Caesars
Quote: GWAEBut he prefers to stay on the boardwalk. I can also get weekend at Harrah but we want to be on the beach so we are staying sun to Thursday instead at Caesars
Oh, sure. That makes a lot of sense to me. But, Harrah's has given a room with a rack rate of about $400/night (it's July 4th). Nobody else did. What would they need to be willing to give in order for it not to be a disappointment?
For non-gambling check out the following links.
http://www.atlanticcityexperience.org/
http://www.atlanticcitynj.com/events/details.aspx?id=3400
http://tropicana.net/entertainment/imax-theatre/
http://www.highrollerfishing.com/
http://www.atlanticcityweekly.com/
Atlantic City literally has hundreds of restaurants, one of the best with the most history is The Knife and Fork.
http://www.knifeandforkinn.com/aboutus.php
Many of the less expensive drink and dining options are outside casinos.
http://picalilliac.com/
http://www.yelp.com/biz/the-irish-pub-atlantic-city
http://www.tonyboloneys.com/
http://ducktowntavern.com/
http://whitehousesubshop.net/
Some casinos may offer free play for new players for signing up for a card. Check the casino websites.
Along the boardwalk Caesar's, Tropicana and Taj Mahal are the nicest IMHO. Borgota is the most successful casino in A.C. However, it is in the Marina district.
Map of A.C. Showboat, Revel . Trump Plaza and Hilton are closed.
http://www.theatlanticcitycasinos.com/
I'm dreading the heat. What time will things start to cool off in the evening?
Plenty of times I have stopped in to cool off, warm up or just get out of the weather.
