Atlantic City Open Forum
https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/other-casinos/15899-atlantic-city-open-forum/110/
Right...That's my point. By dumping all the fiscally strapped assets in one company and leaving some top tier properties (presumably with less debt, but I haven't seen a balance sheet), in another company. CET is trying to weasel out of some debt. They will file Chapter 11 on the "troubled" properties and try to write down their debt on those properties. But they've screwed their debt holders. Who will be none to happy I'm sure. The only people making money on this are going to be the lawyers. Where is Ace when we need him?
Quote: vendman1The shift of assets leaves much of the debt with Caesars Operating Company, which would leave value with those companies if Caesars Operating Company files for bankruptcy. At least that's what management thinks, but it would likely be a huge fight for assets if bankruptcy does ensue."
https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/other-casinos/15899-atlantic-city-open-forum/110/
Right...That's my point. By dumping all the fiscally strapped assets in one company and leaving some top tier properties (presumably with less debt, but I haven't seen a balance sheet), in another company. CET is trying to weasel out of some debt. They will file Chapter 11 on the "troubled" properties and try to write down their debt on those properties. But they've screwed their debt holders. Who will be none to happy I'm sure. The only people making money on this are going to be the lawyers. Where is Ace when we need him?
That's kinda the idea of the whole thing.
CZR "junior" debt holders are screwed, & it is them left holding the bag.
Also, CZR confiscated Total Rewards for their top tier casinos only- which includes ONLY Harrahs in AC.
So if you are a top (or any)tier Ballys or Ceasars AC player, are your play & tier pts going to be of any worth to CZR?
Quote: 7star4nowThat's kinda the idea of the whole thing.
CZR "junior" debt holders are screwed, & it is them left holding the bag.
Also, CZR confiscated Total Rewards for their top tier casinos only- which includes ONLY Harrahs in AC.
So if you are a top (or any)tier Ballys or Ceasars AC player, are your play & tier pts going to be of any worth to CZR?
It seems like it would be illegal to restructure a company into 3 separate ones and then file bankruptcy on the losing ones.
What do you think the future will be for the Total Rewards program? I have almost $1500 worth of points. I feel like I need to get rid of the ASAP before they are worthless.
If total rewards was an asset, doesn't seem worth protecting if the benefits are stiffed. From their perspective, the asset is the player list, but still it becomes counter productive angering the same players. Using your points can't hurt as long as you're happy using them purchase wise, bird in the hand and all that. I usually use all points before leaving casinos anyways because it always made sense for casinos to undervalue people for offers considering they'll have to come back to use their points.Quote: GWAEIt seems like it would be illegal to restructure a company into 3 separate ones and then file bankruptcy on the losing ones.
What do you think the future will be for the Total Rewards program? I have almost $1500 worth of points. I feel like I need to get rid of the ASAP before they are worthless.
Yes as an individual, it's illegal planning to declare bankruptcy, but companies can.
You can buy NFL and other pro hakers with reward credits fyi. I've been getting emails about it lately and seems like a nice way to use them.
Quote: GWAEIt seems like it would be illegal to restructure a company into 3 separate ones and then file bankruptcy on the losing ones.
What do you think the future will be for the Total Rewards program? I have almost $1500 worth of points. I feel like I need to get rid of the ASAP before they are worthless.
I've heard Loveman say that total rewards isin't going anywhere. But Loveman says a lot of things so who knows. Just a thought though. For all their flaws, the one thing CET has done right is build the best loyalty program in the industry. I think for the most part people love TR. Even if they close some properties or file for bankruptcy (seems inevitable at this point). TR will still be around. You may have less places to use it. But it will still be there (i hope).
Quote: GWAEIt seems like it would be illegal to restructure a company into 3 separate ones and then file bankruptcy on the losing ones.
What do you think the future will be for the Total Rewards program? I have almost $1500 worth of points. I feel like I need to get rid of the ASAP before they are worthless.
It should be but isn't apparently. What would be illegal, would be screwing bondholders by intentionally/knowingly putting a bunch of losing assets together and "selling" them to bondholders as a "new" company. Which is what they've done. See the 08/09 financial crisis when Goldman Sachs and others, packaged worthless mortgage securities as investments and sold them to institutional investors who lost billions. (great book on the subject called "the big short" by Michael Lewis). That's the part of this whole seedy mess that may be in court for years.
"The provisions of the agreement state that if any member of Caesars Enterprise Services files for bankruptcy, it will lose its "governance rights" in the JV(the"Joint Venture" that now owns Total rewards."
"If CEOC (the group that includes Ballys & Caesars AC) filed for bankruptcy, for example, it would still have rights to the intellectual property, but it would lose the ability to control how its JV partners used it royalty-free"
It would seem to me that if, & when (Jan?) CZR declares bankruptcy, CEOC/Ballys/ Caesars AC will have inherited 2 orphaned AC casinos, they need to foreclose on, since they will no longer receive debt pmts.They will likely close Ballys.
Also, CEOC will have its hands full with a bunch of other "dog" CZR properties Loveman, et all , dumped on them.
They will also be in a protracted legal battle with "CERP" (Caesars Entertainment Resort Properties, owner of Harrahs AC).
So the surviving Caesars (& Ballys-if open) /AC entity will have lost control of the TR program & its hard to imagine that either side will be interested in maintaining any reciprocity aspects of the Total Rewards program.
http://www.thestreet.com/story/12720133/1/caesars-makes-another-move-to-insulate-healthy-subsidiaries.html?puc=yahoo&cm_ven=YAHOO
Quote: 7star4nowSome think that at least Caesars AC could survive the bankruptcy , but if they do, it would be under an ownership group (CEOC - "Caesars Entertainment Operating Company") that will be hostile towards the CZR parent co, & the group that owns Harrahs AC & surviving Vegas properties(Caesars Entertainment Resort Properties).
"The provisions of the agreement state that if any member of Caesars Enterprise Services files for bankruptcy, it will lose its "governance rights" in the JV(the"Joint Venture" that now owns Total rewards."
"If CEOC (the group that includes Ballys & Caesars AC) filed for bankruptcy, for example, it would still have rights to the intellectual property, but it would lose the ability to control how its JV partners used it royalty-free"
It would seem to me that if, & when (Jan?) CZR declares bankruptcy, CEOC/Ballys/ Caesars AC will have inherited 2 orphaned AC casinos, they need to foreclose on, since they will no longer receive debt pmts.They will likely close Ballys.
Also, CEOC will have its hands full with a bunch of other "dog" CZR properties Loveman, et all , dumped on them.
They will also be in a protracted legal battle with "CERP" (Caesars Entertainment Resort Properties, owner of Harrahs AC).
So the surviving Caesars (& Ballys-if open) /AC entity will have lost control of the TR program & its hard to imagine that either side will be interested in maintaining any reciprocity aspects of the Total Rewards program.
http://www.thestreet.com/story/12720133/1/caesars-makes-another-move-to-insulate-healthy-subsidiaries.html?puc=yahoo&cm_ven=YAHOO
I'm not disputing the story but that makes so little sense as to boggle the mind.
Quote: vendman1(great book on the subject called "the big short" by Michael Lewis).
Michael Lewis is a fantastic writer. He was a Salomon Brothers trader in the late 1980's, so he knows a lot about business. The Big Short: Inside the Doomsday Machine is still slated to be a film, but it is pretty depressing. His books, Moneyball and The Blind Side were both made into films.
Quote: pacomartinMichael Lewis is a fantastic writer. He was a Salomon Brothers trader in the late 1980's, so he knows a lot about business. The Big Short: Inside the Doomsday Machine is still slated to be a film, but it is pretty depressing. His books, Moneyball and The Blind Side were both made into films.
Agreed paco...all those books are worth a read. The Blind Side was also a pretty good film I thought. Though the movie version of Moneyball missed the point a little. Too much Brad Pitt. It's still a good movie just doesn't capture the main points of the book that well.
"The challenge in Atlantic City is not simply revenue but cost," he said. "Given the balance of revenue we enjoy at Bally's, we need to make money there."
Asked whether his debt-laden company is finished closing casinos in Atlantic City in the next one to five years, Loveman would only say, "I can't comment on something that might happen in one to five years."
http://www.businessweek.com/ap/2014-10-22/caesars-ceo-hails-center-fate-of-casinos-cloudy
I feel bad for these workers but they do still have a chance to keep their jobs, albeit they are being forced to contribute to their own retirement & take a hit on healthcare as most of the rest of the country has..
http://www.nbc40.net/story/26867329/union-defends-trying-to-dissuade-taj-mahal-patrons
Quote: 7star4nowThat meant Revel was saddled with more than $1.5 million in monthly power-plant financing fees before it paid one cent for any actual energy used."
l
Holy freaking crap. So Revel was paying almost $3mil
a month just for electric? And that's with half the hotel
not finished? And the new owners are stuck with this?
Are they insane?
"The Revel estate is huge and, at 6.2 million square feet, it’s going to be pricey to power regardless of where the energy comes from, Carney said. The Comcast Center, Philadelphia’s tallest building, is 1.25 million square feet."
So Revel is 5 times larger than the biggest building
in Philly? What were they thinking. Oh wait, the
designer had no idea what she was doing. And they
didn't build the 2nd tower because they ran out of
money? Good god..
Quote: 7star4nowLoveman in AC Today, mentioned Bally's "we need to make money there"
"The challenge in Atlantic City is not simply revenue but cost," he said. "Given the balance of revenue we enjoy at Bally's, we need to make money there."
While Bally's makes less than the other two casinos, it is not that much less !
Obviously, cost and revenue are both important, but it Bally's has reasonable revenue. They should be able to turn a profit.
Daily Revenue September 2014
Per Table: Harrah's $1,292 | Bally's $1,457 | Ceasars $1,783
Per Slot: Bally's $236 |Ceasars $321 | Harrah's $370
Tropicana numbers are similar
Per table day: $1,104. and per slot machine day:$221
http://www.pressofatlanticcity.com/news/breaking/stockton-students-could-occupy-former-casino/article_33172fdf-d0cc-584f-a541-34904741db7f.html
Quote: EvenBobHoly freaking crap. So Revel was paying almost $3mil
a month just for electric? And that's with half the hotel
not finished? And the new owners are stuck with this?
Are they insane?
"The Revel estate is huge and, at 6.2 million square feet, it’s going to be pricey to power regardless of where the energy comes from, Carney said. The Comcast Center, Philadelphia’s tallest building, is 1.25 million square feet."
So Revel is 5 times larger than the biggest building
in Philly? What were they thinking. Oh wait, the
designer had no idea what she was doing. And they
didn't build the 2nd tower because they ran out of
money? Good god..
The new owners are stuck with the power plant. They're not stuck with the O&M contract for it. They'll need to figure out whether it's better to pay to operate the power plant or whether they now want to strand that asset and take power from the grid. If they go the grid route, they'll have a very substantial initial outlay for the required transmission and voltage regulation equipment to serve a new load their size. It was idiotic and irresponsible for them to have not done that initially for redundancy and emergency backup purposes. But, I guess, just look at everything else that happened at Revel to see how well they set up and ran the place...
Edit: That's the tallest building in Philly. it's not the biggest. The Liberty Place complex, which I'm not sure is the largest building either, has about 3MM sqft of finished floorspace.
Quote: rdw4potusThe new owners are stuck with the power plant. They're not stuck with the O&M contract for it. They'll need to figure out whether it's better to pay to operate the power plant or whether they now want to strand that asset and take power from the grid. If they go the grid route, they'll have a very substantial initial outlay for the required transmission and voltage regulation equipment to serve a new load their size. It was idiotic and irresponsible for them to have not done that initially for redundancy and emergency backup purposes. But, I guess, just look at everything else that happened at Revel to see how well they set up and ran the place...
It is insane they didn't set up both options at first.
Quote: sodawaterIt is insane they didn't set up both options at first.
I truly can't believe that they were able to find an accredited electrical engineer that didn't absolutely demand it.
Quote: rdw4potusThe new owners are stuck with the power plant. They're not stuck with the O&M contract for it. They'll need to figure out whether it's better to pay to operate the power plant or whether they now want to strand that asset and take power from the grid. If they go the grid route, they'll have a very substantial initial outlay for the required transmission and voltage regulation equipment to serve a new load their size. It was idiotic and irresponsible for them to have not done that initially for redundancy and emergency backup purposes. But, I guess, just look at everything else that happened at Revel to see how well they set up and ran the place...
Edit: That's the tallest building in Philly. it's not the biggest. The Liberty Place complex, which I'm not sure is the largest building either, has about 3MM sqft of finished floorspace.
I'm surprised they were permitted to operate such a large facility "off the gird". Seems like it might be a safety issue.
http://www.sbnation.com/2014/10/24/7066415/new-jersey-sports-betting-restraining-order
Quote: vendman1I'd love to know if the PA numbers are starting to drop because the novelty is wearing off...or for some other reason. Also I continue to be impressed by the Golden Nugget AC. They are really growing their business. Granted it's much improved over the old..Trump Marina. But it's still the least interesting casino in AC in my opinion. They must be doing something right. I wonder what it is. I haven't been there much lately...but maybe it's time for a trip back there.
I would not recommend Golden Nugget AC. They were so bad about honoring their advertised promotions that my friend threw his player's card away right in front of them after a ridiculous argument.
Quote: sodawaterI would not recommend Golden Nugget AC. They were so bad about honoring their advertised promotions that my friend threw his player's card away right in front of them after a ridiculous argument.
What promotion? Details.
The GN has become my choice since I left the CET casinos.
Free parking. Low table minimums. Match play coupons. Tuesday, Wednesday and Thursday are 'Senior Days'. Players over the age of 50 with a players card who earn 10 credits can get a $5 lunch buffet or $10 dinner buffet.
Quote: sodawaterI would not recommend Golden Nugget AC. They were so bad about honoring their advertised promotions that my friend threw his player's card away right in front of them after a ridiculous argument.
Funny you should say that...the reason I stopped going there was I had an issue with a promo they did right after they took control and remodeled. I basically haven't been back for a couple of years now. I actually forget what they did; or didn't do; it's been so long. But I remember it pissed me off. This is also the only casino in AC that seems to have noticed that I'm a counter. They didn't back me off or anything but they were certainly paying a lot of attention to my play. But I don't spread that much as to avoid heat.
Quote: FatGeezusQuote: sodawaterI would not recommend Golden Nugget AC. They were so bad about honoring their advertised promotions that my friend threw his player's card away right in front of them after a ridiculous argument.
What promotion? Details.
It was the "we'll match any other casino's offer" promotion (once a week for 4 weeks) earlier this year. He brought in $200 of matchplay and they decided to only honor it for $100 of matchplay.
The next week he brought in another $200 matchplay and they gave him nothing, saying his "play last week didn't merit it."
Well nothing in the ads said anything about having to merit it with play.
They also canceled both of our tier-match cards, booting us from access to their shithole premium players' club food spread. That place was the best gamble in the Golden Nugget, gambling that you wouldn't get sick from the lukewarm food.
The GN AC is a shitty casino in general, my least favorite in NJ.
The last time I stayed there the room was disgusting, with sopping wet filthy washcloths from the last guest and a worker actually hammering something outside my window. I e-mailed customer service about it and they didn't even bother to reply.
I do not feel safe at all in their parking garage. Last time I was in their garage, a car with 4 adult men slowly followed me until I turned back and went back to the casino.
Finally, I have not had good experience with GN employees on all levels. Last weekend, a GN poker dealer who shall remain nameless was actually given a three-rotation penalty in a Borgata donkament for outrageously abusing the tournament staff and other players. She was screaming so loud the entire room heard her.
Quote: vendman1All of your experiences above Jibe with my memories of going there. The staff seemed surly and rude. The rooms have the thinnest walls of any casino I've ever stayed in..I can always hear people next door or above me or whatever. Every time. It's why I stopped going there. Somehow though their business is up when most others are down. That's what I was curious about.
I think it's just a function of the marina doing so well while the boardwalk fails. People just seem to have a nicer time at the marina, and there the GN is next to the two best properties in AC. It's got a great location now.
Quote: vendman1All of your experiences above Jibe with my memories of going there. The staff seemed surly and rude. The rooms have the thinnest walls of any casino I've ever stayed in..I can always hear people next door or above me or whatever. Every time. It's why I stopped going there. Somehow though their business is up when most others are down. That's what I was curious about.
Agree with both of you. I have no interest in going back when both of the other marina casinos treat me so much better and are much better properties. GN is still a low roller casino that sweats the money. No reason to go there unless you are a penny slot player looking for a free buffet that will cost you $300. Casinomom loves the place and that is all you need to know.
Quote: vendman1Also I continue to be impressed by the Golden Nugget AC. They are really growing their business. Granted it's much improved over the old..Trump Marina. But it's still the least interesting casino in AC in my opinion. They must be doing something right. I wonder what it is. I haven't been there much lately...but maybe it's time for a trip back there.
I think they are the casino that got the most benefit from Atlantic Club closing. They did a lot of marketing to get those players and it's a relatively small casino like Atlantic Club (so less walking). I think the best thing about the place is their nice outdoor hottub / firepit area... which is kind of strange since they are a casino that seems to mostly draw an older / senior crowd.
Quote: vendman1I'd love to know if the PA numbers are starting to drop because the novelty is wearing off...or for some other reason. .
Personally, I think that slots with tax rates over 50% provide little incentives to the casino owners. The mini casinos are an exception because they are relatively new.
Change in slot revenue for the 2013-14 Fiscal year to the previous FY.
Mini-Casinos Destination Overnight Resorts or Convention Centers
Valley Forge 22.6% (open 90 days before previous fiscal year)
Nemacolin N/A (not open the full year previous year).
Stand alone Casinos
The Rivers -2.2%
Mohegan Sun -2.4%
Sands Bethlehem -3.6%
Mount Airy -3.9%
SugarHouse -4.6%
Horse Racing Track Casinos
Parx -5.8%
The Meadows -8.3%
Penn National -9.0%
Presque Isle -10.8%
Harrah's Philadelphia -12.2%
Total Slot Revenue -4.5%
Slot machines still bring in the most revenue (over $2 billion of which operators keep $1 billion)
$2,319,890,598 gross revenue
$1,078,672,462 casino share
Table Games are a better area to try to expand
$731,874,861 gross revenue
$626,590,706 casino share
The problem is that it is difficult to expand table games in a locals market. Sands Casino is the only one with a proximity to New York city (Chinatown and Brooklyn) and the investment capital and skills to know how to really expand this market. They can build shopping centers and hotels and run dozens of buses per day
Table Games North Eastern-Central PA
$177,243,417 SANDS BETHLEHEM
$44,741,447 MOHEGAN SUN
$42,013,330 MOUNT AIRY
$34,360,555 PENN NATIONAL
$298,358,749
Table Games Philadelphia Area
$123,302,380 PARX
$86,213,180 SUGARHOUSE
$74,496,004 HARRAH'S PHILADELPHIA
$33,830,602 VALLEYFORGE
$317,842,166
Table Games Western PA
$68,431,134 THE RIVERS
$29,955,300 THE MEADOWS
$12,460,838 PRESQUE ISLE
$4,826,674 NEMACOLIN
$115,673,946
Sands Casino Revenue
$177,243,417 : Table Game Revenue Taxes at 14.4%
$280,390,252 : Slot Machine Revenue Taxes at 54.6%
Quote: pacomartin
The problem is that it is difficult to expand table games in a locals market. Sands Casino is the only one with a proximity to New York city (Chinatown and Brooklyn) and the investment capital and skills to know how to really expand this market. They can build shopping centers and hotels and run dozens of buses per day
It's funny, because I've actually been paying a little bit of attention to this. Meadows went Vegas-Style last month and again this month offering free drinks for anyone playing Table Games at any betting level, of course, they can't serve 24/7 like Vegas can, but I think it's a definite power play for Rivers/Wheeling Island/Mountaineer Tables players.
It's difficult to say how much success they've had with it, because when I called at the end of September, they weren't sure if they were going to do it again in October, but they've brought it back. I just called a few minutes ago, and while they are doing it for the remainder of October, they're not sure about November.
I guess they're not sure whether or not it is a profitable decision yet, probably giving it a few months to compare to same-time-period last year numbers.
Quote: Mission146I guess they're not sure whether or not it is a profitable decision yet, probably giving it a few months to compare to same-time-period last year numbers.
From the September numbers it seems to be a huge failure (down 1/3 from previous years)
(July ----------- Aug ------------ Sep )
$3,057,586 $2,428,163 $1,948,525 (2014)
$2,901,369 $3,024,425 $2,959,755 (2013)
$3,757,735 $3,220,333 $2,818,372 (2012)
$2,744,742 $3,510,056 $3,160,914 (2011)
Quote: onenickelmiracleWestern Pennsylvania has seen many casinos and now even more racinos open up in Northeastern Ohio and I'm sure falling numbers in Western Pennsylvania have much to do with it. It takes a lot of leeway from the casinos to make people travel farther when they have a local option I do agree with and feel it from a personal level no longer excited to travel.
In my opinion, Meadows is doing nearly everything they can. Free shuttles to any of the hotels around there, fairly generous Free Play, decent perks for higher tier Members (Clubhouse for Gold/Platinum/Owners, Adios Lounge for Platinum/Owners) I think they should make a strong play against the Ohio casinos by just offering free drinks for all players across-the-board because the Ohio casinos cannot legally do that. There'd have to be some strong billboard/TV/Radio advertising push to go along with it, though.
What is the state tax on slot revenues in Ohio?Quote: onenickelmiracleWIt takes a lot of leeway from the casinos to make people travel farther when they have a local option I do agree with and feel it from a personal level no longer excited to travel.
33% pretty sure for casinos but I'm not sure about racinos.Quote: SanchoPanzaWhat is the state tax on slot revenues in Ohio?
Quote: SanchoPanzaWhat is the state tax on slot revenues in Ohio?
State of the States gives you tax rates and a lot of other information for each state laws. But Ohio is indeed 33%/
Quote: wardnineAny suggestions on best places to play BJ in AC now? Inexperienced card counter going up this weekend; looking for $10-$25 table minimums, 6-8 deck, S17 as practice. Is Borgata good for this? Any of the Caesar's casinos?
CET has the sh%#$iest games in town. You can say that about pretty much any town.
You can probably go count cards all you want at taj. I doubt any of the PCs there are motivated to back off card counters. They probably don't give a s%^t at this point.
I can't see into the future but Loveman said of Bally's, "we have to make money their." Something tells me given the rapidly declining market Bally's could close in the not to distant future. They could then try and lure Bally's players into Caesars next door. And remember Resorts isn't exactly setting the world on fire either. Revel? Who knows if it can turn a profit or not.
That would leave Tropicana, Caesar's and possibly the successor to Revel on the boardwalk.
I really hate being such a pessimistic killjoy but A.C. is taking major hits even on national news. People will just stay away........
The Marina casinos seem to be doing just fine. Clean, safe and a more upscale demographic.
Lemieux is gonna have to find a new source of income!
Quote: JackStraw8004Mass. casinos will suck more money out of AC in the coming years. Many of AC customers come from Boston area. WYNN casino will give them a reason to not travel to AC.
The exceptional and unparalleled service and experience Wynn Everett is going to offer is going to put many of the NE casinos to shame not just AC. If the MA casinos carry the same amount of high quality customer service (minus the Bellagio LOL) over from Vegas, AC as a gaming destination would come to an end. Not an abrupt end but a slow painful one. Revel tried that but didn't work because they attempted the Vegas experience yet doesn't know what that means and lacked the Vegas level of service. Borgata has a minor feel of Vegas but in terms of service, doesn't even come close. The Borgata is a nervous freak when you do things somewhat differently from the 98%. I mean if that casino is so nervous about things better off converting yourself into a Chucky Cheese. LOL.
Quote: sodawaterBorgata is closing its buffet in December for repairs.
Lemieux is gonna have to find a new source of income!
Sodawater, Borgata gamblers have been selling comp dollars to any guys for cash in many ways. Examples are:
1) $10 cash for a meal ticket to the Borgata buffet, or if the buffet is closed, then
2) $10 cash for a meal ticket to the Borgata Amphora Lounge, or if a meal ticket is not your cup of tea, then
3) $100 cash in exchange for $200 comp dollars to pay for the room bill at the check-out. It's especially good for the "buyer" during the weekends.
Notes:
The seller cashes in his comp dollars at a rate of 2 for 1 at the check-out. The "buyer" pays for his room bill with the seller's comp dollars and saves himself 50% of the room expenses. The deal is good for both seller and buyer. BTW, "Jorge" was the seller who bragged to me how he sold his $2,000 comp dollars to a degenerated Asian gambler for $1,000 cash.
Quote: Artemis$100 cash in exchange for $200 comp dollars
I'd rather keep the 200 comp dollars and use them for 20 buffets.
Quote: sodawaterI'd rather keep the 200 comp dollars and use them for 20 buffets.
To each his own. "Mickey" had saved up his comp dollars for the same reason as you've mentioned. Recently he's blacklisted, and his comp dollars are frozen just like Lemieux66.
Just think of a ticking bomb .
A player (just like Mickey or Lemieux66) never knows when his comp dollars go KA-BOOM anytime.
Quote: ArtemisSodawater, Borgata gamblers have been selling comp dollars to any guys for cash in many ways. Examples are:
1) $10 cash for a meal ticket to the Borgata buffet, or if the buffet is closed, then
2) $10 cash for a meal ticket to the Borgata Amphora Lounge, or if a meal ticket is not your cup of tea, then
3) $100 cash in exchange for $200 comp dollars to pay for the room bill at the check-out. It's especially good for the "buyer" during the weekends.
Notes:
The seller cashes in his comp dollars at a rate of 2 for 1 at the check-out. The "buyer" pays for his room bill with the seller's comp dollars and saves himself 50% of the room expenses. The deal is good for both seller and buyer. BTW, "Jorge" was the seller who bragged to me how he sold his $2,000 comp dollars to a degenerated Asian gambler for $1,000 cash.
There used to be a guy on EBAY (10 yrs ago? in boom time)- selling his weekend comp rooms & big show tkts @ Foxwoods for a thousand $+ every week.
I think he was a local player, who didn't need the room, or he & his wife both both had room comps.
He seemed to get away with it for quite a while - a free $1000/week bankroll.
