Atlantic City Open Forum
Quote: onenickelmiracleIt's wait and see now and the wait will be between long and never. Happens all the time in Ohio where there is lots of talk and nothing ever happens. Sounds like the bank owns the casino and banks never have to do anything, never under pressure.
Unfortunately for Revel (& AC) they've hit a buzz-saw of a perfect storm.
Some neophyte "Destination Expert" may imagine that CZR or Hard rock , for example put up their own $ to finance acquisitions.
To the contrary, it is private investors, such as the AC property bondholders who financed CZR's acquisition of Showboat, Ballys & Ceasars who put up the $ & take the risk.
CZR just made its previous financiers squeal like a pig , eat Showboat debt, & put them on the hook for the solvency of Ceasars & Ballys (while, furthermore, confiscating intellectual property right to their "Total Rewards" program)
Would you do business in a toxic environment with CZR , when Gary Loveman's running out of town- with his hair on fire?
The only game in NJ is now in the Meadowlands, across the bridge from NYC.
(That goes double for Hard Rock)
Any amateur "Destination Expert"could see that if he took his head out of his arse & hand out of Kevin's empty pockets.
Anybody think this sudden change of heart was for AC- vs Meadowlands?
http://www.reviewjournal.com/business/casinos-gaming/mgm-resorts-takes-steps-regain-nj-gaming-license
“ Christie -So the downsizing of Atlantic City is going to be a natural thing that’s going to happen, when you’re built for a monopoly and you no longer are a monopoly,” Christie said
Read More: Christie aims to grow AC as a 'resort town' | http://nj1015.com/christie-aims-to-grow-ac-as-a-resort-town/?trackback=tsmclip
A RESORT TOWN WHICH HAPPENS TO HAVE CASINOS. Seriously cut those gaming taxes to 0 and Atlantic City won't go anywhere. It's probably worth it just to preserve the gambling tradition keeping the jobs and to get back at the other states.Quote: 7star4nowRIP AC
“ Christie -So the downsizing of Atlantic City is going to be a natural thing that’s going to happen, when you’re built for a monopoly and you no longer are a monopoly,” Christie said
Read More: Christie aims to grow AC as a 'resort town' | http://nj1015.com/christie-aims-to-grow-ac-as-a-resort-town/?trackback=tsmclip
Here is the report for the first 7 months of 2014
-7.20% - Drop in revenue for Atlantic City since 2013
-2.56% - Drop in revenue for Atlantic City w/o Atlantic Club
-11.17% - Drop in revenue for three casinos closing in September
-1.03% - Drop in revenue for eight remaining casinos
-9.34% - Drop in revenue for four Harrah's casinos (closing one to stabilize the other three)
Increase in revenue for 2014-2013 first 7 months
+1.15% Borgata
+4.26% Resorts
+15.51% Tropicana
+34.37% Golden Nugget
There is some indication that Atlantic City will be more stable after this fall.
"-7.20% - Drop in revenue for Atlantic City since 2013
-2.56% - Drop in revenue for Atlantic City w/o Atlantic Club"
Can one imply AC lost nearly 5% of it's revenue simply because Atlantic Club closed -& those customer's stopped coming to AC altogether?
"There is some indication that Atlantic City will be more stable after this fall"
Will AC redistribute these revenues -even though one end of the Boardwalk will be dark, & there will be a big hole between Ceasars & Trop, & the critical mass of Casinos in one destination (ie a continuous mini Vegas strip of casinos)- which AC enjoyed, vs isolated local slot parlors ,no longer exists?
Quote: pacomartin
Here is the report for the first 7 months of 2014
-7.20% - Drop in revenue for Atlantic City since 2013
-2.56% - Drop in revenue for Atlantic City w/o Atlantic Club
-11.17% - Drop in revenue for three casinos closing in September
-1.03% - Drop in revenue for eight remaining casinos
-9.34% - Drop in revenue for four Harrah's casinos (closing one to stabilize the other three)
Increase in revenue for 2014-2013 first 7 months
+1.15% Borgata
+4.26% Resorts
+15.51% Tropicana
+34.37% Golden Nugget
There is some indication that Atlantic City will be more stable after this fall.
This is what Loveman is thinking and why he is pushing so hard to ensure no one buys the closing casinos with the intent of reopening them. Many do not like him, but in this case he is only doing what is best for his company and its shareholders.
Quote: dave12038457I just can't think of what could pay overhead and still return a profit to new owners.
Do they need a unique shopping mall in the area?
Small individual stores that just happen to be the size of hotel rooms.
Quote: rxwineDo they need a unique shopping mall in the area?
Small individual stores that just happen to be the size of hotel rooms.
And actually, if you knock out walls between rooms, you can fully customize the size.
http://www.cardplayer.com/poker-news/17705-nearly-a-third-of-the-casino-floor-space-in-atlantic-city-will-be-inactive-by-year-s-end
Quote: 7star4nowThese stats beg the quetions I've been asking myself- for ex:
"-7.20% - Drop in revenue for Atlantic City since 2013
-2.56% - Drop in revenue for Atlantic City w/o Atlantic Club"
Can one imply AC lost nearly 5% of it's revenue simply because Atlantic Club closed -& those customer's stopped coming to AC altogether?
"There is some indication that Atlantic City will be more stable after this fall"
Will AC redistribute these revenues -even though one end of the Boardwalk will be dark, & there will be a big hole between Ceasars & Trop, & the critical mass of Casinos in one destination (ie a continuous mini Vegas strip of casinos)- which AC enjoyed, vs isolated local slot parlors ,no longer exists?
It is impossible to give definitive answers to these questions. Gambling revenue has no hard relationship to number of machines or tables. Each table can produce a wide variation of revenue.
Certainly Loveman is hoping that by closing Showboat, he won't lose those customers, but they will stay at Ceasars and drift over to Bally's. Since it is a long walk back to the Taj Mahal, they will stay on CET properties.
Carl Icahn may still try and buy Revel and Taj Majal. He is a bottom feeder, so I am sure he is hoping that the price will drop to nothing.
I read the same thing. This means a return to arrogance which got them all here. Politics, corruption and possibly collusion to blame. I know market conditions matter, but on the other hand competition matters too. More people will just go to Vegas, stay home, or go locally. Nothing will be done so everyone just has to accept it.Quote: 7star4nowNearly A Third Of The Casino Floor Space In Atlantic City Will Be Inactive By Year's End
http://www.cardplayer.com/poker-news/17705-nearly-a-third-of-the-casino-floor-space-in-atlantic-city-will-be-inactive-by-year-s-end
As for someone purchasing Revel or Taj Mahal, anything is possible. But in a fast declining market it really is hard to justify buying a casino in A.C. Many players are gambling closer to home, those that remain are invested in a comp system that many are loyal to. It is difficult to lure players away from other casinos without giving away the store so to speak. The market really can't be grown. You can only cannibalize from other casinos. A very challenging market to try and re-brand a casino in IMHO.
Quote: pacomartin
Here is the report for the first 7 months of 2014
-7.20% - Drop in revenue for Atlantic City since 2013
-2.56% - Drop in revenue for Atlantic City w/o Atlantic Club
-11.17% - Drop in revenue for three casinos closing in September
-1.03% - Drop in revenue for eight remaining casinos
-9.34% - Drop in revenue for four Harrah's casinos (closing one to stabilize the other three)
Increase in revenue for 2014-2013 first 7 months
+1.15% Borgata
+4.26% Resorts
+15.51% Tropicana
+34.37% Golden Nugget
There is some indication that Atlantic City will be more stable after this fall.
Nice map. Can I still take the people mover to the Sands? :-)
Frankly, I don't see gaming rebounding in A.C. I see the city tipping further and further into an abyss. Home property values have fallen, 30% tax hike and soon to be many unemployed whose homes may get foreclosed on. Hate to sound so pessimistic but A.C. hasn't really been family friendly since the 1960's.
So I wouldn't expect to see much of a turnaround.
If there won't be a casino, there is no point to spending money to prevent one as was done with Atlantic Club and other places or forgoing money. This points to blaming the casinos for their problems and for the problems the market has endured. Shell companies they sell to anyways very likely.Quote: dave12038457The casinos in A.C. have considerable overhead. Utilities, taxes, wages etc. Up to 50% of rooms are given away as comps. For more then one casino it is a struggle to remain profitable. The deed restriction while somewhat underhanded, makes good sense from CET's point of view.
Frankly, I don't see gaming rebounding in A.C. I see the city tipping further and further into an abyss. Home property values have fallen, 30% tax hike and soon to be many unemployed whose homes may get foreclosed on. Hate to sound so pessimistic but A.C. hasn't really been family friendly since the 1960's.
So I wouldn't expect to see much of a turnaround.
Quote: GWAEI was thinking about the casinos closing. What about the restaurants in them? I think I am more sad about those closing than the actual casino. I wonder if any of them will relocate? If Taj closes then will a place like rain forest cafe close? They have their own entrance but they are within the building.
I think you mean when Trump Plaza closes, and yes the word is Rainforest Cafe will be closing as well.
Quote: GWAEI was thinking about the casinos closing. What about the restaurants in them? I think I am more sad about those closing than the actual casino. I wonder if any of them will relocate? If Taj closes then will a place like rain forest cafe close? They have their own entrance but they are within the building.
Yes, the restaurants close. You can't operate a restaurant in a closed casino. Most (all?) of Revel's restaurants are just tenants, and they will have to close.
Quote: BozI think you mean when Trump Plaza closes, and yes the word is Rainforest Cafe will be closing as well.
yep that is what I meant. Well that is a shame then. I think things closing like that are just more reasons AC will fail on top of the casinos. Take away things that kids like and take away the casinos and there is just no reason to go there.
Quote: dave12038457Rainforest Café will remain open after Trump Plaza closes. I called them and that is what they told me.
I stand corrected. Glad to hear it. They should still get business from Caesars.
Quote: 1BBJust for fun check room prices for this weekend in AC. Anyone not comped or already booked will be paying top dollar and then some. We have had offers to buy our room but we don't get into that.
The CZR Properties have been filled for a while as they are having a huge IPAD Giveaway for players. Probably the best giveaway in years for them.
Quote: BozThe CZR Properties have been filled for a while as they are having a huge IPAD Giveaway for players. Probably the best giveaway in years for them.
But can you serve an iPad for dessert?
Quote: BozThe CZR Properties have been filled for a while as they are having a huge IPAD Giveaway for players. Probably the best giveaway in years for them.
" Probably the best giveaway in years for them"
agree - I was shocked, I called 1st week -they said they were sold out - put me on wait list.
With no incentive to goto AC, booked my trip to LV.
They called me yesterday saying IPAD was now available
I said no thanks.
My bad- it's so GD annoying trying to find Johnny Rocket coupons in LV - & none of the undeleted LV Desination Experts emphasize these coupons - how will I possibly enjoy myself?
Quote: JackStraw8004How much prior action was required to be invited for iPad giveaway. I know some 7Stars players who didn't receive an invite.
obviously was not based on tier but ADT- I'm a medium Diamond this year- but I'd say I got it since my ADT jumped last 2 visits - didn't win or lose much but played a lot longer than usual & hit 5k tier bonus both times
"A source said the casinos where Singh played and lost are not responsible for repaying the money"
http://nypost.com/2014/08/26/bandit-makes-off-with-32k-loses-it-all-in-roulette-game/
Quote: JackStraw8004How much prior action was required to be invited for iPad giveaway. I know some 7Stars players who didn't receive an invite.
Its all about ADT. My wife is a mid Diamond based on slot play and usually earns around 1000-1500 points a day and recieved the invite. It wasnt too busy Saturday at the giveaway, but some players had a choice of a Mac Airbook or a 27inch All in One Apple Desk Computer. So there was levels of awards involved. They did not give out the gifts, as they will be shipped.
Caesars casinos itself was packed Saturday and Sunday and reminded me of the old days of AC. Visited Trump Plaza one last time and it was dead.
Nothing Them roulette system players won't do.Quote: 7star4nowBandit makes off with $32K, loses it all in roulette game
"A source said the casinos where Singh played and lost are not responsible for repaying the money"
http://nypost.com/2014/08/26/bandit-makes-off-with-32k-loses-it-all-in-roulette-game/
Quote: AxelWolfNothing Them roulette system players won't do.
Winning roulette system:
1. Steal money
2. Bet with stolen money
3. Profit
Quote: Dicenor33The man is good at stealing. We are talking 100% positive EV here. What else can anyone dream about?
I still don't understand how you rob 12 banks and only get $32k total.
Read more: http://www.nbcphiladelphia.com/news/local/Armed-Carjacker-Targets-Golden-Nugget-Casino-Customers-Police-272812701.html#ixzz3BYQjZXeC
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The banks don't keep as much cash around for the purpose of making someone else seem more attractive a place to rob at gun point.Quote: AxiomOfChoiceI still don't understand how you rob 12 banks and only get $32k total.
Quote: onenickelmiracleThe banks don't keep as much cash around for the purpose of making someone else seem more attractive a place to rob at gun point.
Yeah but they have more than 2-3k. I have withdrawn more than that on multiple occasions. I have also been turned down for withdrawals (told I can only withdraw 3k when I wanted 5) but I was not actually taking all their cash when I took the 3k -- they just wanted to make sure that they did not run out.
Even a small grocery store bank branch should have $10k or so. A real bank branch should have a lot more. You can probably get more than 2-3 k by robbing all the people in the bank, rather than the bank itself.
He could have stuck around 5 more minutes but didn't want to wait and be caught.Quote: AxiomOfChoiceYeah but they have more than 2-3k. I have withdrawn more than that on multiple occasions. I have also been turned down for withdrawals (told I can only withdraw 3k when I wanted 5) but I was not actually taking all their cash when I took the 3k -- they just wanted to make sure that they did not run out.
Even a small grocery store bank branch should have $10k or so. A real bank branch should have a lot more. You can probably get more than 2-3 k by robbing all the people in the bank, rather than the bank itself.
He was trying to avoid CTR's.Quote: AxiomOfChoiceI still don't understand how you rob 12 banks and only get $32k total.
Quote: AxelWolfHe was trying to avoid CTR's.
I literally lol'ed at that one. llol!
Quote: AxelWolfHe was trying to avoid CTR's.
I literally lol'ed at that one. llol!
I had negligible play and absolutely zero offers from Taj before this.
