Atlantic City Open Forum
Quote: edwardhou1Thanks, so I presume that it is anyone's guess if the better 3-card paytable will ever return.
NOT. Is the proper guess
Quote: Lemieux66I did some counting at the red felt tables at Trop. Piece of shit PB asked me if I wanted insurance at one point(I said no, although it was very close) and then had the shoe shuffled after that hand. I obviously then left.
I learned something though. Using red chips to ramp up bets in a green chip game is a dead giveaway. I met another counter there who knew what he was doing so I just followed his lead(he was Asian though so I assume he draws less attention). I need to cool it at Trop because the poker game is good there and I can't have my comps snatched there too. Ill be virtually SOL in AC if this happens after the borgata incident.
Generally, you always want to bet with the fewest possible chips. Never use chips denominated below your base level. The only exception is to be wary of using chips that would cause attention on their own (if "purple action" is going to be called, don't use a $500 chip on a $600 bet, etc.).
Also, if you can tell the answer that the pit boss wants, you always have to give it to him. The cost of taking insurance when it's slightly out of the money is much less than the cost of losing the opportunity to continue to play at the Trop...
Quote: Lemieux66I did some counting at the red felt tables at Trop. Piece of shit PB asked me if I wanted insurance at one point(I said no, although it was very close) and then had the shoe shuffled after that hand. I obviously then left.
I learned something though. Using red chips to ramp up bets in a green chip game is a dead giveaway. I met another counter there who knew what he was doing so I just followed his lead(he was Asian though so I assume he draws less attention). I need to cool it at Trop because the poker game is good there and I can't have my comps snatched there too. Ill be virtually SOL in AC if this happens after the borgata incident.
I am starting to feel bad for you. You have the worst luck of anyone I have ever heard from when it comes to being backed off in AC. My question is if you are spending hundreds of hours in Poker Rooms and not using the comps, you must be winning so why even bother with BJ?
Quote: BozI am starting to feel bad for you. You have the worst luck of anyone I have ever heard from when it comes to being backed off in AC. My question is if you are spending hundreds of hours in Poker Rooms and not using the comps, you must be winning so why even bother with BJ?
It's a leak. I sometimes go into slumps in poker(sometimes variance, sometimes just not being patient) and if I lose something substantial I want to count and get it back. It's stupid. Luckily last night I figured out a way to get out of it. I simply never ever shut up as I play. I angle for calls preflop every time. It's fun too. More money in the pot.
I also like comp rooms. I found out that at Trop poker does nothing in terms or giving you that. Poker rate yeah but not comp. Only tables and slots helps you. Since they don't even have a 9:6 machine there, I went to BJ.
Quote: Lemieux66I did some counting at the red felt tables at Trop. Piece of shit PB asked me if I wanted insurance at one point(I said no, although it was very close) and then had the shoe shuffled after that hand. I obviously then left.
I learned something though. Using red chips to ramp up bets in a green chip game is a dead giveaway. I met another counter there who knew what he was doing so I just followed his lead(he was Asian though so I assume he draws less attention). I need to cool it at Trop because the poker game is good there and I can't have my comps snatched there too. Ill be virtually SOL in AC if this happens after the borgata incident.
if you are getting this much heat in AC then you are doing something very wrong.
Quote: GWAEif you are getting this much heat in AC then you are doing something very wrong.
I'm a white male in a hoodie. Doesn't help. I also stand up as I do it which probably isn't helpful.
Quote: GWAEif you are getting this much heat in AC then you are doing something very wrong.
I'm beyond baffled. Lemieux, in his first post 2 1/2 months ago, was talking about a 1-6 spread at $5 minimums on 8 deck H17 games. How do you go from that to getting "banned" all over town?
I found a weak dealer at Revel and I spread 1-20 green for three hours and won a bundle. I played unrated with an in your face attitude. I used zero cover and made ridiculous index plays without a hint of heat. Something does not add up.
Quote: 1BBI'm beyond baffled. Lemieux, in his first post 2 1/2 months ago, was talking about a 1-6 spread at $5 minimums on 8 deck H17 games. How do you go from that to getting "banned" all over town?
I found a weak dealer at Revel and I spread 1-20 green for three hours and won a bundle. I played unrated with an in your face attitude. I used zero cover and made ridiculous index plays without a hint of heat. Something does not add up.
perception is reality.
Possibly Lemieux is not getting heat but is perceiving other things as such.
Lemieux, if you think wearing a hoodie and standing is causing you heat then freaking change what you do.
Quote: GWAEperception is reality.
Possibly Lemieux is not getting heat but is perceiving other things as such.
Lemieux, if you think wearing a hoodie and standing is causing you heat then freaking change what you do.
My first indicator of heat, at Revel, I was wearing a Super Mario Brothers 3 yellow shirt and sitting down. I also was conversational with people at my table.
I'm seriously not leaving anything out either. They just target me.
Quote: Lemieux66My first indicator of heat, at Revel, I was wearing a Super Mario Brothers 3 yellow shirt and sitting down. I also was conversational with people at my table.
I'm seriously not leaving anything out either. They just target me.
You claim that they target you because of your race, how you dress, and the fact that you stand while you play.
Obviously you cannot change your race. Have you considered changing how you dress and the fact that you stand? Complaining about things that you can change makes no sense. Just change them.
Quote: Lemieux66My first indicator of heat, at Revel, I was wearing a Super Mario Brothers 3 yellow shirt and sitting down. I also was conversational with people at my table.
I'm seriously not leaving anything out either. They just target me.
OK, and I'm really not trying to be a smart-ass here...but you are the most parinoid counter I've heard of. I've played literally thousands of hours of BJ in AC..and have never seen someone getting heat for doing the things you are doing. In fact I've never seen someone get heat period at a red chip level, or green (which is what I usually play). Lemieux is it possible you are just misinterpreting the floor personels level of interest in you?.
Most of the time when I play I have at least some conversation with the pit people, they take your card, wish you luck, and sometimes stand around a bit and comment on your play. Most of their comments are inane and typical nonsense. It doesn't mean they think your counting, or care if you are.
At lower levels I've had many a pit person in AC say they welcome counting..because most people can't do it or don't have the bankroll to do it right. So they don't care.
It's also possible your "tension level" is part of the problem. If you look like you are trying to pull a fast one (hoodie doesn't help here). and stand up while playing looking all figity and nervous, you're going to draw more attention. Relax man.
I'm not misinterpreting anything. They took all my shit away at borgata. I have heat at Revel and get half-shoe treatment. It happens to me.
Quote: Lemieux66I'm really not trying to pull a fast one.
I'm not misinterpreting anything. They took all my shit away at borgata. I have heat at Revel and get half-shoe treatment. It happens to me.
I wasn't meaning to imply that you are pulling a "fast one". But if you look like you are; it might be a reason for all your heat. The world isin't a fair place people judge other people by how they look. Shocker I know. Borgota is the one hotel in AC I don't frequent, so I can't comment on that. The Revel shuffling up on you is really hard to believe; they are so facking clueless there I'm really surprised they did that. Allthough I'd argue that them suffling up on you only proves my point that they are clueless. Depending on when you were in Revel you may have been one of only 3 or 4 people playing blackjack. So maybe you were just getting all the attention. Best of luck avoiding heat in the future.
Quote: vendman1I wasn't meaning to imply that you are pulling a "fast one". But if you look like you are; it might be a reason for all your heat. The world isin't a fair place people judge other people by how they look. Shocker I know. Borgota is the one hotel in AC I don't frequent, so I can't comment on that. The Revel shuffling up on you is really hard to believe; they are so facking clueless there I'm really surprised they did that. Allthough I'd argue that them suffling up on you only proves my point that they are clueless. Depending on when you were in Revel you may have been one of only 3 or 4 people playing blackjack. So maybe you were just getting all the attention. Best of luck avoiding heat in the future.
Thank you. Free rooms are what I want and I learned that playing poker at Taj and or Ballys are how to get them. So there is that.
Quote: Lemieux66I think I might have figured it out. I usually play when it's not so busy. My theory is the pit bosses don't have much to do so they watch the games and thus watch me. I think I need to also need to become better at not staring at everyone's cards so much. It's my fault.
In a few short weeks you've gotten heat at Revel, the Borg and the Trop. Why is this happening? Are you an annoying person? Do you need a bath?
I'd like to watch you play, discretely of course. Are you going to be in town this week?
Quote: 1BBIn a few short weeks you've gotten heat at Revel, the Borg and the Trop. Why is this happening? Are you an annoying person? Do you need a bath?
I'd like to watch you play, discretely of course. Are you going to be in town this week?
Not this week, but I will go next week. I'd be getting in Wednesday night/Thursday morning at 1230AM.
Also, no bath needed. I'm talkative at the table but not annoying(I assume). I think being silent at the table can be a giveaway.
to clarify, you mean that you DO expect the 50:1 straight flush and 100:1 on the mini-royal (and the 10:1 ante bonus on the mini-royal) to return?
Thanks
Quote: edwardhou1NOT. Is the proper guess
to clarify, you mean that you DO expect the 50:1 straight flush and 100:1 on the mini-royal (and the 10:1 ante bonus on the mini-royal) to return?
Thanks
The progressives were in for such a short period of time that there's a chance they could literally go back to the old tops/felts. They're probably still on-property somewhere.
Quote: sodawaterBorgata offers mini bacc at both $20 and $40 min bets. During the week you will find $20 mini bacc. They also have one midi-bacc table that is always either $60 or $100 minimum. GN doesn't have midi-bacc, in fact last time I was there they didn't even have any baccarat game going. I haven't been in Harrahs Asian pit in years so I don't know what they have.
You should easily find $10 craps and $15 blackjack at Borgata.
Thanks for the reply. Wow, Borgata only has one midi table? I know they at least used to have a big baccarat table in the high limit room that you could see from the main floor, but I assume it's going the way of the dodo bird like most other places outside the high end LV properties. I read somewhere that even Aria won't open their big baccarat table except for the highest of high rollers.
I did a little digging, and according to the Harrah's AC website, they still offer midi-baccarat. I also found a blog post from 2008 which said this game was offered at Harrah's AC at $25 minimums at off peak times then, and considering how AC has done, I doubt those minimums have gone up...
Quote: silversonic2006Thanks for the reply. Wow, Borgata only has one midi table? I know they at least used to have a big baccarat table in the high limit room that you could see from the main floor, but I assume it's going the way of the dodo bird like most other places outside the high end LV properties. I read somewhere that even Aria won't open their big baccarat table except for the highest of high rollers.
Borgata has two big-table baccarats in the high-limit room, although they are rarely both going at the same time. Maybe weekends.
The midi table and the mini-bacc tables are in the Asian pit, separate from the high-limit room at the center of the floor.
Quote: Lemieux66There's a mixed game that goes on nearly every day at Ballys(half 10-20 Omaha HL and half 10-20 Stud HL both with half kill) that gives you three bucks an hour and free food off the menu. It's a tough game though. Lots of regs. I may just play an hour to get lunch lol.
haha i dont imagine the 10-20 split "regs" at Bally's on the weekdays are all that "tough." By "regs" do you mean retirees?
Quote: sodawaterhaha i dont imagine the 10-20 split "regs" at Bally's on the weekdays are all that "tough." By "regs" do you mean retirees?
Nah. Some are old though. They just know when to bet, check, etc. Obvious stuff but they just don't make any glaring mistakes. Plus the rake and split pot nature of the games make it tough to hit a profit.
Caesars Entertainment Corp. (CZR:US), the largest operator of casinos in Atlantic City, New Jersey, is looking for ways to reduce capacity in the struggling market, including closing properties.
“We are looking at all of our options to reduce the cost of doing business here,” Chief Executive Officer Gary Loveman said today on a conference call after reporting a wider first-quarter loss. “All the businesses in A.C. are under tremendous pressure.”
Caesars has been struggling to remain solvent amid a glut of casinos and weak consumer spending, following a 2008 leveraged buyout that left the company with about $23 billion in debt. The company said in March it would close a property in Tunica, Mississippi. That move may set a precedent for other markets like Atlantic City, Loveman said.
http://www.businessweek.com/news/2014-05-07/caesars-weighs-closing-atlantic-city-casinos-to-reduce-glut
Quote: 7star4nowCaesars Weighs Closing Atlantic City Casinos
Caesars Entertainment Corp. (CZR:US), the largest operator of casinos in Atlantic City, New Jersey, is looking for ways to reduce capacity in the struggling market, including closing properties.
“We are looking at all of our options to reduce the cost of doing business here,” Chief Executive Officer Gary Loveman said today on a conference call after reporting a wider first-quarter loss. “All the businesses in A.C. are under tremendous pressure.”
Caesars has been struggling to remain solvent amid a glut of casinos and weak consumer spending, following a 2008 leveraged buyout that left the company with about $23 billion in debt. The company said in March it would close a property in Tunica, Mississippi. That move may set a precedent for other markets like Atlantic City, Loveman said.
http://www.businessweek.com/news/2014-05-07/caesars-weighs-closing-atlantic-city-casinos-to-reduce-glut
I go to AC a few times a year with some friends mainly whenever there's an mma event in town. We play PGP @ Showboat. Last weekend, for the first time in years, I left with a win, up about $500. If Showboat closes, I'm laying claim to it.
Quote: gts4everI go to AC a few times a year with some friends mainly whenever there's an mma event in town. We play PGP @ Showboat. Last weekend, for the first time in years, I left with a win, up about $500. If Showboat closes, I'm laying claim to it.
From all we've seen, SB would definitely be the #1 AC property to close, maybe your $500 win will be the straw that broke the camels back LOL.
The biggest impact I see for AC players like me, since CZR controls a large % of AC rooms, comped weekend rooms will be much more difficult to get.
Quote: 7star4nowFrom all we've seen, SB would definitely be the #1 AC property to close, maybe your $500 win will be the straw that broke the camels back LOL.
The biggest impact I see for AC players like me, since CZR controls a large % of AC rooms, comped weekend rooms will be much more difficult to get.
I nominate Trump Plaza as the first to close. I don't know a single person who goes there.
Quote: Lemieux66I nominate Trump Plaza as the first to close. I don't know a single person who goes there.
correction, I meant the first CZR casino to close, athough, CZR is under severe immediate pressure to cut costs - asap.
I predict SB closure is imminent, even before TP.
Ironically, TP , which has been enduring a slow death for many years, may get revived interest if CZR drastically reduces AC room capacity & opportunists swoop in to fill the void.
Quote: Dicenor33I could never figure out CET moves. On one hand, they built a new mall, next invest to remodel Harrah's, then they buy Atlantic Club. It seems the money they spent could get them a brand new property. At least they could be competitive. Against Borg, and Mohegan Sun they stand no chance.
If you notice, all their recent moves, including the Linq in Vegas, were financed with "other people's money".
IMO, they now recognize that they are not capable of operating casinos, hotels,& restaurants at a profit. Their last ditch effort for solvency is to leverage their real estate holdings to outsourced operations, making more of their investors "pregnant with debt" (ie, dependant on CET survival to have any chance of making their $ back).
Is there any way a forward thinking group with solid marketing and good gaming offers can make a go of a smaller, scaled back property?
Just wondering if anyone is brave enough to invest in that market right now?
IMO, the answer is no.
Quote: TomspurDo you gusy think there are any groups or individuals crazy enough to make offers on casinos that CZR ar planning to close?
Is there any way a forward thinking group with solid marketing and good gaming offers can make a go of a smaller, scaled back property?
Just wondering if anyone is brave enough to invest in that market right now?
IMO, the answer is no.
I agree.
IMO, the reason CZR may mothball AC casinos, vs selling them to willing & able buyers, is the lack of willing & able buyers in AC.
I personally blame the misguided $3.5 billion bath investors took in Revel "Nanny Enterprises" as scaring away any future meaningful investment in AC.
AC & NJ, et al, tried to bet the farm on non-gaming.
Dominoes are falling.
Quote: 7star4nowI agree.
IMO, the reason CZR may mothball AC casinos, vs selling them to willing & able buyers, is the lack of willing & able buyers in AC.
I personally blame the misguided $3.5 billion bath investors took in Revel "Nanny Enterprises" as scaring away any future meaningful investment in AC.
AC & NJ, et al, tried to bet the farm on non-gaming.
Dominoes are falling.
And you can't really blame the investors as there is simply too much competition in the adjoining states to make it worth going to AC.
In all reality, the only thing it has going for it is the beaches and ocean which is in a sorry state anyway.
If they really want to make a go of it, they should reabilitate the entire boardwalk area, make it so that you can walk from the boardwalk, all the way around the absecon inlet to Borgata/Harrahs and the inlet harbor.
Close down at least half of the properties (I would say, keep Trop, Caesars, Revel, Borgata). Raz the others and make parks or amusement or something different to attract families and non gaming tourists.
Even with all of this said and done, people would rather travel to Ocean City, Cape May, Wildwood and so on.......
Quote: 7star4nowcorrection, I meant the first CZR casino to close, athough, CZR is under severe immediate pressure to cut costs - asap.
I predict SB closure is imminent, even before TP.
Ironically, TP , which has been enduring a slow death for many years, may get revived interest if CZR drastically reduces AC room capacity & opportunists swoop in to fill the void.
I'd be more sad about Earl of Sandwich going away than the actual casino section.
Quote: sodawaterShowboat is such a disgusting property. Hope it closes, is sold, and is renovated by someone who knows what he's doing.
Unlike Ballys and Harrahs, it's also not part of the play 4 hours of poker and get a comp room Sunday-Thursday promotion. "Too small" is the reasoning.
Let someone else try.
edit: They can close casinos if they have to but should still replace Loveman. He has tried and failed long enough.
"When the Revel joined the market, as you all know, it didn’t do anything to grow it, instead it just took a portion of the existing level of activity. "
Read more at http://www.philly.com/philly/blogs/inq-phillydeals/Caesars-boss-More-Atlantic-City-casinos-should-close.html#pmyaOE7jhxlV0mVk.99
1. FREE PARKING
If other casinos can do it so can you.
2. BETTER COMPS FOR TABLE PLAYERS
Yesterday I played for over an hour and earned .88 cents in comps.
Let's start with these two and see what happens.
Listening around a bit, I'm thinking that the first game I'd like to try is craps, although I'd probably knock out more than one game on a single trip. I've also heard the property I should try hitting up first is Trump Plaza, with rumors of low minimums coming down the grape vine. Seeing that I only have to play for a set duration (attempt thirty minutes, fifteen acceptable if a buy-in of $50 or greater goes broke), I'm more concerned about the minimums than things like service or property quality. If anyone else more familiar with Atlantic City than I am has comments or recommendations on this end, I'd love to hear them.
(Note that I may not gamble at any CET property.)
Quote: LineAwayI've decided to embark on a grand adventure—attempt to play every table game at least once (excluding pai gow tiles)
Why would you exclude the best table game?
Quote: Dicenor33The idea of boardwalk and casinos seems to be outdated. Look at Borgata, it's a palace in the middle of wetlands, Mohegan sun is surrounded by hills and lakes. The ocean front should be a great addition to a grand project. Chaotic boardwalk destroys the balance. AC needs to think hard of how to reinvent itself.u
I don't think the boardwalk is the problem. Revel would have been much more successful with better management and marketing.
Quote: sodawaterWhy would you exclude the best table game?
I still plan on trying to play it, but it's not part of the prop bet. Mostly because I'm pretty sure I wouldn't be able to set my hand myself with any accuracy even with a printed-out guide and asking for the house way every time would probably get me run off the table in less than the requisite 30 minutes. I still want to try a few hands, though, even if it is the most intimidating game I know of. I thought the bets on craps were bad, but I'm used to those now—on the other hand I can hardly recognize pairs of non-matching tiles.
Regulators fear getting caught with their pants down in markets where Caesars may want to stay, or enter (ex: NY).
Their financial viability will be put under the microscope for renewing existing casino licenses & getting new ones.
"The Ohio Casino Control Commission will review the financial condition of Caesar’s Entertainment Corp. at its next monthly meeting May 22.
The Las Vegas –based gaming company is a 20 percent owner and manager of Horseshoe Casino properties in Cincinnati and Cleveland. It’s been struggling with a $23 billion debt load and recently announced the closure of a casino in Mississippi. CEO Gary Loveman told Wall Street analysts Wednesday that he is looking for ways to reduce costs in Atlantic City and could close a casino there.
Horseshoe Casino Cincinnati is also looking to cut costs by asking table games employees to “bid” for new schedules in a process that will force some employees into part-time positions with no health benefits.
“Now that we have been operating for a full year, things have leveled out and we have a much clearer picture of our guests’ patterns in playing with us,” said an internal memo obtained by WCPO Reporter Jason Law. “Thus, we need to modify our current table games team schedules to match the business patterns and volumes.”
The Ohio Casino Control Commission has been working for weeks to schedule an update on the financial condition of Caesar’s Entertainment, said Matt Schuler, the commission’s executive director. Caesar's General Counsel Michael Cohen is expected to brief commissioners on recent debt-restructuring moves by the company. Commissioners are likely to explore whether financial problems for the parent company could impact Cincinnati and Cleveland properties.
But Schuler stressed that regulators aren’t worried about the viability of Caesar’s Entertainment.
“I think worry would be the wrong word,” he said. “The commission is always interested. We have an obligation under Ohio law to always consider the financial integrity of all of our licensees.”
http://www.wcpo.com/money/local-business-news/ohio-casino-regulators-to-explore-financial-condition-of-horseshoe-casino-cincinnati-operator
Quote: LineAwayI still plan on trying to play it, but it's not part of the prop bet. Mostly because I'm pretty sure I wouldn't be able to set my hand myself with any accuracy even with a printed-out guide and asking for the house way every time would probably get me run off the table in less than the requisite 30 minutes. I still want to try a few hands, though, even if it is the most intimidating game I know of. I thought the bets on craps were bad, but I'm used to those now—on the other hand I can hardly recognize pairs of non-matching tiles.
Asking the dealer to set your hand the house way every hand should be fine... it takes about 5 seconds. Just wait till all other players have set their hand and then open yours.
You should know, however, that the house way is not the best player strategy.
Quote: FatGeezus
2. BETTER COMPS FOR TABLE PLAYERS
Yesterday I played for over an hour and earned .88 cents in comps.
Let's start with these two and see what happens.
I would specify better, "Discretionary comps," for Table players. Even for a casino who has a liberal comp dollar structure, there's still nothing that compares (in the customer's mind) to thinking they are getting a comp or deal that is just for them.
Quote: Mission146I would specify better, "Discretionary comps," for Table players. Even for a casino who has a liberal comp dollar structure, there's still nothing that compares (in the customer's mind) to thinking they are getting a comp or deal that is just for them.
Player: Can I get a hooker comp?
PB: I'll see what I can do.
I like it! Lol
Quote: Mission146I would specify better, "Discretionary comps," for Table players. Even for a casino who has a liberal comp dollar structure, there's still nothing that compares (in the customer's mind) to thinking they are getting a comp or deal that is just for them.
I would agree wholeheartedly with that exact statement. Slot comps are relatively straightforward; table comps are paltry, and yet my average bet on a table is 10 to 50 times my average slot bet; I would love to see more parity, and more leniency for pit personnel to reward their players.
